Another what to buy thread

[Just_Kevin]

Greetings all,

Short version: longtime Windows user looking to buy a Mac. Use case: minor photo & video editing, CAD & 3D printing, plus the usual stuff, no gaming. Minimum dual external monitor support. 14”. Budget $2500 US.

Longer version:
I’ve been a Windows user going back to 3.x, initial smartphones were Blackberry then Android, switched to iPhone about two years ago. Since then I’ve picked up an iPad Air and Apple Watch, so I’m pretty much all-in on the ecosystem now. I moved to iPhone and iPad from Android phones and tablets because I got fed up with poor performance after a year or so. I’m at that point with Windows, last two machines only lasted about three years before having performance and battery issues. These weren’t budget machines either. I’m willing to pay “Apple money“ if it means I’m buying less frequently.

I’ve only done very minor photo editing and even less video, but I’d like to get more involved so I don’t need to rely on others for those tasks. I’m getting more involved with Fusion 360 for my 3D printing projects. I suspect they will be the most tasking jobs for whatever I buy. I don’t do any gaming. This will be my only computer, so web browsing, email, Word, Excel and other typical daily uses.

Dual monitor support is mandatory. From my research that eliminates the Air and base M3. I feel the M3 Max would be overkill, plus over budget. 14” display is sufficient, I’d rather that money go towards performance. So, I see my options as M3 Pro or refurbished M2 Pro or Max. My concern there is shorter life and availability. On the flip side it sounds like a M2 Max is as good or better than the M3 Pro due to the reduced bus speed of the M3.

I think that brings me to budget. I’d like to stay around $2500 pre-tax or AppleCare.The pre-configured M3 Pro with 18GB and 1TB fits that slot. Even better, I have enough Amazon points to pay for almost a third of it. I don’t think the refurbished machines on Amazon are Apple refurbished, so I’d likely buy a refurbished machine directly from Apple, which is more money out of pocket.

Pretty sure I covered all of the relevant parts and some irrelevant stuff as well. So, suggestions?

 

[dmr727]

I think that brings me to budget. I’d like to stay around $2500 pre-tax or AppleCare.The pre-configured M3 Pro with 16GB and 1TB fits that slot.

It'll have 18GB of memory, but that's also a configuration I've been looking at, and I think it'll be a fantastic machine for you. You'll be blown away by the combination of performance and battery life. Amazon has it at $2249 at the moment.

 

[Just_Kevin]

Yes, 18GB, I fixed it.

Also, yes on the Amazon price, I’ve been looking. I’m a minimum 2 weeks out if not longer from a purchase due to some work travel coming up and what my accountant has to say about tax filing and return.

 

[smirking]

The Apple refurb store has an excellent reputation and a lot of the long time MacRumors members buy from there whenever possible. One thing to note about the refurb store is that the inventory moves fast on popular items. If you have a config in mind and you see it, be ready to jump on it immediately. If you sleep on it, it may be gone by the time you return.

That 18GB machine ought to do you well. In addition to the Apple refurb store, also look into B&H. If you signup for their PayBoo card, they'll pick up the sales tax so if you find a discount there, their sales tax offer will easily beat any Amazon points you'd earn.

 

[Just_Kevin]

I’ll have to look into B&H and if I can still get AppleCare on refurb from them.

I would not be earning Amazon points on the purchase. I’d most likely be using points and doing their 0% on the balance, which is not point eligible. Unless I get exceptionally good news with regards to tax refund.

 

[CalMin]

M3Pro 18GB/1TB will crush your stated use case. M2Pro (or even M1Pro) would be fine too - Source: I have a 16GB/1TB M1Pro and it's blazing fast even after over 2-years of owning it.

I get wanting to use your Amazon points, but if you regularly shop there, I'd just use them for something else and go Apple refurb. I love Apple refurbs because they feel like new machines but for less money vs. 3rd-party refurbs which can be hit or miss.

 

[smirking]

Yup, you can get AppleCare on Macs ordered through B&H:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1793625-REG/apple_mrx43ll_a_14_macbook_pro_pro.html

That's not a refurb unit. That's just a discounted price.

As for refurbs, the only refurbs that are true Apple Refurbs come from Apple. Apple Refurbs are as good as new. There's no telling what refurb means anywhere else.

 

[Just_Kevin]

So, I shouldn’t be concerned with the reduced bus speed in the M3 vs the M2?

If the M3 Pro I’m looking at would perform similar to M2 Max at similar price, I’d do new. But if a refurbished M2 Max would outperform the M3 Pro, it would seem like a no-brainer to go refurbished, if it’s available.

I’m probably/hopefully overthinking this, I know.

 

[CalMin]

So, I shouldn’t be concerned with the reduced bus speed in the M3 vs the M2?

If the M3 Pro I’m looking at would perform similar to M2 Max at similar price, I’d do new. But if a refurbished M2 Max would outperform the M3 Pro, it would seem like a no-brainer to go refurbished, if it’s available.

I’m probably/hopefully overthinking this, I know.

I mean, I'm sure you will find a benchmark test somewhere that will show you different, but in actual use there will be no difference unless you put a stopwatch on your video rendering times. At MOST it will be a couple of seconds here and there, but nothing to make a meaningful difference to your life unless you're doing LONG or COMPLEX projects.

It's like saying a Ferrari is faster than a Porsche. As true as that may be, which one will get you to the supermarket faster? It doesn't really matter unless you're maxing out the performance each time and even then the difference is only marginal.

 

[AlmightyKang]

Put it this way, it's not worth obsessing about minor details. Just stay away from the 8Gb one and you'll be fine. I do a lot of photo and video editing on a base 16Gb/512Gb SSD M1 14" MBP and it goes like lightning. I'd go for the 1TB option though if you can.

In context, my desktop PC, a top end Intel 14900K with 64G of overclocked RAM and 7300MB/sec SSD, takes about 6 minutes to do an AI denoise in Lightroom. My 14" MacBook Pro (base 16/512 model) hammers through it in a 1 minute and has a considerably less laggy UI.

The PC is optimised for CPU compute though (simulation workloads). It's not all about the numbers but about the workload profile.

 

[leifp]

Do you plan to use its laptop functionality? I have a similar setup to what you’re looking for and my next Mac will be a desktop (which I already have on a secondary setup). You’ll save a lot of money getting a Mac mini with M2Pro (or waiting on the M3Pro if you prefer)

 

[Just_Kevin]

Yes. That’s another reason for the 14”, it needs to be portable as well. I had considered getting a Mac as a desktop and keeping current Windows laptop, but that is nearly useless for me now. Plus I don’t want to manage two and rely on cloud or other methods of making sure I can access the files I need when and where I need them.

 

[leifp]

My sole concern for you would be CAD/3D printing. That first because there’s a real dearth of options for CAD on MacOS and that second because I personally have no idea about it.

Are you wedded to a particular CAD program or do you just generally dabble?

 

[Just_Kevin]

This is my biggest concern about switching to Mac as well. It seems most CAD/3D printing is done with Windows OS.

I use Fusion 360 because that’s what was often recommended, they offer a free hobbiest license, and I found numerous online tutorials that I liked. I would’t say I’m unable or unwilling to make a switch, but I’d rather not. 3D printing is a hobby for me, primarily to support other hobbies, not a source of income. It’s still a major reason for needing a laptop and not just, say an iPad Pro.

 

[CalMin]

This is my biggest concern about switching to Mac as well. It seems most CAD/3D printing is done with Windows OS.

I use Fusion 360 because that’s what was often recommended, they offer a free hobbiest license, and I found numerous online tutorials that I liked. I would’t say I’m unable or unwilling to make a switch, but I’d rather not. 3D printing is a hobby for me, primarily to support other hobbies, not a source of income. It’s still a major reason for needing a laptop and not just, say an iPad Pro.

Are you sure that you want to switch then? If the software that you use most isn't available on Mac or doesn't have a Mac equivalent that you like, can you be happy with the machine? VMWare Fusion and Parallels let you run WindowsARM through emulation and it's great, but not everything runs on WindowsARM.

M-series Macs can no longer run x86 Windows or dual-boot. Of the many advantages of Apple silicon, the loss of x86 support is a real deal breaker for many.

 

[leifp]

I’ll not pretend to be an expert here (the last time I used CAD professionally was turn of the millennium) but it seems that AutoDesk does make macOS versions of some of their toys (not Fusion, unless I misunderstood). This might be of use: https://all3dp.com/2/best-free-cad-software-for-mac/

Or, you know, stick with Windows. Sometimes there are no (real) alternatives to ones preferences…

 

[Just_Kevin]

Fusion does support Mac silicon now, somewhat recently. I’ve read mixed reports on how well it runs. I think I currently have more reasons to switch than stay. Amazon and Apple both have decent return policies if the Mac won’t work for me.

Two worst cases, beyond returning the MB, is I run F360 on work laptop, or get a desktop PC for it.

 

[Just_Kevin]

Following up.

I picked up a MBP with the M3 Pro Chip, 12/18 Cores, 18GB and 1TB. I went with this configuration primarily to keep the cost down, also based on availability and what I thought would fit my needs. I figured I had 14 days to do my own real world testing and exchange for a more powerful machine, or abandon Mac altogether if necessary.

The good news is I've had no performance related issues so far. I did get the spinning color-wheel, beachball a few times, cannot say why since I was not running any memory or CPU hungry programs at the time, and the Memory Pressure was low. I've been keeping the Memory Pressure screen open in the background while I am doing more demanding tasks like working in Fusion 360 and slicing 3D files for printing. I've yet to see it go yellow. Files slice in a fraction of the time vs my old Windows box. To be fair to it, it is a three year old Surface and not designed to do what I started asking of it in the last year.

I'm most likely keeping this MBP, but I am not 100% on it just yet. As much as I'm trying, I'm really struggling getting used to certain aspects of the MacOS. For example, how you cannot do a cmd-x > cmd-v to MOVE a file or folder, it only COPIES/Duplicates it. I'm working around that currently by using Forklift to actually move the files around. It is a little slower, but doable. I've just created a new post looking for help on another challenge I've run into as well.

I want to be satisfied and make the transition, it certainly is convenient since I have the iPhone and iPad as well. I have 9 days left to keep plugging away and trying to adapt before I need to make a final decision.

 

[Kotsos81]

You can move a file using cmd+c -> option+cmd+v. The option modifier key converts the original copy (cmd+c) to a cut.

In general, option key unlocks many interesting features. Google about its use, along with the most important keyboard shortcuts. It will make your life easier.

 

[leifp]

“I did get the spinning color-wheel, beachball a few times, cannot say why since I was not running any memory or CPU hungry programs at the time, and the Memory Pressure was low.”

When you first begin using a Mac it indexes and works in the background improving the efficiency of the entire system. If you still get those beachballs appearing while running the same programs in a few days time there might be an issue but not when new.