MP 1,1-5,1 Apple MacPro4.1 with 2xCPUs board is UNABLE to use RAMslots 5–8 PROBLEM (?)

[K.J.]

Hi there to ALL and @tsialex ,

I would like to ask you for some specific unrecovered MacPro 4.1/upged to 5.1 PROBLEM
I have 2 CPUs board and Iam not able to use any of 5–8 RAM slots - With tem MAC not boot or unattended shutdowns ... I realy does "everything" from 12 different 100% checked sets of RAM modulse, any type of congigurations, all disasembeled... tried 4 different CPU boards and 4 different MacPros 4.1 and upged to 5.1 FW to eliminate rest MAC HW problem stuff till ASD AHT testing and another SW tools but "all stills looks working" but its not true.
So if I use only slots 1–4 everything works OKAY. I have used and using this MAC everyday a now Iam in this situation.
Please can you help me to resolve this complications and be able again to use all RAM slots (?)

TechSpecs are:
Apple MacPro 4.1 FW flashed to 5.1 with matched Pair Intel Xeon X5690 3.46GHz 6.4GT/s 12MB 6 Core 1333GHz LGA 1366 CPU and 64GB - Elpida 16 GB DDR3-1333 PC3L-10600R CL9 Server ECC RAM.

Thank you,
K.J.

 

[tsialex]

Did you inverted the Xeons positions to see if the non-working slots change to 1-4?

 

[K.J.]

Did you inverted the Xeons positions to see if the non-working slots change to 1-4?

YES and tried 3 different SETs with different types of Xeon versions sets in both positions anx mixtures. The same BAD result...

It just happend and now its persistent, but if will be there some HW failure it will be appeard sure at AST AHT monitoring/tests...

It was originally setled as 2x 2.66Xeon from factory and happend as it was before any HW changes.
But Iam unable to identify possible problem because if it will be HW it will be POSTed at measures/test/diagnostics

After all I tried at ladt to do CPU changes/upgrades to may correct "problem" but it not helped me out.

 

[tsialex]

YES and tried 3 different SETs with different types of Xeon versions sets in both positions anx mixtures. The same BAD result...

It just happend and now its persistent, but if will be there some HW failure it will be appeard sure at AST AHT monitoring/tests...

It was originally setled as 2x 2.66Xeon from factory and happend as it was before any HW changes.
But Iam unable to identify possible problem because if it will be HW it will be POSTed at measures/test/diagnostics

So, let me understand, this happens with multiple CPU trays, multiple pairs of Xeons, multiple Mac Pros? This makes no logic at all.

Are you sure that you are not mixing UDIMMs with RDIMMs?

AHT/ASD don't detect problems with QPI links. There are lot's of X5690 on the Chinese market that only have one QPI link working and only work correctly with single CPU trays.

 

[K.J.]

So, let me understand, this happens with multiple CPU trays, multiple pairs of Xeons, multiple Mac Pros? This makes no logic at all. Are you sure that you are not mixing UDIMMs with RDIMMs?

AHT/ASD don't detect problems with QPI links. There are lot's of X5690 on the Chinese market that only have one QPI link working and only work correctly with single CPU trays.

Sorry for misunderstooding info... resolving:
It firstly happend with Apple original defaul factory HW config without any HW changes on MP 4.1. Computer started often REstrating due unexpected reason...after OFF autostarting shuttied down... after few weeks it was every day till NOT agle to started .. no LEDs no chimes just Ojn and OFF ... after few repeating ONs it was started and often shutdown or smoentimes 1 day runs and shutted down... So it was STARTING POINT to do some operations to fing the problme and correct it.

And about CPUs/boards ets... it is DUAL CPU board so it must have same matched pairs of CPUs. I tried 3 different measured 100% working (in other machines) CPU for that board and tired too changing tem from 1. postition to the 2. sure in one set of mateched pairs to conclude tkat RAM slots will changed by the CPU managing from 5–8 to 1–4 but its not.

So conclusion is after all that "PROBLEM" is only with that one CPU/RAM board. But any changes wich will working in other the same versions of MacPros 4.1 + uppedFW to 5.1 dont corresting the RAM slots 5–8 to work again.

Is it now more accurate?

 

[K.J.]

If there will be some HW error it will be apperade in any of possible channels or errors or not-correct-functioning MAC ... but with only 64GB RAM ECC in slots 1–4 its running more than 3/4year NONSTOP everyday used for V-RAY a Blender creations and rendering...without any error/problems.... So Iam triing to find and correct "the problem"...

 

[K.J.]

and about RAM modules ... ALL are deeply tested and heated in 2 MacPros before putting to test in the problematic one.
I Tried NON ECCs and ECCs modules and i cant be mixtured sure ... Really the problem is not with the RAM modules.

 

[tsialex]

Don't do multiple posts, this is not a support chat, try to be concise and read what you are writing, you are putting to much unrelated information and I'm having trouble to decipher what you are trying to tell. My time is extremely limited.

First thing, there is no matched pair with Nehalem/Westmere Xeons at all. Matched pair Xeons are a thing from the long past. For Nehalem/Westmere Xeons, you just need to get the exactly same S-Spec Xeons and then you have "a matched pair".

Second, did all 8 DIMMs work simultaneously with another dual CPU Mac Pro?

Third, how you are sure that the problem is not your CPU tray itself?

 

[K.J.]

Don't do multiple posts, this is not a support chat, try to be concise and read what you are writing, you are putting to much unrelated information and I'm having trouble to decipher what you are trying to tell. My time is extremely limited.

First thing, there is no matched pair with Nehalem/Westmere Xeons at all. Matched pair Xeons are a thing from the long past.

Second, did all 8 DIMMs work simultaneously with another dual CPU Mac Pro? How you are sure that the problem is not your CPU tray itself?

ad CPUs:
originally was maded by Apple/Intel from fabric without any user changes where it was firstli happend
"matched pairs" iam tanslating form eBay whera Iam buing CPUs for MACs 4.1/5.1 without any problems at all

ad RAM modules:
ALL pairs and sets ar firstly deeply tested and checked in other 2 MacPros before putting or triing to correct the problems with "wrong one"

ad CPU/RAM tray:
How can I identify/display/find the problem if the Tray is wrong ... or anything on Tray wich will causing unusable RAM slots 5–8 (?)

 

[tsialex]

ad CPUs:
originally was maded by Apple/Intel from fabric without any user changes where it was firstli happend
"matched pairs" iam tanslating form eBay whera Iam buing CPUs for MACs 4.1/5.1 without any problems at all

This is seller talk. There are no matched pairs with Nehalem/Westmere Xeons. You can buy one from China and another one from the computer shop down the road and both will work fine (if both are working Xeons).

ad RAM modules:
ALL pairs and sets ar firstly deeply tested and checked in other 2 MacPros before putting or triing to correct the problems with "wrong one"

What you wrote don't answer my question at all. Again, did you tested all eight DIMMs simultaneously with a dual CPU tray Mac Pro?

ad CPU/RAM tray:
How can I identify/display/find the problem if the Tray is wrong ... or anything on Tray wich will causing unusable RAM slots 5–8 (?)

There are too much points of failure on a dual CPU tray to diagnose what the real problem is outside a lab. AHT and ASD just check the basics.

Install your Xeons and the 8 DIMMs on another dual CPU tray and check if the combo it's working, if it is, then can only be two problems, your CPU tray is defective or you have a defective backplane.

If your problematic tray works correctly with another Mac Pro, then you isolated the problem to the backplane.

 

[K.J.]

ad RAM

This is seller talk. There are no matched pairs with Nehalem/Westmere Xeons. You can buy one from China and another one from the computer shop down the road and both will work fine (if both are working Xeons).


What you wrote don't answer my question at all. Again, did you tested all eight DIMMs simultaneously with a dual CPU tray Mac Pro?


There are too much points of failure on a dual CPU tray to diagnose what the real problem is outside a lab. AHT and ASD just check the basics.

Install your Xeons and the 8 DIMMs on another dual CPU tray and check if the combo it's working, if it is, then can only be two problems, your CPU tray is defective or you have a defective backplane.

If your problematic tray works correctly with another Mac Pro, then you isolated the problem to the backplane.

ad RAM:
YES I tested ALL 8 dimms simultaneously in 3 different dual CPU MacPros
I tried any type of working combinations tested in 2 fully working MacPros after to put them in 3.rd problematic MacPro

ad TRAY:
If I put it in any other MacPro the RAM slot 5–8 notworking promlem is the same - not working 5–8 slots
I tried tio switch xeons between 3 same MacPros - problme the same

OKAY so we can say that really CPU/RAM TRAY is the problem- but how can I idnetify and repair/correct the problem on my TRAY. Iam sure thet the problme is now only with the Tray but I want to identify and try to correct it.
Not only to deside to buy a new one Dual Tray - its not cheap...

 

[tsialex]

ad RAM

ad RAM:
YES I tested ALL 8 dimms simultaneously in 3 different dual CPU MacPros
I tried any type of working combinations tested in 2 fully working MacPros after to put them in 3.rd problematic MacPro

ad TRAY:
If I put it in any other MacPro the RAM slot 5–8 notworking promlem is the same - not working 5–8 slots
I tried tio switch xeons between 3 same MacPros - problme the same

OKAY so we can say that really CPU/RAM TRAY is the problem- but how can I idnetify and repair/correct the problem on my TRAY. Iam sure thet the problme is now only with the Tray but I want to identify and try to correct it.
Not only to deside to buy a new one Dual Tray - its not cheap...

So, you got to the point that besides checking for bent CPU socket pins on the CPU tray and applying some de-oxidant spray, there are nothing else that an end user can do to get a defective CPU tray working again.

Btw, even if you find someone capable to diagnose/repair your dual CPU tray, it's probably not really economical for an early-2009 dual CPU tray.

 

[K.J.]

So, you got to the point that besides checking for bent CPU socket pins on the CPU tray and applying some de-oxidant spray, there are nothing else that an end user can do to get a defective CPU tray working again.

Btw, even if you find someone capable to repair your dual CPU tray, it's probably not really economical for early-2009 CPU trays.

Conclusion:
OKay so Iam end of abilities only to find and buy NEW used dual CPU tray.
So now its working with half RAM slots at 64GB great but Iam unable to achieve more RAM only tu buy new Tray

And I cannot search and find in my power user conditions/tools "the problem" on my Tray.
I have 2x MoBos to maybe try to re-glue in LAB some parts ... but I must them first identify by my conditions.

 

[tsialex]

And I cannot search and find in my power user conditions/tools "the problem" on my Tray.
I have 2x MoBos to maybe try to re-glue in LAB some parts ... but I must them first identify by my conditions.

Even if you are a experienced technician and have all the tools to diagnose the CPU tray PCB, like high frequency oscilloscopes and logic analyser with enough channels to cover the memory controller/CPU, Apple never made the circuit diagram and schematics available nor it's ever leaked.

So, it's not an easy task even for someone working on this type of thing day in and out.

 

[K.J.]

Even if you are a experienced technician and have all the tools to diagnose the CPU tray PCB, like high frequency oscilloscopes and logic analyser with enough channels to cover the memory controller/CPU, Apple never made the circuit diagram and schematics available nor it's ever leaked.

So, it's not an easy task even for someone working on this type of thing day in and out.

...damn... I know ;–(
So I have deadend wrong part od my CPU/RAM Tray but I can use it act as now only with 64RAM/1–4slots. So thats not so bad )
If I want to be cleared out with full working RAM slots I must to buy "new/used" CPU/RAM tray...

Thak you very much for you effort time and help and sorry me for bothering you.
Have a nice days and thx,
K.J.

 

[rorydaredking]

So, you got to the point that besides checking for bent CPU socket pins on the CPU tray and applying some de-oxidant spray, there are nothing else that an end user can do to get a defective CPU tray working again.

Btw, even if you find someone capable to diagnose/repair your dual CPU tray, it's probably not really economical for an early-2009 dual CPU tray.

Thanks for the suggestion of de-oxidant spray, I'll give that a go in mine. I have a similar issue with CPU B and slots 5-8 on my 4.1 upgraded to a 5.1. Won't boot with any RAM in slots 5-7, but no red lights on the tray. As soon as I remove the RAM it boots fine. With RAM in slot 8, it will boot but no red light and not detected by the OS, but I have a thought this may be as its a channel shared with slot 7 and so may not detect unless slot 7 is populated?