The truth about Surface Pro

[cocoua]

I'm not going to bother you about how much love Macs and Apple products in general and how much I hate Windows (but not all MS stuff…)

I bought a Surface Pro 2 some years ago at 250$ because I needed a very portable computer to travel and draw on the go. It was only for using one month, but I never could left it behind.

I still work occasionally with it, I used it as backup computer when the MBP was at the SAT, I play games and watch movies on the go or in the big Tv, battery is quite impressive, even for the 2nd generation, already 9 years old and last for 5 hours. I can use full Adobe Suite and do whatever I need as it is a full computer. I can use it in tablet mode when in the couch and I can take it to the kitchen to follow a recipe. I just hate Windows and it is countless incongruous way of doing some things.

But I'm pretty sure, a 2 in 1 like this from Apple, and now even more obvious with the ARM transition, would be the definitive device for many.

And there will be a time, maybe in 5-10 years, where PCs will be indistinguishable from a smartphone. As no gaming or pro users would have enough power in their hand, just arrive to home and connect it to your hub with external screen and whatever you will need.

The Surface Pro is very close to be the perfect tool, it just needs the MacOS consistency and reliability


But of course, Apple is not ready to merge 2 profitable products, this is the sad truth about a Tablet with MacOS and only competition could force them doing that.

 

[xraydoc]

While Apple has gone on record and said that they're not interested in merging the iPad with the Mac, now that they're both based on the same CPU architecture, I wonder if a dual-boot machine (switch back and forth between macOS and iPadOS) is something on Apple's radar. A 12.9" iPad Pro with an M1 could certainly be up to the ask of doing double-duty.

 

[cocoua]

having to reboot for choose the system would lose the optimal user experience.
But it's true this opens the door for a merge, as we now, Apple likes to do things slowly and release polished versions (avoiding the Surface RT effect) so maybe all this "iOS apps aon Mac" is an experiment to see how apps evolve.

As an artist and video editor, I'm just dreaming with that device.

I had the Modbook and was absolutely wonderful, very expensive and a lot of hot though….

 

[skaertus]

I'm not going to bother you about how much love Macs and Apple products in general and how much I hate Windows (but not all MS stuff…)

I bought a Surface Pro 2 some years ago at 250$ because I needed a very portable computer to travel and draw on the go. It was only for using one month, but I never could left it behind.

I still work occasionally with it, I used it as backup computer when the MBP was at the SAT, I play games and watch movies on the go or in the big Tv, battery is quite impressive, even for the 2nd generation, already 9 years old and last for 5 hours. I can use full Adobe Suite and do whatever I need as it is a full computer. I can use it in tablet mode when in the couch and I can take it to the kitchen to follow a recipe. I just hate Windows and it is countless incongruous way of doing some things.

But I'm pretty sure, a 2 in 1 like this from Apple, and now even more obvious with the ARM transition, would be the definitive device for many.

And there will be a time, maybe in 5-10 years, where PCs will be indistinguishable from a smartphone. As no gaming or pro users would have enough power in their hand, just arrive to home and connect it to your hub with external screen and whatever you will need.

The Surface Pro is very close to be the perfect tool, it just needs the MacOS consistency and reliability


But of course, Apple is not ready to merge 2 profitable products, this is the sad truth about a Tablet with MacOS and only competition could force them doing that.

I have to disagree. I do not think a 2-in-1 device, replacing a tablet and a laptop, would be an optimal choice, at least not for me.

I am not even going to start on a Windows vs. macOS discussion. I understand that this is largely a matter of personal preference. Windows may have its annoyances, but it is a competent and flexible operating system. I can run basically anything on it. Of course, macOS is a joy to use on laptops, but it also has its shortcomings. But I will stick to discussing the form factor.

I have had some tablets running different operating systems: two iPads, a Surface, and a Galaxy Tab. All of them are decent devices, but I came to the conclusion that they cannot replace a laptop, at least not for me. And it is not just because of the operating system. A tablet running Windows is definitely better than one running iOS (or iPad OS) or Android. But it still cannot fully replace a laptop running Windows.

And this is because of the keyboard. Yes, a Surface can have a keyboard attached to it, and so can an iPad or an Android tablet. If Apple would release a 2-in-1 Mac, it would do the same thing as well. But the keyboard is inferior. And the main reason is the weight balance. On a laptop, the internals, including the processor and the battery, are under the keyboard. On a tablet, the internals is behind the screen, and the keyboard is a separate piece, usually lighter and not as stable as it does not carry all the weight.

I use a computer mostly to type. A touch screen is fine, but it can never replace a decent keyboard. I really need to have a good keyboard on the go, and not only when I connect the device to an external screen. I like a backlit keyboard, with good travel and comfortable keys, and with good weight balance so I can put the device on my lap. So, while a 1-in-1 would be fine for many, I feel it is not the ideal device for me. Unless some manufacturer manages to make a 2-in-1 with a great keyboard, then I would prefer a laptop any day.

 

[Abazigal]

I'm not going to bother you about how much love Macs and Apple products in general and how much I hate Windows (but not all MS stuff…)

I bought a Surface Pro 2 some years ago at 250$ because I needed a very portable computer to travel and draw on the go. It was only for using one month, but I never could left it behind.

I still work occasionally with it, I used it as backup computer when the MBP was at the SAT, I play games and watch movies on the go or in the big Tv, battery is quite impressive, even for the 2nd generation, already 9 years old and last for 5 hours. I can use full Adobe Suite and do whatever I need as it is a full computer. I can use it in tablet mode when in the couch and I can take it to the kitchen to follow a recipe. I just hate Windows and it is countless incongruous way of doing some things.

But I'm pretty sure, a 2 in 1 like this from Apple, and now even more obvious with the ARM transition, would be the definitive device for many.

And there will be a time, maybe in 5-10 years, where PCs will be indistinguishable from a smartphone. As no gaming or pro users would have enough power in their hand, just arrive to home and connect it to your hub with external screen and whatever you will need.

The Surface Pro is very close to be the perfect tool, it just needs the MacOS consistency and reliability


But of course, Apple is not ready to merge 2 profitable products, this is the sad truth about a Tablet with MacOS and only competition could force them doing that.

I think it’s not so much about cannibalising your own hardware revenue, but more that a 2-in-1 portable, like another device, simply entails a different set of trade-offs.

In terms of form factor, I suppose the iPad Pro with magic keyboard might come closest, but the trade off is that the magic keyboard is extremely bulky and heavy. Will we see an ipad in the future which can switch to macOS when docked? Who knows.

I am currently using a HP EliteX2 for work and I will say that my experience with it is a mixed bag. Battery life isn’t particularly stellar (I get about 2-3 hours of usage). Many of my colleagues suffered from heat-related screen issues last year when we were conducting home-based learning and were constantly zooming all day. The keyboard and trackpad on the detachable keyboard is a joke. Most people I observe use it as a laptop with a faulty hinge, but rarely ever as a tablet.

Personally for me, I am not prepared to make that degree of trade off. I was getting more of the drawbacks than the benefits.

So currently, I am happy bringing a laptop (essentially the EliteX2) and my iPad Pro to work, and keeping my imac and MBA at home for the PC stuff.

Sure, they are all separate devices, but at least I get the best of both worlds as well.

 

[skaertus]

I think it’s not so much about cannibalising your own hardware revenue, but more that a 2-in-1 portable, like another device, simply entails a different set of trade-offs.

In terms of form factor, I suppose the iPad Pro with magic keyboard might come closest, but the trade off is that the magic keyboard is extremely bulky and heavy. Will we see an ipad in the future which can switch to macOS when docked? Who knows.

I am currently using a HP EliteX2 for work and I will say that my experience with it is a mixed bag. Battery life isn’t particularly stellar (I get about 2-3 hours of usage). Many of my colleagues suffered from heat-related screen issues last year when we were conducting home-based learning and were constantly zooming all day. The keyboard and trackpad on the detachable keyboard is a joke. Most people I observe use it as a laptop with a faulty hinge, but rarely ever as a tablet.

Personally for me, I am not prepared to make that degree of trade off. I was getting more of the drawbacks than the benefits.

So currently, I am happy bringing a laptop (essentially the EliteX2) and my iPad Pro to work, and keeping my imac and MBA at home for the PC stuff.

Sure, they are all separate devices, but at least I get the best of both worlds as well.

Yes, this is right.

A 2-in-1 involves some trade-offs, and manufacturers have not yet been able to put everything in a single package. And perhaps they never will.

The iPad Pro is a nice device. But then there are the trade-offs. It becomes heavy and bulky with the addition of the keyboard, as you mentioned. And the iPad Pro with a Magic Keyboard becomes an expensive device, more than many capable laptops. And it is still an iPad running a mobile OS. As for the keyboard, I have tested it but I do not have the full experience to tell if it is as good as a decent laptop keyboard.

I am currently using a 14-inch LG Gram as my main laptop, which I think is the best compromise I could find so far. It has decent specs, is very light (about 1kg), and has great battery life. The full HD screen is fine, although not great, and the keyboard and trackpad are decent (but not best-in-class).

I also have a 13-inch MacBook Pro with Touch Bar. It is certainly more premium than the LG Gram, with a better screen and finer materials. However, much because of these more premium materials, it is also heavier and has poorer battery life.

I have an 11-inch Galaxy Tab S7 as well, which is fine as a tablet, but the OS and the keyboard make it a less-than-optimal replacement for a laptop.

The device that I use the most right now, during the pandemic, is my desktop. It is the ultimate trade-off that I built some 2 years ago and still has some juice: a Core i7-9700K with a GeForce RTX 2070, 32 GB RAM, a 512 GB SSD, a 4 TB HDD, a 32-inch 4K monitor, and a mechanical keyboard. Zero portability, but lots of power, screen real estate, comfort, and convenience, especially when compared to a portable device.

 

[Steve Adams]

The actual machine that is the best of all worlds is the book. Docked on the keyboard it's very powerful, as a tablet it works better than 2 in 1's. They needed to make a floppy keybaord for it like the pro and it would be a killer all in one.

 

[nearfield]

I think it’s not so much about cannibalising your own hardware revenue, but more that a 2-in-1 portable, like another device, simply entails a different set of trade-offs.

In terms of form factor, I suppose the iPad Pro with magic keyboard might come closest, but the trade off is that the magic keyboard is extremely bulky and heavy. Will we see an ipad in the future which can switch to macOS when docked? Who knows.

I am currently using a HP EliteX2 for work and I will say that my experience with it is a mixed bag. Battery life isn’t particularly stellar (I get about 2-3 hours of usage). Many of my colleagues suffered from heat-related screen issues last year when we were conducting home-based learning and were constantly zooming all day. The keyboard and trackpad on the detachable keyboard is a joke. Most people I observe use it as a laptop with a faulty hinge, but rarely ever as a tablet.

Personally for me, I am not prepared to make that degree of trade off. I was getting more of the drawbacks than the benefits.

So currently, I am happy bringing a laptop (essentially the EliteX2) and my iPad Pro to work, and keeping my imac and MBA at home for the PC stuff.

Sure, they are all separate devices, but at least I get the best of both worlds as well.

Regrettably, this is my experience with the Elite X2, too. This machine had quite a few good reviews, and it is repairable. I really wanted to like this computer and make use of its tablet properties, but most of the time I don't. I might also get an iPad to go along with a regular laptop, even though the iPads can get so expensive.

 

[MBAir2010]

My ex next door neighbor who runs a successful internet marking company said these Surfaces are the best things to buy as far as computing, he does code on a desktop with multi monitors, and has his a plug in that does other things i dont care about.
I was going to get A surface go in 2019 but stuck with the ipad,
In which Edge runs better than Safari and is responsive and syncs better, which is just plain weird!

 

[grmlin]

My ex next door neighbor who runs a successful internet marking company said these Surfaces are the best things to buy as far as computing, he does code on a desktop with multi monitors, and has his a plug in that does other things i dont care about.
I was going to get A surface go in 2019 but stuck with the ipad,
In which Edge runs better than Safari and is responsive and syncs better, which is just plain weird!

Edge in iOS is Safari though. Just with a different skin... browsing performance should be the same.

 

[The_Interloper]

My ex next door neighbor who runs a successful internet marking company said these Surfaces are the best things to buy as far as computing, he does code on a desktop with multi monitors, and has his a plug in that does other things i dont care about.

Love the practicality of this setup, complete with Surface Book 3 mounted in a vertical dock:

 

[maflynn]

Love the practicality of this setup, complete with Surface Book 3 mounted in a vertical dock:

That's a really nice setup. I owned a SurfaceBook when it was released and it was a decent computer. I think they've improved upon the original model. I've also owned Surface Pros, but like the SB, the Surface Pro fails to meet my needs at this point. When I'm in the market for another laptop in a few years, the surface line up will definitely be on my short list.