Bought Surface Book to wait out refresh.

[dark_mark]

Wow. Sensitive aren't you.

As I said - most don't need 32gb of RAM. Dell awaits you though so fear not.

Don't let the memory swaps give you nightmares.

I will use whatever the hell I want. And I will be using my 2016 Macbook Pro for now.
And guess what? I will also buy 2017 Macbook Pro the moment they release it with 32GB RAM.
And I will come here to laugh at all the people who kept saying that 16 of ram is enough, to justify their purchase.

You say no one needs 32GB Ram? Lol. Are you that insecure that you need to go as far as to say that "no one" needs it, just to justify your purchase?

 

[WhiteWhaleHolyGrail]

I will use whatever the hell I want. And I will be using my 2016 Macbook Pro for now.
And guess what? I will also buy 2017 Macbook Pro the moment they release it with 32GB RAM.
And I will come here to laugh at all the people who kept saying that 16 of ram is enough, to justify their purchase.

You say no one needs 32GB Ram? Lol. Are you that insecure that you need to go as far as to say that "no one" needs it, just to justify your purchase?

I think you're not very well. You're arguing with yourself. Take a breath or two.

 

[Queen6]

Shall we be brutally honest here? The SB is decent in its own right but compared to MBP, it doesn't even come close in build, performance and user experience (due to Windows still being as intuitive as a chocolate teapot). You'll probably use the pen a few times before you realise it's pointless whilst the designers out there use dedicated drawing pads.

As for these hilariously far fetched expectations concerning RAM - please someone enlighten me as to how anyone needs 32gb.

Yes let`s be; I have both Surface Book & 13" rMBP on my desk right now, the Surface Book's build quality easily compares to the MBP. Both systems have their respective "edges", however the Surface Book being a 2 in 1, having a dGPU in a 13" class machine, combined with it's phenomenal battery runtime makes it a clear winner for my needs. For my case usage neither has any significant performance issue, however one offers significantly more usability, utility & functionality.

Same applies for both OS, Windows 10 is a more complex environment, equally you can be limited at times with OS X without explicit knowledge of Terminal and associated commands. Apple simply favours a more simplistic approach for it's end users, neither is right, nor is either one wrong. Windows 10 is very productivity focused, however like all complex software suites there is an associated learning curve to get the best out of it. It's clear from your comments that you have little if any experience of what the Surface Book actually offers for those that can advantage of it`s features. Being able to convert complex hand written notes instantaneously to text, edit or create hand draw complex flow diagrams directly in VISIO, reviewing & marking up technical documents/papers submitted for review are just a few examples of the benefit of Pen input. Microsoft will address the Surface Pen`s shortcomings in the next revision, improving the inking experience for "creatives" So some us might just be inclined to document directly on the display of a 2 in 1 as opposed to dealing with paper and needing to transcribe all to digital at a later point in time, wasting both time & money, with Pen input being more collaborative and intuitive.

I look at in a very simplistic manner; will the device improve or augment my workflow? The emblem on the lid has absolutely no bearing, what does is the hardware/software that helps me deliver a better product/service to the client. Personally I always purchase the best tool for the job, the cost to me irrelevant as the device pays it`s own way in a matter of days, what`s more important is what it can deliver as a whole.

As for 32Gb, some users do have such lofty requirements, resultantly some OEM`s provide such an option, equally these notebooks are not designed with the average user in mind. It`s of no surprise to me that some may well have such a requirement for the MBP. I have personally used specific engineering applications where 32Gb is the minimum requirement. Apple have explained why the current MBP does not include a 32Gb option, likely future models will. I wonder if you will post so virulently against such an option? Might want to spend some time in the Mac Pro forum, you tell the members how they are wasting their money on 64Gb & 128Gb rigs; was once bandied around that 640kB was enough for anyone's needs, and that turned out to be BS as well...

If the 2016 MBP met my needs, I would be responding on one...

Q-6

 

[WhiteWhaleHolyGrail]

Yes let`s be; I have both Surface Book & 13" rMBP on my desk right now, the Surface Book's build quality easily compares to the MBP. Both systems have their respective "edges", however the Surface Book being a 2 in 1, having a dGPU in a 13" class machine, combined with it's phenomenal battery runtime makes it a clear winner for my needs. For my case usage neither has any significant performance issue, however one offers significantly more usability, utility & functionality.

Same applies for both OS, Windows 10 is a more complex environment, equally you can be limited at times with OS X without explicit knowledge of Terminal and associated commands. Apple simply favours a more simplistic approach for it's end users, neither is right, nor is either one wrong. Windows 10 is very productivity focused, however like all complex software suites there is an associated learning curve to get the best out of it. It's clear from your comments that you have little if any experience of what the Surface Book actually offers for those that can advantage of it`s features. Being able to convert complex hand written notes instantaneously to text, edit or create hand draw complex flow diagrams directly in VISIO, reviewing & marking up technical documents/papers submitted for review are just a few examples of the benefit of Pen input. Microsoft will address the Surface Pen`s shortcomings in the next revision, improving the inking experience for "creatives" So some us might just be inclined to document directly on the display of a 2 in 1 as opposed to dealing with paper and needing to transcribe all to digital at a later point in time, wasting both time & money, with Pen input being more collaborative and intuitive.

I look at in a very simplistic manner; will the device improve or augment my workflow? The emblem on the lid has absolutely no bearing, what does is the hardware/software that helps me deliver a better product/service to the client. Personally I always purchase the best tool for the job, the cost to me irrelevant as the device pays it`s own way in a matter of days, what`s more important is what it can deliver as a whole.

As for 32Gb, some users do have such lofty requirements, resultantly some OEM`s provide such an option, equally these notebooks are not designed with the average user in mind. It`s of no surprise to me that some may well have such a requirement for the MBP. I have personally used specific engineering applications where 32Gb is the minimum requirement. Apple have explained why the current MBP does not include a 32Gb option, likely future models will. I wonder if you will post so virulently against such an option? Might want to spend some time in the Mac Pro forum, you tell the members how they are wasting their money on 64Gb & 128Gb rigs; was once bandied around that 640kB was enough for anyone's needs, and that turned out to be BS as well...

If the 2016 MBP met my needs, I would be responding on one...

Q-6

So enjoy your SB. Why the crusade to covert people who have just bought a MBP? Don't you feel misplaced?

Also, why do naysayers feel entitled to provide their opinion on features whilst those content with their purchases expressing a contrary opinion are deemed as providing mere opinion?

 

[Queen6]

Lol. Who needs 32GB ram?

I am a software engineer. I am on a 2016 15" maxed out macbook pro. Right now I have Safari with 10 tabs open, running XCode, Windows 10 in Parallels with Visual Studio open.

The memory pressure monitor is already in the red and I have used about 5GB of swap files.

And I don't consider having 10 safari tabs, xcode and visual studio to be "taxing" the system. It's just a normal day for any software dev.

If you are just writing word documents sitting at starbucks then no you don't need 32gb. In fact you don't even need a 15" MBP Pro. You could just as well have used entry level Macbook Air.

Btw, Windows 10 is way way more intuitive than macOS. It's not going to be intuitive to you if you haven't used it for the past several years. In fact Windows 10 would still not be intuitive to you even if it was the most intuitive operating system in the world with just one app. Why? Because you are not using it. So stop comparing it's intuitiveness to your own opinion.

I`ll answer; the people who are so against a 32Gb option are very likely reflecting their own experiences & usage, which may well be limited to basic computing. Inversely the day Apple offers a 32Gb option they will be the very first to proclaim it as being "revolutionary" and a must have for their FB needs

Companies produce portables with 32Gb of RAM and more for good reason, same as companies purchase such systems, as they have valid use case scenarios for the hardware. Come 2018 MBP will have the 32GB option, which no doubt will be received with great enthusiasm by the Dev community.

Q-6

 

[malikkamran]

Some issues of surface book no go
Cons
-thicker and heavier than 13- and 14-inch Ultrabooks
-no USB-C or HDMI
-no WWAN or RJ-45
-no SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner
-no secondary storage device
-no TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons
-software-undocking still prone to errors
-bad upgradeability
-tablet warm under load
-high price

 

[Queen6]

So enjoy your SB. Why the crusade to covert people who have just bought a MBP? Don't you feel misplaced?

Also, why do naysayers feel entitled to provide their opinion on features whilst those content with their purchases expressing a contrary opinion are deemed as providing mere opinion?

Why the crusade to pour negative comment on the SB? No not at all as I still own and use 5 other Mac`s. I am merely expressing opinion same as you, if you don't care for it, don't engage, although that`s really what the forum is all about.

People should purchase what works for them, plain & simple....

Q-6

 

[WhiteWhaleHolyGrail]

Why the crusade to pour negative comment on the SB? No not at all as I still own and use 5 other Mac`s. I am merely expressing opinion same as you, if you don't care for it, don't engage, although that`s really what the forum is all about.

People should purchase what works for them, plain & simple....

Q-6

You're on a Mac forum criticising the new MBPs through total opinion whilst also touting other laptops through more opinion to people who have just heavily invested in new MBPs and now you're saying that I need to respect that opinion and remain neutral on the SB because it's about choice? Honestly, are you that conceited or just a troll?

 

[Queen6]

Some issues of surface book no go
Cons
-thicker and heavier than 13- and 14-inch Ultrabooks
-no USB-C or HDMI
-no WWAN or RJ-45
-no SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner
-no secondary storage device
-no TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons
-software-undocking still prone to errors
-bad upgradeability
-tablet warm under load
-high price

With that list you need a ThinkPad methinks , P50 is a good start.

• No SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner =Windows Hello biometric login, no smart card or finger print reader required. It utilises the 3D infrared camera, basically if you are not sat in front of the Surface it will not unlock, your account and personal data is secure.
• No secondary storage device = Micro SD Card with adaptor, up to 256Gb
• No TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons = Built into the trackpad, same as a Mac
• Software-undocking still prone to errors = Not in my experience, works flawlessly on my own Surface Book

Expecting USB C/TB-3 on Surface Book 2 release, same as today you will need an adaptor for HDMI, currently you need Mini Display Port to HDMI, same applies for Ethernet.

Q-6
[doublepost=1481045185][/doublepost]

You're on a Mac forum criticising the new MBPs through total opinion whilst also touting other laptops through more opinion to people who have just heavily invested in new MBPs and now you're saying that I need to respect that opinion and remain neutral on the SB because it's about choice? Honestly, are you that conceited or just a troll?

If you want to only read how "awesome" Apple is, best go over to Apple`s official forum, as they delete all negative content, here we like to call it how it is, and have open debate. My criticism of the 2016 MBP is in the context of my own requirements, they are far from being bad notebooks, equally for some of us, they could have been so much more.

Some here are genuinely interested in the Surface Book`s capabilities, so they are fully entitled to discuss, as I own and use one in professional capacity. That places me in a good position to discuss. What would you prefer me to compare the surface book to a tin of biscuits?

Don't be so emotional, they are just tools to get a job done, nor should one overly invest in such things both emotionally and financially as the scene is alway in flux.

Q-6

 

[WhiteWhaleHolyGrail]

With that list you need a ThinkPad methinks , P50 is a good start.

• No SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner =Windows Hello biometric login, no smart card or finger print reader required. It utilises the 3D infrared camera, basically if you are not sat in front of the Surface it will not unlock, you r account and personal data is secure.
• No secondary storage device = Micro SD Card with adaptor, up to 256Gb
• No TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons = Built into the trackpad, same as a Mac
• Software-undocking still prone to errors = Not in my experience, works flawlessly on my own Surface Book

Expecting USB C/TB-3 on Surface Book 2 release, same as today you will need an adaptor for HDMI, currently you need Mini Display Port to HDMI, same applies for Ethernet.

Q-6
[doublepost=1481045185][/doublepost]

If you want to only read how "awesome" Apple is, best go over to Apple`s official forum, as they delete all negative content, here we like to call it how it is, and have open debate. My criticism of the 2016 MBP is in the context of my requirements, they are far from being bad notebooks, equally for some of us they could have been so much more.

Some here are genuinely interested in the Surface Book`s capabilities, so they are fully entitled to discuss, as I own and use one in professional capacity that places me in a good position to discuss. What would you prefer me to compare the surface book to a tin of biscuits?

Don't be so emotional, they are just tools to get a job done, nor should one overly invest in such things both emotionally and financially as the scene is alway in flux.

Q-6

Please tell me where I was emotional and perhaps review your own posts regarding the same. Your conflicting views on the relevance of 'opinions' simply don't add up which I note you have swerved.

As for constructive criticism here, you'll see from my posts that I note irritating bugs and issues which I share to discuss without blowing them all out of proportion due to some unknown hidden agenda.

I'm well within my grace period and if I didn't like my machine I'd return it with no fuss, much like many others.

 

[Queen6]

Please tell me where I was emotional and perhaps review your own posts regarding the same. Your conflicting views on the relevance of 'opinions' simply don't add up which I note you have swerved.

As for constructive criticism here, you'll see from my posts that I note irritating bugs and issues which I share to discuss without blowing them all out of proportion due to some unknown hidden agenda.

I'm well within my grace period and if I didn't like my machine I'd return it with no fuss, much like many others.

Dude if you like your 2016 MBP, I`m good, actually happy for you, I am only expressing my own personal concerns. In all transparency I don't track every members posts, nor do I expect the same, the content is just here & now. Me I am steadfast in my opinion that the 2016 MBP doesn't work for me, something else does and it opened a lot of avenues simple as that.

I`m just not so invested in specific companies, just picked up a 34" LG Ultra Wide, someone was to say, that was a poor choice, I would be interested in the "flip side of the coin" their opinion if you will, equally I would still be good with my purchasing decision, as for the most part I do my home work.

Q-6

 

[SteveJUAE]

Shall we be brutally honest here? The SB is decent in its own right but compared to MBP, it doesn't even come close in build, performance and user experience (due to Windows still being as intuitive as a chocolate teapot). You'll probably use the pen a few times before you realise it's pointless whilst the designers out there use dedicated drawing pads.

As for these hilariously far fetched expectations concerning RAM - please someone enlighten me as to how anyone needs 32gb.

I think your in denial this is just click bait dohh
[doublepost=1481050449][/doublepost]

What's keeping me in OSX is Xcode and iMessenger. If I eventually can text from my windows device using my iPhone, I will most likely move on. I feel apple is investing more time into making IOS their main jam than focusing on Mac OS. I wouldn't be surprised to see an Xcode for the iPad Pro 2 soon.

I know it's possible to txt using Cortana from Win10 to Samsung S6/7, it may also be possible on your iPhone if the MS apps on the IPhone give the same functionality as Android equivalents.

I can't say it was the easiest thing to use but it's there along with missed calls and messages and can only get better

 

[DarwinOSX]

Surface Book is awful. I work for a big tech company in Seattle and that's my work computer. I have so many issues with incremental windows updates, its a constant visit to the IT Helpdesk at least twice a month.
Battery life is horrible, it will die when in your bag because you think it's in sleep mode when it's not. Just overall horrible experience. I have swapped out many of Surface Books and still always get a dud

We've had a number of people where I work buy Surface books and they have all had nothing but issues. They expected to really like it. My boss (VP/software development) just ordered a Mac to replace his and he's a real Microsoft fan. Desktop support won't allow anyone to buy them any more because they are such a hassle to maintain.

 

[SteveJUAE]

We've had a number of people where I work buy Surface books and they have all had nothing but issues. They expected to really like it. My boss (VP/software development) just ordered a Mac to replace his and he's a real Microsoft fan. Desktop support won't allow anyone to buy them any more because they are such a hassle to maintain.

Interesting you have to buy your own work laptop

Strange my work experience in many multi national companies is entirely different and MAC's in my field of engineering are like hens teeth and IT will not buy or support them although I have seen the odd IPAD used by top exec's for email but that's about it

 

[dark_mark]

We've had a number of people where I work buy Surface books and they have all had nothing but issues. They expected to really like it. My boss (VP/software development) just ordered a Mac to replace his and he's a real Microsoft fan. Desktop support won't allow anyone to buy them any more because they are such a hassle to maintain.

Conversely I work for a big media company(biggest on the planet) and we have nothing but issues with macs. The reason? Most of the business critical software we use doesn't run on macOS.

Outside of a small minority of users on these forums, macs have really low market share, both in business world and among consumers. Last time I checked it was less than 5%.

Now having said that, I work as a software engineer for the said company and I use a MacbookPro for my developing needs. But most of the corporate world uses windows and that's because PCs have less compatibility issues.

 

[Queen6]

Conversely I work for a big media company(biggest on the planet) and we have nothing but issues with macs. The reason? Most of the business critical software we use doesn't run on macOS.

Outside of a small minority of users on these forums, macs have really low market share, both in business world and among consumers. Last time I checked it was less than 5%.

Now having said that, I work as a software engineer for the said company and I use a MacbookPro for my developing needs. But most of the corporate world uses windows and that's because PCs have less compatibility issues.

From my personal experience I now have more issue with OS X than Windows 10 these days, which I would've never believed had someone suggested the same in the past. When on a project I tend to push the file system hard with numerous inputs and applications. It`s a little difficult to describe; the OS simply collapses, with the only recourse being to reload a known good backup image, as once the damage is done it looks to be irreparable in the short term. Clearly Apple is looking to remedy with the upcoming new file system.

When I was in the corporate environment there was frequent issue with the standard W7 system, equally much was related to the mandatory corporate SW image. Since W7 SP3 I've personally encounter very little issue with Microsoft`s OS, that said you need to be in control of the environment, not someone else.

Q-6

 

[Pootmatoot]

Im a little let down after returning my 13" TB rMBP. For a 2.5k laptop, I expect at least 8-9 battery life and no lagging in the UI.

This feels like the first gen of the rMBP 15" with 650m to me again, laggy scrolling and abysmal battery life. I picked up a SB for 1k with the 940m, and I think I'm going to hold up for the rMBP 13" TB until they refresh it with the bugs worked out.

It's a bit disappointing how many issues it has after near 3 years without any solid update.

Bit of an odd time to buy a Surface Book, I'd have thought: there's a high chance the SB2 is out within 6 months with a 10xx series, which will be a spectacularly more impressive machine.

If they can also work out the thermals to get a quadcore in there, it will be close to the perfect laptop MS originally promised.

 

[SteveJUAE]

Bit of an odd time to buy a Surface Book, I'd have thought: there's a high chance the SB2 is out within 6 months with a 10xx series, which will be a spectacularly more impressive machine.

If they can also work out the thermals to get a quadcore in there, it will be close to the perfect laptop MS originally promised.

Maybe the new case design for the latest SB has this in mind already however there are some great bargains to be had with the older model, so for some it will make sense

otherwise

Yes MS have a great opportunity to provide a stunning spec

What I would of preferred from MS is some form of modular design especially for the new Surface Studio but also with the book where the base unit could be swapped out or upgraded with plug and play slot in modules

Given the money is in the screen with the studio this could of been a great option and would stop the fence sitters to some degree

 

[Mathias Denichi]

Bit of an odd time to buy a Surface Book, I'd have thought: there's a high chance the SB2 is out within 6 months with a 10xx series, which will be a spectacularly more impressive machine.

If they can also work out the thermals to get a quadcore in there, it will be close to the perfect laptop MS originally promised.

If I really wanted a redesign, I'd just sell my current SB and buy the new one.
[doublepost=1481065680][/doublepost]

Some issues of surface book no go
Cons
-thicker and heavier than 13- and 14-inch Ultrabooks
-no USB-C or HDMI
-no WWAN or RJ-45
-no SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner
-no secondary storage device
-no TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons
-software-undocking still prone to errors
-bad upgradeability
-tablet warm under load
-high price

-it's .6 more pounds than the MacBook Pro 13", with a way better dGPU and 10-12 hours actual battery life
-agree, I want USB C, I'm expecting SB2
-doesn't affect me
-I prefer windows hello over a fingerprint scanner any day
-not sure if you mean a second partition
-MBP doesn't have this either
-they've fixed many of the undocking issues
-that's every ultrabook today
-see above, unless it's an m3 model, this is the case
-yeah, but it's really a product in its own class. It should be 2-300 less with the current io and GPU

 

[SteveJUAE]

Some issues of surface book no go
Cons
-thicker and heavier than 13- and 14-inch Ultrabooks
-no USB-C or HDMI
-no WWAN or RJ-45
-no SmartCard reader or fingerprint scanner
-no secondary storage device
-no TrackPoint or dedicated mouse buttons
-software-undocking still prone to errors
-bad upgradeability
-tablet warm under load
-high price

Apart from being somewhat inaccurate as others have already noted you simply have not proposed your alternative suggestion

 

[maflynn]

Some issues of surface book no go
Cons

I think you're really stretching and doing some logical backbends on those cons.

Few laptops have RJ-45 ports, Apple dropped that a long time ago.
SmartCard reader? Really what makes you think this needs one?
No secondary storage device, you mean you cannot connect USB drive to the laptop???
The Surface book has in fact trackpad and like the MBP you can use that for its buttons
I've not had issues with undocking
Upgradability is as good (or bad) as the MBP
Warm is better then hot
high price - premium price and an odd remark being levied in a MBP forum where MBPs are very pricey.

all of those those Cons can be levied against the MBP (other then the docking ones)