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1rottenapple

macrumors 601
Original poster
Apr 21, 2004
4,707
2,723
This is a warning. Those of us with thousand of music be super careful with Apple Music. It seems as though once you subscribe and sync you library Apple Music makes changes to the actual music file that are ORIGINALLY YOURS that you purchased elsewhere or download elsewhere. I had over 6200 individual tracks culled together for the past 20 yrs and Apple Music just decided to take over and Mark my music with a tag essentially taking ownership of the songs away from me.

I was trying to restore my iTunes music and now it won’t let me transfer the songs back. Ugghhhhh doing a manual reset with back up music files from before hopefully this will work but my playlist are definitely gone for good.

check out the pictures I took Do you see the files with the Apple sign? Then look at the files with the music ? symbol the music symbols are MY SONGS I can still transfer the Apple sign files are my files that were converted

now look at the pictures that says on the bottoms only show transferable media. Yup I went from 5212 mp3 files to only 2k files that I can transfer

THESE ARE DAMN MP3 that I bought or downloaded over the years since I was in undergrad in 2000s ?
BF6BB0A0-080F-442F-9CD4-56F6AA45A2A8.jpeg
369D9F3B-9616-4BA5-91A3-C74C9784095A.jpeg
7762F2FC-719A-40BD-BA2A-1CE81BCE1840.jpeg
C72F81AB-F64C-41E4-8DE4-6E0BB01CFB02.jpeg
 
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Shirasaki

macrumors P6
May 16, 2015
15,706
11,003
This is just tips of the iceberg reason I will never subscribe to Apple Music. Worse, all of my music are CD quality or even HiRes, none of which are cheap. Since I am unable to backup my iTunes library due to severe lack of disk space, such destructive behaviours would literally destroy my entire music library.

Apple won’t populate such info in their manual or website, yet those are what truly hurts customers.

To anyone who might visit this thread and also has a huge iTunes library, BACK YOUR WHOLE LIBRARY UP before subscribing to Apple Music, especially the new “Apple One” subscription bundle.
 

AnthroMatt

macrumors 6502a
Jun 8, 2011
766
777
Redlands, CA
Even before I subscribed to Apple Music, I had my library backed up in three places. Can’t risk anything when it comes to music, haha. I made the error of not backing up in the past and through my own foolishness lost about 4000 songs. I’d probably have over 20k now if I hadn’t messed that up lol
 

TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2017
4,205
8,838
Since I am unable to backup my iTunes library due to severe lack of disk space, such destructive behaviours would literally destroy my entire music library

What's wrong with an external drive?

These days backups are easy to set up pretty cheap if one goes for slower drives.

Being paranoid I have backups going to a local Time Machine drive, my NAS, Acronis Cloud and Tresorit.
 

1rottenapple

macrumors 601
Original poster
Apr 21, 2004
4,707
2,723
This is so stupid! I'm super annoyed. I thankfully have a copy of my files but my playlist and song counts will be lost.
 

dmccloud

macrumors 68030
Sep 7, 2009
2,990
1,727
Anchorage, AK
There's a reason I have kept all of my music on external drives for years. Also, your music shouldn't be getting replaced with copies from Apple unless you subscribed to iTunes Match.
 
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1rottenapple

macrumors 601
Original poster
Apr 21, 2004
4,707
2,723
There's a reason I have kept all of my music on external drives for years. Also, your music shouldn't be getting replaced with copies from Apple unless you subscribed to iTunes Match.
I didn’t sub to match. It put like a mark on the files on my phone. So when I needed to restore my music files from the iPhone back to my mac it will only transfer songs that didn’t have that Apple mark; look at the screenshots. I’m not making this stuff up. I have close to 6k music files and I was only able to transfer 2 1/2 music files back. Thankfully I have backups on my external but playslist and play counts and all that are gone.

The reason why I need to transfer music files back to my Mac because when your library is synced to Apple Music you can’t add more music. This is based on what happened last night. I was trying to add an acoustic version of a song I love, and I couldn’t add it to my phone. This acoustics song is not on the Apple store. One solution was to restore my old files by transferring the songs on my iPhone back to my Mac using this app called imazing on my desktop that allows me do this.
 
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posguy99

macrumors 68020
Nov 3, 2004
2,282
1,531
This is a warning. Those of us with thousand of music be super careful with Apple Music. It seems as though once you subscribe and sync you library Apple Music makes changes to the actual music file that are ORIGINALLY YOURS that you purchased elsewhere or download elsewhere. I had over 6200 individual tracks culled together for the past 20 yrs and Apple Music just decided to take over and Mark my music with a tag essentially taking ownership of the songs away from me.
Hello, have you been living under a rock? Apple Music has been destroying local libraries for *years*. Very very old news.

If you *are* going to subscribe to AM, *never* let it see your real local library. Create another blank library and import into that library whatever you can't live without. You have to, because if you don't give it access to *something*, it's crippled by design and won't even let you create playlists.

AM has so many bad design choices it's really not worth paying for. I have a subscription only because VZW was giving free AM away.
[automerge]1600094436[/automerge]
Thankfully I have backups on my external but playslist and play counts and all that are gone.
Why weren't you backing up the library files?
 

posguy99

macrumors 68020
Nov 3, 2004
2,282
1,531
This is just tips of the iceberg reason I will never subscribe to Apple Music. Worse, all of my music are CD quality or even HiRes, none of which are cheap. Since I am unable to backup my iTunes library due to severe lack of disk space, such destructive behaviours would literally destroy my entire music library.
So skip a few pizzas and buy an external HD. There's just no excuse not to make backups.
 

Command

macrumors regular
Jan 23, 2015
183
79
USA
There's a reason I have kept all of my music on external drives for years. Also, your music shouldn't be getting replaced with copies from Apple unless you subscribed to iTunes Match.

This is accurate. AM alone does not work that way. Unless, in a scenario of the files were on Machine A when it all started, Machine A is no more, Machine X has since replaced it, things were fine until finally AM was disabled or terminated. Otherwise, AM will not touch your original files. Only Match replaces sub-256bit files with 256 bit versions. None in any other format (lossless, etc.) and none higher than 256bit already.
 

posguy99

macrumors 68020
Nov 3, 2004
2,282
1,531
This is accurate. AM alone does not work that way. Unless, in a scenario of the files were on Machine A when it all started, Machine A is no more, Machine X has since replaced it, things were fine until finally AM was disabled or terminated. Otherwise, AM will not touch your original files. Only Match replaces sub-256bit files with 256 bit versions. None in any other format (lossless, etc.) and none higher than 256bit already.
Nope, it does. Has since the beginning. On three separate widely spaced (measured in years) attempts, Apple Music replaced tracks in my library with other tracks. First time was the original trial, the second time was well after the trial ended, and of course they must have fixed the egregious bugs by then. Not. The third time was last year.

Ref: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7142385 for examples from people experiencing the same thing.

It boggles the mind, how there could actually be a design goal that would replace local files under *any* circumstances. It's more or less a bug in the process that allows machine A to upload a file without supervision. Apple Music then matches a different file, combined with another bug in the process that machine A should be able to download files it does not already have. Well, that's right, it doesn't have that file, because it was mis-matched.

But it does it anyway. Been there, done that, ran the diff against the library backup.

And I'm not the slightest bit interested in it uploading files from the local library in any case. Whyinhell would I be? Whyinhell would *anyone* be? Why can't that be turned off? But Apple conditions a significant portion of Apple Music functionality on you allowing that to take place.

I used to think Apple paid smaller license fees if they could show that you owned the track they were streaming to you. But since they replace one track with another, that can't be the control.

And years later, I'm still wondering how they're getting around the fact that the user almost certainly does *not* have a distribution right on the file(s) that're being uploaded, since that user is almost certainly not the copyright owner. Apple must have one *hell* of a contract with the major labels.
 
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1rottenapple

macrumors 601
Original poster
Apr 21, 2004
4,707
2,723
Nope, it does. Has since the beginning. On three separate widely spaced (measured in years) attempts, Apple Music replaced tracks in my library with other tracks. First time was the original trial, the second time was well after the trial ended, and of course they must have fixed the egregious bugs by then. Not. The third time was last year.

Ref: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7142385 for examples from people experiencing the same thing.

It boggles the mind, how there could actually be a design goal that would replace local files under *any* circumstances. It's more or less a bug in the process that allows machine A to upload a file without supervision. Apple Music then matches a different file, combined with another bug in the process that machine A should be able to download files it does not already have. Well, that's right, it doesn't have that file, because it was mis-matched.

But it does it anyway. Been there, done that, ran the diff against the library backup.

And I'm not the slightest bit interested in it uploading files from the local library in any case. Whyinhell would I be? Whyinhell would *anyone* be? Why can't that be turned off? But Apple conditions a significant portion of Apple Music functionality on you allowing that to take place.

I used to think Apple paid smaller license fees if they could show that you owned the track they were streaming to you. But since they replace one track with another, that can't be the control.

And years later, I'm still wondering how they're getting around the fact that the user almost certainly does *not* have a distribution right on the file(s) that're being uploaded, since that user is almost certainly not the copyright owner. Apple must have one *hell* of a contract with the major labels.
Yah I’m just glad I got my files back up. Folks if you have mp3 and aac files you own . Remove them from your iPhone. And don’t sign into the same account as the music app in your mac.
 

Command

macrumors regular
Jan 23, 2015
183
79
USA
Nope, it does. Has since the beginning. On three separate widely spaced (measured in years) attempts, Apple Music replaced tracks in my library with other tracks. First time was the original trial, the second time was well after the trial ended, and of course they must have fixed the egregious bugs by then. Not. The third time was last year.

Ref: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7142385 for examples from people experiencing the same thing.

It boggles the mind, how there could actually be a design goal that would replace local files under *any* circumstances. It's more or less a bug in the process that allows machine A to upload a file without supervision. Apple Music then matches a different file, combined with another bug in the process that machine A should be able to download files it does not already have. Well, that's right, it doesn't have that file, because it was mis-matched.

But it does it anyway. Been there, done that, ran the diff against the library backup.

And I'm not the slightest bit interested in it uploading files from the local library in any case. Whyinhell would I be? Whyinhell would *anyone* be? Why can't that be turned off? But Apple conditions a significant portion of Apple Music functionality on you allowing that to take place.

I used to think Apple paid smaller license fees if they could show that you owned the track they were streaming to you. But since they replace one track with another, that can't be the control.

And years later, I'm still wondering how they're getting around the fact that the user almost certainly does *not* have a distribution right on the file(s) that're being uploaded, since that user is almost certainly not the copyright owner. Apple must have one *hell* of a contract with the major labels.

There is always so much to it, really. With millions of available songs, etc., there are hundreds of millions of combinations and possible outcomes. Various albums - live, remasters, etc. There is also the impact of artists dictating what versions can be available via Apple Music. This is only a small, but still impacting element.
I can give one real world example, as simple and straightforward as it can get. I do absolutely see mismatched songs to the degree of it being the same song, per se, but a different version.
I have a Def Leppard album - Hysteria. LP version, imported straight from CD, 2011 is when the file notes it was imported. It shows as the original file (Pour Some Sugar on Me) in the library on my primary iMac - the one I've maintained for years - farther back than 2011. This iMac, for reference, is a Late 2013, presently running Mojave with the Music app, not iTunes. So, it's been through many upgrades, migrations, etc., since (before) 2011. Additionally, I have always imported above 256bit, which takes the Match upgrade out of the equation.
Now, I can confirm that this song is still the original MP3 file on that iMac, in the Music (iTunes) library. However, on no other device, iPhone, iPad, iMac(other), MacBookPro - in either the Music app OR iTunes, can I ever get that version to play. It is always at least the remastered (different intro) or live version. Annoying, to say the least, but one thing I can undoubtedly confirm is that the files on the original Mac, in the original library, have not been replaced by either Match (which I had for a few years prior to AM) or Apple Music since - and I use this song only as a specific example, but this exact behavior occurs the same with many, many songs, as I copy a vast amount (~32GB) of my music directly from my iMac library to a USB for my truck, to have a local copy of the right music instead of these matched files from my iPhone - that is more secondary.
Now, I know that my case is not the same as everyone's because my library is not the same as anyone's - you'll never find any two person's libraries alike. Ever. But we're talking about computers. They don't pick and choose what data goes where, they do YES/NO computations. I will always feel that this is more likely user originated, from thinking that your music actually exists on your iPhone/iPad/iPod from sync and can be imported to a new computer, to thinking that once your music is matched, your local library can be deleted to save space. Or, the more common of events, computers get replaced or reinstalled with no actual file backup. These are very simple, common mistakes that lead to you getting the incorrect music while using either Match or Apple Music with iCloud library sync. But when something doesn't do what it's expect it to do, even if the expectations is incorrect, it's always someone else's problem first.
Again, and final thought - I believe this can and does happen in some scenarios. I can't prove or disprove otherwise, given the variables. I am just trying to say that it doesn't always, and more likely than not, doesn't happen as often as claimed.
 
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