Darwin Ports Lead Laid Off

[MacRumors]

Landon Fuller was laid off from Apple in late October.

Landon Fuller was an engineer in Apple's BSD Technology Group and one of the primary architects of the Darwin Ports system.

The number of Apple layoffs at that time was unclear.

 

[groovebuster]

Companies don't just lay people off, when they are good and there is no economical pressure (and there is none for Apple at the moment). Would be interesting to hear Apple's version why he got fired. There are high chances that he isn't telling the whole story...

groovebuster

 

[ryme4reson]

Living in Cupertino, I hear of friends and people at Apple who always discuss the layoffs. Apple, and most tech companies always seem to be laying off people. Although it may be no nore than 20 people per quarter, most tech companies try to "cut the fat".

Although Apple is making a profit, they have not given a raise to "normal" non exec types in about 3 years. That sucks!

 

[johnnowak]

It could be simply because this guy was a jerk. I'm not accusing him of anything, I'm just saying people get cut for for all kinds of reasons.

 

[bobindashadows]

"Lucky Straw"

I like how he calls being laid off as the "lucky straw"... seems he didn't like working there.

 

[ITR 81]

Thing is no matter how good you are there is about atleast 5 others as good as your if not better to replace you. I don't think we've got the whole story.

 

[Photorun]

Things that make you go "hmmm."

Agreed, I don't think we're hearing the whole story here, it's a little to tidy. Why would they just lay this guy off, seems kinda important as positions go. I don't buy that he was just a "lucky straw," there's something more here, we just don't know it.

 

[DeusOmnis]

What did he do exactly? I mean for his job and for how he got fired.

 

[landonf]

Hello.
When I was e-mailed a link to macrumors.com this morning, I was a little surprised to find myself as a news item (even if it is a page 2 news item). I chuckled a little and went on with my day.

However, some of the later comments concerned me. In the day of Google, nearly every public internet posting is cross referenced and available to all.

I want to point out that I was laid off - not fired. The reason was "business reasons and conditions", and while this may be a very vague reason, it was truly the only one I was given. Sometimes, a corporation reshuffles resources given the current business priorities, and I imagine that's what happened here.

I enjoyed my time at Apple, and I left on good terms. I'm still fond of the company, and may consider working for them again (just not now).

For now, I'm a young engineer, and being laid off is not the end of the world. I'd rather look at it as a chance to take a break and explore future possibilities, than to lament the loss of my job. Thus, the lucky straw. Not many people get (and take) the chance to adventure.

Cheers all. It's not every day I get my own (page 2) news item.

 

[bo3b]

Speaking of jerks....

It seems everyone is jumping to conclusions, with the general consensus that Landon must be a first class jerk, incompetent dweeb, etc. I don't think any such allegations have the slightest merit.

The initial post was just an announcement that someone important to the Open Darwin project was laid off. There was no invitation to solicit opinions on why he was laid off, and I think most of us already knew that it is possible to be laid off for a multitude of reasons. Perhaps some of you think it makes you appear more intelligent to restate the obvious.

As to the powers of deductive reasoning exhibited in this thread, I can only say its really difficult to pump a dry well. You have no facts to work from, so you throw out maxims such as 'Companies don't just lay people off, when they are good and there is no economical pressure.' I didn't realize that human resource management was so simple!

I think some of you are violating the rules against personal insults, or are skirting close to the limits. Why not give the guy the benefit of the doubt? We don't know if Apple considers Open Darwin a mission critical technology, or what other reasons they may have had for laying off a member of their OS X team. BTW, he was not the only member of his team laid off at this time, suggesting it was more than personal performance that prompted the layoff.

'nuff said!

 

[Rower_CPU]

landonf-

Thank you for taking the time to post and explain your situation a little better.

Good luck in your future endeavors and thank you for your work with Apple and Darwin.

 

[Analog Kid]

Originally posted by landonf
I want to point out that I was laid off - not fired. The reason was "business reasons and conditions", and while this may be a very vague reason, it was truly the only one I was given. Sometimes, a corporation reshuffles resources given the current business priorities, and I imagine that's what happened here.

Thanks for dropping in, Landon!

I know you're still under NDA, but is there anything you can say about what's going to happen with the work you were doing now that they've let go of their technical lead?

[edit: just looked and I'm not sure where I got "technical lead" from... Regardless, the question is just as valid substituting "architect".]

Is there someplace we can find a resume?

Good luck to you-- fortunately the Valley isn't quite as dry as it was a few years ago... =)

 

[Analog Kid]

Originally posted by groovebuster
Companies don't just lay people off, when they are good and there is no economical pressure (and there is none for Apple at the moment). Would be interesting to hear Apple's version why he got fired. There are high chances that he isn't telling the whole story...

groovebuster

It's a lot easier to lay people off in the US than it is in Germany. Orders of magnitude easier, actually. So companies tend to use layoffs rather than retraining if they need to change their staffing balance.

It's a lousy practice in my opinion, and probably detrimental to the company in a lot of ways (lost loyalty and morale), but it's how things go.

As far as economic pressure, I work for a company in the Valley that's stayed profitable though the recent downturn and there's a constant concern that without constant vigilance profits could easily become losses next quarter. Everyone is trying to run as lean as possible until they know the markets they're selling into are growing again.

Apple really has tried to engineer their way through the downturn and to great results, in my opinion. They've probably cut technical staff less deeply than most companies here-- but I'm sure they're keeping a close eye on where the business focus is and the money that goes with it.

 

[DeusOmnis]

Sounds like apple doesnt provide much as far as job security......

 

[Tommy Wasabi]

Welcome to the Real World

(See Title)

Sometimes companies do what they have to do - and no one knows why - it's called "Working for the man."

Get use to it - the days of company loyalty is long gone. I get up every day thinking I'm going to lose my job - that's why I bust my ass EVERYDAY. Make yourself valuable - not only will you be less of a target when someone needs to cut short term forecasts - but you'll be a happier person.

Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying kill yourself by working 100 hour weeks EVERY week - you'll turn out to have no life and if you get laid off - you truly will not know what to do. Do what you must, but leave some time there for kids, spouse, yourself. Even if you work for Steve (who EXPECTS you to work 110 hour weeks every week) there is nothing wrong with pushing back after 80 hours (and for you none IT types - 60 hours <grin>)

And for all those people that "work to live" - find something you LOVE so you too can "live to work".

I completely understand Landon's position on this (been there - done that) and all I can wish him is "good luck" and I hope you find something you love.

 

[tny]

Originally posted by DeusOmnis
Sounds like apple doesnt provide much as far as job security......

One problem with tech right now is that the market is still mediocre. Sure, Apple is doing well, relative to the industry; but it's entirely possible that management was told they had to bring up some extra margin and so had to trim some of their long-view projects for now.

 

[timman]

I'd like to clarify the difference between firing someone (for cause) and a laying them off. Unfortunately, I've had to do both and they are very different (legally), especially when you are working for a large company like Apple. If someone isn't working out or they screw up big time you fire them for cause. They are not eligible for unemployment. If a position or job goes away and, after looking at your resources, you determine that you have too many people or people with the wrong skill sets you lay people off. I've been in situations where I needed a person with say EEE parts experience while I've had too many software engineers (all excellent by the way) and had to lay-off software engineer while still trying to hire a EEE person. This is very painful to do. It's very probably that the subject of this thread had experience that was incompatible with the business needs of the organization. With someone who has been laid off, don't try to make a value judgment on the quality of their work. In fact, they could be best within their niche. Its just that their last organization no longer need someone to fill that niche.

 

[mrsebastian]

Originally posted by Analog Kid
It's a lousy practice in my opinion, and probably detrimental to the company in a lot of ways (lost loyalty and morale), but it's how things go.

i agree completely. generally speaking, the only way to really move up in position and financially these days, is to switch to a new company. many co-workers over the last couple of years have found no reward for going that extra mile. in the end they get frustrated and either get head hunted or on their own move to another company.

 

[edenwaith]

Ugh.

No matter what the situation with those who got cut from Apple's roster, I feel sorry for them...and I'll be joining them in the poor house soon, myself since my contract job will be ending soon, and considering how long it took for me to get a job last time....hmmm...maybe I should just take some classes on English grammar so I don't use such long, run-on sentences instead.

 

[edenwaith]

Originally posted by Rower_CPU

Good luck in your future endeavors and thank you for your work with Apple and Darwin.

Sounds like the ending sentence of a rejection letter. Almost every employment rejection letter I've received uses the word 'endeavor' in it, which is a word I certainly don't use too often.

"Good luck in future employment endeavors."

"In the meantime, we wish you every success in your professional endeavors, and thank you again for your interest in Company Y."

"Meanwhile, I will keep your resume on file for future consideration, and we wish you all the best in your employment endeavors."

I keep searching for a Rejection Letter template in MS Word, since it seems like nearly all of them follow the same format. "Thank you for your interest, but we do not have a job which matches your skills. We were impressed with your skills you demonstrated...blah, blah, blah...Company X is continually growing and changing...blah, blah, blah....we will keep your resume on file and contact you if another position arises which more closely matches your skills....blah, blah, blah...good luck in getting a job, you sucker!"

 

[ucs308]

More than one.

There were a number of lay-offs at Apple recently (last Friday), not just in the Darwin team. This is a fact of valley life, and as Landon points out is generally a positive rather than a negative thing.

 

[Rower_CPU]

Originally posted by edenwaith
Sounds like the ending sentence of a rejection letter. Almost every employment rejection letter I've received uses the word 'endeavor' in it, which is a word I certainly don't use too often.

"Good luck in future employment endeavors."

...

Heh, guess it sorta does sound that way, though it wasn't the intention.

How 'bout this: "Good on ya, mate!"

 

[dstorey]

I just wish DawinPorts made it into the final release (i read somewhere that it was in the betas?) and became another cheasy name like xPorts Is Dawin ports based on the BSD ports system? I guess with this, it would be an easy way to update all the unix/bsd open source parts of the OS to the latest versions,. I know OS X has been blamed in the past for shipping older versions of things like Perl, so it could be an official way of fixing this. Just add it as an optional instal and link it in with software updates as a different tab or something.

 

[Jon the Heretic]

Originally posted by Analog Kid
It's a lot easier to lay people off in the US than it is in Germany. Orders of magnitude easier, actually. So companies tend to use layoffs rather than retraining if they need to change their staffing balance.

It's a lousy practice in my opinion, and probably detrimental to the company in a lot of ways (lost loyalty and morale), but it's how things go.

Job security in Tech today is a big ZERO. It isn't a matter of being "good" or working yourself to death. Today's corps are ruled by a oligarchy of executives who are only overseen by their board of directors---composed of OTHER company's high-level execs. They have no outside accountibility, not even to the stockholders.

"Rebalancing" is the term used for random, periodic layoffs to flush out higher paid workers for new, younger, lower paid workers. It is rare that HR even investigates whether YOU already have the new hot skill of the month---they commonly dump job families as opposed to individuals whose skills have been honestly evaluated. It works to the company's benefit to dump better paid employees who have been with the company longer.

In Europe, there are protections against this type of exploitation by companies. And unions are common; in the U.S. unions are rare.

Offshoring is a continuation of this 21st century feudal system. Being skilled and hardworking is NOT enough anymore---unless you live in a 3rd world country where a corp can hire 4 of you for just 1 of those U.S. guys.