Sold my M1 8/8/512 Macbook Air...So...Windows laptop: where is this land paved with cheap gold?

[MajorFubar]

Dear Readers,

In May I bought a 8/8/512GB M1 Macbook Air when I saw one on the UK Refurb Store.
I've just sold it because I found myself not using it enough to justify keeping it when I already own a Mac Studio.
Now let me stress unconditionally, my selling it is 100% not the machine's fault: I stand by my belief that it's a phenomenal piece of gear.

However, for the benefit of having just 'a' laptop when I need one, I have considered buying a cheap Windows laptop, because if I 'go over to the dark side' I could almost justify said purchase, because 'vive la difference', there might be something I would use it for that I might not be able to do on a Macbook because most of the world runs Windows. Plus, no Apple Tax, right? Capitalism and competition at its very best, driving down the price of a laptop with 128GB RAM, billion GHz processor and 2TB SSD for the price of three tokens off the back of cereal packets? That kind of stuff.

So, this past Boxing Day I found myself just casually trawling round my local PC World, to see what Windows machines totally blew away my Macbook for the same or less price (considering, no Apple Tax).

My dear readers, trust me this is NOT easy.

The cheapest Windows laptop I would consider buying from the ones on display was the HP Pavilion 14-eh0500sa, with 8GB RAM, 512GB SSD, 11 hour* battery life and 2240x1400 Iris IPS graphics for £599 discounted from £849: not a massively different list price from the 256GB M1 Air which will totally smoke it in terms of performance, build, battery life, power efficiency, resource efficiency, and screen quality, which I can buy new from Amazon UK for £878.

I was also eying up a Samsung Galaxybook 360 13.3 for £649 (discounted from £999): an absolute MBA cosmetic clone with 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD, amazing 1920x1080 display (beamed to you directly from 2009 when a 1080p display was good), and 22 hours* battery life.

Everything cheaper than these had a mixture of obviously sh-t(er) screen, poor keyboard with deckflex like a trampoline, slow(er) processor, nasty barrel-connector power supply from 1986 and, mostly, not even multi-gesture trackpads.

Possibly I will end up buying the HP, but rest assured my dear Apple friends, the road is NOT paved with cheap gold the minute you look over the Apple wall...

*wait 'til the fans spin up and watch it dive.

 

[maflynn]

The cheapest Windows laptop I would consider buying from the ones on display was the HP Pavilion 14-eh0500sa, with 8GB RAM, 512GB SSD, 11 hour* battery life and 2240x1400 Iris IPS graphics for £599 discounted from £849: not a massively different list price from the 256GB M1 Air which will totally smoke it in terms of performance, build, battery life, power efficiency, resource efficiency, and screen quality, which I can buy new from Amazon UK for £878.

I was also eying up a Samsung Galaxybook 360 13.3 for £649 (discounted from £999): an absolute MBA cosmetic clone with 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD, amazing 1920x1080 display (beamed to you directly from 2009 when a 1080p display was good), and 22 hours* battery life.

I'm a big believer in you get what you pay for. Finding the cheapest windows laptop will only result in frustration and disappointment. Given what the specs of the HP and possibly the Samsung, I think you'll be disappointed.

I think those 600 dollar laptops are so far behind what the MBA is capable doing in every category, its a mistake imo

 

[MajorFubar]

I'm a big believer in you get what you pay for. Finding the cheapest windows laptop will only result in frustration and disappointment. Given what the specs of the HP and possibly the Samsung, I think you'll be disappointed.

I think those 600 dollar laptops are so far behind what the MBA is capable doing in every category, its a mistake imo

I 100% hear you. And I'm here to warn people who think life is better beyond the Apple Taxed wall, that it isn't necessarily so. I'm fortunate that I've ended up using a laptop so stupidly few times (I recharged it like 4 times in 7 months) that I only need a laptop capable of doing really, really basic things like running Word reasonably well and playing YouTube videos: so '2008 level' of taxing. But I don't want an old obsolete Macbook because it won't run the latest OS's, it won't run new-ish apps and browsers, and consumable parts like batteries will be NLA. So, I thought, cheap modern Windows laptop FTW.

But the reality is not so rosy. The Windows laptops that will blow a Macbook away for 50% of the price are, it turns out, a complete work of fiction dreamed-up by Windefenders.

 

[maflynn]

it turns out, a complete work of fiction dreamed-up by Windefenders.

My Razer blade advanced can go toe to toe with the MBP and will come out head on pure computational benchmarks. It falls down completely on battery life, fan noise and temps. I love the razer, its a great laptop, but its also wildly expensive - MBP expensive.

who think life is better beyond the Apple Taxed wall

Yeah, you can get a really good windows machine, but not at 600 dollars. Even then, intel based processors, and nvidia based GPUs are so power hungry that you'll be carrying a huge brick to power it - kind of like what I have to do with my razer.

 

[unrigestered]

I still have a Win 7 laptop from 2010.
and while i'm extremely happy with my current two M1 Macbooks, i'm also keeping an eye for a decent replacement for that old Windows machine.
Thing is:
decent Windows laptops have gotten so much more expensive than they used to, that they are often pretty much on par with Apple's pricings, not rarely even more expensive, while giving you a worse laptop experience, with worse battery life, fan noise and more throttling, unless you keep it plugged and need a really powerful graphics card.
but then, you could as well go fully desktop, where you will get even more powerful systems due to less heat related constraints a tiny package like a laptop will give you.

there are still good laptops to be had for a good price, like from Asus or Acer, but apart from the Microsoft line of laptops, everything will come with more or less of a crap ton of bloatware pre-installed on your system.
Even on those MS devices, you can't opt not to have at least an upgradable Office demo installed, but the rest usually comes with at least McAfee this and that, HP stuff comes with at least a dozen of HP apps on it, etc.

so i guess i will keep my "ancient" Win 7 laptop for the time being, until the "PC" world will catch up with similarly capable laptop design CPUs that won't require cooling fans running even for the most basic things

 

[JustAnExpat]

Dollar for dollar (or pound for pound), Macbook Airs can't be beat for their value. I had a Lenovo Z50 that I have to get rid of (it shocks me when I touch it) and I brought a new Infinix X2 notebook in silver. There's some advantages (more ports! cheaper!), disadvantages (slower WiFi! Noisy! Requires its own special USB C cable!) and some WTF moments (Upside Down USB A port?!).

Do I recommend it? Eh, not really. But it's good enough for a backup Windows machine, or as a disposable computer on the go. I purchased a cheap Windows 11 Pro license and encrypted the hard drive. But there's no way I will separate myself from my MacBook Air, at all.

 

[sracer]

I 100% hear you. And I'm here to warn people who think life is better beyond the Apple Taxed wall, that it isn't necessarily so. I'm fortunate that I've ended up using a laptop so stupidly few times (I recharged it like 4 times in 7 months) that I only need a laptop capable of doing really, really basic things like running Word reasonably well and playing YouTube videos: so '2008 level' of taxing. But I don't want an old obsolete Macbook because it won't run the latest OS's, it won't run new-ish apps and browsers, and consumable parts like batteries will be NLA. So, I thought, cheap modern Windows laptop FTW.

But the reality is not so rosy. The Windows laptops that will blow a Macbook away for 50% of the price are, it turns out, a complete work of fiction dreamed-up by Windefenders.

Hyperbole aside, I'm sorry to hear that you were unable to find Windows laptops that offer a better cost-value than Macbooks. They absolutely do exist, but what options are available depends highly upon what your requirements are.

In your comparison shopping, you did not compare similar RAM/Storage capacities.

You mentioned that a 256GB M1 Air cost £878. You compared that to an HP Pavilion 14-eh0500sa, with 8GB RAM, 512GB SSD that cost £599. How much is a 512GB M1 Air? £1078?

Apple's pricing tiers are set so that the base model offers the best value. Any increase in RAM or storage disproportionately increases the price.

 

[keeper]

I've just sold it because I found myself not using it enough to justify keeping it when I already own a Mac Studio.

So the key takeaway is you were not using it, what makes you think you would use a windows laptop if you don't have a specific need for it?
I'd just be keeping the money in the bank till you need a machine to do something that your current Mac won't do unless you want to move to windows land.

 

[Annv]

If you use a laptop so rarely, you could simply remote into your Studio from an iPad if you already have one. And for YouTube, an iPad alone might be enough.

Spending 99% of the time on my Windows desktop, I could not justify buying a laptop, so I use JumpDesktop ($17) on iPad with the keyboard and mouse that came with the iMac.

As to the price of Windows laptops, if you want a nice screen, good specs and a quality keyboard, they are really not cheap. For example, my son's gaming ASUS ROG Strix costed about $1000, is a good machine, but still has compromises: 67% sRGB, no USB-C charging, lower performance when not plugged in, and a super short battery life. BTW, by remoting into the iPad I get a long battery life, as all the heavy lifting is done on the desktop.

 

[Wizec]

These are not “MBA Killers!”, but they are solid Windows laptops:

$712 with 12GB RAM, 512GB SSD, nice build quality

Best Buy: Lenovo Yoga 7i 2-in-1 14" Touch Screen Laptop Intel Evo Platform Core i5 12GB Memory 512GB Solid State Drive 82BH00DQUS/82BH0006US

Shop Lenovo Yoga 7i 2-in-1 14" Touch Screen Laptop Intel Evo Platform Core i5 12GB Memory 512GB Solid State Drive at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

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$749 with 16GB RAM, 512 SSD

Best Buy: Dell Inspiron 2-in-1 14” FHD+ Touch Laptop – AMD Ryzen 7 – 16GB Memory – 512GB SSD Pebble Green i7425-A266PBL-PUS

Shop Dell Inspiron 2-in-1 14” FHD+ Touch Laptop – AMD Ryzen 7 – 16GB Memory – 512GB SSD Pebble Green at Best Buy. Find low everyday prices and buy online for delivery or in-store pick-up. Price Match Guarantee.

www.bestbuy.com

I really appreciate many attributes of my M1 MBA. Parallels virtualization gives me pretty good Windows 11 support, but there are a few things that I would like full x64 support for, so I’m looking at higher end Windows laptops myself, like the Yoga 9i. I wish Intel was even down to 5nm by now so we could get a totally cool n quiet option. Although, from watching lots of YouTube videos the 12th gen i7 in the Yoga 9i is pretty much silent until it’s pushed hard, and then the fan becomes audible, but not obtrusive…

 

[MBAir2010]

Dollar for dollar (or pound for pound), Macbook Airs can't be beat for their value.

Yup,
My Dell XPS 13" 2019 USB ports went kaput, and getting a trust batty from dell was a failure
While
my MBAir 2010 still works today, with new reputable battery too!

 

[MajorFubar]

So the key takeaway is you were not using it, what makes you think you would use a windows laptop if you don't have a specific need for it?
I'd just be keeping the money in the bank till you need a machine to do something that your current Mac won't do unless you want to move to windows land.

That's a very fair question. My assumption was that I would be able to spend say £400 on a very usable and current Windows laptop that I didn't feel guilty about it being sat in the drawer most of the time, but was there when I needed a laptop. Gotta be honest I've probably had a need for a laptop more in the week since I sold it than in the seven months since I bought it, but that was guaranteed to happen!

For the time being I've just banked the money and I'm sitting it out.

 

[1BadManVan]

I don’t see the point in wasting money on a crappy windows machine if the air is a way better value for the money and performs better? In this price category, the m1 air is top of the list. As someone else pointed, budget windows laptop lately aren’t that competitive

 

[maflynn]

to spend say £400 on a very usable and current Windows laptop

Very usable for what? That's the question because 400 dollar class laptops are not very capable for most tasks imo.

 

[Technerd108]

I would avoid "cheap" windows laptops. Mid range is where it is at and you can often find sales of mid range windows laptops better equipped than Mac alternatives.

For example I purchased a Microsoft Surface Laptop 4 early last year or late the year before and I got the AMD model for $649 which at the time was a great deal. It is a premium laptop. Granted it only had a 128gb ssd and 8gb ram but the chasis and speakers and screen were all top notch. I sold it for near what I paid for it and bought on sale a new Lenovo 14" 7i last year around late summer, early fall. It had a 12th gen Intel chip, 2.5k resolution touch screen. 4 speaker system, 16gb ram and 512gb ssd for $549 on sale at Best Buy. Retail was close to $1200.

My point is that you can often find mid range devices for much less than retail if you watch for sales typically around summer and fall. My Lenovo 7i is a pretty decent replacement for my M2 MBA in terms of specs and build quality although the air has a brighter screen, is fanless and faster and much lighter device. But on paper they are close. It was less than half what I paid for the M2 air. I did already after 3 months have the mother board die and just got back the replacement. Never had that happen on any laptop I have owned except one in the last 15 or more years of owning laptops. I hope it is not a trend and that it doesn't happen again.

I think really low end Windows laptops are just as bad as cheap chromebooks and simply not worth the money. You are better off spending around $600-$800 for a windows laptop on sale with mid range specs than a bargain basement laptop with really bad screen, plastic build and poor performance. If you just need something to browse the net a decent midrange Chromebook might even be better.

In the end you get what you pay for. This holds true for MacBooks, Windows PC's, Chromebooks, iPads, Android Tablets and phones. There is a certain price range where you can find deals on various devices but going lower you always end up having more problems than it is worth in terms of savings. At least that has been my experience.

When I used to buy Surface Laptops or Surface Pro Tablets I would always buy a generation behind depending on the specs. That way I never spent the ridiculous prices MS charged or if another brand I would wait until there were big sales like summer or black friday and I basically save up for those times. I always sell what I used to have and since I never pay retail the money I get back is close enough to what I paid it is worth it to upgrade. If I didn't follow this method I would not have the tech I currently do because I could not afford it.

 

[v0lume4]

Hey, did you ever find a laptop that suits you? I'm typing this from this laptop. I got it open-box from Best Buy for $540, but it retails for $750. It's available open-box as I type this. Doesn't sound like you're in the US, so I'm not sure how much this laptop goes for at other retailers. The laptops model is Q409ZA.

It's absolutely unreal how good of a machine this is given it's price. Probably one of the best Windows thin-and-lights you can get under $1,000. Only two hits are the battery life and some weird Windows hibernation issues. The battery life is only ok. Middling office work etc. will yield 5-6 hours of screen on time. But that's ok if you keep it topped off when you aren't using it. The Windows hibernation issues... well, sometimes the laptop will not wake up and I have to hold the power button to force it off before I turn it back on again. Also, sometimes hibernate will work correctly but then all my windows will be closed when I boot up the machine, with me risking losing my work. These issues seem to have been lessened in frequency since I updated the BIOS. Hope this helps.

 

[MajorFubar]

No I ended up spending the money on other things because even a Windows laptop would mostly have just sat there gathering dust. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Lihp8270]

Unfortunately there’s 3 choices. Cheap, nasty, poor quality windows laptop. Or a good quality one that is just as expensive as a MacBook.

 

[Technerd108]

Unfortunately there’s 3 choices. Cheap, nasty, poor quality windows laptop. Or a good quality one that is just as expensive as a MacBook.

Not really true. I mean if you just buy at MSRP then maybe but I have a nice current windows laptop made with all aluminum and glass. 12 gen Intel, plenty of ram and pci 4 SSD for almost a 1/3 to half the cost of a MacBook air.

Mid range Windows laptops when found on sale are a very good value.

 

[NT1440]

I tell people this all the time when inevitably asked “what computer should I buy”: how long do you want to keep it?

With basic specs being more than enough for these types of users I ask them: Do you want a cheap plastic body whose hinges will break in 2 years, or do you want to spend a couple hundred dollars more for something that the body won’t crack and break?

There are plenty of good windows machines out there, but the bottom of the barrel price tiers are not in it for the long haul unless you physically baby the machine, and looking at how they treat their work machines….no.

 

[Lihp8270]

Not really true. I mean if you just buy at MSRP then maybe but I have a nice current windows laptop made with all aluminum and glass. 12 gen Intel, plenty of ram and pci 4 SSD for almost a 1/3 to half the cost of a MacBook air.

Mid range Windows laptops when found on sale are a very good value.

Then you have to compare to a generation old MacBook which is on sale also.

 

[Technerd108]

Then you have to compare to a generation old MacBook which is on sale also.

So is the latest M2 MBA? What is your point?

 

[maflynn]

Unfortunately there’s 3 choices. Cheap, nasty, poor quality windows laptop. Or a good quality one that is just as expensive as a MacBook.

Actually that's not true at all. You can buy high quality PC laptops for a lot less then what Apple charges. Lenovo makes quite a number of different models are excellent. Dell, HP Acer, Asus all make quality laptops that are no where near the price of the MBP. Dell has a 15" XPS for 1900 dollars that's 600 dollars cheaper then the base 16" MBP The 13" is 1,000 and yet the 14" MBP is 2000.

Making such broad stroked generalizations almost always gets you in trouble as you're easily proved wrong. You may have a bias towards Macs, like many other people, and/or dislike Pcs and that's fine. We all have our preferences but to say that you only choices are cheap, nasty, poor quality PCs unless you want to pay Mac like prices is just plain silly and ignorant.

 

[TechRunner]

Actually that's not true at all. You can buy high quality PC laptops for a lot less then what Apple charges. Lenovo makes quite a number of different models are excellent. Dell, HP Acer, Asus all make quality laptops that are no where near the price of the MBP. Dell has a 15" XPS for 1900 dollars that's 600 dollars cheaper then the base 16" MBP The 13" is 1,000 and yet the 14" MBP is 2000.

Making such broad stroked generalizations almost always gets you in trouble as you're easily proved wrong. You may have a bias towards Macs, like many other people, and/or dislike Pcs and that's fine. We all have our preferences but to say that you only choices are cheap, nasty, poor quality PCs unless you want to pay Mac like prices is just plain silly and ignorant.

I waited years for Apple to deliver a 15" MBA and finally gave up a little over a year ago and bought an XPS 15 with a 12th gen Intel i5 and 8/256. It came out of its premium packaging flawless, and has stayed problem-free during my first thirteen months of ownership. And no issues with Windows 11, either. Oh, and uh...the RAM is user upgradeable to 64GB, and it has a second SSD slot, so not only can I upgrade the primary drive, I can add a second one. I paid $1149 during a pre-Christmas sale. The battery life isn't Mac-like, for sure. And I do prefer macOS. But the XPS 9510 is plenty fast in its base configuration, it has a premium feel and good keyboard/trackpad, and for a non-demanding-tasks user like myself, should last a good long time. So I 100 percent agree with you that it's troublesome to spout negative generalizations about all Windows laptops.

 

[MBAir2010]

does Dhell (and other PC makers) cut corners on a base model XPS?
for instance, if a poor schmuck purchased a Dell XPS 265GB 8GB ram i5 chip,
would the battery, usb ports and ssd drive be of a poor quality compared to a souped up one?
well I just realized we will never figure this out because no one will do a study on this
but this tactic could be possible.