Does anyone miss Internet Explorer?

[Westside guy]

I keep IE around because I do Web development - every once in a blue moon a Mac IE user will complain about something. Invariably it's an IE-specific problem (something broken on Windows as well as Mac); generally those I don't fix because I try to stick to standard code, as long as basic functionality is maintained for IE users.

Safari has run into trouble on a few sites, in my experience. So far Mozilla Firebird has been able to handle those.

I've run into fewer "IE only" sites in the past year; and when I do I complain persistently (and they will usually listen). I think it helps to point out that functionality doesn't have to suffer when they stick to Web-standard coding, since the IE-specific stuff has generally been written as an alternative to CSS/XHTML functionality, not to do something that can't be accomplished otherwise. Most of the time people are open to suggestion. On one occasion though it became obvious the Web "developer" only knew IE coding; in that case I tracked down and wrote a polite note to the person's supervisor. Eventually the site got changed (don't know about the site personnel though!).

 

[Les Kern]

Since I design web sites, I HAVE to use it to view. Also form a PC using the same. But for every day browsing? Nope, and Never again

 

[iChan]

I remember a time when MS were bringing out lots and lots of updates to IE, I was really very excited because that was right at the cusp of the .com boom, I actually wanted MS to 'defeat' Netscape because I was developing for IE and didn't see the point in having to support an arguable inferior browser...

that was the biggest mistake I ever made...

 

[Powerbook G5]

I remember cheering for IE during the "Battle of the 4.0 Browsers" and then the "Battle of the 5.0 Browsers" back in the day.

 

[chv400]

I use Netscape 7.1 and IE was deleted and Safari took it's place. Then I downloaded Netscape and It loaded some sites faster and it worked in ones that Safari didn't. So i use Netscape as my main browser

 

[Powerbook G5]

Does Netscape take forever to startup or has that been fixed now? I used to use it a lot on my G3 under OS 9 and it was the only program I ever had to wait for whenever I launched it.

 

[coolsoldier]

Since I discovered the "Debug" menu (
so I can tell safari to identify itself as IE), I haven't started up Internet Explorer once.
I haven't yet come across a compatibility problem that wasn't solved by setting "User Agent" to "Windows MSIE 6.0" on the Debug menu.

 

[Powerbook G5]

Setting the agent to MSIE 6 doesn't solve all of the problems, but does help with some of them. My school's webmail still doesn't work, and neither do many other sites such as Alienware, SprintPCS.com account page, etc.

 

[iChan]

how do you tune on the debug menu again? i used to do it when apple was seeding early version of it to developers to check out new features, but since v1.0, i've had no reason, it offers everything I need! but I want to go to buymusic.com to have a look... just to point and laugh!!

 

[Powerbook G5]

Open Terminal and type: defaults write com.apple.Safari IncludeDebugMenu 1

 

[Horrortaxi]

Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I remember cheering for IE during the "Battle of the 4.0 Browsers" and then the "Battle of the 5.0 Browsers" back in the day.

I always loved Netscape and didn't really care for IE. Then sometime around 1999 Netscape suddenly sucked. I couldn't find an alternative to IE so I grudgingly started using it. Little did I know that I was playing right into Microsoft's hands.

 

[Powerbook G5]

Sadly enough, when Windows 98 allowed for the option to integrate IE into the OS and allow you to use your computer as one large browser, I ate it up for a while...until I realized how poorly designed and implemented it was.

 

[yoman]

?

Originally posted by jelwell
My favorite clothing designer's website works in IE, but not safari:
http://www.toptops.com/

My favorite DJ's website doesn't work in Safari either, but works in IE:
http://website.tiesto.com/index1.html

I am curious about this b/c the sites seem to work fine when i use safari. Am I missing something?

 

[MisterMe]

Originally posted by coolsoldier
Since I discovered the "Debug" menu (
so I can tell safari to identify itself as IE), I haven't started up Internet Explorer once.
I haven't yet come across a compatibility problem that wasn't solved by setting "User Agent" to "Windows MSIE 6.0" on the Debug menu.

Yes. The problem is that many sites expect IE behavior. Your non-IE browser may identify itself as IE. If it does not behave like IE, however, it still won't work. This is a problem of pinhead web designers who are ignorant of standards, but it is a problem.

 

[Apple][Forever]

Originally posted by Horrortaxi
I always loved Netscape and didn't really care for IE. Then sometime around 1999 Netscape suddenly sucked. I couldn't find an alternative to IE so I grudgingly started using it. Little did I know that I was playing right into Microsoft's hands.

If by "playing into MS's hands" you meant "use the superior browser" than you're right. I hate MS as much as the next computer-literate guy but at the time (4.0) IE beat the stuffing out of Netscape. I had switched over to PCs at the time (I was still sore about my poor Apple ][GS) and switched from NS to IE then. It was faster (to use, and sometimes to render), with a cleaner interface.

Isn't that why we use Macs? Cleaner interface, allowing us to get our tasks done quicker?

I use Safari except for some system maintenance (network) stuff which never works right in it, but if Microsoft restarted IE development and beat Safari I'd go back in a second.

 

[Powerbook G5]

Speed has always been the biggest gripe I've had with Netscape when comparing between IE vs. NS

 

[ddbean]

Re: Safari print help FOUND

Originally posted by ddbean
On the issue of Safari print, what am I doing wrong? I can't ever get Safari to ever print a page that's not microscopic in the lower left corner. I have to use IE for anything on the web that I need to print. (But now I'll go try out those other browsers mentioned in previous posts)

Please help with my print issue. I do use the preview option and that's how I know it's not ok. Also shows up the same when I save as PDF via Print dialog.

Setup, See Signature;
Plus Epson all-in-one printer/scanner USB
G5 Firmware up to date

OK, turns out this is not an isolated issue with some apps printing in miniature. Found this fix on Apple's discussion board, so I thought I'd share it here just in case more of you have this problem, since it fixed my issue. Note that it doesn't fix everyone's problem, as mentioned on board, but it's a great place to start.

Here's the path for thread:
Home > Mac OS X > Mac OS X v10.3 Panther > Print Center & Faxing > Print results are miniatures...

And here's the fix:
... the key to avoid repetition of problem is to not choose make default in any of page set up windows

a nit -- i almost messed with the library in my system folder - a big no no. the library i needed to delete prefs was in my home folder.

just to be complete, i would add the minor change to dmg's instructions as follows:

To resolve the recurrance of the problem where you get miniatures,

1) delete the prefs file as follows:
my home file/Library/Preferences/com.apple.print.PrintingPrefs.plist

[edit here; I moved the file to desktop and added "old." in front of name so I could move it back should I need to, which I didn't, but safety first]

[2nd edit, I logged out here and back in before doing step 2]

2) set your default paper settings by using the TextEdit application NOT with MS Word or any other application

3) do not select make default settings in any printer page set up after 2) is completed

 

[Horrortaxi]

Originally posted by Apple][Forever
If by "playing into MS's hands" you meant "use the superior browser" than you're right.

That's true, but it wasn't my point. That was at the time Microsoft had just about killed off Netscape. On an even playing field Netscape probably would have remained the superior browser but we know how Microsoft feels about even playing fields.

 

[Makosuke]

Way back in the NS4 era, I used and even liked Mac IE5--I had gotten so fed up with NS4 crashing, forgetting to empty its cache, and just not display pages correctly that I was begining to dispair of the whole concept of web browsing in general (ever use NS3 Gold? That actually made me stop browsing the web for a while). IE5, on the other hand, did a very good job of rendering for the time, was fairly stable, and was fast. A good browser.

However, I haven't used it more than occasionally since Camino hit 0.6, and I haven't touched it other than once or twice for page testing purposes in almost a year. I certainly don't miss it, either.

Interestingly enough, I've NEVER had a problem with a site that wouldn't display correctly in either Safari or Camino (except BuyMusic, which lost me as a customer of theirs), even without chaning the identification string. All three of the online banking sites I use work ok, as do all three webmail accounts I use. Go figure.

I do miss two IE features:

1) That kickass print preview. Yes, with the new PDF previews you can get close, but on-the-fly text resizing was way too cool.

2) The page-holder sidebar. Tabs pick up some of the functionality, but being able to drop a page into the bar on the left was wicked-cool, and I got a lot of use out of that during development.

 

[Powerbook G5]

I miss the page holder tab from IE, too, in fact, that whole tabbed section on the left came in handy quite often.

 

[latergator116]

All I miss was the ability to continue downloads.

 

[FelixDerKater]

I wish they had brought it up to speed with the Windows IE 6.0 and its features before they dropped development... That would have been quite helpful.

 

[Makosuke]

Originally posted by FelixDerKater
I wish they had brought it up to speed with the Windows IE 6.0 and its features before they dropped development... That would have been quite helpful.

No, actually, they made it far better than IE 6 for Windows, adding a heap of CSS2 and even preliminary CSS3 suport, as well as other stuff.

They just didn't call it IE6 for Mac--they called it the MSN browser, and will charge you $10 a month as part of the MSN software package if you want to use it. I'm sure not giving them my money, but from what I hear it's not a bad browser, and has some cool standards support at least.

 

[Powerbook G5]

IE 5 was slightly updated with the release of Panther, does anyone know if that added any features? I haven't used IE much at all since getting OS X so I can't tell if there is anything changed but do know it was updated with 10.3.

 

[5300cs]

I've always tried to like Netscape, but it was difficult during the NS 6.0 years

One thing I liked about IE for Mac, was the ability to save a webpage as an archive, with the images and all that. I don't think Safari will do that.