Feasibility of running macOS on iPads in the near future?

[Arunachala]

Since the new Macs have ARM chips, there is now access a build of macOS that technically could run on a device like, say, the iPad Pro? The architecture should be pretty much the same, I guess?

Clearly some tinkering would be required, but how feasible is it, given the right skills and tools?

I suppose this would be something similar to what the Hackintosh community has been doing for over a decade with macOS on Intel computers. Only instead of creating Clover bootloader etc. to make macOS "think" it's running on a Mac, the same would be done on a jailbroken iPad, making macOS think that iPad is a Mac.

Obviously one would pair a bluetooth keyboard and mouse to get that desktop experience. Heck, maybe even a second monitor through the thunderbolt port on the iPad Pro?

I figure the coolest thing would be to have a dual-boot of both iOS and macOS on the same iPad. I guess virtualisation on top of iOS may also work, but I think the performance would be way better if running bare metal macOS.

Another cool idea, Imagine having macOS as a dual boot option on your iPhone 12. All you would need would be a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and an adapter to plug it into a TV, and your phone could be your computer to go wherever you needed it.

How feasible is this stuff? I mean architecturally I believe these devices are very similar, so it appears to me that it would mainly be a matter of bypassing some of Apple's security features? The jailbreaking community have done amazing things in the past, though.

 

[chabig]

I guess the architecture of my Corolla is pretty much the same as a Mazerati, so I'll just put a Maserati engine into it. Clearly some tinkering would be required, but given the right skills and tools?

 

[Arunachala]

I guess the architecture of my Corolla is pretty much the same as a Mazerati, so I'll just put a Maserati engine into it. Clearly some tinkering would be required, but given the right skills and tools?

Hey there! I am not sure how serious you are here or if you are trying to be funny, but I would say that comparing the iPad Pro to a Toyota Corolla is not very helpful. There is an IPP model with 6 GB of ram (macOS can run on 4) and the chip of the IPP is no slouch.

Moreover, the new Macbook Air is fanless, just like the IPP.

Have you looked at benchmarks and spec sheets of the new Apple Silicon Macbook Air, and compared it to the iPad Pro? I realize the new Macbook Air is better, but do you really think the Ipad Pro would be worthless running macOS?

What if your use case is light coding, office work, web browsing, maybe some light Photoshop?

 

[chabig]

I was trying to be funny. I own and like an iPad Pro. I own and like a MacBook Pro. And I own and like an iPhone. At no point have I considered trying to turn one into the other. Nor, I'm sure, has Apple. Each product has its own distinct use cases.

 

[Arunachala]

I was trying to be funny. I own and like an iPad Pro. I own and like a MacBook Pro. And I own and like an iPhone. At no point have I considered trying to turn one into the other. Nor, I'm sure, has Apple. Each product has its own distinct use cases.

Apple has for sure considered it, however, they have, for the most part decided not to, this far.

The internals of these devices are now very similar.


The new Macs can run unmodified iPad and iPhone apps, and many speculate that the two platforms may eventually grow closer. macOS Big Sur has many UI features similar to iPad OS.

There is speculation that Apple may be intending to release Macs with touch screens in the future, which would make more sense with the new Big Sur UI which is more touch friendly (big buttons, etc.), and the support for iOS apps.

Also, the main point here would be the cost savings. Instead of having to buy two devices, you could have one device for everything.

 

[chabig]

I think Apple's thinking runs along these lines:

iPad: "Let's make the very best iPad we can make"
iPhone: "Let's make the very best iPhone we can make"
Mac: "Let's make the very best Mac we can make"
Watch: "Let's make the very best Watch we can make"

Every statement by every Apple leader has been very clear that there is a place for each device. They will only merge features when it makes the product demonstrably better. So someday, if adding a touchscreen to a Mac makes it better, they will do it. But not earlier. They will never do what Microsoft did with Windows 8.

 

[Arunachala]

I think Apple's thinking runs along these lines:

iPad: "Let's make the very best iPad we can make"
iPhone: "Let's make the very best iPhone we can make"
Mac: "Let's make the very best Mac we can make"
Watch: "Let's make the very best Watch we can make"

Every statement by every Apple leader has been very clear that there is a place for each device. They will only merge features when it makes the product demonstrably better. So someday, if adding a touchscreen to a Mac makes it better, they will do it. But not earlier. They will never do what Microsoft did with Windows 8.

Well, if you take the iPad Pro with macOS and a keyboard case with trackpad, it is literally a Mac, and much faster than Intel Macs released just a few years ago. How would that be bad? What would that lack? it could even dual boot macOS and iOS.

Your arguments for why Apple will never do that, though are fair enough. Also, I believe the main reason Apple will not do this is revenue. Many customers who would have previously bought two devices would now only buy one. Which may mean that Apple would sell less.

However, in this thread, I am not asking whether Apple will do it. I am asking how feasible it is for iOS jailbreakers or the Hackintosh community to do it.

 

[Yebubbleman]

Since the new Macs have ARM chips, there is now access a build of macOS that technically could run on a device like, say, the iPad Pro? The architecture should be pretty much the same, I guess?

Clearly some tinkering would be required, but how feasible is it, given the right skills and tools?

I suppose this would be something similar to what the Hackintosh community has been doing for over a decade with macOS on Intel computers. Only instead of creating Clover bootloader etc. to make macOS "think" it's running on a Mac, the same would be done on a jailbroken iPad, making macOS think that iPad is a Mac.

Obviously one would pair a bluetooth keyboard and mouse to get that desktop experience. Heck, maybe even a second monitor through the thunderbolt port on the iPad Pro?

I figure the coolest thing would be to have a dual-boot of both iOS and macOS on the same iPad. I guess virtualisation on top of iOS may also work, but I think the performance would be way better if running bare metal macOS.

Another cool idea, Imagine having macOS as a dual boot option on your iPhone 12. All you would need would be a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and an adapter to plug it into a TV, and your phone could be your computer to go wherever you needed it.

How feasible is this stuff? I mean architecturally I believe these devices are very similar, so it appears to me that it would mainly be a matter of bypassing some of Apple's security features? The jailbreaking community have done amazing things in the past, though.

It's technologically very doable. Apple straight up took the same SoC that's in the current iPad Pros and used it as the basis for their Developer Transition Kit for the current architecture transition. The limitations and inability lie in a few things:

1. Apple locks down the firmware for both iOS/iPadOS and Apple Silicon Macs (and to a lesser, but still relevant extent, T2 based Intel Macs). There's nothing stopping the OS from running as, it is the same architecture and even a similar enough implementation of it. But you'd need Apple to provide the missing pieces to make it work.

2. Drivers. There is no touchscreen driver for macOS the way there is for iPadOS or iOS. A viable driver would need to be created and injected into macOS for it to not lose its sh*t and kernel panic (or just not boot at all). Similarly, there are other iPad exclusive components for which there are not drivers for in macOS.

3. The bootloader is different enough between them as well. This one is arguably the least difficult limitation to skate around, but given that you're still dealing with Apple with both the Mac and the iPad, that will still present challenges the likes of which never really existed with Hackintoshes and Intel Macs.

I would say that if any iPad/iPadOS device had the best fighting chance of being able to do it, it'd be the current iPad Pros given that it's the same SoC from the Developer Transition Kit, but you're still left with the aforementioned uphill battles. I think, if anything, that only resolves half of #2 and MAYBE a third of #1. Not enough to really get things going in earnest. The new Air being A14 Bionic based (which is M1 adjacent) might also have a similar fighting chance, but I would imagine that, even if successful, the end experience would be garbage as the A14 Bionic lacks features from the M1 whereas the A12Z Bionic was used as-is in both the DTK and the 2020 iPad Pros.

Hope that helps answer your question!

 

[Arunachala]

It's technologically very doable. Apple straight up took the same SoC that's in the current iPad Pros and used it as the basis for their Developer Transition Kit for the current architecture transition. The limitations and inability lie in a few things:

1. Apple locks down the firmware for both iOS/iPadOS and Apple Silicon Macs (and to a lesser, but still relevant extent, T2 based Intel Macs). There's nothing stopping the OS from running as, it is the same architecture and even a similar enough implementation of it. But you'd need Apple to provide the missing pieces to make it work.

2. Drivers. There is no touchscreen driver for macOS the way there is for iPadOS or iOS. A viable driver would need to be created and injected into macOS for it to not lose its sh*t and kernel panic (or just not boot at all). Similarly, there are other iPad exclusive components for which there are not drivers for in macOS.

3. The bootloader is different enough between them as well. This one is arguably the least difficult limitation to skate around, but given that you're still dealing with Apple with both the Mac and the iPad, that will still present challenges the likes of which never really existed with Hackintoshes and Intel Macs.

I would say that if any iPad/iPadOS device had the best fighting chance of being able to do it, it'd be the current iPad Pros given that it's the same SoC from the Developer Transition Kit, but you're still left with the aforementioned uphill battles. I think, if anything, that only resolves half of #2 and MAYBE a third of #1. Not enough to really get things going in earnest. The new Air being A14 Bionic based (which is M1 adjacent) might also have a similar fighting chance, but I would imagine that, even if successful, the end experience would be garbage as the A14 Bionic lacks features from the M1 whereas the A12Z Bionic was used as-is in both the DTK and the 2020 iPad Pros.

Hope that helps answer your question!

Thanks a lot for the thorough and detailed answer! Your insight is greatly appreciated.

 

[StellarVixen]

It's technologically very doable. Apple straight up took the same SoC that's in the current iPad Pros and used it as the basis for their Developer Transition Kit for the current architecture transition. The limitations and inability lie in a few things:

1. Apple locks down the firmware for both iOS/iPadOS and Apple Silicon Macs (and to a lesser, but still relevant extent, T2 based Intel Macs). There's nothing stopping the OS from running as, it is the same architecture and even a similar enough implementation of it. But you'd need Apple to provide the missing pieces to make it work.

2. Drivers. There is no touchscreen driver for macOS the way there is for iPadOS or iOS. A viable driver would need to be created and injected into macOS for it to not lose its sh*t and kernel panic (or just not boot at all). Similarly, there are other iPad exclusive components for which there are not drivers for in macOS.

3. The bootloader is different enough between them as well. This one is arguably the least difficult limitation to skate around, but given that you're still dealing with Apple with both the Mac and the iPad, that will still present challenges the likes of which never really existed with Hackintoshes and Intel Macs.

I would say that if any iPad/iPadOS device had the best fighting chance of being able to do it, it'd be the current iPad Pros given that it's the same SoC from the Developer Transition Kit, but you're still left with the aforementioned uphill battles. I think, if anything, that only resolves half of #2 and MAYBE a third of #1. Not enough to really get things going in earnest. The new Air being A14 Bionic based (which is M1 adjacent) might also have a similar fighting chance, but I would imagine that, even if successful, the end experience would be garbage as the A14 Bionic lacks features from the M1 whereas the A12Z Bionic was used as-is in both the DTK and the 2020 iPad Pros.

Hope that helps answer your question!

Do you know that people have installed Mac OS on non Apple laptops with touchscreen and that touch input works?

 

[Yebubbleman]

Do you know that people have installed Mac OS on non Apple laptops with touchscreen and that touch input works?

There is a drawing tablet driver as that is a common macOS device class. But that doesn't equate to full touch support throughout the operating system. And not all digitizers are created equally here. Meaning macOS could still kernel panic with the wrong driver in play.

 

[johnnyturbouk]

I was trying to be funny. I own and like an iPad Pro. I own and like a MacBook Pro. And I own and like an iPhone. At no point have I considered trying to turn one into the other. Nor, I'm sure, has Apple. Each product has its own distinct use cases.

Trying being the operative word ? tbh you come across as a bit grouchy!
I think with ios14, big sur and AS, the once clear delineation between the IPP and macbooks have become obfuscated And moreover, we all have different needs and preferences. what worked for one may not be productive or feasible for another. ive used keyboard on my iPads since the first gen, and was always told by many on here, the ip is not designed to be used with a keyboard or stylus.

 

[johnmarki]

This is a great question and makes me think about the future of "Hackintosh." Personally, it seems that Hackintosh will evolve (or devolve, depending on your personal preference) from MacOS on custom "PC" builds, to MacOS on iOS devices. Now that the OS's and Silicon are becoming closer and more uniform across the different product lines, IMO it would seem building a custom Hackintosh machine to run MacOS for AS will be more difficult.