Graphic Design as a career? Need some input from experienced folks.

[highres]

Well said. Excellent post...

...also esp. the bit about proofing.

Thanks Blue...As you already know, and those who have been there know...there is nothing more horrifying than having your boss literally say "stop the presses"...I have only heard it 3 times. The painful realization was that a few more minutes proofing would have caught the mistake...

 

[Lacero]

Don't you just love it when your beautifully designed publication comes back with the type in courier?

 

[highres]

Don't you just love it when your beautifully designed publication comes back with the type in courier?

*shudders* Or my personal favorite, when you get the first box of catalogs off the press and see a price point error for a piece of merchandise selling it for say $200 less than it is supposed to. With 750 stores in a chain and 6-7 million pieces in the print run all advertising that piece of merchandise at the lower price, that mistake can cost the client company hundreds of thousands of dollars, because once something is advertised at a certain price, the company has to (in most cases) honor the advertised price. You can lose your job, your company loses the account and your client loses lots of money. Brutal.

 

[RugoseCone]

I'm not a graphic designer and I don't play one on television. But I work with a lot of them. The only thing I can add to this topic that I haven't seen mentioned is don't pigeon-hole yourself when looking for employment.

There's more than ad agencies/marketing firms that employ graphic designers. Film studios, manufacturing, the entire exhibit industry (museum and trade shows) relies very heavily on GD's, and service industries; just to name a few.

Graphic deisgn is sort of like CAD work (Computer Assisted Drawing). Used in more places than you'd ever guess. Not to mention, there's a good chance she'll end up in an unrelated field that still manages to utilize her schooling in some capacity. Happens all the time...

 

[Jaffa Cake]

Don't you just love it when your beautifully designed publication comes back with the type in courier?

That's why you always, always get the printer to supply proofs.

 

[Blue Velvet]

That's why you always, always get the printer to supply proofs.

Much (but not all) of our work doesn't justify the time and cost of printers' proofs, unfortunately. Most typo errors that seem to occur are the result of poor internal copy and proofing by internal clients.

So flightchecking and careful attention to detail has to substitute when collecting work for press especially with that loveable maverick: QuarkXpress 6.x

Faxing over a runout (for type placement mainly) and FTPing or ISDNing them a PDF x1a or x3 seems to be OK for most work.

RugoseCone makes an excellent point, though. I don't work for a design agency -- I work for a large national charity that produces an endless stream of info packs, flyers, posters, publications and promo items. So there are positions available in all sorts of organisations. However, competition is always tough which is why doing what you can to get your foot in the door is recommended i.e. voluntary placements to build up your contacts and 'real-world' experience.

 

[beatle888]

My point is that telling someone that they can get by with just a little press knowledge is pure BS.

In fact, it's pure 'blah, blah, blah' to quote you.

15 years in print? Baby.

what the......who said they can get by with just a little knowledge? hmm. maybe I/you should re-read my original post. what i meant was that one SHOULD have a decent understanding of the production methods of their medium otherwise the more seasoned pros will sorta raise a brow to them.

how is that suggesting that she could get by with only a little knowledge? I do know many art directors and designers that dont know much at all about the print techniques.....thats why we have a production studio. the designers and art directors work in low rez and offend every production standard in the book. its the production artists job to make it print as best as possible. so technically she DOESNT need to know production at all. however it will be much harder for her to find work since a lot of studios will try to get a designer that knows how to do production as well. it just depends on the studio. my current client doesnt let the art directors do ANY of the production. they dont know much production at all. so, F.Y.I. art directors DONT need production skills.

but i wouldnt recommend that to someone just starting out. so i guess we agree. i think you misread my post or i failed to communicate.


and actually its eighteen years of print knowledge and fifteen on the computer. the first three were with traditional stat cameras and paste up.

 

[beatle888]

Calm down there matey. Blue was on the money. You weren't very clear, and essentially said designers don't need to know about pre-press.

Which is nonsense if you design for print.

Bluevelvet knows her stuff by the sound of it, and I'm amazed you've been working so long with your attitude.

yeah, i guess i wasnt clear. i didnt mean that she didnt need production skills. i meant that she needs the basics. but just like i said in the above post most art directors/designers dont really touch on production issues. thats what the production studio is for. of course not all agencies work this way.

anyway sorry about the attitude. i wasnt sure why BlueV had a problem with my post. now i know.


last comment. you say its nonesense that one doesnt need to know pre-press but it isnt. only one agency that i work at has the art director doing production. the other agencies have their art directors worry about design/layout/content/look and feel. its up to the studio to produce the project.

THERE, i'll stop. ive regurgitated the same point over and over. sorry to confuse.


peace.

 

[Blue Velvet]

peace.

Likewise. Sorry to sound so high-strung... short tether at the mo.

Anyways, I know we're all singing from the same hymn-sheet, after all.

 

[Jaffa Cake]

Much (but not all) of our work doesn't justify the time and cost of printers' proofs, unfortunately. Most typo errors that seem to occur are the result of poor internal copy and proofing by internal clients.

Fair enough – it's something we always budget for (both in terms of cost and time) but I realise not everyone has that luxury.

 

[highres]

Fair enough – it's something we always budget for (both in terms of cost and time) but I realise not everyone has that luxury.

In some cases even if our client has signed off on the color/pricing/copy on the last round of color proofs or match prints (which our output house pulls from the output film) which are included with the blue lines (an exact match mockup of the final catalog pulled from the same film as matchprints and four-color film that the web printers plate up for the print run) there still can be errors or mistakes that get past everybody and aren't visible until the first tear-sheet comes off the press, that's why we also have someone from our agency and our clients office at the press check to sign off on color and content.

There is a lot of money on the line so we find that we can't proof and qc enough, and we still get mistakes that get all the way through the finished product and then heads roll. Even if we could say the "client signed off on the final proofs", do we really want to risk losing a multi-million dollar account over a $200,000 printing mistake? Usually the agency sucks it up and takes the loss and deals with it "in-house". Brutal but true. Multi-million piece print runs are high stress and can cause all kinds of gray hairs for a production manager/art director...

The most dangerous errors normally occur when the client wants to go direct to plate (when all the files are digitally preflighted and prepared and posted directly to the printer via ftp after the client has signed off on the last set of color proofs via Fed Ex), the wrong fonts are loaded, or the bleeds aren't pulled correctly or any number of errors can happen.

Sorry for the encyclopedia length post, this is a subject I have lived and breathed and wanna give any future graphic artists the heads up on what can occur in the real world of print design and web printing...

 

[beatle888]

Fair enough – it's something we always budget for (both in terms of cost and time) but I realise not everyone has that luxury.

and a luxury it is. at least for small and medium sized agencies. and when you get four hours or maybe a full day to bang out a mechanical with photoshop backgrounds thats composited of maybe four different images, making masks, clipping paths, color correction and major construction...it's amazing that the client usually expects it to fly out the door without allowing for the high quality proofing process. i hear car brochures are different. that would be a nice project. i want to concentrate on high end digital compositing and color correction at the moment. i want to work with some money. really take the time to get those neutrals just right.


p.s. yellow is the kiss of death in subtle grey tones if your aiming for a neutral. the old C3_M2_Y2_K0 doesnt cut it. even on nice paper. once the UV coating hits its all over. if anyone has tried other mixes for neutral grey areas please post them. i think im going to try a C4_M3_Y2_K0.


Jaffa Cake what industries are your clients in?