New U.S. Antitrust Bill Would Require Apple and Google to Allow Third-Party App Stores and Sideloading

[zantafio]

It's not about consumer choice. it's about giving government access to your data.

Remember a few years ago the debate about giving governments a back door to bypass encryption? Remember "the software equivalent of cancer"?

Well they found a new way, by mean of a Trojan horse: they pretend to be concerned about consumer's freedom of choice so as to force Apple. & Co to allow sideloading, finally giving them the backdoor.

 

[JMacHack]

I would love to hear people say they don't want this because it makes iOS less secure, but allowing Apple to scan your images and messages and possibly upload them to the government, that's OK ??

Okay, I’ll bite.

Apple reports csam to the government. I don’t like that one bit.

I do like that they have some standards that apps mist follow though.

While I (unfortunately) cannot escape the eye of the government, I would prefer the ability to escape the prying eyes of other entities.

 

[sw1tcher]

Will the government next force Walmart to allow Target to advertise their own products and install their own cash registers in Walmart stores?

Walmart currently isn't allowing Target to market their products in Walmart stores or their website.

However, Apple is allowing other retailers and service providers to advertise their products and services on Apple's App Store.


Then there's this:

Under the terms of the bill, which applies to companies that own or control an App Store with more than 50,000,000 users, Apple would not be able to require developers to use its own in-app purchase system

Using Walmart as an example again, the current situation would be like Walmart only accepting a Walmart credit card, Walmart gift card, or Walmart Pay as a form of payment.

Not requiring Apple developers to use Apple's in-app purchase system is analogous to Walmart accepting cash, checks, and non-Walmart credit/debit cards.

 

[jonblatho]

I think this was the real reason for the closed Apple ecosystem from the get go. Not so much security for the consumers but (revenue) security for developers.

The real reason was and still is Apple’s bottom line.

 

[LeadingHeat]

For all of you who are praising this… I wonder if you’ve thought about the ramifications. Actually thought about them. Security workarounds with apps not being reviewed by Apple (even as imperfect as it is now) would allow many multitudes more malware to exist and make it through to the end user.

Also, for the third party app stores… do you really think that app developers are going to keep them in the App Store if they can get their app hosted for free or very discounted elsewhere? Of course not. The App Store will soon be as bad as the Mac App Store if that’s the case. “Just keep using the App Store if you don’t like side loading or installing new app stores” doesn’t hold water if there are no more apps on that App Store. I know for a fact the devs in the “app coalition for fairness” group and supporters will leave. That’s tile, Facebook, Spotify, ProtonMail, epic, etc etc etc. it’s going to be a snowball effect for sure.

 

[vagos]

Pirates rejoice!

It's not a winning situation for Apple Developers. The Torrent sites will be loaded with apps that can be installed without having to jailbreak your device.

If you let politicians control Technology, we will have total chaos.

Well it works fine on the mac where you can install whatever you want and it's quite secure. I don't see any chaos on the mac.

 

[Khedron]

Cool. Apple will now have to hire even more people to man their Genius Bars when people bring in malware laden iPhones and go "I sideloaded this game...but it mess it up with Moose porn malware...fix it..."

Apply for a job now, they're going to need it!

Oh no, think of the poor accountants having less money to hoard in offshore accounts while average employees get salaries AND benefits just for doing a job Apple gave them.

When is Apple going to get 30% of its employees' salaries back for providing the platform their job depends on? Justice for Apple!

 

[turbineseaplane]

Why are people so worried about the "Genius" bar?

Who cares?

Let the 2 Trillion dollar behemoth worry about that.

Use some of the money they hoard from dodging taxes all over the planet.

 

[Amazing Iceman]

Well it works fine on the mac where you can install whatever you want and it's quite secure. I don't see any chaos on the mac.

Unless you are a Developer, you wouldn't understand it.

 

[willzyx]

I truly hope new iPhones won't come preloaded with a third party App Store without a way of deleting it. The reason I switched to iPhone from a Samsung is because of this.

 

[vagos]

“Just keep using the App Store if you don’t like side loading or installing new app stores” doesn’t hold water if there are no more apps on that App Store.

There will be apps because apple will be forced to drop 30% down to 5% and apps will have incentive to be on the app store.

 

[_Spinn_]

I absolutely do not want third party app stores or other payment options in apps. I don’t want to give my payment info to every app/store under the sun and risk potential data leaks where my credit card number gets stolen. I trust Apple to keep my payment info secure. That’s why I don’t buy much online. I limit my purchasing to Amazon (since if they were hacked everyone would be screwed) and websites that take Apple Pay or PayPal (which is a pain to use). I don’t give my credit card numbers out anywhere else.

If Apple could require apps to provide both Apple’s and 3rd party IAP I guess that would be the least bad of all options. I doubt Apple would be allowed to do that though - most courts would probably see this as an abuse of their market position.

I’m mostly worried about apps that only support 3rd party IAP or are walled behind third party app stores. While it has been pointed many times out that I can just ignore those apps, what happens when there is one that I actually need (not just want)?

As far as allowing third party app stores, I could potentially see larger devs like say Google forcing users to install their App Store to get their apps (based off what they did with Windows Phone this doesn't seem that far off). Or what if some government like Russia forced all apps installed in their country to go through their App Store? Who knows what kind of surveillance could be injected this way.

As a consumer I already have options for what payment method actually backs Apple's IAP - whether that be a credit card (Visa, MasterCard, Discover, etc.), PayPal via linked AppleID account, or cash via purchased gift cards. This isn't really about consumers, this is about devs that don't want to give Apple a cut of the payments. I highly doubt prices would be lower with 3rd party IAP - Apple already lowered their commission from 30% to 15% for most apps and I'm not aware of any that have lowered their prices to pass the savings onto the consumer.

Physical stores already limit what payment methods consumers can use. Visa and MasterCard are accepted pretty much everywhere though Costco only accepts Visa. I've already been to places that won't accept my Discover card and American Express has an even lower acceptance rate than Discover. Some stores don’t even accept credit cards. There are even stores that will give you discounts for using their store loyalty/credit card. Should they be forced to accept all credit cards?

Edit: This will benefit large devs the most since they will have the infrastructure to host app stores (think Microsoft, Google, Amazon, Epic) and then they can pocket 100% of their IAP themselves. This won't help small devs nearly as much - they would have to partner with other app stores to be hosted. I can even envision certain apps being signed to exclusive deals with certain stores (similar to how streaming services get their exclusive content). What happens if an app moves stores? Do I need to re-download it again to continue to get updates? Will I have to re-buy my IAP since that was tied to the original store?

 

[jonblatho]

The App Store will soon be as bad as the Mac App Store if that’s the case.

That gets to the whole point.

This would force Apple to compete and make the App Store compelling for developers and users instead of forcing it as the only option.

 

[sw1tcher]

If this is the case, then the same should apply to Game Consoles: Playstation, Nintendo, Xbox, etc...
We want to sideload to the consoles as well.

You can sideload on a game console (i.e. bypassing Sony's, Microsoft's, Nintendo's, etc. game store) by buying games on a disc/card through Amazon, Best Buy, etc.

Also, I want to be able to install 3rd Party apps on my Mazda.

You mean you want to be able to install and use non-OEM/after market parts and fuel on your Mazda. Oh, wait. You already can.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I wonder if you’ve thought about the ramifications. Actually thought about them. Security workarounds with apps not being reviewed by Apple

Are you worried about this on macOS?

Let's stop treating users like babies and give them choices on how they want to experience their devices.

 

[jonblatho]

While it has been pointed many times out that I can just ignore those apps, what happens when there is one that I actually need (not just want)?

Well, weigh your need to have nanny Apple purportedly protect your device by way of a 5-minute (if that) app review against your need for the app.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I truly hope new iPhones won't come preloaded with a third party App Store without a way of deleting it. The reason I switched to iPhone from a Samsung is because of this.

Do you really think Apple would sell you an Apple device with any App Store preloaded that isn't their own?

 

[2crazy]

I am thinking that this will open the flood gates for malware. Not everybody has the technical knowledge or the common sense not install software from questionable sources. I personally would welcome side loading open source emulators on my iPad for instances, but I can't imagine that to be good in general for the iOS landscape.

 

[falkon-engine]

This could actually be bipartisan right? Be cool to see some emulators on iOS

They used to exist back in the day when I used to jailbreak. But I haven’t tried jail breaking in years ever since the ability for my phone to operate as a hotspot became a standard feature that no longer needed a jailbreak to work.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I absolutely do not want third party app stores or other payment options in apps.

For all we know, a compromise could be that they have to at least offer Apple Pay in the third party app stores.

Problem solved for you there.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I am thinking that this will open the flood gates for malware.

Has it done that on macOS?

 

[Amazing Iceman]

You can sideload on a game console (i.e. bypassing Sony's, Microsoft's, Nintendo's, etc. game store) by buying games on a disc/card through Amazon, Best Buy, etc.

That's not considered sideloading...

sideload | ˈsīdˌlōd |​

verb [with object] Computing

install (software, especially an app) obtained from a third-party source rather than an official retailer: when you sideload an app from the Web, you're installing an unapproved app from an unknown developer.

• copy or transfer (data) from one device to another directly, typically by means of a link such as a USB cable or wireless connection: you'll need to connect your tablet up to your PC and sideload the file.

 

[dwaltwhit]

This will eventually happen. When it does, there will be problems and it will change the experience. When people start complaining about their phone going slow and having viruses, we can say at least apple tried.

 

[turbineseaplane]

This will eventually happen. When it does, there will be problems and it will change the experience. When people start complaining about their phone going slow and having viruses, we can say at least apple tried.

Third party app stores ≠ breaking the sandbox rules on iOS

 

[neilw]

The real reason was and still is Apple’s bottom line.

The problem is that Apple let the two separate goals of enhancing their bottom line and enhancing platform security get intertwined, and the result is this legislation which will have seismic impact on the platform. If Apple had eased up on the bottom line focus while retaining focus on security, they might have avoided this. They have only themselves to blame by making the App Store a huge profit center.