The 2019-2020 Football Thread

[Lord Blackadder]

It's going to be a make or break week for OGS at United. Poch is available and seemingly interested in the job, United have two derbies — the Mourinho Derby and the Manchester Derby — between today and the weekend, the squad is facing even more key injuries — Anthony Martial is unavailable to play against Spurs tonight, no idea if McTominay will be back, either.

I can easily see OGS losing his job if United lose both of these matches, even if the circumstances are pretty unfair with the injury situation. Still, I don't think he's managed the part of his squad that's actually fit all that well, he's made some bad mistakes tactically and with substitutions, and the team has just not showed well enough against some lower level competition despite some signs of progress. I was pretty firmly on the side of giving him time, but now I'm not so sure, especially with such a desirable and accomplished alternative free and available.

I still think the Arsenal suits would be idiots to not try and poach Poch immediately. Under Poch I can see Arsenal winning a big trophy - Arsenal are not the biggest spenders but will give him more resources than Levy did. Of course Man Utd could do far worse than bringing him on board as well. Did anyone except the suits at Man Utd really think of OGS as a long-term solution after the Mourinho hangover wore off? Maybe he can do the job someday, but surely this is too early in his career for that unless he is exceptionally talented. So far he has not risen to that level.

Both Spurs and Man City really need to beat Man Utd this week to keep their seasons on track, so these will be tough matches for all parties. From a purely selfish perspective, I am hoping to see some classic Mourinho antics against Man Utd ... let's all hope for a massively controversial VAR intervention and watch Mou either gloat or rave about "Einsteins" or "respect, respect, respect" in the post-match presser. Hopefully we don't see any eye-pokes, though. Mourinho is always a hoot - unless he is playing against your team.

I am excited to watch Leicester's good run under Rogers continue. They show every sign of finishing in the Champions League spots. That would leave just one spot for Spurs, Chelsea, Man Utd and Arsenal to fight over....

 

[JamesMike]

Watching the Man U vs Spurs, surprisingly Man U is leading, hope they can keep it.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I still think the Arsenal suits would be idiots to not try and poach Poch immediately. Under Poch I can see Arsenal winning a big trophy - Arsenal are not the biggest spenders but will give him more resources than Levy did. Of course Man Utd could do far worse than bringing him on board as well. Did anyone except the suits at Man Utd really think of OGS as a long-term solution after the Mourinho hangover wore off? Maybe he can do the job someday, but surely this is too early in his career for that unless he is exceptionally talented. So far he has not risen to that level.

Both Spurs and Man City really need to beat Man Utd this week to keep their seasons on track, so these will be tough matches for all parties. From a purely selfish perspective, I am hoping to see some classic Mourinho antics against Man Utd ... let's all hope for a massively controversial VAR intervention and watch Mou either gloat or rave about "Einsteins" or "respect, respect, respect" in the post-match presser. Hopefully we don't see any eye-pokes, though. Mourinho is always a hoot - unless he is playing against your team.

I am excited to watch Leicester's good run under Rogers continue. They show every sign of finishing in the Champions League spots. That would leave just one spot for Spurs, Chelsea, Man Utd and Arsenal to fight over....

Personally, I would love - absolutely love - to see Pochettino recruited as Arsenal manager; this would be the best possible outcome, to my mind. At the moment, I doubt that a better coach is available, and, if I were one of the suits, I would do absolutely everything in my power to bring about this greatly desired outcome.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

It sounds silly to be nervous about a Merseyside Derby at Anfield, given Liverpools' record in this fixture, but Everton are usually up for the match in a big way, and Liverpool are very much in season-management mode now. Let's see what happens, but it sure would be nice to see an early goal or two from the front three....

EDIT: Origi bags a goal in the 6th minute, but it's a very open game. Liverpool can't keep a clean sheet these days either, so a long way to go....

EDIT2: Wow, a crazy first half, 4-2 :Liverpool at the break! Liverpool should be steamrolling Everton but have not been able to keep it tight enough at the back. There is plenty of time for lots more drama. Klopp will want to see more control in the second half.

 

[JamesMike]

I was pleased with Man U play, getting the win against 'The Manager' was icing on the cake.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I was pleased with Man U play, getting the win against 'The Manager' was icing on the cake.

Defeating "The Special One" must give anyone who has worked with him in the past a sort of special pleasure.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Crikey, another wild match against Everton. The scoreline looks reasonably comfortable but the match was not. Liverpool can be got at, but they are also capable of scoring at any time and continue to dig out results in different ways.

Origi and Shaq stepped in and kept the campaign ticking over.

Defeating "The Special One" must give anyone who has worked with him in the past a sort of special pleasure.

Man Utd have relied so heavily on Rashford, but he continues to deliver more often than not. Mou is still on good behavior so sadly no histrionics from him. It's a pretty bad result for Spurs though the match was close. Man Utd desperately need the points, especially with City up next.

 

[Silencio]

United played very, very well all match long and were outright dominant for long stretches of the first half. Rashford was really in the mood, should have had three or four goals instead of a brace, and McTominay and Fred held the upper hand in midfield. Good result.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Extraordinary match between Liverpool and Everton - but, notwithstanding the drama, goals, defences, - Liverpool still won. To be a champion, you must be able to win pretty, win ugly - and, as was the case last night, win with drama.

Manchester United defeated Spurs, and are possibly over-reliant on Rashford, while yes, there were no histrionics from The Special One (for it is clear that he is still in the honeymoon stage and, equally clearly, is still on his best behaviour. However, whether the "new manager bounce" is already beginning to wear off, is something of a moot point).

 

[Lord Blackadder]

A lot of pundits are already calling Liverpool's title challenge a "procession" this season and that terrifies me. Liverpool's performance dropped just enough in the second half of last season to let Man City take the title, so clearly the critical phase of the season is yet to come. Much depends on Man City. They are in a bigger hole this time around, and have a worse defense. But if they can gather themselves and start winning again, they have the talent to go undefeated the rest of the season.

Liverpool still need to lose 4-5 matches to relinquish their lead, but it is not an unassailable advantage. Of course, if Leicester keep winning - surely not, eh? Then again, they've done it before. They are by no means to be ignored: Man City still have to play them twice, and Liverpool once. They will likely have some say in who wins the title this season.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

A lot of pundits are already calling Liverpool's title challenge a "procession" this season and that terrifies me. Liverpool's performance dropped just enough in the second half of last season to let Man City take the title, so clearly the critical phase of the season is yet to come. Much depends on Man City. They are in a bigger hole this time around, and have a worse defense. But if they can gather themselves and start winning again, they have the talent to go undefeated the rest of the season. Liverpool still need to lose 4-5 matches to relinquish their lead, but it is not an unassailable advantage. Of course, if Leicester keep winning - surely not, eh? Then again, they've done it before. They are by no means to be ignored: Man City still have to play them twice, and Liverpool once. They will likely have some say in who wins the title this season.

Bear in mind that Liverpool lost the Premiership by the narrowest of margins last season and were defeated only once during the entire season - whereas Manchester City had to be consistently at their very best for a very long time in order to claim the title. Remember, too, that Liverpool also managed to successfully win the Champion's League trophy, where they had been runners-up the previous year.

At this stage, and yes, there is a long way to go, while it is not "a procession", I would argue that the title is Liverpool's (undefeated this season so far) to lose. This looks to me to be their season.

Manchester City - a superb team - have shown that it is well nigh impossible to keep to that superlative standard for three consecutive seasons.

Leicester are also excellent, and play superbly as a team.

For now, my worry with Liverpool would be injuries to key players this early in the season. If they can avoid that, and keep a degree of both mental strength and remain physically fit (and sufficiently injury free), they have an excellent chance of claiming the title this season.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

A lot was also being made of Klop's decision to bring in Lallana, Shaquiri, and Origi for the match, as opposed to playing a changed team against Bournemouth this weekend. I didn't feel that way. Origi is not the equal of our "big three" attackers, but he is an absolute cult hero and scores in big games. Shaqiri is a favorite of mine and I expected him to deliver, as he did. Lallana has never quite lived up to expectations but he is a solid squad player and did more than enough to justify his presence. Also, Mane started the match and he is the best of the front three at the moment - and showed it again.

Another thought on Man Utd this season - they seem well off the pace in general, but they also seem to step up and perform in big matches, which takes the pressure off OGS. the problem with that is, there are relatively few "big" matches compared with the weekly grind. They need to be winning more of the latter too if they hope to improve their league position.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

A lot was also being made of Klop's decision to bring in Lallana, Shaquiri, and Origi for the match, as opposed to playing a changed team against Bournemouth this weekend. I didn't feel that way. Origi is not the equal of our "big three" attackers, but he is an absolute cult hero and scores in big games. Shaqiri is a favorite of mine and I expected him to deliver, as he did. Lallana has never quite lived up to expectations but he is a solid squad player and did more than enough to justify his presence. Also, Mane started the match and he is the best of the front three at the moment - and showed it again.

Another thought on Man Utd this season - they seem well off the pace in general, but they also seem to step up and perform in big matches, which takes the pressure off OGS. the problem with that is, there are relatively few "big" matches compared with the weekly grind. They need to be winning more of the latter too if they hope to improve their league position.

Liverpool's main problem under Keegan (yes, this was a long time ago, but they were an excellent team that season) was mental strength, as Keegan let Ferguson's jibes get to him.

Okay, from Ferguson's perspective, all may have been fair in love, war, and football, and it worked at the time, but it was an unpleasant tactic to use.

However, the thing is, having already won the Champion's League, this Liverpool team have proven that they have the necessary mental strength to win; collapsing mentally is not what they are prone to, not any longer.

My main worry would be serious injuries to key players too early; Manchester City - exceptional two seasons ago, and still formidably good last season - may have peaked.

Spurs and Manchester United are still well off the pace - it is still not sufficiently appreciated just how much (and for how long) Spurs consistently over-achieved under Pochettino.

Chelsea have done surprisingly well so far under Lampard, both the transfer ban and the decision not to proceed (for now) with building a new stadium simultaneously taking pressure off the team, and allowing for a welcome and unexpected degree of settled stability to take root.

Arsenal, dear divinity, but I devoutly wish that they would simply pay (in pride and money) whatever it takes to persuade Pochettino to join them.

Leicester and Wolves are an absolute pleasure to watch; it is terrific to see that massive money cannot buy absolutely everything, and also great to see teams with a great work ethic and a positive and proud team spirit still able to lay claim to top five positions in the Premiership.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Ah: News just announced: Everton have fired Marco Silva.

Hm.

Quite a few Premiership managers have been handed their walking papers this season, thus far.

 

[JamesMike]

Getting ready to watch the Arsenal match, will see how they handle the firing of the manager

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Getting ready to watch the Arsenal match, will see how they handle the firing of the manager

Oh, they (the players, that is) most certainly wished for the manager (Mr Emery, that is) to be fired, and did everything (such as not "turning up" - i.e.playing with passion and commitment - on the pitch) o show that; equally telling - and a marked contrast with the clearly dismayed response of some Spurs players when Mr Pochettino was fired - was the almost deafening silence from Arsenal players when Mr Emery was fired.

Unai Emery is a decent and dignified man, but out of his depth at Arsenal.

What is much more instructive - and more ominous, as it suggests very deeply rooted issues - is the fact that Freddie Ljungberg does not appear to be on the receiving end of the sort of improved play and performance from a team (desiring to impress even a manager appointed for the short term) that is referred to as the "new manager's bounce".

I am not sure whether the players are unwilling or unable to improve; either way, it doesn't bode well, and, that they don't seem to move with a bit more energy, commitment, passion, focus than they did under Emery is a cause for considerable concern.

 

[pachyderm]

Getting ready to watch the Arsenal match, will see how they handle the firing of the manager

I know they lost because my son just stomped out of the living room and upstairs.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I know they lost because my son just stomped out of the living room and upstairs.

Bad enough that they lost - and lost at home - (which is something that rarely happened under Mr Wenger, in the late Wenger years, while Arsenal were notoriously poor travellers, they usually held firm at home) but more ominous, to my eyes, is the fact that there has been no "new manager's bounce" (such as Lampard experienced at Chelsea, OGS at Manchester United, or The Special One - for a few matches - at Spurs).

 

[Lord Blackadder]

Bad enough that they lost - and lost at home - (which is something that rarely happened under Mr Wenger, in the late Wenger years, while Arsenal were notoriously poor travellers, they usually held firm at home) but more ominous, to my eyes, is the fact that there has been no "new manager's bounce" (such as Lampard experienced at Chelsea, OGS at Manchester United, or The Special One - for a few matches - at Spurs).

Liverpool did not find Brighton an easy opponent. On the other hand, the rot is deep at Arsenal and Emery was not the root cause.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Liverpool did not find Brighton an easy opponent. On the other hand, the rot is deep at Arsenal and Emery was not the root cause.

Oh, agreed, the rot, decline - that mental lack of strength, that brittle fragility - and, that calamitous defence and uninspired midfield - all long predated Emery; I'm not blaming Emery, who is a decent and dignified man but will say that I think he was a poor choice as manager.

 

[JamesMike]

Watching Man U vs Man City, my team is playing well so far, leading 2-0 first half.

 

[Lord Blackadder]

So, Everton's loss in the Derby lead to Silva's sacking...after which they pull off a very creditable win against Chelsea today. It's worth pointing out that Everton were outplayed by Liverpool but never looked like they'd given up during the match.

Watching Man U vs Man City, my team is playing well so far, leading 2-0 first half.

This may be the first time I've ever been happy to see Man Utd win a football match.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

So, Everton's loss in the Derby lead to Silva's sacking...after which they pull off a very creditable win against Chelsea today. It's worth pointing out that Everton were outplayed by Liverpool but never looked like they'd given up during the match.



This may be the first time I've ever been happy to see Man Utd win a football match.

Re Everton, I suspect a case of "new manager bounce" as well.

 

[pachyderm]

Wednesday win!

Up to 6th.

Let's see what happens with all our legal troubles...

 

[Scepticalscribe]

Wednesday win!

Up to 6th.

Let's see what happens with all our legal troubles...

There are certain football clubs which engender a smile, whenever one hears their name, or, reads their names in print: Teams with names from the Victorian era, such as Hamilton Academical, Brighton & Hove Albion (yes, they defeated Arsenal, but I would prefer to see their splendid and quite wonderful Victorian full name used when the team are mentioned), and, of course Sheffield Wednesday, all fall into this list.