Spoilers Favorite Time Travel Paradoxes

[a2jack]

Great stuff here. Huntn started this thread way back in '15', (talk about time travel. LOL.)

Total time travel fan here from age of 11. Thought I had read all the classics, but maybe not. What a treat to find this thread. 'Amazing'. a2

 

[Huntn]

Added to post one:

Deja Vu (2006) is an enjoyable Denzil Washington movie where a police officer travels back in time (about a week) to prevent a terrorist attack on a ferry carrying passengers and automobiles. Yes, there are now 2 of him, but the story is surpringly coherent.

Star Trek Next Generation: Cause and Effect- A brilliant episode.
The destruction of the Enterprise near a distortion in the space-time continuum causes a temporal causality loop to form, trapping the ship and crew in time and forcing them to relive the events that led to their deaths.

 

[Huntn]

Interstellar (2014)- I just watched this and decided I really like this science fiction story because it‘s equal parts SciFi and an examination of human emotion in extreme circumstances, and what could be described as a perfect time paradox, a visual depiction of time as non-lineal and under certain vague hypothetical circumstances (a Tesseract) provided by advanced beings, (maybe advanced us), accessible at different points.

It also includes other vague plot points such as quantum data being transmitted from inside a black hole to help scientists on a dying Earth figure out ...something, survive? I’m not sure. But the important thing is that I was comfortable not focusing on hard technical, scientific details which are sparse and going with the story and accepting the narrative as presented. I’ll update post 1 to reflect my new insight.

 

[mikzn]

Great stuff here. Huntn started this thread way back in '15', (talk about time travel. LOL.)

Total time travel fan here from age of 11. Thought I had read all the classics, but maybe not. What a treat to find this thread. 'Amazing'. a2

Yes - cool thread - just noticed it - I love a good time travel yarn - Kudo's to Huntn for starting it and all the thought provoking references in the thread ?

One of my favorite Sci-Fi stories about Time is "Timescape 1980 by Gregory Benford"

 

[compwiz1202]

What I like about Back to the Future is the inconsistency. How come in one his changing the past threatens his existence? When Biff changes the past it creates a divergent timeline.

Going by the BtF 2 rules. When Marty prevented his parents relationship. He would have just created a divergent timeline. While he would still exist in his universe. When he went to the future it would have been in a universe which he did not exist.

Which is also the only possible outcome. Preventing his own conception would create a impossible paradox without a divergent timeline and universe. By preventing his conception he would not exist to have prevented it. Nor would the time machine have made it back.

Of course there is also the problem of the Time Machine only being able to go to the same position in the past or the future that it departed from. This would mean that any time travel would most likely result it appearing in outer space. As the universe is mostly empty space.

Since at any time the total speed of the Earth moving through the universe is between ~750,000 and ~1,900,000 MPH. If you could only go to the same place you departed from. Earth would be around 200 to 500 trillion miles away from you when you arrived about 30 years in the past or the future.

Edit: Correction that would be 200 to 400 billion miles.

Exactly. That is the biggest paradox, which is why I like the movies with the rules where you are unable to do anything to alter your own past since it would cause the paradox. The one that bugs me the most in BttF is about not seeing you future self. If you left the timeline to travel forward, who would age to become your future self?Totally proven by no second Einstein when he went a minute into the future.
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I think most paradoxes require a suspension of disbelief. That's a great point about location, that I've not considered before. You'd just use your time/space movement calculator to figure out the new location along with the time. I'll need to watch the second one again as I don't remember the "alternate time line" aspect of the story. I'm most clear on the 1st and 3rd movies.



I remember seeing it where repeated attempts are made to fix the future?

In Pt 2, the concept, which I think was one of the cooler parts, is that they couldn't go forward to stop future Biff from taking the time machine, because that was a future of the timeline before Biff gave himself the Almanac. They had to go back in time to stop the transaction to restore the timeline. And the difference is Biff never did anything to affect his birth. He was just giving himself the Almanac to change the future of his past self. Now they paradox I could see is when past Biff becomes rich and powerful, he never would have been in the situation in the future to take the Almanac back.
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Great stuff here. Huntn started this thread way back in '15', (talk about time travel. LOL.)

Total time travel fan here from age of 11. Thought I had read all the classics, but maybe not. What a treat to find this thread. 'Amazing'. a2

Geeze and I replied to some of the first posts This is the second thread today that started way back with new replies. I never remember to look at the initial date. I just look for threads on the first few pages with new replies.

 

[Huntn]

Belated Avenger’s Endgame comment plucked from the Avenger’s thread.

So ambitious, so long, and I did not feel worthy closure, just a muddled ending. It would have been better if they tacked the first 30 min of Endgame onto Infinity Wars and be done with it.

What stood out was the lecture from Bannon about how time does not work that way, if you go back and change the past, you split off the past into a new reality/timeline, and after saying that, they do exactly that, go back in time in 3 different groups to 3 different times, and that somehow fixed their original time line?? I know, just go with it.

And putting the infinity stones back fixes all possible problems of this nature in the future, how? Won't there be people looking for them?

And bringing back Thanos felt like just another excuse for a big muddled battle.

And the business of snapping your fingers? Do you have to think about something in particular?

 

[D.T.]

And the business of snapping your fingers? Do you have to think about something in particular?

It's just a physical trigger, it's like 1-2-3 go ...

 

[breezyf808]

Anyone mentioned the movie Donnie Darko?
Don’t know if it’s really a time travel movie or a trippy movie; but all I remembered was that I really enjoyed it.
Butterfly Effect (Only watched first one w/Ashton Kutcher).
I know it’s not movies but all the different versions of The Flash interested me.

 

[Huntn]

Anyone mentioned the movie Donnie Darko?
Don’t know if it’s really a time travel movie or a trippy movie; but all I remembered was that I really enjoyed it.
Butterfly Effect (Only watched first one w/Ashton Kutcher).
I know it’s not movies but all the different versions of The Flash interested me.

Tell us about DD. Butterfly Effect, was there time travel in that? I don’t remember.

 

[Huntn]

Added to post 1:

• 21Mar20- Added Harry Potter And The Prisoner Of Azkaban.

 

[mikzn]

The Final Countdown - Release date - August 1, 1980 - great movie ?

"The Final Countdown is a 1980 alternate history science fiction film about a modern aircraft carrier that travels through time to the day before the 1941 attack on Pearl Harbor. Produced by Peter Vincent Douglas with director, producer, actor and Troma Entertainment founder Lloyd Kaufman and directed by Don Taylor the film contains an ensemble cast with Kirk Douglas as leader, Martin Sheen as supporting and James Farentino, Katharine Ross and Charles Durning in roles of secondary importance."

View attachment 899638

The Final Countdown - Another movie that you can add to the list on page 1

 

[jeyf]

only fitting but; this is a 5y old post?

 

[D.T.]

T E N E T

Discuss.

 

[Huntn]

The Final Countdown - Another movie that you can add to the list on page 1

• 2 May20-Added The Final Countdown

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T E N E T

Discuss.

Why don’t you start since you mentioned it?
It looks like it is or was due out in Jul 2020.

 

[compwiz1202]

What I like about Back to the Future is the inconsistency. How come in one his changing the past threatens his existence? When Biff changes the past it creates a divergent timeline.

After watching 2 for like the 100th time, I realized this is a mistake too according to Doc's theory. If changing the past makes it that you can't travel forward on the previous timeline, how did Biff return the time machine to when Doc and Marty were?? Or did the future somehow change around them without them noticing?

 

[yaxomoxay]

Or did the future somehow change around them without them noticing?

They would have to notice. Biff goes back right before they enter the XXI century McFly home; once they enter, Marty is married to Jennifer, and George is married to Lorraine, but at that point old-Biff is already in the 1950's. In the new "rich Biff" timeline, Biff marries Lorraine, which would've make the XXI Century McFly home totally impossible (let alone that Biff comes back as the old, poor individual in a non-derelict Hill Valley).
The only way for me to square the circle is that when old Biff comes back to the future in the old timeline Biff hasn't done anything yet, so there might be a 1:1 time ratio between the two parallel timelines. When Biff places the first bet, things will start to change, and so on.

 

[D.T.]

Why don’t you start since you mentioned it?
It looks like it is or was due out in Jul 2020.

I got nothing ...

Well, I have a take on what we're seeing in the trailer, I'll link to that, maybe we can use it as a starting point

Basic gist: Written and Directed by Chris Nolan, looks like a guy in law enforcement is enlisted into some kind of covert group who are using time travel to solve crimes - like Inception, just incredible looking visualizations:

 

[Huntn]

I got nothing ...

Well, I have a take on what we're seeing in the trailer, I'll link to that, maybe we can use it as a starting point

Basic gist: Written and Directed by Chris Nolan, looks like a guy in law enforcement is enlisted into some kind of covert group who are using time travel to solve crimes - like Inception, just incredible looking visualizations:

I watched the trailer, it mostly raises a bunch of intrigue and questions with few answers and it appears that time travel of some kind maybe involved, but the "welcome to the afterlife" bit, is rather inconclusive as to what that means. One point though, Inception was not about time travel but about sharing and influencing others through dreams.

 

[D.T.]

I watched the trailer, it mostly raises a bunch of intrigue and questions with few answers and it appears that time travel of some kind maybe involved, but the "welcome to the afterlife" bit, is rather inconclusive as to what that means. One point though, Inception was not about time travel but about sharing and influencing others through dreams.

I think "Welcome to the afterlife" is simply that he's "dead" in the context of his former existence - they say in the trailer, they're testing him, and said he was willing to die to protect his team. It's probably so secret, you're totally off the grid, Men in Black style, you don't exist anymore (they likely even document your "death").

The thing I was really intrigued by is the time reversal - it looks like they jump forward, but then have to physically navigate around time as I catches up and/or as they move back to their origination point - hence, why it appears there's two different time directions occurring in many of the scenes. It's a neat idea, and of course, can set up some amazing Nolan set pieces.

 

[Huntn]

I think "Welcome to the afterlife" is simply that he's "dead" in the context of his former existence - they say in the trailer, they're testing him, and said he was willing to die to protect his team. It's probably so secret, you're totally off the grid, Men in Black style, you don't exist anymore (they likely even document your "death").

The thing I was really intrigued by is the time reversal - it looks like they jump forward, but then have to physically navigate around time as I catches up and/or as they move back to their origination point - hence, why it appears there's two different time directions occurring in many of the scenes. It's a neat idea, and of course, can set up some amazing Nolan set pieces.

Yes, I noticed several shot of vehicles traveling backwards.

 

[DeepIn2U]

@Huntn,

which 12 Monkeys, and which Jumanji are we talking about here? Jumanji, for the most part is the same but includes more characters in The Rock's remake (I don't like this version very much), and I think 12 Monkeys remake (not the Brad Pitt & Bruce Willis original) also is different (never seen it though).

 

[Huntn]

@Huntn,

which 12 Monkeys, and which Jumanji are we talking about here? Jumanji, for the most part is the same but includes more characters in The Rock's remake (I don't like this version very much), and I think 12 Monkeys remake (not the Brad Pitt & Bruce Willis original) also is different (never seen it though).

I added dates to post1, those are both 1995 movies I referenced.

 

[Huntn]

Added to post 1:

• Back To The Future Part 2(1989)- Not as good as the first one. However they explained how when old Biff gave the sports almanac to young Biff, it caused a tangent in the time line so things in the future where they were (2015) did not change, because a new timeline was created in 1955 with the handing over of the book to young Biff. The solution was to go back before the divergence and take the book back.
  
  The fallacy with this time travel example is that they use this one event, knowledge of the future outcome of sporting events, as the only thing that would drastically alter the future, although cumulatively all of the changes caused by Marty going back, then the Professor and Marty going back and interacting with people, any number of minute things could drastically altered the furture, but hey, that gets too complicated fast, and... it’s a time paradox.

What I like about Back to the Future is the inconsistency. How come in one his changing the past threatens his existence? When Biff changes the past it creates a divergent timeline.

Going by the BtF 2 rules. When Marty prevented his parents relationship. He would have just created a divergent timeline. While he would still exist in his universe. When he went to the future it would have been in a universe which he did not exist.

Which is also the only possible outcome. Preventing his own conception would create a impossible paradox without a divergent timeline and universe. By preventing his conception he would not exist to have prevented it. Nor would the time machine have made it back.

Of course there is also the problem of the Time Machine only being able to go to the same position in the past or the future that it departed from. This would mean that any time travel would most likely result it appearing in outer space. As the universe is mostly empty space.

Since at any time the total speed of the Earth moving through the universe is between ~750,000 and ~1,900,000 MPH. If you could only go to the same place you departed from. Earth would be around 200 to 500 trillion miles away from you when you arrived about 30 years in the past or the future.

Edit: Correction that would be 200 to 400 billion miles.

Five years later, we just watched BTTF Pt2 and your observation about it is spot on.

 

[D.T.]

Devs could go in this thread - not "time travel" so much, kind of "time analysis"? Coming to grips with the Multi-verse? Reverse Matrix???

 

[jdoyle]

I recently saw Predesination with Ethan Hawke. It wasn't the best movie... it was quite odd to be honest. I don't want to give it away, but I saw the first twist regarding the Woman's relationship to her past lover. The twist at the end caught me completely off guard and I beat myself up a little for not considering it. Like I said, the movie wasn't great but the ending twist blew my mind.

I loved Predestination. Crazy mind bending time travel as it should be. The final shot was such a shock! Saw it here in Australia with a Q&A from the directors afterwards a few years ago.