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satcomer

Suspended
Feb 19, 2008
9,115
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The Finger Lakes Region
I have been running a mac mini as my "server" for 6+ years. I like that it has more functions that a nas. Having a TB hub connected with 8 4 TB drives connected. So are backup drives and I only turn them on once a week for backup. Another plus for this system is there is no one point of failure. If the mini dies I can move one or any drive to a mac to access the data. I also have 2 VM running Pi hole and VPN software to name a few.

The only thing ng that is wrong with that is technology changes! You probably will have to find cable adapters when you finally join the modern age!
 

Analog Kid

macrumors G3
Mar 4, 2003
8,982
11,726
Nope...Server is no longer what it used to be, so no benefit as a NAS (it still does a couple of other things, but nothing file serving specific).

For file sharing, you don't need anything extra, you can use any Mac as a local file server with no additional software.

If you have a Mini to spare, this is a pretty good option. If starting fresh and buying hardware, I still vote for the Synology. Main points:

  • Web interface, no monitor needed, no remote desktop setup needed. Meant to be headless.
  • Built-in RAID redundancies (for multi-drive models)
  • Ability to swap drives on the fly, including increasing a volume size without erasing and reformatting
  • Very cross-platform if you want to share with other devices (Win, iOS, Android, etc)
  • Drive tool to automatically sync and backup...including over the internet without having to do router config or network tweaks
If buying gear, one would need both the Mini and an external storage box. The 220+ is likely cheaper and is more compact (one box, one plug, etc.).

PROS: Lower cost, more compact, dedicated headless, more functionality and flexibility
CONS: New OS/interface to learn
Biggest benefit of Synology in my mind is being able to fuse mismatched disks into one volume. I’m not sure that can be done with a Mini, but then I haven’t played with the RAID tools for years.
Slightly offtopic, but if you've had a Synology that has been working flawlessly for a long period of time, like those 8 years of mine, without having any problems with the drives or the Synology, would you consider upgrading the Synology? right now, it's doing nothing but file serving/sharing/internal cloud, and photo storage. I'm asking because while I have the DS213j, the DS220j is currently on sale. Everywhere I'm seeing with someone asking the same question is replying back with "run the DS213j until it dies", but I'm trying to fight off that upgrade urge. Thoughts?
I upgraded to a x21+ model with support for SSD caching and that made a huge difference when using as a Time Machine volume, for example. Overall transfer speeds for general data (photos, videos, data files) also increase over my x15 model. If that’s not useful, then I tend to stick with the hardware I have and avoid the hassle of changing it over. Only took a couple hours to setup and a day or two for the volumes to finally settle, but time I generally wouldn’t spend if there wasn’t a payoff.

Assuming you have parity enabled, I doubt a hardware failure would lead to unrecoverable data corruption, but someone here might have actual knowledge about that rather than my opinion.
 
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dimme

macrumors 68040
Feb 14, 2007
3,053
28,142
SF, CA
The only thing ng that is wrong with that is technology changes! You probably will have to find cable adapters when you finally join the modern age!
I think my next setup will be a Linux based build. When I started my current setup I was on MacOSX server, now Apple has let it die. Before OSX server I was on Windows home server.
 

TiggrToo

macrumors 601
Aug 24, 2017
4,205
8,838
Another vote for Synology.

I lucked out and grabbed a free 12 bay unit from the company I worked for that died on day one with a known CPU issue. Synology replaced it no questions asked and even paid for the return shipping.

I've now got several docker containers running on it for NextCloud, Pi-Hole and an IKEv2 VPN Server, and it's also now my DHCP server.

Oh, and I store and backup stuff to it as well...!
 

DaveFromCampbelltown

macrumors 68000
Jun 24, 2020
1,563
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Maybe you should invest into a smart NAS of your choosing!

I have, a WD My Cloud, for which Western Digital have just told me there won't be any more software updates. It also has my FireWire drive attached, but only by a USB 2 connection.

Fortunately, I still have my Raspberry Pi, with two USB 3 3Gb drives attached. That works quite nicely, with SMB, NFS and AppleShare shares.
And I can do other things with it, like reply to Macrumors...
 
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dimme

macrumors 68040
Feb 14, 2007
3,053
28,142
SF, CA
What I don’t like about a proprietary nas is that you can not pop out a disk and put it in another machine. If you have a hardware failure. As with any system a good backup plan is very important
 

dimme

macrumors 68040
Feb 14, 2007
3,053
28,142
SF, CA
The only thing ng that is wrong with that is technology changes! You probably will have to find cable adapters when you finally join the modern age!
Everything in my setup is usb3, or thunderbolt. I have hooked the up to my M1 Mac. So I am very modern.
 
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bradl

macrumors 603
Jun 16, 2008
5,936
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What I don’t like about a proprietary nas is that you can not pop out a disk and put it in another machine. If you have a hardware failure. As with any system a good backup plan is very important

With Synology, you could, especially if you set it up as RAID1 or JBOD. Synology uses EXT4 by default (Synology NASes are essentially glorified Linux boxes) or any OS that they support. So that brings in BTRFS, EXT4, EXT3, FAT, NTFS, exFAT, and HFS+.

So you could pull out that drive, plug it into a Linux box and should be able to mount it.

If it's formatted as FAT, NTFS, or even better, HFS+, you should be able to plug that into a Mac and have instant access to the disk.

BL.
 
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hobowankenobi

macrumors 68020
Aug 27, 2015
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on the land line mr. smith.
What I don’t like about a proprietary nas is that you can not pop out a disk and put it in another machine. If you have a hardware failure. As with any system a good backup plan is very important
I would agree. The backup plan is...to have a backup. Pulling a drive is a last-ditch long shot when one has no backup.

With a Synology, the easiest thing would be to schedule automatic backups up to USB connected HD formatted FAT, so it could be used with any platform. Cover all the bases: failed RAID controller/loss of volume or partition, corrupt/deleted data, etc. The same would be true for most platforms; backups should be on a separate drive/device.
 
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bradl

macrumors 603
Jun 16, 2008
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I would agree. The backup plan is...to have a backup. Pulling a drive is a last-ditch long shot when one has no backup.

With a Synology, the easiest thing would be to schedule automatic backups up to USB connected HD formatted FAT, so it could be used with any platform. Cover all the bases: failed RAID controller/loss of volume or partition, corrupt/deleted data, etc. The same would be true for most platforms; backups should be on a separate drive/device.

I'll go even further. A backup plan is to have a successful restore. You can take all of the backups that you want, but if none of the restores work from that backup, then your backup has failed, leaving you with no backup plan.

Backups should be on a separate drive? Absolutely; in fact, having it on more than one drive is optimal, because you never want to be stuck with a single point of failure. Having, say, two or three separate drives with your backups on them, and rotated out on an occasional period is optimal... because when you think about it, unless you have more than one (which means you have the money to not have to worry about this to begin with!), your home is a single point of failure. So keeping one offsite is always a safe bet as well.

Sounds crazy/paranoid, I know; However, I'm a sysadmin. It's my job to be paranoid.

BL.
 

Analog Kid

macrumors G3
Mar 4, 2003
8,982
11,726
I'll throw another comment in here while I'm thinking of it: avoid Drobo like the plague.

I bought a couple of them in days gone by and like the appliance like nature and like the direct attach versus network attached design. Problem is that their support sucks. I wanted to move to dual disk redundancy, so I put a bigger disk in which, since I was still on single disk redundancy made my volume larger than the maximum allowed size at the time and forced creation of a second volume. I turned on dual disk redundancy, the extra capacity promptly disappeared, but the secondary volume remained. I contacted support to figure out how to remove it and was told my serial number was out of support-- I don't know if they wanted me to pay a support fee or what, but I was infuriated that I had a simple question about a basic problem and was told they weren't going to talk to me which probably took more typing than just answering the question I'd asked.

Never did figure it out. I just had this stupid extra empty volume that I had to unmount every time until the day I decommissioned the system.

Years later I'm trying to move data from those old Drobos to another drive, but the current versions of their driver software doesn't seem to support the older systems and the older drivers don't work on the newer MacOS, so I dug up an old Mini with an old MacOS install on it to talk to them and do the transfer and it's just a miserable experience.

Synology isn't perfect, but it seems stable and their support has been excellent and those are the two most important things to me when I'm using their product to archive a ton of valuable data.
 

hobowankenobi

macrumors 68020
Aug 27, 2015
2,076
883
on the land line mr. smith.
I'll throw another comment in here while I'm thinking of it: avoid Drobo like the plague.

I bought a couple of them in days gone by and like the appliance like nature and like the direct attach versus network attached design. Problem is that their support sucks. I wanted to move to dual disk redundancy, so I put a bigger disk in which, since I was still on single disk redundancy made my volume larger than the maximum allowed size at the time and forced creation of a second volume. I turned on dual disk redundancy, the extra capacity promptly disappeared, but the secondary volume remained. I contacted support to figure out how to remove it and was told my serial number was out of support-- I don't know if they wanted me to pay a support fee or what, but I was infuriated that I had a simple question about a basic problem and was told they weren't going to talk to me which probably took more typing than just answering the question I'd asked.

Never did figure it out. I just had this stupid extra empty volume that I had to unmount every time until the day I decommissioned the system.

Years later I'm trying to move data from those old Drobos to another drive, but the current versions of their driver software doesn't seem to support the older systems and the older drivers don't work on the newer MacOS, so I dug up an old Mini with an old MacOS install on it to talk to them and do the transfer and it's just a miserable experience.

Synology isn't perfect, but it seems stable and their support has been excellent and those are the two most important things to me when I'm using their product to archive a ton of valuable data.
Having supported both....I would agree. While Synology is not perfect, none of the half dozen Drobos I have seen would I recommend for more than a non-essential backup destination. Last one I have seen was new about 2018, but unless there has been a fundamental change or improvement...nope.
 

halloleo

macrumors newbie
Dec 1, 2021
27
1
I have the Synology DS220+ and I'm extremely happy with it. Super easy to configure and it supports time-machine straight out of the box. Can't go wrong with it.
What do you mean with "it supports time-machine straight out of the box"? How do you use Time Machine with your Synology? Didin't you have to create some share on the Synology for Time Machine?
 

hobowankenobi

macrumors 68020
Aug 27, 2015
2,076
883
on the land line mr. smith.
Thanks. The video says you have to create a share first. That was exactly my question to FilipeTeixeira, whether they did this. The "out of the box" just made me curious...
Yes, you have to create a share. But that is a good thing so you don't fill the entire volume, not to mention user permissions/privacy, especially if you have multiple machines to backup.

BTW, it similar step using Mac OS X Server for a TM destination. Again, essential to be able to manage the backups. Even with an attached drive for TM, I would typically make a partition to limit filling the entire drive if it was in use for anything else.
 

Marshall73

macrumors 68030
Apr 20, 2015
2,680
2,776
Not exposing a NAS to the WAN mitigates the external threat. Does nothing to protect against a threat initiated from the LAN side if a user downloads an infected payload in an email or from the internet. Given the historical track record of most OEM NAS vendors, who's business model is based solely on the initial acquisition purchase, there is no incentive for OEMs to provide long term software support even when vulnerabilities are discovered, except the potential impact on reputation and future product sales. Just read any OEM NAS vendor Limited Liability Warranty.




This is why you have a hardware firewall, email scanning and filtering, multi factor authentication, local antivirus and finally education. And of course, you keep your NAS boxes for backups only and they are not visible/reachable from the user subnet. Doubt many folk have this at home, disable UPNP on your nas and block internet access. Manually upgrade firmware when required. Get a proper router/firewall, don’t use the crap ones your isp supply.
 
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DaveFromCampbelltown

macrumors 68000
Jun 24, 2020
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This is why you have a hardware firewall, email scanning and filtering, multi factor authentication, local antivirus and finally education. And of course, you keep your NAS boxes for backups only and they are not visible/reachable from the user subnet. Doubt many folk have this at home, disable UPNP on your nas and block internet access. Manually upgrade firmware when required. Get a proper router/firewall, don’t use the crap ones your isp supply.

Also install air-gap between your network and the Internet.
As well, the only un-hackable OS is CP/M.
 

jjcs

Cancelled
Oct 18, 2021
317
153
Another option that works well with all Apple devices is a Mac Mini with a drive enclosure. Easily expanded. Familiar OS. I have a 2012 Mini with an OWC JBOD enclosure. Works great for backups and as a media server.

If you want to go with a traditional NAS then go with Synology.
Works well. Have an older Mini running Catalina that works fine as a NAS with 2 OWC RAID enclosures. Works great. Time Machine to the Macs in the house, NFS to the others.
 
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Jay-Jacob

macrumors 6502a
Sep 10, 2015
528
313
England
I have, a WD My Cloud, for which Western Digital have just told me there won't be any more software updates.
Me too. Now I am considering replacement. I am almost most likely pick Synology but not yet decided to pick which version also 1 bay or 2 bay. They are quite expensive compare WD My Cloud but they are far better (what I have read online so far). It seems J series too slow and should go for Value series minimum and Plus series at moment price too high for me. Got until April to decide before my WD My Cloud cut off.

EDIT: Probably most likely get 1 bay DS118. That just in my price range.
 
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bradl

macrumors 603
Jun 16, 2008
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Me too. Now I am considering replacement. I am almost most likely pick Synology but not yet decided to pick which version also 1 bay or 2 bay. They are quite expensive compare WD My Cloud but they are far better (what I have read online so far). It seems J series too slow and should go for Value series minimum and Plus series at moment price too high for me. Got until April to decide before my WD My Cloud cut off.

EDIT: Probably most likely get 1 bay DS118. That just in my price range.

Let me ask you this. What's the difference between you getting a 1-bay DS118 versus simply getting an external HDD enclosure and putting in a big sized HDD?

I mean, outside of the software Synology has, you're not gaining anything except storage. If anything, you'd still need an extra disk for backups in case the single drive (the single point of failure in the DS118) dies.

If anything, it would be more economical and feasible (especially with the safety of your data) to go 2-bay. The DS218 or anything in the 200 series will work great. Yes, that will mean adding an additional drive, but with RAID you can add redundancy to your setup, so in case 1 drive dies, the other is there without any loss of data. Additionally, with the SHR (hybrid RAID) functionality Synology has, you can mix/match the sizes of the disk, in which Synology will use all of the space, as opposed to RAID, which will use the space relative to the smallest disk available. This, of course, assuming not using RAID 0 or JBOD.

BL.
 

Jay-Jacob

macrumors 6502a
Sep 10, 2015
528
313
England
Let me ask you this. What's the difference between you getting a 1-bay DS118 versus simply getting an external HDD enclosure and putting in a big sized HDD?

I mean, outside of the software Synology has, you're not gaining anything except storage. If anything, you'd still need an extra disk for backups in case the single drive (the single point of failure in the DS118) dies.

If anything, it would be more economical and feasible (especially with the safety of your data) to go 2-bay. The DS218 or anything in the 200 series will work great. Yes, that will mean adding an additional drive, but with RAID you can add redundancy to your setup, so in case 1 drive dies, the other is there without any loss of data. Additionally, with the SHR (hybrid RAID) functionality Synology has, you can mix/match the sizes of the disk, in which Synology will use all of the space, as opposed to RAID, which will use the space relative to the smallest disk available. This, of course, assuming not using RAID 0 or JBOD.

BL.
I already have external drive for backup. You probably right but I want NAS function and access network on any my devices. I will consider 2 bay and see if I able get it on discount offer etc. I have got until April to think.

Thanks for info for me think about.
 
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