Best Canon HV20 mini DV camcorder replacement?

[Rizvi1]

Pulled my Canon HV20 out for the first time in a year to record the kids' presentations at their school, but ended up just learning it's time to retire this. I was fighting all the problems - battery, skipping during playback, etc. But now I can't connect it to my computer anymore, it seems it's not compatible with the latest iMovie. I was already working with my older computer (a 2015 13" MPB) rather than my main computer a 2019 16" MPB because of the Firewire Port to Thunderbolt connection. But now I'll have to go work on editing on an old mac mini at my parents'.

I'm wondering what's good that's out there that's of the same caliber because this got the job done well for my needs - recording stand-up, recording events at the school, etc.

The mics that I use with the camcorder are the AT-822 (connected via an azden mount) as well as for wireless, the Saramonic Wireless VHF Handheld Mic. My tripod I have, the Sony VCT-870RM (bought for use w/ my original Sony HC1, now long gone) is barely holding on so that's probably something to replace.

Anyways, any thoughts on what I can get, please share. I'm not a fan of recording via the phone and dealing with the storage, etc so I want a dedicated device for my "professional"-ish recording needs. Especially something I can keep using some of this same equipment that I have with.

 

[einmusiker]

Honestly the iPhone camera is fine but if you really want to upgrade check out the canon m50 mark ii. Best vlogging camera on the market for the price

 

[dandeco]

Even though it's been discontinued for a little while, I'd recommend the Canon VIXIA HF R800. I have the very similar-in-specs R600, and it's great for making vlogs and other video shoots, particularly with its' tripod mount, optical image stabilization, 1080p 60fps recording (in MP4 and AVCHD), true 16:9 widescreen CCD, external microphone jack, and manual focus and image controls. For editing the footage I record, it's so quick and easy for me to take out the SD card and slide it into a card reader (either built onto the Mac or an external card reader of some kind) and then import the clips into iMovie, Final Cut Pro or whatever using the Import From Camera mode, and the quality is indeed noticeably better than Canon's later HDV camcorders like the HV20 was (I also have an HV40 myself).

 

[Rizvi1]

Honestly the iPhone camera is fine but if you really want to upgrade check out the canon m50 mark ii. Best vlogging camera on the market for the price

Ok sorry in advance for the super noob question here but what's the reasoning for using a camera as a camcorder? I know that's normal now, I see people at stand up shows recording with cameras I just never understood the reasoning.

I also have a Canon Rebel which we rarely use. My wife grabbed it years ago when she wanted to get into photography but we never did much with it. I still do have it. I'm guessing there's a bunch of reasons why older cameras couldn't be used in place of camcorders versus new cameras but just thought I'd ask.

Anyways I looked online and it looks like the Canon m50 mark II is around $700, which isn't terrible. I mean around the time of when I got my HV20, that's the price we were aiming for. I got the HV20 after losing my HC1 in a house fire. I had also just gotten a Canon XH-A1 to try to seriously get into filmmaking but lost that in the house fire too (insurance covered both so no worries). After that just stick with staying in the consumer/prosumer world of recording.

The $700 includes the 15-45mm lens which I'm guessing would be versatile enough for my needs? I know nothing about lenses. There's an option to pay an extra $230 and get a 55m-200m lens too.

Something kind of interesting is the camera with a content creator kit for $900 total and that kit has also a HG-100TBR Tripod Grip, DM-E100 Directional Microphone, and IFC-600PCU Interface Cable for connecting to a computer for making the m50 a webcam, transferring imagery, or connecting to a power adapter for charging.

If there's a compelling reason to get that variation let me know. I actually would like to have a table top tripod, especially since my current Sony VCT-870RM is dying (connector on the top broke off in diff places so barely holds on). Mic wise I've always used my AT-822 w/ my camera and would plan to keep using with whatever I replace it with.

 

[Rizvi1]

Even though it's been discontinued for a little while, I'd recommend the Canon VIXIA HF R800. I have the very similar-in-specs R600, and it's great for making vlogs and other video shoots, particularly with its' tripod mount, optical image stabilization, 1080p 60fps recording (in MP4 and AVCHD), true 16:9 widescreen CCD, external microphone jack, and manual focus and image controls. For editing the footage I record, it's so quick and easy for me to take out the SD card and slide it into a card reader (either built onto the Mac or an external card reader of some kind) and then import the clips into iMovie, Final Cut Pro or whatever using the Import From Camera mode, and the quality is indeed noticeably better than Canon's later HDV camcorders like the HV20 was (I also have an HV40 myself).

Thanks for the advice on this. I checked out some reviews and it seems like this could mostly be a good option. The biggest thing bothering me is that it doesn't have a shoe to add an external mic which I really would like to use. So that alongside it being discontinued pretty much make this a deal killer.

That said, I saw this review on the HF R800 that recommended the Panasonic HC V770 as an alternative that's a step up. Besides the shoe adapter for accessories, it supposedly also offers more features and functionality, captures notably better footage, better onboard microphone (I'm always keeping a mic on so may not be relevant for me) and better low-light performance. Only downside is the price of $600, much higher than the HF R800.

Also, do you have any thoughts on the suggestion above to get a canon m50 mark ii?

 

[ColdCase]

Ok sorry in advance for the super noob question here but what's the reasoning for using a camera as a camcorder? I know that's normal now, I see people at stand up shows recording with cameras I just never understood the reasoning.

Convenience. Even a decent phone's image stabilization produces good videos and pretty good is good enough for most. I see a lot of iPads as it has a bigger view finder

A better tool for taking photos is a photo camera, better tool for video is a video camera. If you are going to be doing both and don't want to lug around several cameras, and are willing to compromise a bit, a photo camera with good video capability (not all take good video) is a compromise most take. Most, now days, view video on a small screen, and it doesn't take a great video camera to capture good video for that purpose. They may want high resolution larger photos, however.

As you know, regular SLR type cameras that have video capability make decent video but compromises on optical image stabilization and a convenient smooth zoom (I have a EOS70). So you need a tripod or firm hand. A video specific camera provides better video making tools so it takes better videos but lacks photo tools (I have a VIXIA HF G40).

Even more convenient is just using a decent phone that you are carrying around anyway. It will have image stabilization but will lack optical zoom/range. Now days there are some phones with both excellent video and photo capability, within the limits of a small sensor and limited zoom. Unlike years ago, when phone capture was lacking, my iPhone 11 pro takes good enough photos and video that I don't take the big gun tools out much. When I'm out shooting wildlife I bring the big cameras and lenses.

 

[Genome58]

My video setup for years was my beloved HV30, recording directly to the original Atomos Ninja Star via the HDMI output jack of the HV30, thereby automatically obtaining HiRes h422 format. One thing I learned when looking for cameras to replace the HV30 (while continuing to use Atomos products): the camera must yield "clean HDMI" output, otherwise, metadata will appear on the bottom of your videos. The same applies if you record to camera and then play back the recording via the camera's HDMI output jack on a TV. Which brands and models of camera yield clean HDMI isn't immediately apparent. Also make sure there is an audio input jack. I'm not kidding. The top of the line of the now discontinued Nikon 1 line - the J5 - has gorgeous video capture, but has neither clean HDMI output nor an audio input jack. So take nothing for granted and don't rely on reviews, which never accurately reflect how YOU intend to use the device.

 

[Rizvi1]

So update on this: I ended up getting a Sony FDR-AX53 camcorder. I saw Dandeco's advice on considering the Canon VIXIA HF R800, which is where I started my search. But I really wanted an accessory shoe so I could add on a microphone.

I then considered a step up which would have been the Panasonic HC-V770. I still had more room in my budget though and saw that a 4k camera would give better HD picture than an HD camera would. So that brought me to the AX53 and the Canon G50. I was actually liking the G50 more but got a better open box deal on the AX53. I think the AX53 is for the better because the G50 has more manual control and I'm not really good with that.

I did also consider the other advice on this thread which was considering the Canon Mark II, but I'm just more comfortable with a camcorder. I don't really do still photo.

 

[dandeco]

Yeah; for my Canon VIXIA HFR600 I got an external accessory shoe mount that my camcorder can also screw onto. It looks a little cumbersome at first, but it works pretty well.

Eventually I may upgrade to a DSLR camera though, as they've been getting increasingly popular with independent filmmakers and have been getting more camcorder-esque features, like a flip-out LCD, external microphone jack, etc.

 

[gshocked]

Hi, this may be a controversial thought but I think there is still a need for video cameras vs a DSLR/mirrorless camera set-up. I'm very impressed with the image quality you can get with recent 4K video cameras, the colour reproduction and sharpness are still of a higher quality than most phones that can shoot 4K. Then the autofocus of the video camera, in most automatic settings, is still smoother than most DSLR/Mirrorless setups, although they're catching up and yes some are on par.

I'd be looking at at least a 1/2" sensor, which most Sony, Canon and Panasonic at about $1000 should have.
I'm a Canon photographer but have always used Panasonic video cameras.

What about this?
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1451710-REG/canon_3667c002_vixia_hf_g50_4k.html

or this?
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1383052-REG/panasonic_hc_vx1k_hc_vx1_4k_camcorder.html

 

[jwolf6589]

Even though it's been discontinued for a little while, I'd recommend the Canon VIXIA HF R800. I have the very similar-in-specs R600, and it's great for making vlogs and other video shoots, particularly with its' tripod mount, optical image stabilization, 1080p 60fps recording (in MP4 and AVCHD), true 16:9 widescreen CCD, external microphone jack, and manual focus and image controls. For editing the footage I record, it's so quick and easy for me to take out the SD card and slide it into a card reader (either built onto the Mac or an external card reader of some kind) and then import the clips into iMovie, Final Cut Pro or whatever using the Import From Camera mode, and the quality is indeed noticeably better than Canon's later HDV camcorders like the HV20 was (I also have an HV40 myself).

Thats there same model I have and I love it! If it broke I would get it repaired or I would have to buy a new model.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1308393-REG/canon_1959c001_vixia_hf_r80_camcorder.html

 

[jwolf6589]

Yeah; for my Canon VIXIA HFR600 I got an external accessory shoe mount that my camcorder can also screw onto. It looks a little cumbersome at first, but it works pretty well.
View attachment 1992321

Eventually I may upgrade to a DSLR camera though, as they've been getting increasingly popular with independent filmmakers and have been getting more camcorder-esque features, like a flip-out LCD, external microphone jack, etc.

Check out this model.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1308393-REG/canon_1959c001_vixia_hf_r80_camcorder.html

 

[jwolf6589]

Convenience. Even a decent phone's image stabilization produces good videos and pretty good is good enough for most. I see a lot of iPads as it has a bigger view finder

A better tool for taking photos is a photo camera, better tool for video is a video camera. If you are going to be doing both and don't want to lug around several cameras, and are willing to compromise a bit, a photo camera with good video capability (not all take good video) is a compromise most take. Most, now days, view video on a small screen, and it doesn't take a great video camera to capture good video for that purpose. They may want high resolution larger photos, however.

As you know, regular SLR type cameras that have video capability make decent video but compromises on optical image stabilization and a convenient smooth zoom (I have a EOS70). So you need a tripod or firm hand. A video specific camera provides better video making tools so it takes better videos but lacks photo tools (I have a VIXIA HF G40).

Even more convenient is just using a decent phone that you are carrying around anyway. It will have image stabilization but will lack optical zoom/range. Now days there are some phones with both excellent video and photo capability, within the limits of a small sensor and limited zoom. Unlike years ago, when phone capture was lacking, my iPhone 11 pro takes good enough photos and video that I don't take the big gun tools out much. When I'm out shooting wildlife I bring the big cameras and lenses.

Yes but a snapshot camera and or phone lacks all the features of a separate camcorder. For example my budget Canon Camcorder has shooting modes, effects, and the like which are lacking with my Canon Powershot SX740HS unit.

 

[MacNut]

Yes but a snapshot camera and or phone lacks all the features of a separate camcorder. For example my budget Canon Camcorder has shooting modes, effects, and the like which are lacking with my Canon Powershot SX740HS unit.

Never use shooting modes. Shoot everything raw and do the editing in post if you want effects. This is what LUTS are for, to color grade the footage after.

 

[dandeco]

Never use shooting modes. Shoot everything raw and do the editing in post if you want effects. This is what LUTS are for, to color grade the footage after.

All I use is the white balance mode, depending on where I am. When the set and subject are properly lit, I can just leave it on automatic. Otherwise depending on the location, I'll set it on Daylight or Tungsten to achieve the proper look. But everything else I do raw. I'm glad those later camcorders did away with those useless built-in digital effects and titling tools, but a few still have the fader to try and simulate fading in and out. It's much better to wait until post-production to add those effects; even in iMovie you can achieve the same results without having to mess up the footage as you're shooting.

 

[jwolf6589]

Never use shooting modes. Shoot everything raw and do the editing in post if you want effects. This is what LUTS are for, to color grade the footage after.

What’s LUTS?

 

[MacNut]

What’s LUTS?

Guide to LUTs: How to Color Grade Films With LUTs - 2022 - MasterClass

Color grading can be a time-consuming part of the post-production process, which is why many directors and colorists rely on a look-up table, or LUT, to save a particular color as a template for later use. Learn more about the role of LUTs when color grading a film.

www.masterclass.com

LUT stands for “look-up table.” A LUT is a tool that lets filmmakers, editors, and colorists save particular color grades as a template. Think of a LUT as a color preset that a filmmaker can readily turn to when working on a project. For instance, the color editing process may require a team to convert a color space from a standard color space for televisions (such as Rec. 709) to a cinema standard color space (such as DCI-P3). If a colorist has one or more cinematic LUTs on file, they will find it easy to make this conversion.

 

[jwolf6589]

Never use shooting modes. Shoot everything raw and do the editing in post if you want effects. This is what LUTS are for, to color grade the footage after.

That’s what I currently do but I will say the 4th of July it was useful having a fireworks mode on camcorder.