HomeKit Thread network toasted by latest HomePod update (15.4)?

[mpetrides]

Yesterday I updated all my HomePods (6 OG HomePods and 6 HomePod minis) to OS 15.4. Since then, ALL of my Thread accessories have become unresponsive. This includes a number of Nanoleaf Essentials bulbs, Nanoleaf light strips, and an Eve Weather.

They all show up as unresponsive in the Home App but also in their manufacturer-specific apps.And, because they are unresponsive, I can't do any sort of firmware update on them. I have reset several of the HomePod minis, which function as Thread border routers but that makes no difference. As I mentioned, I have 6 HP minis scattered around the house, so Thread coverage should not be an issue.

Is anyone else having this problem? Has anyone found a workaround?

Note: all my Phillips Hue lights work fine, but they are not Thread.

 

[mpetrides]

Addendum to original post: After waiting 24 hours (too busy to take on troubleshooting yesterday), I started by removing the battery from the Eve Weather and resetting it. When that did not work, I used the Eve app to remove the Eve weather from my HomeKit Home and then reinstalled it. The first time I tried this it did not solve the problem.

However, I went through the same sequence (reset, remove, reinstall), the Eve Weather showed up in my Home and functioned properly in the Eve app (was able to set it to F instead of C, unlike the first time). But the best thing is that doing the above ALSO made all my Nanoleaf lights reachable. It's almost as if having that one dysfunctional/unreachable device on the Thread network rendered the entire network unreachable. Weird!

 

[Itinj24]

Addendum to original post: After waiting 24 hours (too busy to take on troubleshooting yesterday), I started by removing the battery from the Eve Weather and resetting it. When that did not work, I used the Eve app to remove the Eve weather from my HomeKit Home and then reinstalled it. The first time I tried this it did not solve the problem.

However, I went through the same sequence (reset, remove, reinstall), the Eve Weather showed up in my Home and functioned properly in the Eve app (was able to set it to F instead of C, unlike the first time). But the best thing is that doing the above ALSO made all my Nanoleaf lights reachable. It's almost as if having that one dysfunctional/unreachable device on the Thread network rendered the entire network unreachable. Weird!

Very weird… Thread is supposed to be a self healing mesh network ?‍♂️. So far, I understand it’s in the infancy stages, but I haven’t bought into the hype just yet. Sounds promising but I’ve been a huge fan of bridged accessories that use Zigbee (Aqara, Hue, Lutron Caseta’s Clear Connect version). Super fast, super reliable and troubleshooting is typically necessary only at one location point.

My first and only experience with Thread has been lousy. I have the Wemo Stage Scene Controller and updated the firmware to enable Thread as soon as it was available in January. Right after the update, the battery of that thing would die in under week (replaced the CR 2032 three times to test and also several resets and removals and re-adding to HomeKit) and the connectivity was just as bad as it was with Bluetooth (have several HomePod Minis and a 2nd Gen ATV 4K). Had to sell my soul to Wemo to get a warranty replacement which I haven’t had the time to test yet.

 

[originalbryan]

It’s toasted my entire HomeKit system. Some grouped minis on 15.4 insist on being the hub, which completely breaks all HomeKit accessories. Only solution is removing or unplugging them. ☹️

 

[rgwebb]

My hunch is that the OG HomePods when it is the primary home hub leads to one of Thread router capable devices promoting itself to leader in the mesh. This seems to be the common signature for times when I have broad Thread-enabled problems with Home Kit. I use the Eve app to find out which thread device if any is leader then disconnect the leader and stop power to my entertainment center. I have all my non-Thread Apple TVs disabled for home hub usage. So the only home hubs in stand by status - after removing the OG HomePods from power - are Thread-enabled (newest Apple TV 4K and HomePod Minis). I try to goad the Home app into selecting a new primary hub by using devices within the app but I don’t know if that helps. Within a few minutes you will usually have a new hub selected as primary. Somewhere between 5-15 minutes later the thread devices in your house should all be working again.

I really like my OG HomePod in a stereo pair connected to an Apple TV. Unfortunately, it seems that if they become a primary hub after a mass reboot (power interruption or installing a HomeOS update to devices) that it prevents the thread enabled hubs from doing the requisite mesh network joining/building to allow your Home app to reach out and touch these devices. Essentially, your Thread mesh thinks it is healed and your HomePods have no knowledge of how to reach them.

This is just deduction on my part but it seems reasonable considering this is the consistent type of state I find my Thread devices in after a reboot or update. Furthermore, the fix has been very consistent albeit an annoying pain in the butt. It is probably resolvable with a software fix but seems like it would be easier to have a workaround in events such as this to just disable arbitrary HomePods from being a home hub.

 

[Jmco173]

Yesterday I updated all my HomePods (6 OG HomePods and 6 HomePod minis) to OS 15.4. Since then, ALL of my Thread accessories have become unresponsive. This includes a number of Nanoleaf Essentials bulbs, Nanoleaf light strips, and an Eve Weather.

They all show up as unresponsive in the Home App but also in their manufacturer-specific apps.And, because they are unresponsive, I can't do any sort of firmware update on them. I have reset several of the HomePod minis, which function as Thread border routers but that makes no difference. As I mentioned, I have 6 HP minis scattered around the house, so Thread coverage should not be an issue.

Is anyone else having this problem? Has anyone found a workaround?

Note: all my Phillips Hue lights work fine, but they are not Thread.

Do you have a ATV 4k in your setup? Since 15.4 my HomePod mini no longer shows up in my thread network (eve app). My ATV still works as a border router so all my thread devices still work. To test I unplugged the ATV. Prior to 15.4 the HomePod mini would take over as border router now it doesn’t. It like the update disables thread all together on the mini Did you get your HomePod mini back as your thread border router and if so how. I am not quite sure what you explained. Thanks.

 

[mpetrides]

Do you have a ATV 4k in your setup? Since 15.4 my HomePod mini no longer shows up in my thread network (eve app). My ATV still works as a border router so all my thread devices still work. To test I unplugged the ATV. Prior to 15.4 the HomePod mini would take over as border router now it doesn’t. It like the update disables thread all together on the mini Did you get your HomePod mini back as your thread border router and if so how. I am not quite sure what you explained. Thanks.

Yes. I have two Apple TV 4K v2 (which is the version required to function as a border router), as well as the 6 HomePod minis. I never thought to check the Eve app to see if the HP minis show up in it until now, so I have no idea if they showed up as border routers prior to the 15.4 update but they do not show up there now. But the ATV 4K v2s do not show up either. I'm not seeing ANY border routers right now but my network works fine.

Alas, I've had enough trouble with my network of late that I am not inclined to unplug my ATV 4k v2s just to see if my Thread network stops functioning. Sorry. But with my luck, I'll bring the whole house of cards crashing down!

 

[DapperTiem]

Something is definitely wrong with audioOS. I filed a BR earlier today and within a few hours, an Apple engineer sent a reply requesting a lot more info and to pull diagnostics from my phone.

Since we can’t interact with the thread network and have very little to go on, it’s really hard to trace this. But I’ve remove, reset and re added my accessors multiple times, reset my HomePod mini, signed in everywhere and checked all permissions and I can’t get the thread network activated.

I can’t pin point when it occurred but it was working for most of 15.4 betas. I’m guessing whatever happened happened near 15.4 rc or even 15.4.1 public release for me.

My network is 4 Nanoleaf A19 and a HomePod mini. I have them all on the latest betas and the problem is still there.

 

[mpetrides]

Something is definitely wrong with audioOS. I filed a BR earlier today and within a few hours, an Apple engineer sent a reply requesting a lot more info and to pull diagnostics from my phone.

Since we can’t interact with the thread network and have very little to go on, it’s really hard to trace this. But I’ve remove, reset and re added my accessors multiple times, reset my HomePod mini, signed in everywhere and checked all permissions and I can’t get the thread network activated.

I can’t pin point when it occurred but it was working for most of 15.4 betas. I’m guessing whatever happened happened near 15.4 rc or even 15.4.1 public release for me.

My network is 4 Nanoleaf A19 and a HomePod mini. I have them all on the latest betas and the problem is still there.

Are you able to access the Nanoleaf A19s in the Nanoleaf app? Do any of them require a software update? Once I finally got my Nanoleaf Essentials to connect (by resetting/re-pairing the Eve Weather twice, which seemed to fix the problem with my Thread network being completely inaccessible), I noted that they all required software updates--which I believe can only be applied from within the Nanoleaf app. Just a thought... might not work but worth checking.

 

[DapperTiem]

No they are all up to date. Everything is up to date. I'm about that beta life.

 

[mpetrides]

No they are all up to date. Everything is up to date. I'm about that beta life.

Frustrating to say the least. Alas, I'm out of suggestions. Anyone else have ideas?

 

[DapperTiem]

Frustrating to say the least. Alas, I'm out of suggestions. Anyone else have ideas?

The frustrating thing is it was working till either RC or final.

i swapped out my router last night so it’s not that either (was worth a shot). The only other thing I haven’t isolated is the HomePod mini (swap it out for another one). But it’s pretty unlikely that thread is broken and the rest work (no network issues on the HomePod).

I‘m pretty certain it’s a bug. Wish I could help isolate the cause tho. And other than this thread, I haven’t seen anyone hit by it.

 

[robotica]

Strange, mines is all working with 6 Nanoleaf essentials and one eve smart plug. I only have one HomePod mini. I can see that the eve smart plug has taken over as the main boarder router after the HomePod mini. It’s the farthest one away but it’s all working as expected.

 

[rgwebb]

Strange, mines is all working with 6 Nanoleaf essentials and one eve smart plug. I only have one HomePod mini. I can see that the eve smart plug has taken over as the main boarder router after the HomePod mini. It’s the farthest one away but it’s all working as expected.

I’ve thought about buying an eve powered thread accessory partly for the increased visibility of thread topology. Is it worth considering it…the app UI expose significantly more information?

 

[robotica]

You can use the eve app to view details on your thread network even without an eve accessory. I got it as it was on sale otherwise I probably would have gone something cheaper. It is very good tho!

 

[mpetrides]

The frustrating thing is it was working till either RC or final.

i swapped out my router last night so it’s not that either (was worth a shot). The only other thing I haven’t isolated is the HomePod mini (swap it out for another one). But it’s pretty unlikely that thread is broken and the rest work (no network issues on the HomePod).

I‘m pretty certain it’s a bug. Wish I could help isolate the cause tho. And other than this thread, I haven’t seen anyone hit by it.

Swapping out your router was a great idea. I've had lots of problems that eventually resolved when either I replace my router or, in one case, when my ISP replaced the fiber optic ONT.

I know you said your network is just the 4 Nanoleaf bulbs and the HomePod mini but do you have anything else that's capable as acting as a Thread border router, like an Apple TV 4K v 2, so that you could remove the HP mini from the network and use the other border router alone?

Also, given that my problem turned out to be a single "rogue" device (the Eve Weather), have you tried removing all of the Nanoleaf bulbs (unscrewing them, not necessarily completely resetting them) and adding them back one at a time? If that doesn't work, maybe try removing them all and resetting just one and plugging just that one in--i.e. making a network consisting of just the one reset Nanoleaf and the HomePod mini. Grasping at straws here... Ignore at will.

 

[DapperTiem]

Unfortunately no. I have an iPad that can act as a home hub not nothing that can provide its own thread network.

Yeah, I tried adding each bulb back in one at a time after reading your post above about fixing your entire network with one problematic component. No luck there.

I appreciate the ideas though. Having something else that can provide a thread network could isolate whether it's the HomePod or something else. A shame my $3k Mac Studio can't fit the bill, considering it's a desktop and stays home 24/7.

 

[Itinj24]

You can use the eve app to view details on your thread network even without an eve accessory. I got it as it was on sale otherwise I probably would have gone something cheaper. It is very good tho!

Are you sure of this? I’ve just keep getting a spinning circle and “Checking Network Status” text in the Eve app Thread network. No Eve accessories currently but a several HomePod Minis, AppleTV and a Wemo Stage

 

[DapperTiem]

Are you sure of this? I’ve just keep getting a spinning circle and “Checking Network Status” text in the Eve app Thread network. No Eve accessories currently but a several HomePod Minis, AppleTV and a Wemo Stage

And you can confirm your thread network is up and running?

 

[Itinj24]

And you can confirm your thread network is up and running?

Is there a way to turn it off? Lol

 

[DapperTiem]

Is there a way to turn it off? Lol

I don't have mine "turned off" but do not have it running.

 

[Itinj24]

I don't have mine "turned off" but do not have it running.

How do you get it running then? I thought it was something that just occurred if you have the accessories to support it.

I was just referencing this thread I made on Thread a few months back so now I’m all sorts of confused lol…

Eve App Thread Network

I have seven HomePod Minis, an ATV 4K (2021), and a Wemo Stage Scene Controller with the Thread firmware update. That’s about the extent of my Thread devices for now. When I open the Thread Network setting in the Eve app, it just stays stuck on “Checking Network Status”. It’s been like that for...

forums.macrumors.com

 

[robotica]

Are you sure of this? I’ve just keep getting a spinning circle and “Checking Network Status” text in the Eve app Thread network. No Eve accessories currently but a several HomePod Minis, AppleTV and a Wemo Stage

Yeah this is what I see. I saw the same without the smart plug before I bought it. The smart plug is the “computer”

 

[rgwebb]

The Eve thread topology list view will work without an Eve device but an Eve device provides the app with some more metadata. I know one of the additional features is that the HomePods and Apple TV’s with thread radios will show up on the list.

 

[robotica]

@Itinj24 I have never seen screen you showed in the above link in the eve app, I have had a good hunt around and its just not there on mine.

Edit- just spotted that could be the screen before anything is set up.