Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Return of the PowerMac Cube?
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
to everyone wishing for a powerful G5 cube... NO!
apple needs a low end to compete with Dell's low end. apple needs more Mac users in general (a larger market share) more than they need the money brought in by expensive systems. this would be a move to sell as many macs as possible, not necessarily to make maximum profit. more mac users strengthen the mac platform by providing more incentive for developers to make good mac apps, improve's apple's overall reputation.
i think that they could do it for $599. make it the LOW end. as far as cost is concerned, imagine an eMac, but with no display and WAY less materials (plastic etc). no speakers (unless you add apple pro speakers to your order). so a nice chunk of the emac's cost is removed from the cube.
The cube is the ultimate lust object. everyone wants one. if they can pull it off, anyone can afford apple's best designed computer, and apple's reputation would vastly improve. remember, though, maximum performance would not be important in this machine. this machine is simply a cheap tower with limited expandability, but excellent looks. this would agressively compete with Dell, and many mac users with existing computers (such as a G5) may also buy an extra computer for $599. if they choose low performance components (like dell does for their low end), then Apple will be able to price a new Cube at about this price.
the great thing about this is that anyone with money who wants a new expensive computer (like a G5) may ALSO buy a Cube, because of affordability.
apple needs a low end to compete with Dell's low end. apple needs more Mac users in general (a larger market share) more than they need the money brought in by expensive systems. this would be a move to sell as many macs as possible, not necessarily to make maximum profit. more mac users strengthen the mac platform by providing more incentive for developers to make good mac apps, improve's apple's overall reputation.
i think that they could do it for $599. make it the LOW end. as far as cost is concerned, imagine an eMac, but with no display and WAY less materials (plastic etc). no speakers (unless you add apple pro speakers to your order). so a nice chunk of the emac's cost is removed from the cube.
The cube is the ultimate lust object. everyone wants one. if they can pull it off, anyone can afford apple's best designed computer, and apple's reputation would vastly improve. remember, though, maximum performance would not be important in this machine. this machine is simply a cheap tower with limited expandability, but excellent looks. this would agressively compete with Dell, and many mac users with existing computers (such as a G5) may also buy an extra computer for $599. if they choose low performance components (like dell does for their low end), then Apple will be able to price a new Cube at about this price.
the great thing about this is that anyone with money who wants a new expensive computer (like a G5) may ALSO buy a Cube, because of affordability.
Hmm....this might actually work this time. With a bluetooth Mouse + keyboard and airport you could finally have that apparently wireless desktop that the original cube was supposed to have.
Think low-power g5, sata drive (less cable more airflow), 2 ram slots and 8x agp, with maybe a single pci expansion slot. Aluminum case. I think fanless would be a mistake, any high powered video card will have one, and they can just use a couple of low-flow fans like the g5 tower. If they could do that for $1000.....
the one issue with this is that its really close to intruding on the 1.6 g5 tower. the tower offers only one more drive bay and more pci/ram expansion for $1000 more. So this would only work well if the g5 was redesigned with more expansion in mind, or the cube price went up / tower came down.
Think low-power g5, sata drive (less cable more airflow), 2 ram slots and 8x agp, with maybe a single pci expansion slot. Aluminum case. I think fanless would be a mistake, any high powered video card will have one, and they can just use a couple of low-flow fans like the g5 tower. If they could do that for $1000.....
the one issue with this is that its really close to intruding on the 1.6 g5 tower. the tower offers only one more drive bay and more pci/ram expansion for $1000 more. So this would only work well if the g5 was redesigned with more expansion in mind, or the cube price went up / tower came down.
Count me in, brother! Now THAT would be a stunning 20th anniversary Mac!
Back on topic, I don't understand why so many people seem to think that a G5 cube would be too expensive. I really don't think the G4 procs are much cheaper (if at all), and by having more/all product lines use the G5 Apple will surely get them cheaper from IBM. They should just put a single G5 into the original cube design (as it can't be bettered IMO), make it a little bigger overall so normal-sized graphics cards will fit and cooling is better and sell it as cheap as possible. Such a system would sell extremely well.
the problem with the G5 isn't the cost of the processor itself: the new controller chip and associated extras are where the cost comes in. if i remember correctly, the G5 chip itself is cheaper than the G4.
they do not need to fit standard sized graphics cards in, as Nvidia and ATI can make custom cards to fit the cube. the only reason they stopped making them is because the cube was cancelled. if it had sold well, the cube would have received periodically upgraded custom sized graphics cards. so if you want to upgrade your cube's graphics in 2 years, just buy the graphics card that's in the current cube.
they do not need to fit standard sized graphics cards in, as Nvidia and ATI can make custom cards to fit the cube. the only reason they stopped making them is because the cube was cancelled. if it had sold well, the cube would have received periodically upgraded custom sized graphics cards. so if you want to upgrade your cube's graphics in 2 years, just buy the graphics card that's in the current cube.
jayscheuerle
macrumors 68020
Are you high? $499 for all of that? You're talking about a computer that's as powerful as the iMac 17" for less than 1/3rd the cost. Of course it would eat sales. It would eat sales of the eMac also. For the specs you just mentioned in a cube form factor Apple would sell it for at least $1499.
Re: Gentelmen, you can rebuild it...
Oh man, this is excellent. I've considered getting a Cube for some time, and getting the upgrades, but this new enclosure from PowerLogix makes it that much more tempting! Ah, if only I had the money...
Oh man, this is excellent. I've considered getting a Cube for some time, and getting the upgrades, but this new enclosure from PowerLogix makes it that much more tempting! Ah, if only I had the money...
Re: Think Orb
If you want an orb, get an iMac and give it a lower half.
Honestly, I don't think that an orb would sell very well. There has to be consideration given to the functionality of form. The iMac gets away with a circular form factor because it sits under the monitor. But, for computers that are separate from the monitor, there's a reason just about everything that's ever been put out has had a square or rectangular form factor: function.
Oh, and for the record, for most people, expandability is a rarely needed luxury, not a necessity. I dare say that the Power Mac is the line that has always been aimed at the part of the market that needs expandability, while the iMac, the eMac, and the (once and future?) Cube were not.
If you want an orb, get an iMac and give it a lower half.
Honestly, I don't think that an orb would sell very well. There has to be consideration given to the functionality of form. The iMac gets away with a circular form factor because it sits under the monitor. But, for computers that are separate from the monitor, there's a reason just about everything that's ever been put out has had a square or rectangular form factor: function.
Oh, and for the record, for most people, expandability is a rarely needed luxury, not a necessity. I dare say that the Power Mac is the line that has always been aimed at the part of the market that needs expandability, while the iMac, the eMac, and the (once and future?) Cube were not.
jayscheuerle
macrumors 68020
If Apple can't come out with a sub $700 headless computer (for bottom line), they really shouldn't bother.
The eMacs are for people who want or need the all-in-one form (schools for durability).
Give it the same specs as an eMac and lop off $100-$200. There are so many people that want to own a Mac, but can't. This doesn't need to be a compromising machine. It just needs to have a low end.
Re: Re: METAL G5
Uh... perhaps you should review the concepts behind (what should be referred to as) liquid cooling. Yes, it's designed to move heat around. Is the act of moving it supposed to dissipate it? No. Liquid cooling move the heat from the source to a better heat-sink. Imagine if you had an aluminum cased Cube where the entire body acted as an external heat-sink because the heat was carried from the processor to the outer body using a liquid cooling system. This would provide a much more efficient cooling surface than any internal heat-sink directly on the processor, which is why it is what's been used for most custom super-computers for several decades.
Uh... perhaps you should review the concepts behind (what should be referred to as) liquid cooling. Yes, it's designed to move heat around. Is the act of moving it supposed to dissipate it? No. Liquid cooling move the heat from the source to a better heat-sink. Imagine if you had an aluminum cased Cube where the entire body acted as an external heat-sink because the heat was carried from the processor to the outer body using a liquid cooling system. This would provide a much more efficient cooling surface than any internal heat-sink directly on the processor, which is why it is what's been used for most custom super-computers for several decades.
Perhaps some of his specs were a bit high, but I don't think that you'd need to price it quite as high as you're suggesting. Here's a possible spec list:
1GHz PowerPC G4 Processor
System bus
133MHz
Memory
128MB of SDRAM; supports up to 1GB
Hard disk drive
40GB Ultra ATA
Optical drive
Combo drive (DVD-ROM/CD-RW)
Display
None
Graphics support
ATI Radeon 7500 with AGP 4x support; 32MB dedicated DDR SDRAM graphics memory
Ports
Two FireWire 400 ports, three USB ports, ADC output port, headphone jack, audio line in jack
Networking
Built-in 10/100BASE-T Ethernet and 56K V.92 modem
Wireless
AirPort Extreme ready
Speakers
Basic internal speaker
System software
Mac OS X
BTO Options:
Extra RAM (up to 1GB)
Larger hard drive, up to 120GB
SuperDrive (DVD-R, CD-RW)
AirPort Extreme card
Apple Pro Speakers
Perhaps there would be a high-end model that would come with a 1.24 GHz G4. But, as a low end model, I challenge you to tell me that this computer could not be sold for somewhere in the range of $500-$700...
we're talking two totally different computers
From what I'm reading, there's really two computers we're talking about here. A less expensive bare bones consumer line, and a true Powermac Cube.
Apple didn't sell the original cube at budget prices, and probably won't sell this one at budget prices either. That of course doesn't mean they'll be stupid twice and introduce a computer that directly competes with other computers they are selling.
The "PowerMac G5 Cube" would be released similar to the TAM; for those with money to spend on a collector's item computer.
From what I'm reading, there's really two computers we're talking about here. A less expensive bare bones consumer line, and a true Powermac Cube.
Apple didn't sell the original cube at budget prices, and probably won't sell this one at budget prices either. That of course doesn't mean they'll be stupid twice and introduce a computer that directly competes with other computers they are selling.
The "PowerMac G5 Cube" would be released similar to the TAM; for those with money to spend on a collector's item computer.
Should be interesting if Apple keeps the two things that made the darn cube great -- video card & CPU daughtercard -- or they make use of the PowerBook motherboard and bring out a non-upgradable machine in a fancy plastic box.
Or any ultra small headless machine with a AGP slot, and CPU card would be nice.
But the size, cooling, and power requirements of the new ATI 9800 sort of blow the budget if you want the capability to use it. Same with the 1.42GHz G4s (though the 7457s should offset some of that).
Or any ultra small headless machine with a AGP slot, and CPU card would be nice.
But the size, cooling, and power requirements of the new ATI 9800 sort of blow the budget if you want the capability to use it. Same with the 1.42GHz G4s (though the 7457s should offset some of that).
jayscheuerle
macrumors 68020
Re: we're talking two totally different computers
Actually, they didn't sell the original Cube at Power prices either. That was the problem.
Nice idea... for an industrial arts museum. The cube was a niche marketing failure that won't happen again in its original concept regardless of form.
If it's not inexpensive, Apple wouldn't dare make the same mistake twice, no matter how beautiful the machine was.
Actually, they didn't sell the original Cube at Power prices either. That was the problem.
Nice idea... for an industrial arts museum. The cube was a niche marketing failure that won't happen again in its original concept regardless of form.
If it's not inexpensive, Apple wouldn't dare make the same mistake twice, no matter how beautiful the machine was.
That's too low. I don't remember a time Apple sold any computer that cheap...Think about it, that's getting into the iPod price range almost.
Plus, you'll be paying for the form factor design for a product like the cube. That's going to be a big chunk of change.
My understanding is that the new Cube will retain the same acrylic exterior shell as the original, with an anodized aluminum inner case. The target is presently a single 2.0GHz G5, current era I/O port complement, air-cooled, at a $1400 to $1600 range price point. This is secondhand info, but is from multiple manufacturing sources. January-ish for an introduction time. The project's been in development for almost two-years, and is no secret in Taiwanese OEM circles.
While I'm briefly coming out of retirement, I might as well add that the 30-inch Chi-Mei-built Cinema Display is about to start production, and will appear in January, as well, at a price point of $3000 to $3500... and at a "much higher resolution" than the 23-inch ACD.
Peace. MW
While I'm briefly coming out of retirement, I might as well add that the 30-inch Chi-Mei-built Cinema Display is about to start production, and will appear in January, as well, at a price point of $3000 to $3500... and at a "much higher resolution" than the 23-inch ACD.
Peace. MW
Hrm...
Makes me *almost* want to hold off buying a processor upgrade for my cube until *after* mid-January.
It would rock though, if Apple released another quiet running machine. Although, if you ever sit next to an iMac, they're pretty quiet too.
Makes me *almost* want to hold off buying a processor upgrade for my cube until *after* mid-January.
It would rock though, if Apple released another quiet running machine. Although, if you ever sit next to an iMac, they're pretty quiet too.
Yeah, but I bet those custom cards were/would be more expensive than normal-sized ones. Plus, as I said, if a new cube was a little bigger, it would help loads with cooling and would maybe make it possible for a G5 cube to remain fanless and thus silent, which was one of the biggest advantages of the original cube.
the people expecting a under $800 imac or headless mac thats cheap are going to be very disappointed. First of all Apple is a high end computer company, they are not interested in the cheap computer with no margins- see dell,gateway or whoever for one of those. 2nd the cube was a fortune at the time it was introduced, i would expect it to be aimed at the prosumer and fall real close to current imac pricing so dont expect a new cheap Mac because i dont but i do expect a Mac that meets the consumer expectation for power,expandability,utility and style and it wont sell for no $500 more like $1500 if you know Apple like many of us.