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Blackstick

macrumors 65816
Aug 11, 2014
1,214
5,821
OH
Worked at Apple Stores in South Florida for 7 years. A vast amount of customers were South/Central Americans with enough Brazilians we always had multiple Portuguese speaking specialists staffed. Only the richest Brazilianaires with the means to travel to the US and still afford to buy Apple products.

Apple products cost 2-3x down there compared to what they cost here. Truly products for the rich only. Maybe this will help some.
 
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StoneJack

macrumors 68020
Dec 19, 2009
2,434
1,528
Worked at Apple Stores in South Florida for 7 years. A vast amount of customers were South/Central Americans with enough Brazilians we always had multiple Portuguese speaking specialists staffed. Only the richest Brazilianaires with the means to travel to the US and still afford to buy Apple products.

Apple products cost 2-3x down there compared to what they cost here. Truly products for the rich only. Maybe this will help some.
The fact that their own government does that to their own people is horrible. And yet these are countries probably richest in the world in terms of natural resources.
 

neuropsychguy

macrumors 68020
Sep 29, 2008
2,387
5,692
I don’t understand why Apple charges $1400 for an $800 phone in Brazil.
"high import fees levied on electronics in Brazil"

Apple doesn't charge Brazilians higher prices just because it can. It charges higher prices because of Brazil's government's policies. Currency rates can also affect the price.
 
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Skyscraperfan

macrumors 6502a
Oct 13, 2021
761
2,127
When I was in Rio de Janeiro, I had my big camera around my neck on the first day, but locals approached me all the time and told me that it is very dangerous to visibly carry a camera. Especially in Rio everybody can tell you a horror story. Sometimes robbers with guns run into a hotel and rob all the guests. Sometimes they stop a public bus and rob all the passengers. On the most expensive shopping street a guy in a store told me that sometimes stores are robbed in broad daylight by a large group of armed people coming from the nearly favelas. In Rio accidentally driving into the "wrong" neighbourhood can get you killed. You should not be seen coming out of an expensive hotel like the famous "Copacabana Palace", because robbers might follow you until they find the perfect spot to rob you. There are millions (!) of illegal guns just in Rio de Janeiro alone. It is sad what happened to one of the most beautiful cities in the world.

Of course you can have a nice time in Rio. More than 99% of tourist will NOT get robbed and they will return home and tell everyone what a peaceful and wonderful place Rio is.

Personally I love Central Park in New York City at night, but then I talk to locals from New York City and they tell me how crazy I am to walk through Central Park at night. So I can understand why some people feel safe in Rio. You always feel safe until you are the victim of a robbery.

There are also good developments in Brazil though. Sao Paulo once was infamous for being one of the most dangerous large cities in the world. That has changed drastically. Nowadays Sao Paulo is the safest major city in Brazil. It went the opposite direction of Rio, where crime surges more and more every year.
 

Kaikidan

macrumors regular
Jul 3, 2017
181
167
I don’t understand why Apple charges $1400 for an $800 phone in Brazil.

Brazil has a import fee of 60%, that came from the 80-90s when they where trying to "protect the national industry" and had a over protective goverment on national matters, devalued currency, the confiscation of money from people reserves, the exchange from cruzeiro to real to try to value the currency etc etc etc.

Normally when purchasing anything from outside, specially chinese market places, there was basically a taxation wheel spin caused by the inneficiency of the postal services, when you could either buy something and pay no taxes or be taxed a lot by a arbitrary ammount ("hummm here says it costs 78USD in the import declaration, but we think that it 's real value is 230USD based on our random arbitrary reasoning, so You need to pay us 350 in taxes" was pretty common) , 70-80% of the time you product would get there without incurring taxes.

Goverment was angry because of the lax fiscalization and the huge ammount of people opting to purchase outside even with the wheel spin, because of the surreal taxes on the internal market, and... less tax money is less money in their pockets and it was also making the store owners mad by lossing customers to aliexpress and shein, since instead of purchasing the same chines eproduct from them for 5x time the price, people purchased from chinese sellers directly, and so after much consideration, goverment decided that instead of leviating the taxes for a more sane ammount increassing comsuption and so gathering more money from lesser taxes in the process, like most other countries, they got lobbied pretty hard by the "national industry" to try to increase even more. in the end they decided that for imported purchases under 50USD you only pay 17% ot tax, but for purchases above 50USD the tax currently is at 93%, and they increased the fiscalization to make sure taxes are being paid, not because they expect people will buy, but kinda of as a barrier to importation as a whole since hardly anyone will try to purchase something paying fdouble the price, in a atempt to force people to buy from the lobbied industry internally. Basically if something costs 50usd you will pay 59USD, but if said thing costs 50,01USD you will pay 97USD for it. thats for you purchasing directly from the internet as a customer, if you purchase from a store or something, them there is even more taxes over the import taxes.

Paraguay, on the other side, decided to go to the oposite direction and focus on welcoming imports, so much so that they have basically triple the variety of products most of it don't comking to brazilian market because it would be too expensive and no one would be able to buy anyway, for 1/3 of the price. So when you need something very specific people tend to travel to paraguay frontier for a day or so via bus or plane, and purchase things there, (by law you can bring 500USD of products import tax free from terrestrial frontier, or 1000USD via plane, but as always, 99% of the time there is no one to fiscalize that...) and it will be cheapper than buying here, or most of the time it would not even sell here in the national market.

last time I've gone there myself, hotel+plane to Foz was like 50USD, then I purchased a 8tb hard drive, 2 128gb sd cards, 1 512gb nvme, a satechi mac mini dock, a 65W GAN charger and some other smaller things for 465USD, 515USD taking into account travel expenses, If I was to buy here, just the 99usd dock alone would cost at least 200USD and the 8tb drive 350USD.
 
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Mchuv

macrumors newbie
Jul 16, 2020
14
13
I don’t understand why Apple charges $1400 for an $800 phone in Brazil.
It's because taxes, I'm from Perú if you want to sell an iphone in My country as a bussiness you must pay %25 as "tariff duty" and then as seller you must pay 18% as "Sales taxes", and also you have to win, let say 25%, at the end you must add 25% + 25% + 18% of taxes to the final price. In some countries Apple have only resellers or dealers, there are no Apple offices. In Perú if you have an iPhone people think you are wealthy, but if they see you are wearing modest clothing, they assume it's a stolen iPhone. Since the arrival of Venezuelan refugees, robberies in Peru have increased exponentially. I don't use AirPods because they would know I have an iPhone; instead, I use wired EarPods and walk calmly without anyone trying to rob me.
 
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erasr

macrumors 6502a
Sep 18, 2007
619
410
Some of you lot need to watch Kurt Caz to see how ‘dangerous’ these ‘dangerous’ areas really are.

Absolute nonsense.
 

contacos

macrumors 601
Nov 11, 2020
4,717
18,326
Mexico City living in Berlin
In Brazil showing an iPhone in public makes you a prime target for robbery. Foreign tourists are even advised to "look poor" to avoid getting robbed. And poor means poor even by Brazilian standards. So you should basically look like a homeless person.

I always take an older generation phone when I visit my family in Mexico but I also recommend people to do the same for places like Spain.

Here are some of my experiences over the year

  1. Barcelona: I was walking along the beach in the evening and suddenly I feel something pulling on my belt. Turns out a woman sneaked her hand into my pocket without me even noticing (yes, like in the movies!) and held my phone in her hand, thankfully it was tied to my belt with one of those hooks and people were making fun of me beforehand for "exaggerating" !
  2. Mexico City: My dad and I were on the way to a shopping center and a car was being annoying on the traffic light behind us. My dad (typical!) hit the break on purpose and drove slower which seemed to have pissed them off and then they followed us to the parking lot of the shopping center and threatened my dad through the car window to hand over his phone
  3. Bogota: I was on the bus, sitting on the aisle next to a guy on the window seat, trying to select music on his iPhone and suddenly a guy standing in the aisle pulls out a knife and threatens the guy sitting next to me with me in between to hand over his iPhone. This one was the most scary one so far because he literally pulled out his knife and moved his knife towards the guy while I was sitting in between like uhh hello do you not see me
HOWEVER, a friend also got her iPhone stolen in Berlin and my cousin in Paris so this isnt necessarily just a latin American problem but you expect it more in your every day life to happen there unfortunately
 
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Kaikidan

macrumors regular
Jul 3, 2017
181
167
I always take an older generation phone when I visit my family in Mexico but I also recommend people to do the same for places like Spain.

Here are some of my experiences over the year

  1. Barcelona: I was walking along the beach in the evening and suddenly I feel something pulling on my belt. Turns out a woman sneaked her hand into my pocket without me even noticing (yes, like in the movies!) and held my phone in her hand, thankfully it was tied to my belt with one of those hooks and people were making fun of me beforehand for "exaggerating" !
  2. Mexico City: My dad and I were on the way to a shopping center and a car was being annoying on the traffic light behind us. My dad (typical!) hit the break on purpose and drove slower which seemed to have pissed them off and then they followed us to the parking lot of the shopping center and threatened my dad through the car window to hand over his phone
  3. Bogota: I was on the bus, sitting on the aisle next to a guy on the window seat, trying to select music on his iPhone and suddenly a guy standing in the aisle pulls out a knife and threatens the guy sitting next to me with me in between to hand over his iPhone. This one was the most scary one so far because he literally pulled out his knife and moved his knife towards the guy while I was sitting in between like uhh hello do you not see me
HOWEVER, a friend also got her iPhone stolen in Berlin and my cousin in Paris so this isnt necessarily just a latin American problem but you expect it more in your every day life to happen there unfortunately
The biggest problem in Brazil is not being robbed in itself, is that murder is "normalized" in those situations, being robbed and don't complying, or not noticing, resisting, basically any other action can and most of the time will result in you being dead, since they know nothing will be done about it. with tourists it's more uncommon since they don't want to scare they out of the country, but if you live there... I saw some cases of people being shot because the robber didn't liked that the people only had so much money with them or that the cellphone was too old or just because they felt like doing it.
 
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YourBoss

macrumors member
Sep 22, 2020
48
48
In Brazil showing an iPhone in public makes you a prime target for robbery. Foreign tourists are even advised to "look poor" to avoid getting robbed. And poor means poor even by Brazilian standards. So you should basically look like a homeless person.
Well, all this xenophobia just showed how much you don't know about Brazil. Robbery exists anywhere in the world. Of course, here in Brazil some more touristy places are more targeted by criminals, as is also the case with the Eiffel Tower in Paris, France.
 

luigismalucelli

macrumors member
Jan 23, 2011
41
73
Well, all this xenophobia just showed how much you don't know about Brazil. Robbery exists anywhere in the world. Of course, here in Brazil some more touristy places are more targeted by criminals, as is also the case with the Eiffel Tower in Paris, France.
I feel very offended by all this xenophobia, they clearly never been to Brazil and are saying the most stereotypical things. It infuriates me.
 
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shadowboi

macrumors member
Feb 16, 2024
92
100
Unknown
Looks like economic pre-war measures and not just a tariffs workaround. In case smth happens in Taiwan strait in 2025 they will not loose much money as soon as sanctions hit China
 

apparatchik

macrumors 6502a
Mar 6, 2008
845
2,615
Argentina and Brazil are closed economies with very high import duties, high taxation and large bureaucracies. Brazil at least has a large enough internal market (around 25% of the population is not poor, and would classify as middle and upper class by international standards, which would make it as a potential market around the size of France or Germany) that it might make sense to assemble (with imported parts) some products locally, but certainly not the full range of iPhone or iPad models.
 

apparatchik

macrumors 6502a
Mar 6, 2008
845
2,615
I feel very offended by all this xenophobia, they clearly never been to Brazil and are saying the most stereotypical things. It infuriates me.

It is mostly true, though, certain cities, like Rio, are among the most dangerous in the planet, full of crime, drugs and prostitution.
 
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fbr$

macrumors 6502a
Feb 6, 2020
547
1,124
Don't think Apple will lower iPhone 15 prices in Brazil because the iPhone 13 and 14 models will continue to be imported so they can not have prices lowered.
 

DOD250

macrumors newbie
Sep 14, 2023
3
12
I'm Brazilian and here Apple devices are synonymous with social status, luxury, wealth.
The market is dominated by brands such as Samsung, Motorola and Xiaomi as they have more basic devices at a lower price.
The price of Apple in Brazil generally costs twice as much as in the USA, but as Brazilians have a lower salary, it ends up costing a lot.
Interestingly, in Brazil, Samsung's top devices such as the S24 Ultra cost much cheaper than an iPhone 15 Pro Max, unlike the prices charged in the USA and Europe.
 
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svish

macrumors G3
Nov 25, 2017
9,592
25,441
Happy to hear that production outside China is expanding. This move should definitely help in reducing prices in Brazil. Will be good if Pro models are also manufactured. Seems like Pro models are manufactured in China only
 
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amartinez1660

macrumors 68000
Sep 22, 2014
1,577
1,606
So glad to hear that what used to be my neighbor country is making strides of this magnitude! Obrigado por mostrar o exemplo!
This is the type of endeavors that can over time lift the country from the poverty line… even if the gap widens between rich and poor for now due to it, doesn’t matter as long as overall everyone is better long term and gives everyone a leg up to do orders of magnitude better.
This is something my previous home country could only dream off.

None needed. All of us know this, it's common knowledge in South America. It's why many of us have two phones, one for going out and another for home.
Agreed, with the advent of the very first iPhone some people still kept their previous flip phones in case they got robbed they would give that one. And that was 15+ years ago, today you really have to look modest to poor, no jewelry and all that… robbers rip earrings bloodily to pedestrians and drivers stuck in traffic with their windows down (never drive with your windows down in there).
(For those complaining, nothing xenophobic about this, so spare me that condescending tone, I’m from one of those countries, lived it through and through)

It's because taxes, I'm from Perú if you want to sell an iphone in My country as a bussiness you must pay %25 as "tariff duty" and then as seller you must pay 18% as "Sales taxes", and also you have to win, let say 25%, at the end you must add 25% + 25% + 18% of taxes to the final price. In some countries Apple have only resellers or dealers, there are no Apple offices. In Perú if you have an iPhone people think you are wealthy, but if they see you are wearing modest clothing, they assume it's a stolen iPhone. Since the arrival of Venezuelan refugees, robberies in Peru have increased exponentially. I don't use AirPods because they would know I have an iPhone; instead, I use wired EarPods and walk calmly without anyone trying to rob me.
I’m so sorry to hear this. I don’t know where to put my head in the sand anymore. I quit that country a decade and a half ago very high up north… until that attitude and nonsense got exported and has reached places.
It truly is the few that poison the well, but they poison it so massively and so “many few” that it’s crazy. I don’t know why, and it isn’t personal, they attack and rob their own citizen brothers with the same full force.
I promise you, ourselves are victims of the same 😞

That has nothing to do with xenophobia. The murder rates are public. It is more likely to get murdered in a week in Brazil than in a year in my home country. When I was in Rio in 2016, the murder rate was over 100 per week. That is an insane number.
I don’t know why people find stats xenophobic or racist or similar, I’m starting to think it’s because they are in it and don’t want people to know… because else it serves no purpose.
My fellow countrymen get seriously upset and irrational when I explain why I left, blind nationalism/tribalism is a thing.

Let me up that one, when I left my country the murder rate for my city was at 100 per WEEKEND (not week, WEEKEND, not country, a SINGLE city), 95% of those crimes aren’t solved (and never will be, it’s just insurmountable). At some point they would equate those deaths as being way more than many wars (gulf war and whatnot) combined.

In any case, glad to see Brazil holding a beacon there, it’s already an economical powerhouse, this goes in the right direction even more.
 
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