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MrTangent

macrumors regular
Mar 26, 2003
146
634
Yeah, because iOS is so badly developed it’s open season for malware.. remember the clicker trojan? Or the many “interaction-less” bugs ? ‘Allowed’ by apple to install via apps in the ‘secure’ appstore.. never discovered by apple..
Secrecy is apple’s thing, not security
Again, nothing is perfect. But if you’re sitting here saying that an OS would be more secure with any/every app a user finds online you’re whack.
 

gnipgnop

macrumors 68020
Feb 18, 2009
2,210
3,007
Because existing law doesn’t match how business has evolved over the past several decades. Apple and other Big Tech companies may not be violating the letter of the law, but as today’s Senate Judiciary Committee vote shows, at least 16 of 22 legislators on the committee believe they’re violating the spirit of the law. (The only committee member who explicitly doesn’t believe there’s a competition issue in Big Tech — regardless of whether they support this specific bill — is Sen. Feinstein, and she probably doesn’t know what year it is at this point, so.)
The evolution of the business model for software was that smartphones introduced CHEAPER apps than what existed prior to the smartphone. That can't be denied. And yet the U.S. Senate seems to believe that smartphone app stores are somehow "anticompetitive". Anticompetitive with what? You're not going to get cheaper prices for games or apps on desktops/laptops or consoles.
 

zorinlynx

macrumors G3
May 31, 2007
8,202
17,928
Florida, USA
People against sideloading seem to forget that sideloading is voluntary, and you can choose to use 100% app store if you want.

You can sideload on Android devices yet choose to only download from the Play Store.

Sideloading gives you more options, not less. It gives you access to software that Apple doesn't approve of, like emulators and adult apps. It keeps Apple from being able to censor certain apps as easily. Remember the Discord controversy earlier about adult chats? Apple shouldn't have say in what people talk about and share on their own phones.

Support sideloading.
 

deeddawg

macrumors G5
Jun 14, 2010
12,256
6,410
US
DAM. Can I just get this right though, you would only be at risk of you download a sideloaded app right? If you keep to AppStore apps wouldn’t it still technically be secure?

Are you *sure* nobody would deep-embed some code in their app store app which, after some period of time, then side-loaded some other malicious app or code?
 

dypeterc

macrumors regular
Mar 5, 2012
239
286


The U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee today approved the American Innovation and Choice Online Act, which means it will now move on to the Senate floor for a vote, reports The Wall Street Journal.

iOS-App-Store-General-Feature-JoeBlue.jpg

The bill, which was first introduced over the summer, would require major changes to the App Store if passed in its current incarnation. It is designed to prevent "dominant platforms" from "abusing their gatekeeper power" by favoring their own products and services over those of competitors.

It would enable sideloading, a process by which iPhone and iPad users would be able to use alternate app stores or other means to install apps on their devices outside of the App Store. Earlier this week, Apple's Senior Director of Government Affairs Timothy Powderly said that implementing such a change would cause consumers to face "malware, ransomware, and scams."

Sideloading would "hurt competition and discourage innovation" by making it "much harder" to protect the privacy and security of personal devices in the United States, according to Apple.

Apple urged the Senate Judiciary Committee not to approve the act, but it will now advance. Several senators have suggested that they want to see changes implemented before voting in favor of the measure, so it could ultimately be toned down.

Senator Dianne Feinstein criticized the bill and said that it targets a "small number of specific companies," and Senator Alex Padilla said that it was difficult to "see the justification for a bill that regulates the behavior of only a handful of companies while allowing everyone else to continue engaging in that exact same behavior."

Other senators have complained that the bill in its current incarnation is not specific enough and could ultimately result in "collateral damage."

The bill is aimed specifically at Apple, Google, Facebook, and Amazon, but amendments will see it also including large foreign-owned tech platforms like TikTok. The Senate Judiciary Committee will also soon hear additional bills that also target tech companies.

Article Link: U.S. Senate Panel Approves Antitrust Bill That Would Allow Sideloading
I'm not so sure a law can target just 4 companies specifically. Like is Playstation and Xbox not specified?

Also, is Android already open to side-loading?
 
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MacBebe

macrumors 6502
Oct 13, 2017
285
294
Sacto, Ca
People that value security and privacy don't care much because sideloading is that their thing for sure. The issue for Apple is for people that sideload and then call Apple support if there is a problem.
 
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jkozlow3

macrumors 6502a
Jul 16, 2008
973
658
I don't understand all these comments about "saying goodbye to security". How is allowing apps that aren't on the iOS App Store any different than how Windows and Mac machines allow software to be installed from anywhere?

Most people don't download all their software exclusively from the Mac or Windows app stores. If someone wants to install software from another source that should be their prerogative. Why should iOS be any different vs. MacOS in this regard?

99% of users will still use the App Store exclusively anyway. The percentage of people that want sideloaded apps is pretty small in the grand scheme of all iPhone users worldwide.
 

boak

macrumors 65832
Jun 26, 2021
1,501
2,420
Won't apps with sufficient market power just not go through the App Store and add extra stuff to track users?

I can already see Facebook pulling all its apps from the App Store to circumvent the privacy rules thing
 

gregmancuso

macrumors 6502
Nov 1, 2014
408
512
DAM. Can I just get this right though, you would only be at risk of you download a sideloaded app right? If you keep to AppStore apps wouldn’t it still technically be secure?
Not necessarily. Today there is one and only one installation vector. It is pretty well locked down. Adding in the ability to side load, even if off by default, is adding a door to the wall.

Liken it to the requested backdoors to encryption. We can all agree we don't want Apple to cave on that. That would be adding a door to the wall (encryption) which weakens for all.

Even if you personally never unlock that door there will be plenty of people picking at that lock until there is a breach that is guaranteed to affect all.

And that does not take into consideration any nefarious actions taken by a side loaded app that was installed by an acquaintance that then attacks all of their contacts.
 

jdphoto

macrumors 6502
Jan 13, 2014
323
119
People against sideloading seem to forget that sideloading is voluntary, and you can choose to use 100% app store if you want.

You can sideload on Android devices yet choose to only download from the Play Store.

Sideloading gives you more options, not less. It gives you access to software that Apple doesn't approve of, like emulators and adult apps. It keeps Apple from being able to censor certain apps as easily. Remember the Discord controversy earlier about adult chats? Apple shouldn't have say in what people talk about and share on their own phones.

Support sideloading.
You can't guarantee that though, if sideloading is allowed what if companies pull the app from the app store and only distribute it via sideloading? Then it does most definitely impact and *removes* that choice where I can get everything via the app store.

Also tangentially what if the app is still offered in both places but you get more features or earlier access to features if you sideload the app? Plenty of ways this can impact users who don't want sideloading.
 

jonblatho

macrumors 68030
Jan 20, 2014
2,513
6,216
Oklahoma
The evolution of the business model for software was that smartphones introduced CHEAPER apps than what existed prior to the smartphone. That can't be denied. And yet the U.S. Senate seems to believe that smartphone app stores are somehow "anticompetitive". Anticompetitive with what? You're not going to get cheaper prices for games or apps on desktops/laptops or consoles.
Apple’s status as both the referee and a player on the sole authorized general-purpose app distribution platform for iOS gives them an opportunity to disadvantage apps and services against which they compete, to break rules that they expect others to follow, and to access sensitive financial information regarding competitors in order to capture ideas that are taking off and proceed to either acquire or copy them.

If Apple didn’t offer its own services that directly compete with third-party apps and services on its platform, or if they spun off oversight of App Store content into an independent board with no profit or other competitive incentive to prohibit (or inhibit) very specific types of apps, I’d be more forgiving because the playing field would be more level. Apple has, of course, had ample opportunity (legislators have been beating the Big Tech antitrust drums for a few years now) to resolve this matter before government felt compelled to step in and fix it for them, but they must be too addicted to that sweet, sweet 30% credit card processing fee.
 

iObama

macrumors 65816
Nov 16, 2008
1,053
2,364
As much as I love my Apple ecosystem (Mac, iPad, iPhone, Watch, AirPlay Speakers, ATV – I'm invested, okay lol), the writing is on the wall here. It's time we accept that maybe – just maybe – our favorite $3 trillion company has tried to squash competition at every turn, and this is the result.

There's a reason Sherlocking is a thing.
 

MacCheetah3

macrumors 68020
Nov 14, 2003
2,155
1,122
Central MN
F-that, say HELL-O to the return of PIRACY.
I hate piracy, so damn LAME.

So get ready for Software/App Prices to GO UP...

These people are FOOLS
I forgot about cracked apps. This would be somewhat hilarious for lawmakers to open the door on deadly skeletons (figuratively speaking). What happens when choosing the lazy way.
 

jonblatho

macrumors 68030
Jan 20, 2014
2,513
6,216
Oklahoma
You can't guarantee that though, if sideloading is allowed what if companies pull the app from the app store and only distribute it via sideloading?
Then you aren’t forced to reward that developer’s decision by installing that app. The fact that sideloading would most likely be disabled by default and buried deep in Settings and probably multiple scary dialogs requiring user confirmation to enable that functionality in the first place is enough of a UX hindrance to offer a compelling reason to stay in the App Store for an overwhelming majority of developers. That's without even getting to the issue of how to tell people how to find your app outside the App Store, how to deal with updates, and so on.

Sideloading, however, would allow apps that Apple currently forbids for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with security and everything to do with their bottom line.
 

Xtir

Cancelled
Jul 18, 2021
186
336
Again, nothing is perfect. But if you’re sitting here saying that an OS would be more secure with any/every app a user finds online you’re whack.
You’re entitled to your detached from reality opinion. Never heard apple describe MacOs as vulnerable with all the any/every app a user can find online.. it’s not about finding, it’s about installing. Someone would be detached from reality to do so..
 
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