Quality of Forum replies

[Wando64]

When I joined this forum back in 2013 it was a great place to discuss technical issues with a community of people with, in many cases, a deep technical knowledge of anything everything Apple and beyond.
These days it would seem we are all very good (me too) at sharing opinions and discussing Apple products as any other consumer would discuss and debate the advantages of pair of shoes versus another pair.
The technical knowledge however is very thin on the ground and any question that require some degree of expertise, either gets ignored or it receives well intentioned, but unfortunately unhelpful, replies that don’t even begin to address the real technical issue that prompted the post.
Perhaps I am generalising and I have just been unfortunate.
I have tried the Apple Community forum, but that too has become quite unreliable.

What is your experience and, more importantly, what do you do when you have a technical issue that is not been answered on this forum?
Are you aware of, and can you suggest, any other Apple technical support forums that have gotten you out of trouble in the past?

Thanks, and please don’t take this post as a rant. From time to time I need technical help and I would like to understand what is the best way to get it.

Mods: If I posted to the wrong sub-forum, please move to the correct one. Thanks.

 

[sack_peak]

Maybe they found better paying work that matches their technical expertise so what you are reading are novices.

 

[maflynn]

When I joined this forum back in 2013 it was a great place to discuss technical issues with a community of people with,
...
The technical knowledge however is very thin

Could it be that when you joined, your own technical expertise was such that it appeared that other people had a richer set of knowledge and now you're quite knowledgeable and the delta between you and others is less significant?

I find that people are very helpful and most problems are addressed with a wide and varied set of suggestions that aide the person in question.

 

[Wando64]

Could it be that when you joined, your own technical expertise was such that it appeared that other people had a richer set of knowledge and now you're quite knowledgeable and the delta between you and others is less significant?

I find that people are very helpful and most problems are addressed with a wide and varied set of suggestions that aide the person in question.

I suppose there might be an element of that.
Or it is also possible that somehow something has changed with the site/forum navigation so that visibility has become more of an issue.
It is good to hear that you are getting answers to problems. Maybe I just need to persevere.

Still it would be good to know what others do when they need technical help that is not appropriately addressed on this site.
At the moment I don’t have any device covered by AC+ so I don’t think I am entitled to free Apple support anymore.

 

[maflynn]

so I don’t think I am entitled to free Apple support anymore.

Maybe its me, but I found the technical support that was offered by apple was inferior to the people here. I usually come here for a problem and then if my apple product needed repair/replace, I was able to tell the genius or phone support why.

 

[floral]

I'm certainly not an Apple professional (the only thing I would call myself skilled in is iPads), so usually whenever I dive into unfamiliar forums I act as a sort of "class clown" and make light of the situation. Sometimes this ends up with a few dislike reacts or a reminder to not be off topic, but I just like seeing (or well, envisioning?) people smile.

Obviously if it's a serious or important thread then I wouldn't do this, but since I do do this I can't exactly reverse and blame someone for being ignorant if they try this in the wrong moment.

 

[sunapple]

You have to have a bit of luck getting someone with that specific knowledge to find your thread I suppose. I was curious what questions you might have posted that did not get a good reply, your Time Machine thread may be the one. Maybe expecting a helpful reply within one day is a bit optimistic. And it would help to state what possible solutions you found, what you have tried and why it may not have worked. Anyway, I searched the forums for an answer and will post it over there.

 

[KaliYoni]

When I joined this forum back in 2013 it was a great place to discuss technical issues with a community of people with, in many cases, a deep technical knowledge of anything everything Apple and beyond.
These days it would seem we are all very good (me too) at sharing opinions and discussing Apple products as any other consumer would discuss and debate the advantages of pair of shoes versus another pair.
The technical knowledge however is very thin on the ground and any question that require some degree of expertise, either gets ignored or it receives well intentioned, but unfortunately unhelpful, replies that don’t even begin to address the real technical issue that prompted the post.
Perhaps I am generalising and I have just been unfortunate.
I have tried the Apple Community forum, but that too has become quite unreliable.

What is your experience and, more importantly, what do you do when you have a technical issue that is not been answered on this forum?
Are you aware of, and can you suggest, any other Apple technical support forums that have gotten you out of trouble in the past?

Thanks, and please don’t take this post as a rant. From time to time I need technical help and I would like to understand what is the best way to get it.

Mods: If I posted to the wrong sub-forum, please move to the correct one. Thanks.

I think you'll be able to get better tailored recommendations of places to get advice if you post more details, such as your own level of technical knowledge, the specific topics where you find MR lacking in user expertise, and what kind of help you want (for example, just-make-it-work! or a deep understanding of how macOS does something or how to use Terminal commands to do something).


----------
ETA: in the absence of specifics, two sites I enjoy are...

(for community-based troubleshooting discussions)

TidBITS

tidbits.com

TidBITS Talk

Comments on TidBITS articles, and general discussions about Apple

talk.tidbits.com

(a deep-dive website)

The Eclectic Light Company

Macs, painting, and more

eclecticlight.co

 

[Wando64]

You have to have a bit of luck getting someone with that specific knowledge to find your thread I suppose. I was curious what questions you might have posted that did not get a good reply, your Time Machine thread may be the one. Maybe expecting a helpful reply within one day is a bit optimistic. And it would help to state what possible solutions you found, what you have tried and why it may not have worked. Anyway, I searched the forums for an answer and will post it over there.

The TM thread is only the last of many.
In the past I have sometimes ended up replying to my own threads with the solution that I eventually found through my own research and/or experimentation.
At least anyone bumping into those threads through a search will be able to see how I managed to solve the problem.

Maybe it is optimistic to expect a reply within one day, however past experience has told me that either I get a reply in the first day or, very likely, I get no replies at all as the thread disappears at the bottom of the pile.

Today I even learned (by being told off) that there is a forum rule forbidding threads bumping. Now I know.

Anyway, maybe because of this posting I have now received a couple of useful replies in that thread. At least now I have a few options to investigate.
Still it would be good to know how other people search for technical information/advice outside of this forum (unless this request also breaks a forum rule, in which case I will stop asking).

 

[Wando64]

I think you'll be able to get better tailored recommendations of places to get advice if you post more details, such as your own level of technical knowledge, the specific topics where you find MR lacking in user expertise, and what kind of help you want (for example, just-make-it-work! or a deep understanding of how macOS does something or how to use Terminal commands to do something).

But all of this would be different on a case by case basis.
My question was more general. Where do people go for technical information/advice outside of this forum?
Reddit? Other forums?

 

[Apple_Robert]

In my opinion, this is the best place to be if you are a tech nerd and like to talk nerd to other nerds, or need help with something. Granted, many threads looking for help don't get a reply or not the answer the OP was looking for. That can be said of any forum or posting site. I have made threads that didn't get a reply at all. It was disappointing but, I remind myself people come here and give of their own time just like I do. Sometimes, you hit a home run with help and sometimes, you strike out. I have also found that many, many times, needful threads quickly disappear to page 3 and beyond. Most people aren't going to look past page 1. Asking for a technical question about TM or some other Mac issue isn't as exciting as most of the other threads. And truth be told, I would venture to say many of the regs come here to socialize and often don't have the answers many others are seeking so, the post or thread dies an early death.

What I described is how it has been since I started reading and then joined. I see no reason to complain about not getting quality free help.

 

[Wando64]

What I described is how it has been since I started reading and then joined. I see no reason to complain about not getting quality free help.

Maybe it is only my perception that has changed over time, as someone else has suggested in an earlier post.

By the way, I know you are not accusing me of anything, but as I said in my original post, please don‘t take it as a rant (or complaint). I just would like to understand what others do to get the best technical advice.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

When I joined this forum back in 2013 it was a great place to discuss technical issues with a community of people with, in many cases, a deep technical knowledge of anything everything Apple and beyond.
These days it would seem we are all very good (me too) at sharing opinions and discussing Apple products as any other consumer would discuss and debate the advantages of pair of shoes versus another pair.
The technical knowledge however is very thin on the ground and any question that require some degree of expertise, either gets ignored or it receives well intentioned, but unfortunately unhelpful, replies that don’t even begin to address the real technical issue that prompted the post.
Perhaps I am generalising and I have just been unfortunate.
I have tried the Apple Community forum, but that too has become quite unreliable.

What is your experience and, more importantly, what do you do when you have a technical issue that is not been answered on this forum?
Are you aware of, and can you suggest, any other Apple technical support forums that have gotten you out of trouble in the past?

Thanks, and please don’t take this post as a rant. From time to time I need technical help and I would like to understand what is the best way to get it.

Mods: If I posted to the wrong sub-forum, please move to the correct one. Thanks.

A few thoughts:

As some others have suggested, my recommendation - firstly - would be to try to be as specific as possible, above all, in the thread title, and secondly, - try to post this thread with a query in the right area of the forum.

This will allow anyone who has knowledge of, or expertise in, this area to judge for themselves whether - and how - they might choose to reply, and, moreover, it will give them a better chance of actually coming across, or finding, the thread, as they, themselves are more likely to be found posting in the areas of their own interest and expertise.

Too many threads seeking information - or advice - are placed (as a sort of desperate catch-all) in the community section (rather than in, for example, the iPhone section, if you need advice on problems with an iPhone), and worse, far too many have a generic thread title such as "Please Help", or "I Need Help", or, sometimes, "Help Needed".

"Please Help" as a thread title tells the reader absolutely nothing. You shouldn't have to read the entire post to discover what it is all about, and to see whether you are in a position to be able to offer 'help', as the thread title should make it quite clear what the thread is about.

That is not remotely helpful (all puns intended), or, more relevantly, useful, to anyone browsing or skimming, the forums, as it tells you precisely nothing about what the problem may be, and how - if at all - you might be able to be in a position to help address, or resolve, this problem.

 

[Apple fanboy]

A few thoughts:

As some others have suggested, my recommendation - firstly - would be to try to be as specific as possible, above all, in the thread title, and secondly, - try to post this thread with a query in the right area of the forum.

This will allow anyone who has knowledge of, or expertise in, this area to judge for themselves whether - and how - they might choose to reply, and, moreover, it will give them a better chance of actually coming across, or finding, the thread, as they, themselves are more likely to be found posting in the areas of their own interest and expertise.

Too many threads seeking information - or advice - are placed (as a sort of desperate catch-all) in the community section (rather than in, for example, the iPhone section, if you need advice on problems with an iPhone), and worse, far too many have a generic thread title such as "I Need Help", sometimes, "Help Needed".

You shouldn't have to read the entire post to discover what it is all about, and to see whether you are in a position to be able to offer 'help', as the thread title should make it quite clear what the thread is about.

That is not remotely helpful (all puns intended), or, more relevantly, useful, to anyone browsing or skimming, the forums, as it tells you precisely nothing about what the problem may be, and how - if at all - you might be able to be in a position to help address, or resolve, this problem.

This! Thread titles matter. Especially as this forum has grown significantly. A please help thread title is easily missed.

 

[avz]

Could it be that when you joined, your own technical expertise was such that it appeared that other people had a richer set of knowledge and now you're quite knowledgeable and the delta between you and others is less significant?

I find that people are very helpful and most problems are addressed with a wide and varied set of suggestions that aide the person in question.

This.

Not to mention that the ability "to ask a question" is an art in itself and requires a certain amount of technical expertise as a prerequisite.

 

[wiimixer]

I'm in agreement with OP, but it's not just these forums - it's everywhere (horror face emoji)

When I begin a forum post, I do so expecting respondents in the following categories:
. Apple apologists. Let's face it, most of us here love Apple. Most understandably still hail Steve Jobs. But only he could pull off the "you're holding it wrong" response to iPhone (4/4s?) antenna issues. Sometimes, increasingly, the issue is with Apple.
. man with a hammer - to whom everything looks like a nail. Well meaning, but tending to bend every issue to something unrelated which they have experienced, and could therefore help with. But it's not your issue.
. comic book guy - ultra earnest, but keener to display their knowledge and skill in spotting faults in posts, however insignificant, than actually helping the poster. (no doubt checking my old posts for failings right now!)
. imagination bypassed - always get Apple Care / try Apple Support. C'mon people, by the time we're posting here we've typically tried the old 'turn off / back on routine'!
. class clown - which floral admirably fessed up to being - which is generally inoffensive, but just noise.

All of the above have a place. It's just that they tend to be more about themselves, rather than the OP, and become a distraction rather than a path to a solution.

Apologies in advance for any offence, genuinely non intended - particularly to floral, as your post here is, ironically, quite illuminating

I suspect it's a symptom of the internet giving so many people their voice and them using it, which I guess is a good thing, right?

And all that being said, I've had great assistance via these forums.

Most recently I raised an issue when using Apple Watch SE2 for swimming - which couldn't be resolved - but reassuring to find & liaise with other interested parties. My motivation was to leave a trail for others with the same issue.

The knowledge base created here is a great resource. Adding to it isn't necessarily as straightforward as it once was. IMHO etc!

 

[I7guy]

I'm in agreement with OP, but it's not just these forums - it's everywhere (horror face emoji)

When I begin a forum post, I do so expecting respondents in the following categories:
. Apple apologists. Let's face it, most of us here love Apple. Most understandably still hail Steve Jobs. But only he could pull off the "you're holding it wrong" response to iPhone (4/4s?) antenna issues. Sometimes, increasingly, the issue is with Apple.
. man with a hammer - to whom everything looks like a nail. Well meaning, but tending to bend every issue to something unrelated which they have experienced, and could therefore help with. But it's not your issue.
. comic book guy - ultra earnest, but keener to display their knowledge and skill in spotting faults in posts, however insignificant, than actually helping the poster. (no doubt checking my old posts for failings right now!)
. imagination bypassed - always get Apple Care / try Apple Support. C'mon people, by the time we're posting here we've typically tried the old 'turn off / back on routine'!
. class clown - which floral admirably fessed up to being - which is generally inoffensive, but just noise.

All of the above have a place. It's just that they tend to be more about themselves, rather than the OP, and become a distraction rather than a path to a solution.

Apologies in advance for any offence, genuinely non intended - particularly to floral, as your post here is, ironically, quite illuminating

I suspect it's a symptom of the internet giving so many people their voice and them using it, which I guess is a good thing, right?

And all that being said, I've had great assistance via these forums.

Most recently I raised an issue when using Apple Watch SE2 for swimming - which couldn't be resolved - but reassuring to find & liaise with other interested parties. My motivation was to leave a trail for others with the same issue.

The knowledge base created here is a great resource. Adding to it isn't necessarily as straightforward as it once was. IMHO etc!

One category was forgotten: Apple critic. No matter what, it’s apples fault.

To me while apple attempts to remove the intricacies of the operation of the iphone there is always the individual use case, which is not always effectively communicated. This makes problem solving on forums sometimes very difficult.

 

[Madhatter32]

I'm in agreement with OP, but it's not just these forums - it's everywhere (horror face emoji)

When I begin a forum post, I do so expecting respondents in the following categories:
. Apple apologists. Let's face it, most of us here love Apple. Most understandably still hail Steve Jobs. But only he could pull off the "you're holding it wrong" response to iPhone (4/4s?) antenna issues. Sometimes, increasingly, the issue is with Apple.
. man with a hammer - to whom everything looks like a nail. Well meaning, but tending to bend every issue to something unrelated which they have experienced, and could therefore help with. But it's not your issue.
. comic book guy - ultra earnest, but keener to display their knowledge and skill in spotting faults in posts, however insignificant, than actually helping the poster. (no doubt checking my old posts for failings right now!)
. imagination bypassed - always get Apple Care / try Apple Support. C'mon people, by the time we're posting here we've typically tried the old 'turn off / back on routine'!
. class clown - which floral admirably fessed up to being - which is generally inoffensive, but just noise.

All of the above have a place. It's just that they tend to be more about themselves, rather than the OP, and become a distraction rather than a path to a solution.

Apologies in advance for any offence, genuinely non intended - particularly to floral, as your post here is, ironically, quite illuminating

I suspect it's a symptom of the internet giving so many people their voice and them using it, which I guess is a good thing, right?

And all that being said, I've had great assistance via these forums.

Most recently I raised an issue when using Apple Watch SE2 for swimming - which couldn't be resolved - but reassuring to find & liaise with other interested parties. My motivation was to leave a trail for others with the same issue.

The knowledge base created here is a great resource. Adding to it isn't necessarily as straightforward as it once was. IMHO etc!

You are forgetting the Crude Reductionist. The one who analyzes and attempts to describe complex insights, motivations, and contributions offered by others into simple lists or categories.

 

[ignatius345]

I find it varies from thread to thread. The big click-baity threads that mention rumored changes to Apple's hardware lineup, anything mentioning pricing of any kind... those draw out the trolls and the armchair executives in a hurry. But the troubleshooting threads are generally a little less full of cynicism. Generally.

I think the other thing to realize is that Apple has gotten more popular over time, and "tech" has as well. Used to be you'd have to be kind of a nerd to come to a forum and speculate about Macs or whatever. Now it seems to me like it's a more mainstream interest.

 

[Analog Kid]

There was a fundamental shift in character of the forums with the rise of iPhone. There are now far more phone users here than Mac users and iPhone doesn't really reward technical knowledge given how iOS is managed. It's not just the iPhone audience who has changed, but the Mac audience as well.

I don't remember exactly what the forums were like in 2013, but it's the midpoint between when I joined and now. When I joined Macs were still architected like more modular PCs, and Apple has steadily moved more toward building them like appliances. In those early years, Mac users knew the differences between PowerPC and x86 and OS X was driving a lot of discussion around OS design and distinctions between MacOS classic and the new BSD based systems. When Apple moved to Intel there was less distinction to debate. As the systems have become increasingly appliance like there's been less need to understand the internals.

Then iPhone. How tech savvy do you need to be (or can you be) with iPhone? It's designed to discourage that.

And of course YouTube has people believing that subscriber count is a metric of technical merit.

Personally I think the changes in the product lines are positive ones-- appliances make less fun toys but more effective tools. But it will lead to an inevitable change in the user base.

Apple Silicon has led to some technically gratifying discussions in some of the subforums. And I find that the user help forums have a few regular denizens who are quite helpful but rarely wander into the better lit forums. It's hopeless in the News forums though. They're for entertainment purposes only.

 

[klasma]

Are you aware of, and can you suggest, any other Apple technical support forums that have gotten you out of trouble in the past?

There’s https://apple.stackexchange.com/ you can try.

 

[ignatius345]

I think threads like this one

All the Hardware Apple Still Sells With a Lightning Port

Apple introduced the Lightning port in September 2012 with the launch of the iPhone 5. The connector was a significant change from the previous...

www.macrumors.com

are just straight up flame-bait and designed to draw out the worst and most cynical comments. We get it, the Lightning transition is going slower than some would like and that Magic Mouse has a minorly inconvenient charge port location. But I can't see any real reason for this story than to inflame forum members.

 

[KaliYoni]

I think threads like this one

any real reason for this story

I'd say one reason for MR articles (as opposed to user-initiated discussion threads) like that is...

Sturm und Drang => Page views => Ad impressions => Clickthroughs=> $$$ for MR

 

[I7guy]

I think threads like this one

All the Hardware Apple Still Sells With a Lightning Port

Apple introduced the Lightning port in September 2012 with the launch of the iPhone 5. The connector was a significant change from the previous...

www.macrumors.com

are just straight up flame-bait and designed to draw out the worst and most cynical comments. We get it, the Lightning transition is going slower than some would like and that Magic Mouse has a minorly inconvenient charge port location. But I can't see any real reason for this story than to inflame forum members.

For forum members that are inflamed that’s on them. No sympathy. If you can’t control yourself maybe you shouldn’t be posting here.