Apple Supplier Catcher Accused of Endangering and Exploiting Factory Workers

[noodlemanc]

Capitalism is a horrible system.

It's not really a "system", it's just what happens when people are free to trade freely. And it's horrible compared to what? Capitalism is the only reason we're not still living in caves, and is why those Chinese workers aren't engaging in back-breaking agricultural labour (which is far worse than factory work, otherwise they'd still be doing it).

 

[Aluminum213]

It's not really a "system", it's just what happens when people are free to trade freely. And it's horrible compared to what? Capitalism is the only reason we're not still living in caves, and is why those Chinese workers aren't engaging in back-breaking agricultural labour (which is far worse than factory work, otherwise they'd still be doing it).

I'm glad to see you get your education from Fox News

 

[linuxcooldude]

No, just their own supply chain.

A job that the Chinese government should be doing in its own country. We have diplomats and the US government to deal with that, not commercial businesses.

It seems pointless to argue that other companies are doing it too, so therefore it is okay. I'd be far more interested in data on turnover rates, and applicant acceptance rates. I would assume that the conditions are misrepresented if people are applying for these jobs in droves, and employees are not quitting.

The turn over rate for many Chinese factories is quite high. If the working conditions are that bad there are many other factories to work in, and many do.

 

[carlgo]

I think it is wrong to not hire people just because they don't have enough tattoos.

Their recycling system is about as high tech as hobos at the aluminum can center.

 

[octothorpe8]

A job that the Chinese government should be doing in its own country. We have diplomats and the US government to deal with that, not commercial businesses.

Are we thinking of the same Chinese government? Because the one I'm thinking of has a pretty atrocious record on human rights.

What you're advocating is a "see no evil, hear no evil" approach where we just merrily outsource our factory labor and don't worry about what goes on over there. Fortunately, there are companies and consumers who don't quite share your nonchalant libertarian view on the matter.

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Capitalism is the only reason we're not still living in caves

I believe you're thinking of agriculture and animal husbandry, neither of which are exclusive to pure capitalism.

 

[linuxcooldude]

Are we thinking of the same Chinese government? Because the one I'm thinking of has a pretty atrocious record on human rights.

What you're advocating is a "see no evil, hear no evil" approach where we just merrily outsource our factory labor and don't worry about what goes on over there. Fortunately, there are companies and consumers who don't quite share your nonchalant libertarian view on the matter.

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I believe you're thinking of agriculture and animal husbandry, neither of which are exclusive to pure capitalism.

So what have you done for these atrocities? I'm guessing pretty much nothing. You are probably using hundreds of products from these so called sweat shops but expect Apple to do it for you.

 

[Mousse]

The floor is said to be littered with aluminum-magnesium alloy shreddings and there are heavy amounts of dust in the air, which poses a health and fire safety risk.

Fire safety risk. Understatement of the week. Magnesium is very flammable and very, very difficult to extinguish once it ignites. I hope they don't have a sprinkler in the building or KABOOOM!!! no more building.

 

[octothorpe8]

So what have you done for these atrocities? I'm guessing pretty much nothing. You are probably using hundreds of products from these so called sweat shops but expect Apple to do it for you.

You're right. As an American consumer I'm part of the problem. But hey, at least I don't go around saying corporations should ignore human rights violations.

 

[linuxcooldude]

You're right. As an American consumer I'm part of the problem. But hey, at least I don't go around saying corporations should ignore human rights violations.

But yet you choose to ignore the problem yourself and put it on someone else.

 

[octothorpe8]

But yet you choose to ignore the problem yourself and put it on someone else.

Who told you I'm ignoring the problem? What do you know about me or what I do, troll?

 

[SockRolid]

... Metal shreddings created during the production process of Apple product covers ...

Two words: "robots," "liquidmetal."

 

[noodlemanc]

I'm glad to see you get your education from Fox News

Such a compelling argument.

Can you explain what part of my post was invalid? Would we be better off without capitalism? Would those Chinese works be better off without capitalism? Is there a "system" that is superior to capitalism?

 

[TechGod]

Is it wrong as a rich white westerner who buys a lot of Apple's products that I couldn't care less?

Yes it is wrong.

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That's across the board, corporations objective equals profit for shareholders. It would be the same for Samsung, Nokia, HTC the list goes on... With Apple it's particularly true as their margins are known to be so high.

Capitalism is a horrible system. I'll be raped for that in these forums however the fact is clear. WE in the West have it relatively cushy because we've fought for so long to make capitalism more comfortable for us - thank you unions of old, not the newer ones that are so closely linked to the system. However with recessions, dips etc. capitalism can take it back at any stage.

Because competition is so harsh in this sector somebody has got to suffer, and it's these workers - they're the pressure point. When you're phone price goes down or someone else comes into the market to compete, these poor bastards are told to work harder for less money and more hours. Remember what you're holding has Chinese blood and sweat gone into it - literally what's in your hand.

"The dignity of labour never rang true to me" - Chumbawamba

Unfortunately, we don't have a better system that we can replace capitalism with.

 

[vartanarsen]

INteresting….what happens when humans inhale metal shred dust?

 

[mazz0]

How much would it actually cost, per device, to manufacture these items in the West, where there are proper standards? I'm sure it's a huge amount in total, but that only matters to shareholders - would I end up paying substantially more for an iPad produced in America or Europe?

If you ask me, it should be illegal to sell products here (in the West) who's manufacture involved practices like those described. That would force the Western companies using these manufactures to seriously deal with the issues, and would force those manufacturers to mend their ways.

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INteresting….what happens when humans inhale metal shred dust?

They turn into cyborg zombies.

 

[Carlanga]

poor workers, its a shame.

 

[samiwas]

Capitalism is a horrible system. I'll be raped for that in these forums however the fact is clear.

I don't think Capitalism in and of itself is a horrible system. It's what brand of Capitalism the US and some other countries have chosen to practice, which is a winner-takes-all, screw-anyone-in-your-way, crush-the-competition, bleed-people-dry abortion of Capitalism.

Is it wrong as a rich white westerner who buys a lot of Apple's products that I couldn't care less?

Little bit, yeah.

Kind of like how I couldn't care how much a rich, white westerner is taxed on his earnings.

It seems pointless to argue that other companies are doing it too, so therefore it is okay. I'd be far more interested in data on turnover rates, and applicant acceptance rates. I would assume that the conditions are misrepresented if people are applying for these jobs in droves, and employees are not quitting.

Kind of a bad way to look at it in a place where there are so many people and possibly not enough jobs. People will whore themselves out just to earn anything. Just because people will work for a place doesn't mean that anything that place does is acceptable.

Why? Says who?

People who don't believe that a company should not care at all how their products are made, as long as they are reaping profits off of them. If you truly believe that it is perfectly okay to support terrible working conditions as long as you're profiting, then you're a pretty sick individual.

It's kind of like these allegations coming out of Qatar with the number of deaths related to building the new World Cup facilities. Should everyone just say "Oh well, there are still workers...must not be that bad"? Or should pressure be put on those involved to make things better?

A job that the Chinese government should be doing in its own country. We have diplomats and the US government to deal with that, not commercial businesses.

No, a business cannot really force a foreign company to do something different, but they CAN choose not to do business with them, and instead do business with a more favorable supplier.

The turn over rate for many Chinese factories is quite high. If the working conditions are that bad there are many other factories to work in, and many do.

Ah, yes. The "if they don't like it, they can leave" mentality. I refer you back to my first paragraph.

 

[noodlemanc]

How much would it actually cost, per device, to manufacture these items in the West, where there are proper standards? I'm sure it's a huge amount in total, but that only matters to shareholders - would I end up paying substantially more for an iPad produced in America or Europe?

It's hard to say, as due to much higher labour costs in the U.S or Europe it's likely that manufactures would invest much more in robots/labour saving devices, so that they won't have to pay as many workers. In the long term it wouldn't affect the price of Apple products that much, as the companies would find ways like these to make it work.

I don't understand how this would help the Chinese workers, though? China was historically an agricultural society, where the most people worked the land and were very poor. As the country industrialised many workers moved to the cities to work in factories, due to the either higher pay, better conditions or both. The industrialisation has helped pave the way for China to become a first world country sometime in the future -- already the middle class in China is 300 million, making up 50% of the urban population.

At one point Hong Kong had the sweat-shops, but eventually when the country developed enough so that people wouldn't work in those conditions for that pay the factories left the city and moved to poorer parts of the world. But developing economies need those factories initially to propel them from agriculture into industry. If those jobs are taken away then how will the peasants working the land ever become middle class?