Lenovo X1 Extreme

[lcseds]

Announced today. Wow, finally a 15.6" with nVidia GPU, two SSD slots and socketed memory. Plus, lots of ports. I think I have finally come across my "change to Windows" system. Hope it doesn't run hot with a loud cooling system. Good competition for the XPS 15 for sure.

And yes, it looks expensive but within three months it will be discounted heavily.

 

[macgeek18]

Lenovo is making it hard to not lose my soul to a credit account. I told myself I would buy my next Thinkpad when my X220 died. Well 7 years later and it's still doing extremely well.

 

[SDColorado]

Announced today. Wow, finally a 15.6" with nVidia GPU, two SSD slots and socketed memory. Plus, lots of ports. I think I have finally come across my "change to Windows" system. Hope it doesn't run hot with a loud cooling system. Good competition for the XPS 15 for sure.

And yes, it looks expensive but within three months it will be discounted heavily.

I am still looking from a change from 2018 MBP hell. Need to check it out!

 

[cube]

P52

 

[SDColorado]

P52

Is that a discount code?

 

[hajime]

I am going to order and give it a try.

Which CPU option do you recommend if I don't want crazy fan noise, uncomfortably hot, thermal throttling to a point of slower than base speed / lower end cpu?

 

[macjunk(ie)]

this looks so good! I am quite tempted to put up my 2015 MBP for sale

 

[lcseds]

Not a lot on configurations from Lenovo right now on the product landing page. But between the upgradeability and the Dolby Vision HDR screen which has gotten very good reviews, this is the most excited I have been for a Win notebook in a long, long time. With Apple seemingly going in a direction different from my wants and needs, I'm salivating for this. And I'll bet I can get an i7, 16GB, 1TB with 3 year warranty for under the $3500 I tried the new MBP for.

 

[maflynn]

Wow, its only 4.02 lbs for the 4k model, which is the same weight as the MBP.

The specs on this, is quite impressive.

Huge price jump between the FHD and 4k model.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

A disassembly video for the Thinkpad P1 - in Korean.
It is similar to the X1E except that it has Quadro cards instead of Nvidia.

It clearly shows that the RAM and SSDs are socketed. And yet, Lenovo has been able to make it thin and light. At least to me, it clearly shows that Apple's current spiteful design is to solely to block out user upgrades to extract more $$$ out of their customers. The money matters so much that they were willing to glue everything in - environment be damned!

Instead of an ambivalent touchbar, it CAN come equipped with a touchscreen with stylus support if you so desire - your choice! A trillion dollar company can't afford to give us choice but a 8 billion company can give us so much choice. The only place where we do have abundant choice is in its watch bands.

It does not need a butterfly keyboard either - comes with deliciously standard Thinkpad keys which you can replace yourself in case of an accident! In case of Apple, 400$ - 700$ bill (1- not sure of the exact number still 2- Post warranty repair costs)!

I am not yet sure if the keyboard is spill resistant - lets see.

AppleCare is so expensive and yet you need to travel to an Apple store to get your laptop looked at or repaired. Lenovo's warranty is onsite and is half the price of AppleCare!

The only drawback for me is the OS - but I am convinced I have reached a point where OSX seems to be an amoral choice. I am sure I will not be reduced to a worthless vegetable if I use either Windows or Linux!
[doublepost=1535722690][/doublepost]I just realized that in the P1, even the battery, although internal, is replaceable and not glued in!
Absolutely fantastic design in my opinion! Lenovo engineers have designed this machine like they would have designed it in Lego!

Even the chassis, in my opinion, is better than the MBP's because it does not pick up scratches easily and does not lose chunks of its body like the MBP does.

Just a beautiful machine overall! I can't wait for its review on Notebookcheck. Things to watch out for:
- Extent of thermal throttling
- PWM displays (Lenovo has a bad habit of still using these kind of displays - this is a deal breaker)
- Display quality on the 4k and the FHD options
- Spill resistant keyboard (I fear we may have lost this. Although not a deal breaker, a big disappointment )

 

[turbineseaplane]

I'm so tired of hearing about how MacBook Pro's "can't have x,y,z" because of the materials and extreme engineering and thinness, etc..

There is simply zero excuse for Apple not to have a machine like this that caters to serious professionals who want and need so much of whats on offer here. Give it an aluminum wedge shape if need be.

It's just heartbreaking to see the hardware I actually want but that can't run the OS I prefer (macOS).

 

[SDColorado]

I have had a fully loaded X1 Extreme in the cart for the last 2 days now. I am really close to pulling the trigger.

Anyone know how their onsite support is?

Also anyone know how well the smart card reader works? Would that replace the need for the iPad/phone based ones for Square/PayPal?

 

[cube]

I once wanted to order restore discs and ended up in a multinational infinite loop between Lenovo and IBM.

 

[KarmaRocket]

Always had a soft spot for Thinkpads. I think they make the best all around machines. Really think they did a great job with their X1 Extreme, P1 and P52/P72 designs. Really offer you a lot of options and customizations based on your needs.

I already bought the 2018 MBP and just past my 14 day return period, but I wouldn't have returned it anyway even if Lenovo came out with these machines earlier. My workflow is really fluid with MacOS (Xcode/FCPX). I need a bit more time to get accustomed to Windows and I'm a little worried the X1X/P1 Thinkpads might be too thin and throttle. I also would want a better GPU. Hoping Nvidia's 20 series and AMD's 7nm Navi come into play next year for Lenovo and maybe even Apple. I don't mind selling my 2018 MBP at a loss for something with a better GPU.

But if you need a machine now, these look incredible. Might just want to wait on reviews though. Also, Lenovo is really good about discounting new machines 3-4 months after release and have great deals on Black Friday if you want to wait a bit longer.

 

[maflynn]

The only drawback for me is the OS

I think that for the most part drew me back in on the Mac. I actually had the Razer and was more or less happy with it. There were some things that bugged me, but it was a fine laptop.

just realized that in the P1, even the battery, although internal, is replaceable and not glued in!

Yep, in the windows world, there are many models that offer replaceable components.

There is simply zero excuse for Apple not to have a machine like this that caters to serious professionals

I'm going to venture a guess that majority of people who buy the MBP are not the type of professionals you have in mind. I'm sure Apple can do many things differently but chose not too because they're making money selling to the lowest denominator customer. That's not bad, but with limited models, this does limit apple from providing various laptop models cover a larger swath of customers.

 

[hajime]

If we could get MacOS working on the Extreme or P1, I would be very happy. After waiting for Apple for three years, I am going to order a ThinkPad.
[doublepost=1535811462][/doublepost]

A disassembly video for the Thinkpad P1 - in Korean.
It is similar to the X1E except that it has Quadro cards instead of Nvidia.

It clearly shows that the RAM and SSDs are socketed. And yet, Lenovo has been able to make it thin and light. At least to me, it clearly shows that Apple's current spiteful design is to solely to block out user upgrades to extract more $$$ out of their customers. The money matters so much that they were willing to glue everything in - environment be damned!

Instead of an ambivalent touchbar, it CAN come equipped with a touchscreen with stylus support if you so desire - your choice! A trillion dollar company can't afford to give us choice but a 8 billion company can give us so much choice. The only place where we do have abundant choice is in its watch bands.

It does not need a butterfly keyboard either - comes with deliciously standard Thinkpad keys which you can replace yourself in case of an accident! In case of Apple, 400$ - 700$ bill (1- not sure of the exact number still 2- Post warranty repair costs)!

I am not yet sure if the keyboard is spill resistant - lets see.

AppleCare is so expensive and yet you need to travel to an Apple store to get your laptop looked at or repaired. Lenovo's warranty is onsite and is half the price of AppleCare!

The only drawback for me is the OS - but I am convinced I have reached a point where OSX seems to be an amoral choice. I am sure I will not be reduced to a worthless vegetable if I use either Windows or Linux!
[doublepost=1535722690][/doublepost]I just realized that in the P1, even the battery, although internal, is replaceable and not glued in!
Absolutely fantastic design in my opinion! Lenovo engineers have designed this machine like they would have designed it in Lego!

Even the chassis, in my opinion, is better than the MBP's because it does not pick up scratches easily and does not lose chunks of its body like the MBP does.

Just a beautiful machine overall! I can't wait for its review on Notebookcheck. Things to watch out for:
- Extent of thermal throttling
- PWM displays (Lenovo has a bad habit of still using these kind of displays - this is a deal breaker)
- Display quality on the 4k and the FHD options
- Spill resistant keyboard (I fear we may have lost this. Although not a deal breaker, a big disappointment )

A Lenovo sales told me that the ssd is user upgradable. Sometimes they gave false information though.

 

[SDColorado]

If we could get MacOS working on the Extreme or P1, I would be very happy. After waiting for Apple for three years, I am going to order a ThinkPad.
[doublepost=1535811462][/doublepost]

A Lenovo sales told me that the ssd is user upgradable. Sometimes they gave false information though.

The SSD is user upgradable in the X1 Carbon, so I believe the information that they have provided would be correct.

 

[macjunk(ie)]

I think that for the most part drew me back in on the Mac. I actually had the Razer and was more or less happy with it. There were some things that bugged me, but it was a fine laptop.
I'm going to venture a guess that majority of people who buy the MBP are not the type of professionals you have in mind. I'm sure Apple can do many things differently but chose not too because they're making money selling to the lowest denominator customer. That's not bad, but with limited models, this does limit apple from providing various laptop models cover a larger swath of customers.

OSX seems to be my Achilles Heel and I was okay with that all these years. MBPs were never cheap all these years and I always remember paying at least a 50%-75% premium over other laptops. This was ok because the overall package was able to differentiate itself from the rest of the market pretty well.

Hardware differentiation:
- nice rectangular block and not the weirdly shaped behemoths like the old Dell Inspirons
- superb trackpad

Software differentiation:
- OSX was great at battery life and memory management
- Good quality software available on the platform
- Need OSX to develop iOS apps

Have a look at the situation today.

Hardware differentiation:
- Many vendors now offer thin laptops with a great profile. Sure they are not Aluminum blocks like the MBP but I much rather prefer the matte ruggedness of the Thinkpads
- Screen ratios are abysmal in the MBPs whereas many vendors offered nearly bezel-less designs. In fact, the IFA 2018 has effectively declared war on laptop bezels. Even the Inspirons get bezel-less designs now!
- Win machines are arguably more reliable than the Macs cause they have been designed with a thermal common sense.

Software differentiation:
- Linux is great at battery life and memory management today. Win10 is getting there but is tremendously better than before
- OSX still has the upper hand in quality apps in my opinion
- Most companies today develop iOS apps in platform agonistic languages such as React or Angular. They only need an OSX device to deploy and test the apps. A friend of mine uses a cheap Mac Mini to do this.

So in reality, there are many wins than losses for the other side. If you also include the fact that Apple has rarely ever produced a reliable machine (GPU failures, keyboard failures), not buying Apple anymore should be a no-brainer! I am pretty damn sure I will not suddenly be a worthless vegetable if I move away from OSX! To that effect, I have been using my T470 running PopOS as my primary machine this week and I am able to do everything that matters. There are only two things I miss so far (which I view as absolute must haves) - system wide dictionary and a good todo app that syncs with my iPhone.

If we could get MacOS working on the Extreme or P1, I would be very happy. After waiting for Apple for three years, I am going to order a ThinkPad.
[doublepost=1535811462][/doublepost]

A Lenovo sales told me that the ssd is user upgradable. Sometimes they gave false information though.

It is. Lenovo had released the hardware maintenance manual earlier but for some reason it is taken down right now. I had a quick look and it showed that there are TWO M.2 slots taking in standard 2280 SSDs! No proprietary stuff! So you can buy 2 Samsung 970 Pro NVME drives to get a maximum capacity of 4TB! Or if that combination gets too expensive, buy 1 Samsung 970 Pro and the other 970 Evo. If you think you need more RAM than SSD speed, load the X1E with 64GB of RAM and buy 2 mSATA drives.

The X1E and the P1 are both fantastic machines. But it remains to be seen if they throttle or not. I also realized today that currently there is no option to buy the machines without the graphic cards. Since it only has a 80Wh battery, I would have preferred to buy a configuration without a graphic card and extend using an external graphic card enclosure if I ever needed some graphical juice. Hopefully, Lenovo will introduce this configuration in the future.

Lastly, the X1E and the P1 do not offer power charging via its USB-C port. It charges using Lenovo's proprietary slim tip charges (which are robustly built unlike Apple's chargers that usually fray after some time). This is because the draw of the machine exceeds the 100W limit currently enforced by the USB-C power delivery standard. SO the machine actually comes with a 135W adaptor. This is not a deal breaker but yet another nice-to-have item.

 

[SDColorado]

Lastly, the X1E and the P1 do not offer power charging via its USB-C port. It charges using Lenovo's proprietary slim tip charges (which are robustly built unlike Apple's chargers that usually fray after some time). This is because the draw of the machine exceeds the 100W limit currently enforced by the USB-C power delivery standard. SO the machine actually comes with a 135W adaptor. This is not a deal breaker but yet another nice-to-have item.

Good info on the charging cable. I noticed on the X1 Extreme site that it states " Rapid Charge technology brings your laptop back up to 80% capacity in just an hour." I assume that this would not be possible if charging was done through USB-C?

 

[maflynn]

I am liking what it has to offer, if I wasn't already owning the 2018 MBP, this one would be the one, I'd buy

 

[SDColorado]

I am liking what it has to offer, if I wasn't already owning the 2018 MBP, this one would be the one, I'd buy

If I need to return my 2018... again. I think it will be the one I buy.

 

[bobbie424242]

The X1X and P1 extensibility and repairability just blows Apple out of the water. Apple and its f.....g glued batteries and every component soldered making it not user upgradable! Thinkpad are like Lego and you can replace anything easily.
The replacement for my Macbook Pro 2014 will not be the X1X or P1, but either the P52 or upcoming P72, because I do not require ultra thin and light and I'd rather avoid it.

 

[KarmaRocket]

The X1X and P1 extensibility and repairability just blows Apple out of the water. Apple and its f.....g glued batteries and every component soldered making it not user upgradable! Thinkpad are like Lego and you can replace anything easily.
The replacement for my Macbook Pro 2014 will not be the X1X or P1, but either the P52 or upcoming P72, because I do not require ultra thin and light and I'd rather avoid it.

Indeed. You get two RAM slots and two M.2 slots to get a total of 4TB (raid). That solution is much cheaper than purchasing from Apple. They might have faster storage, but in real world tests you won't really notice that much of a difference. Plus removeable battery in some models. I love the tough exterior. Sometimes I feel like I'm holding a baby with my MBP because I don't want to scratch or dent it.

If you look at Thinkpad forums or their reddit section, you'll see a ton of Thinkpad fans that love the brand. And it's with good reason. Thinkpads are really well made, and it's great that Lenovo is now putting in some good GPU's in their machines and trying to innovate. Their Yoga lines are really interesting as well. A lot of Thinkpad users hold on to their machines as long as Mac users. Pretty impressive for a PC brand.

With Windows10 getting better and better each year, it's hard sticking with the Mac with all this great hardware being released by Lenovo, Acer, Razer and Microsoft.

 

[lcseds]

The two SSD's can be configured for a Raid 0/1 operation also. Two SSD slots, two memory slots, what's not to love.

 

[SDColorado]

The two SSD's can be configured for a Raid 0/1 operation also. Two SSD slots, two memory slots, what's not to love.

Now that would be an interesting option!

With Windows10 getting better and better each year, it's hard sticking with the Mac with all this great hardware being released by Lenovo, Acer, Razer and Microsoft.

I actually really like Windows 10 in its current iteration. I know it’s a bit sacrilege to say anywhere but here. But I keep going back and forth between using my Surface Pro and MacBook Pro to see if there is anything with MacOS that would give me serious buyers remorse if I switched all over to PC and there isn’t anything about MacOS in comparison that I would consider a deal breaker in making that change