Camera raw updates for Leopard?

[barracuda156]

Yeah, right. How do you determine the correct white balance, contrast, saturation, over or under exposure and so on without seeing the preview first?

Make sane settings while shooting so that nothing drastic is needed, and then 16-bit-per-channel Lab covers most professional needs? Worked for me even in film era. Or probably do not use a PowerMac for commercial shooting, IDK. If one can afford Eizo ColorEdge, perhaps a newer Mac is also affordable. (We are not seriously talking about color correction on a ViewSonic, are we?)
Then, if a given camera deviates in color rendering from a needed profile due to hardware specifics and not careless shooting, that deviation is deterministic, so calibrate settings once with trial and error and just apply in batch conversion.

But hey, I am not selling someone else’s RAW converter here. There is always a neat solution of not using something which does not fit the needs

 

[MrCheeto]

And out of nowhere somebody jumps in the ring with a folding chair 😅

Sorry guys, I have a hobby similar to OP here. Sometimes it’s just interesting to milk these dead cows a bit further. I know fully well my G4 mini is capable of doing a print-worthy job. I think it goes without saying it would be a fraction of the effort to do so on a modern system.

I still don’t know why the OP felt he wanted to convert modern RAW’s on his G5 but here we are.

And as for reporting what isn’t working, this Macports stuff goes way out of the realm of my Apple oriented mind. I stopped experimenting with Linux as soon as I realized that even getting the drivers to function required all this command line crap oh and then the same for updating any of the apps. (sudo apt-get haunts me). This was in 2008 so I’m sure things have changed but that is not the spirit that I want to operate in. Macports is more of that level of nonsense. I had to wait something like two days JUST for it to install, and then a day or so for every… “thing” that I tried to install. Apps? Plug-ins? I still don’t know what I was installing all I know is it failed and wasted my time and I still am not even sure if I removed all of the mess it made on my system.

Cherry on top: I signed up to the….thing, forum or repository or whatever, to report the issues and even THAT required that I Google and research every single field I was required to fill out. I gave up. It was easier for me, being born outside of the US, to come into this country and get an ID without proof of residency than it was to simply report an issue with some Macports app, or plug-in, or whatever. Insanity. I want to contribute whatever I can but dear God I do not have time to earn another degree in another field of study JUST to install an app right now.

Edit: actually if there’s anything I can contribute while I don’t have time to test on my old machines ATM, it’s that perhaps we should be geared to test and repair these apps to work on PPC Tiger. I would think that this would open a door for even more users and, correct me cuz I don’t know, I would think if it works for Tiger it would work for Leopard.

 

[davisdelo]

Just to put some context to the processing time on RAW conversion, my D800's 36MP RAW files through Nikon ViewNX take about 3-5 minutes a piece to process out on my DC 2.3 G5.

(Just tried the sample D800 file below, 1:58 to output a 16bit TIFF from ViewNX)

 

[ojfd]

Just to put some context to the processing time on RAW conversion, my D800's 36MP RAW files through Nikon ViewNX take about 3-5 minutes a piece to process out on my DC 2.3 G5.

Just for the kicks, I took D800's 49.5 MB RAW file and tried to convert it to 16 bit TIFF (sRGB) with the help of RPP converter that I mentioned before, using my highly tuned Mac Mini G4 1.5 GHz. (SSD drive, lots of unloaded components/services etc.)

* Opening the RAW file alone took 1 min. 06 seconds!
* I've spent around 5 minutes trying to figure out the optimum settings for just this one shot. Still not being happy, I gave up after about 5 minutes. Long wait times were getting on my nerves.
* Saving 16 bit TIFF file using highest quality interpolation algorithm took another 5 min. 20 sec.

Ouch! I wouldn't call this a productive workflow.

 

[MrCheeto]

🤔any way I can get my hands on that RAW there? My turn for the flogging.

Oj, RPP allows you to grade color simply using the Macbeth chart in that picture. Premium RPP anyway.

 

[ojfd]

🤔any way I can get my hands on that RAW there? My turn for the flogging.

Go ahead.

Spoiler

https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/nikon-d800/FULLRES/D800hSLI01600NR0.NEF

Oj, RPP allows you to grade color simply using the Macbeth chart in that picture. Premium RPP anyway.

I know, I have a license. But it's clumsy. I use different approach.

 

[MrCheeto]

IDK what anybody is complaining about. I think my G4 mini is my new photo workstation with all the tips I’ve gotten here.




Ok, I’ve been using the mini and trinitron for scanning film, light Photoshop edits and preparing some images for print. It actually works fine if you consider the context of what was normal for that time. I certainly didn’t have a 20+ megapixel camera in 2006.

I pulled a .CR2 from my Canon Rebel. It’s about 12.2mpx.

It took 24 seconds to open in RPP. Adjustments took maybe 14 seconds. Converting to 16bit RAW TIFF takes just less than 2-minutes.

The .NEF brought the system to a damn near halt. 1GB just isn’t enough anymore. Soon we are going to have to start adopting systems that could conceivably reach the 32-bit ceiling of 4GB. RPP was using 680+MB on its own just to open that one image.

I did the Camera Profiling with the Macbeth card in the picture and had absolutely no trouble. Very straightforward process for Russian kludge machinery.

Reviews of the Quad G5 at the time said they could open a similar .CR2 in Aperture in two seconds and convert it in ten or twelve, I forget. I’m just not a fan of the G5 in any implementation as it’s too much sweat for such little juice. Seeing my G4 glide along with most of what I throw at it, all while sipping power and living peaceably next to me on the desk, is the pleasure of the hobby.

Again, with contemporary files and contemporary uses, I think they work just fine. Not sure why OP had such a need to begin with. Mysteries of the internet I suppose.

 

[ojfd]

(Just tried the sample D800 file below, 1:58 to output a 16bit TIFF from ViewNX)

1. It depends, of course, on the machine one is using. G4 Mini is no match for DP G5.
2. RPP uses floating point math and pretty advanced algorithms, whereas ViewNX probably something that was the norm back in the day.

Spoiler

Spoiler

Festina Lente | LibRaw

www.libraw.org

 

[ojfd]

Ok, I’ve been using the mini and trinitron for scanning film, light Photoshop edits and preparing some images for print.

And that Trinitron is calibrated, right?

I did the Camera Profiling with the Macbeth card in the picture and had absolutely no trouble. Very straightforward process for Russian kludge machinery.

Actually, you've "profiled" that one particular scene, not the camera. Profiling camera takes more than underexposed ColorChecker 24 in unevenly lit scene ..

Spoiler

Photography Lab Setup

Test charts Lighting Glare-free, uniform illumination of your test chart is ideal for Imatest software to accurately measure the image quality of your camera. This can be achieved using reflective or transmissive light sources. Reflective inkjet chart lighting Widely available LED shop lights...

www.imatest.com

Spoiler

EDIT. If one is using older Photoshop, it's worth to pay attention to this "Quasi 15-bit" issue.

Spoiler

CS3 Math Errors – ClearPS

clearps.com

Adobe Math

Rags Int., Inc. Digital Photography

web.archive.org

 

[barracuda156]

And that Trinitron is calibrated, right?

😁

BTW, where all Barcos gone?

 

[barracuda156]

1. It depends, of course, on the machine one is using. G4 Mini is no match for DP G5.
2. RPP uses floating point math and pretty advanced algorithms, whereas ViewNX probably something that was the norm back in the day.

Has anyone tried to reach out to the developer? Maybe we can resurrect PowerPC support. It is often dropped merely on assumption of no interest plus due to a lack of hardware for testing. Interest exists, hardware we got some.

 

[ojfd]

Has anyone tried to reach out to the developer? Maybe we can resurrect PowerPC support. It is often dropped merely on assumption of no interest plus due to a lack of hardware for testing. Interest exists, hardware we got some.

I have no intention to do it, but, if you want, there's an email address at the bottom of this page:

Spoiler

Donations

Btw, didn't you say compiling RawTherapee for PPC is possible? It also is using floating point math. Or so they say.

 

[barracuda156]

I have no intention to do it, but, if you want, there's an email address at the bottom of this page:

Spoiler

Donations

Btw, didn't you say compiling RawTherapee for PPC is possible? It also is using floating point math. Or so they say.

It’s not something “I say”, I have recompiled it a dozen of times trying to debug the gui, but here you go, you can try yourself:

rawtherapee: update to 5.10, initial support for powerpc by barracuda156 · Pull Request #23704 · macports/macports-ports

Description Update Move OpenMP into a variant, since it is in fact not required and broken on aarch64. Allow building against gtk+x11 Initial support for PowerPC: everything builds, CLI app works ...

github.com

 

[barracuda156]

Command-line for visual material? Kinda defeats the purpose
But please, keep us posted.
I always wanted to try it on Snow Leopard, but all builds were half way broken.
What did they use for GUI, btw? Qt, wxwidgets or something else?

Behold, the GUI running.

 

[ojfd]

So, you did it? Congratulations! Looks nice.
Is it PPC only or UB? Have a compiled one for the mortals?

* I was interested in it because it has (had?) chromatic abberation correction in floating point.

 

[barracuda156]

So, you did it? Congratulations! Looks nice.
Is it PPC only or UB? Have a compiled one for the mortals?

* I was interested in it because it has (had?) chromatic abberation correction in floating point.

Since gcc does not currently support universal builds, it will be non-trivial, considering a number of dependencies. If by universal you mean ppc+ppc64, then here there is also an issue with ppc64 part (it just won’t work by default, and fixing it seems to require quite some work); if you mean ppc+i386, then cross-family builds are likely to be even harder and perhaps completely untested.

So I would say this is not even planned. (It is perhaps also not worth the pain for a user: why would one need to run the same binary on different cpus as opposed to just building natively on either?)

I wanna get 5.10 working, so that we do not need to have two versions for different archs. Once that is done, it will likely get merged into Macports.

If anyone would want a binary for 10.6 ppc, I can share that (as usual, with use-at-your-own-risk clause). My 10.5 setup is broken since I nuked libgcc when trying to get ppc64 sorted in a reproducible way – and well, I cannot reproduce what I had ever since LOL. (To be clear, ppc on 10.5 is trivial, but I see no point in that, I prefer 10.6; ppc64 would be great, but that is not so trivial.)

 

[ojfd]

Since gcc does not currently support universal builds, it will be non-trivial, considering a number of dependencies. If by universal you mean ppc+ppc64, then here there is also an issue with ppc64 part (it just won’t work by default, and fixing it seems to require quite some work); if you mean ppc+i386, then cross-family builds are likely to be even harder and perhaps completely untested.

By universal I ment PPC and Intel (i386 or/and x86_64).
Their last half way working Intel build for Snow Leopard that could be downloaded was 4.x.x something. For everything newer than that, system requirements were way too high and continiously climbing.
I thought, if you managed to build it for SL PPC, maybe as a by-product, the Intel version also could be built. Nag nag..

If anyone would want a binary for 10.6 ppc, I can share that (as usual, with use-at-your-own-risk clause).

Yes, that would be nice. I could test it on 10.5.8 PPC

 

[barracuda156]

By universal I ment PPC and Intel (i386 or/and x86_64).
Their last half way working Intel build for Snow Leopard that could be downloaded was 4.x.x something. For everything newer than that, system requirements were way too high and continiously climbing.
I thought, if you managed to build it for SL PPC, maybe as a by-product, the Intel version also could be built. Nag nag..

I am sure Intel build will be easy, as long as ppc works, at least x86_64 one (i386 seems to suffer from the same issues as ppc).
Once I have 5.10 reasonably working on ppc (or in the worst case I peg it to 5.9 for the time-being), I will verify Intel works too.

 

[barracuda156]

Go ahead.

Spoiler

https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/nikon-d800/FULLRES/D800hSLI01600NR0.NEF

 

[ojfd]

It's not fair - you have quad 2.5GHz G5 with 16GB RAM. Poor G4 Mini will probably choke while running this thing.

P.S. Is that 5.10 I'm seeing?

 

[barracuda156]

It's not fair - you have quad 2.5GHz G5 with 16GB RAM. Poor G4 Mini will probably choke while running this thing.

P.S. Is that 5.10 I'm seeing?

Yeah, this should build, I believe: https://github.com/macports/macports-ports/pull/23704

May take some time on G4.

On the other hand, while it is faster on the Quad, I had to rebuild this thing perhaps 2–3 dozen times LOL

 

[ojfd]

Yeah, this should build, I believe: https://github.com/macports/macports-ports/pull/23704

May take some time on G4.

I'll wait until you give us mortals the working binary

 

[barracuda156]

I'll wait until you give us mortals the working binary

LOL

Well, that is no issue, however that will still need a working Macports environment on a part of someone who may want to use it. There is a lot of stuff this thing depends on.

The most reproducible way would be to have 10a190 installed. If that is done, you could perhaps use everything pre-built. I just need a server to dump ports onto.
Have been discussed here: https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...lt-powerpc-ports-macports-unofficial.2415306/

 

[ojfd]

Well, that is no issue, however that will still need a working Macports environment on a part of someone who may want to use it. There is a lot of stuff this thing depends on.

Unless there are hundreds of libs that this thing depends on, nothing precludes placing the necessary ones inside the app and re-linking them. I've been pretty good with install_name_tool in the past.

 

[barracuda156]

Unless there are hundreds of libs that this thing depends on, nothing precludes placing the necessary ones inside the app and re-linking them. I've been pretty good with install_name_tool in the past.

In principle you could take an official app, see what it contains and where exactly, and frankenstein the same with ppc components. (It will use libstdc++ though, of course.)
I can archive together ports which show up with `port rdeps rawtherapee`, and you free to experiment from that point.

On a side note, I got it built and launching fine on i386 too. Won’t bother with testing, but I think it is usable.