8GB RAM in M3 MacBook Pro Proves the Bottleneck in Real-World Tests

[deevey]

…and the effective RAM requirements by software have increased.

Requirements that are based on ye' olde stick of high latency socketed DDR.

I have 16gb in my M1 Air, the only time I've ever felt a bottleneck was when I was working on multiple high res files in Affinity Photo and Designer, with FCP running in the background while running XAMPP server and had about 100 tabs open across chrome and Safari.

It was only when things got sluggish I noticed I also had two VM's open in the background with 4GB assigned to each.

A Macbook 8GB on any other given day would do the trick just fine.

 

[Kal Madda]

…and the effective RAM requirements by software have increased.

For some software perhaps, but then there are configurations with more RAM that people using these softwares can buy. For a bunch of software, 8GB on the M1 is more than enough. The base spec isn’t meant or intended to run every high-end software, it’s meant to run the normal software that base spec users want to run. As long as it continues to do that well (which it seems it does based on the high customer satisfaction and high sales), then there’s no reason to add a bunch extra that most base spec users don’t want or need.

 

[Kal Madda]

Requirements that are based on ye' olde stick of high latency socketed DDR.

I have 16gb in my M1 Air, the only time I've ever felt a bottleneck was when I was working on multiple high res files in Affinity Photo and Designer, with FCP running in the background while running XAMPP server and had about 100 tabs open across chrome and Safari.

It was only when things got sluggish I noticed I also had two VM's open in the background with 4GB assigned to each.

A Macbook 8GB on any other given day would do the trick just fine.

Exactly, I regularly run 3D modeling/sculpting software on my M1 Mac with 8GB of RAM, and it’s never as much as slowed down. I’ve never seen the beach ball on it. I also use professional graphic design software regularly. I’m by no means a “light” user, I don’t clean out my Safari tabs nearly as often as I should, and I still have never managed to slow down my Mac.

 

[chucker23n1]

Requirements that are based on ye' olde stick of high latency socketed DDR.

Welllllll yes and no. Sure, higher bandwidth helps. But no amount of bandwidth is going to fit more data in your RAM.

 

[deevey]

Welllllll yes and no. Sure, higher bandwidth helps. But no amount of bandwidth is going to fit more data in your RAM.

For sure, and if you know you are going to be using high end software with insane memory requirements you upgrade ram to at match those requirements anyhow +50-100% if you think you'll be multitasking.

You aren't supposed to be rendering 4k video, or rendering 3D on a base model machine (of any kind). it'll do it, but at sub-optimum speeds. And there is only a handful of professionals who need to run tasks like that (and they already know they need to max out the Ram). The majority of pro's are most likely using spreadsheets and office apps for the life of the machine, which it will do perfectly well without any bottlenecks being reached even at 8gb.

The 8gb Pro is the equivalent of a debadged BMW 316. You buy it because you want the looks and it's comfort without the cost.

 

[Kal Madda]

For sure, and if you know you are going to be using high end software with insane memory requirements you upgrade ram to at match those requirements anyhow +50-100% if you think you'll be multitasking.

You aren't supposed to be rendering 4k video, or rendering 3D on a base model machine (of any kind). it'll do it, but at sub-optimum speeds. And there is only a handful of professionals who need to run tasks like that (and they already know they need to max out the Ram). The majority of pro's are most likely using spreadsheets and office apps for the life of the machine, which it will do perfectly well without any bottlenecks being reached even at 8gb.

The 8gb Pro is the equivalent of a debadged BMW 316. You buy it because you want the looks and it's comfort without the cost.

Exactly, the cheaper base models aren’t intended to run the heaviest softwares out there, they’re intended for more medium workflows like running business software, office software, and also still having the great display and sound system for when people have finished that work and want to relax and stream their favorite show. And many graphic design software’s run perfectly fine on the base model 8GB Mac. I use a base spec M1 Mac for my professional graphic design work, 3D modeling/sculpting, photo editing, some 4K video editing, etc. and have never managed to slow down my Mac, or see the beach ball. For professional video editors, 3D animators, game developers, etc. they can get a higher RAM spec, that’s why those higher-end specs exist. Most business professionals don’t need 128GB of RAM to creat Excel sheets and word documents, and manage Slack group messages/email (8GB is plenty for that). A 3D animator probably has better use for that much RAM. So why should business professionals pay more for more RAM that they don’t want or need for their workflow, just so some edgy YouTuber can say “I use the base-spec Mac for my video editing.” Wait, they don’t, and probably wouldn’t even if the base RAM were increased. These YouTuber’s are generally using the more expensive M3 Pro chip variant, going on and on about what a great value that model is, and then complaining about the cheaper M3 base model that’s more accessible for Pro’s without their hardware preferences/requirements (and budget to burn on extra chip performance and RAM that they don’t want or need).

 

[Torty]

Snip

The 8gb Pro is the equivalent of a debadged BMW 316. You buy it because you want the looks and it's comfort without the cost.

Car comparison: For me it’s the size of the trunk. You can fill it up with stuff you need you can fill it with unnecessary stuff.
It only gives you an advantage if you have regularly a lot of stuff where you need a big trunk.

Exactly, the cheaper base models aren’t intended to run the heaviest softwares out there, they’re intended for more medium workflows like running business software, office software, and also still having the great display and sound system for when people have finished that work and want to relax and stream their favorite show. And many graphic design software’s run perfectly fine on the base model 8GB Mac. I use a base spec M1 Mac for my professional graphic design work, 3D modeling/sculpting, photo editing, some 4K video editing, etc. and have never managed to slow down my Mac, or see the beach ball. For professional video editors, 3D animators, game developers, etc. they can get a higher RAM spec, that’s why those higher-end specs exist. Most business professionals don’t need 128GB of RAM to creat Excel sheets and word documents, and manage Slack group messages/email (8GB is plenty for that). A 3D animator probably has better use for that much RAM.

snip

I would even go to say that most 3D animators etc work for a company and they use the machine they get from the company.
Maybe they can say their wishes but in the end the company decides what they get.

 

[Kal Madda]

Car comparison: For me it’s the size of the trunk. You can fill it up with stuff you need you can fill it with unnecessary stuff.
It only gives you an advantage if you have regularly a lot of stuff where you need a big trunk.


snip

I would even go to say that most 3D animators etc work for a company and they use the machine they get from the company.
Maybe they can say their wishes but in the end the company decides what they get.

The car trunk analogy is actually a great one, some people need a truck bed, so they should buy a truck, others don’t need that much space, and a sports car or sedan has plenty of space for them. 👍🏻

 

[chucker23n1]

I would even go to say that most 3D animators etc work for a company and they use the machine they get from the company.
Maybe they can say their wishes but in the end the company decides what they get.

I'm very confused what this assertion adds to the conversation. Like, yeah, that's probably true, but now what?

(Also, anyone working as a 3D animator who gets a computer with 8 GiB RAM to do 3D work on full-time should probably just straight-out quit. Like, what?)

 

[Kal Madda]

I'm very confused what this assertion adds to the conversation. Like, yeah, that's probably true, but now what?

(Also, anyone working as a 3D animator who gets a computer with 8 GiB RAM to do 3D work on full-time should probably just straight-out quit. Like, what?)

Nobody’s saying a 3D animator should buy the cheapest base spec MacBook with 8GB of RAM. That’s what the higher configurations exist for. They probably should even consider going with the M3 Pro or M3 Max chip configuration for it’s better graphics performance.

 

[Torty]

I'm very confused what this assertion adds to the conversation. Like, yeah, that's probably true, but now what?

(Also, anyone working as a 3D animator who gets a computer with 8 GiB RAM to do 3D work on full-time should probably just straight-out quit. Like, what?)

Just checked CATIA, which is used e.g. in the automotive industry. It's now cloud based so I assume 8GB is enough for those pros.

 

[Kal Madda]

...

Already explained how that video is dishonest clickbait. The “16GB” Windows laptop actually has 24GB of RAM available for the processes he’s comparing them on. It has a dedicated graphics card with its own 8GB of additional RAM that can be tapped into for graphics processes. Oh, and that Windows laptop is also quite a bit more expensive than the base model M3 MacBook Pro. Even the 16GB M3 MacBook Pro is cheaper than that Windows laptop. That video is just clickbait. And deceptive. So no, I don’t care about whatever that YouTube shister tries to claim…

 

[Jim Lahey]

$2

Problem is they wouldn't lose $2 per machine.. They would lose $2 per 8GB machine and minimum $200 per 16GB machine. Whether or not they factor in the number of buyers who just buy nothing at all as a result of their miserly stunts is another question, but I imagine Cook & Co. will never ever change course on this strategy regardless. More likely they would charge even more for even less as a solution to any future impact on the bottom line.

 

[Abazigal]

...

So what exactly is the point of being able to get more ram on a windows laptop for cheaper if the overall experience is still a worse one for me overall?

It is precisely because Apple has control over their hardware and software that they are able to optimise macOS for apple silicon. This allows them to get away with providing less specs on their devices because they know it will offer comparable performance to better-specced equivalents from the competition.

An example of this when back when the iPhone 5s (sporting an A7 chip with 1gb of ram) was found to offer better performance than android smartphones that sported Qualcomm processors with like 8 cores and 4gb of ram. Part of this is because Apple is able to keep iOS lean and running smoothly on less ram, which in turn lets Apple get away with including less ram in their devices, which helps save costs.

You may say that this makes Apple greedy; I say this makes them smart. You have the benefit of owning and controlling the entire stack, leverage it for all it's worth.

The alternative is you can try going with a device from Windows or Android with more ram, and even that may not necessarily get you better performance at the end of the day, if the problem in question is not the result of insufficient ram (such as battery life and overheating issues).

I don't think Apple hardware is overpriced, not least because I can't really find the equivalent windows laptop that gives me 9 hours of zoom on a full charge, while staying cool to the touch, and while being unplugged. I don't think windows laptops quite offer the ability to run under load without being throttled. I can always pay for more ram on my Mac. I can't pay for better battery life on my windows laptop or for it to run more coolly.

The problem isn't that Apple doesn't offer 16gb ram Macs. The problem is that none of you want to pay for it.

 

[Abazigal]

...

I won't say the massive majority of customers aren't buying Macs. I feel it's just a very vocal minority here who are trying to stir up what I feel is really a non-issue.

Even if Apple were to make 16gb ram the default starting spec for Macs starting tomorrow, I doubt we will see it trigger a massive wave of upgrades. What we are seeing is a combination of the pandemic pulling forward a lot of Mac sales, and existing Intel Mac users not upgrading for one reason or another. For the former, their current Apple Silicon Macs are good for another 2-4 years at least. For the latter, I don't know the exact mix of reasons, but I imagine that "not wanting to pay the Apple Tax on ram" doesn't rank all that high.

Fewer people are upgrading because Macs are that good and do last that long, which is the exact opposite of the "forced obsolescence" conspiracy theory you are all so eager to peddle.

 

[Kal Madda]

I won't say the massive majority of customers aren't buying Macs. I feel it's just a very vocal minority here who are trying to stir up what I feel is really a non-issue.

Even if Apple were to make 16gb ram the default starting spec for Macs starting tomorrow, I doubt we will see it trigger a massive wave of upgrades. What we are seeing is a combination of the pandemic pulling forward a lot of Mac sales, and existing Intel Mac users not upgrading for one reason or another. For the former, their current Apple Silicon Macs are good for another 2-4 years at least. For the latter, I don't know the exact mix of reasons, but I imagine that "not wanting to pay the Apple Tax on ram" doesn't rank all that high.

Fewer people are upgrading because Macs are that good and do last that long, which is the exact opposite of the "forced obsolescence" conspiracy theory you are all so eager to peddle.

Yeah, 8GBs of RAM on Apple Silicon is more than enough for a base spec. I use my 8GB M1 Mac for 3D modeling/sculpting, 4K video editing, photo editing, and graphic design work. And with all of these things, it runs perfectly smooth, I’ve never experienced slowdowns, crashes, or seen the beach ball. And I’m also not nearly as tidy as I should be with tabs in Safari, I leave way too many open. All of this has never been an issue on the 8GB M1 for me, and I don’t see that any normal base spec user would really try to do more than I with it. People that want more RAM can always buy it. The base spec is that, a base spec. It doesn’t need to have gobs of extra RAM most people don’t want or need.

And despite the conspiracy theories being floated, all the data points toward most base spec customers being satisfied with 8GB of RAM. The 8GB base spec models are the most stocked in many stores, and Mac customer satisfaction hit record highs recently. If these conspiracy theories were remotely accurate (they aren’t), then we’d expect to see lower customer satisfaction, and less demand for the base models, so less proportional stock of them in stores. But that isn’t what we see…

Oh, and their supposed “planned obsolescence” is working so well that I have a Mid 2012 MacBook Pro which is still running fine… 🙄. Or maybe, there’s no planned obsolescence involved, and Macs last really well…

 

[Chuckeee]

So did you vote in my poll?

Who’s 8GB/256GB good for in 2024?

Lots and lots of discussion so let’s vote: (You can have upto 2 votes)

forums.macrumors.com

 

[avkills]

Yeah, 8GBs of RAM on Apple Silicon is more than enough for a base spec. I use my 8GB M1 Mac for 3D modeling/sculpting, 4K video editing, photo editing, and graphic design work. And with all of these things, it runs perfectly smooth, I’ve never experienced slowdowns, crashes, or seen the beach ball. And I’m also not nearly as tidy as I should be with tabs in Safari, I leave way too many open. All of this has never been an issue on the 8GB M1 for me, and I don’t see that any normal base spec user would really try to do more than I with it. People that want more RAM can always buy it. The base spec is that, a base spec. It doesn’t need to have gobs of extra RAM most people don’t want or need.

And despite the conspiracy theories being floated, all the data points toward most base spec customers being satisfied with 8GB of RAM. The 8GB base spec models are the most stocked in many stores, and Mac customer satisfaction hit record highs recently. If these conspiracy theories were remotely accurate (they aren’t), then we’d expect to see lower customer satisfaction, and less demand for the base models, so less proportional stock of them in stores. But that isn’t what we see…

Oh, and their supposed “planned obsolescence” is working so well that I have a Mid 2012 MacBook Pro which is still running fine… 🙄. Or maybe, there’s no planned obsolescence involved, and Macs last really well…

If 8GB is adequate for you doing 3D modeling and sculpting you must not be dealing with very intense models. What apps are you using? (Although you are probably doing more than me...lol...modeling is not my forte...)

I know for a fact that none of my most demanding motion graphic projects would open or even render with only 8GB RAM. 🤷‍♂️

 

[Kal Madda]

If 8GB is adequate for you doing 3D modeling and sculpting you must not be dealing with very intense models. What apps are you using? (Although you are probably doing more than me...lol...modeling is not my forte...)

I know for a fact that none of my most demanding motion graphic projects would open or even render with only 8GB RAM. 🤷‍♂️

I’ve been working with Blender on my Mac. Most of my modeling projects I’ve been doing on Nomad Sculpt on my iPad, but I’ve imported several of those projects into Blender on my Mac to continue working on them and adding new stuff, and it’s never felt slow to me. I modeled a very detailed sci-fi fighter design that I worked on in Blender, and it never slowed down. And the resolution I had on my parts for it were high.

I’m sure it probably would struggle with heavy motion graphics or animation work, but I don’t expect a base spec configuration to be well suited for that kind of a workload. 👍🏻

 

[anonymous888]

TLDR; 8GB in a computer wearing a Pro monicker in 2024 is the epitome of Cook's Apple and some day soon they're gonna see a decline in business. If they aren't already. Everyone I know in RL is already disillusioned with their antics and has slowed down or completely halted their iPurchases indefinitely. But Apple's response, of course, will be to offer less and charge more. Sad times in tech. The dollar now leads the product instead of following it.

I feel the Apple hype is dying down. It is unlikely to be the most valuable company again.

 

[Kal Madda]

...

Apple’s management is fine, lots of people are happy with a more affordable base spec with 8GB. 8GB is more than enough RAM. If you want a cheap Mac, you shouldn’t expect that to be the Pro model. The Pro model has the highest end display, sound system, most ports, etc. which make it more expensive than the Air. And 8GB on Apple Silicon is more than enough for many people, especially as a base spec. Offering a product that sells well, and garners high customer satisfaction isn’t “mismanagement”, lol, just because you don’t like said product.

 

[valentinavalerie]

Any laptop with 8 GB RAM in 2024? No thanks, not when software requires more and more RAM.
My work requires AT LEAST 16 GB RAM, preferably 32 GB RAM.

 

[Kal Madda]

Any laptop with 8 GB RAM in 2024? No thanks, not when software requires more and more RAM.
My work requires AT LEAST 16 GB RAM, preferably 32 GB RAM.

It’s a good thing for you then that they make other configurations as well. For many people, 8GB is plenty, and we’d rather save some on the cheaper base spec model. And most normal software on macOS runs fine with 8GB of RAM. I run Blender for 3D modeling/sculpting on my 8GB M1 Mac, and have never had it slow down or seen the beach ball.

 

[valkyr]

It’s a good thing for you then that they make other configurations as well. For many people, 8GB is plenty, and we’d rather save some on the cheaper base spec model. And most normal software on macOS runs fine with 8GB of RAM. I run Blender for 3D modeling/sculpting on my 8GB M1 Mac, and have never had it slow down or seen the beach ball.

Well...

Mac Pro: Now 64 GB RAM as minimum, and 192 GB RAM as maximum
MacBook Pro: Still only 8 GB RAM as minimum, and only 48 GB RAM as maximum

Shouldn't the MacBook Pro have at least 32 GB RAM as minimum at this point?
The MacBook Air should also now have at least 32 GB RAM, and AT LEAST 16 GB RAM.

But no... Apple insists that 8 GB is still enough in 2024 while charging at least $1600 for it.
How is this reasonable?

 

[Kal Madda]

Well...

Mac Pro: Now 64 GB RAM as minimum, and 192 GB RAM as maximum
MacBook Pro: Still only 8 GB RAM as minimum, and only 48 GB RAM as maximum

Shouldn't the MacBook Pro have at least 32 GB RAM as minimum at this point?
The MacBook Air should also now have at least 32 GB RAM, and AT LEAST 16 GB RAM.

But no... Apple insists that 8 GB is still enough in 2024 while charging at least $1600 for it.
How is this reasonable?

Because it’s more than enough for lots of people. It makes a great base spec. I’ve used my 8GB Mac for 3D modeling/sculpting, professional graphic design work, video editing, running emulated windows games, etc. and never had an issue. It outperforms 16GB Intel systems I’ve used. It’s perfectly reasonable. If you want more, you can always buy it, that’s why many configurations exist, including the cheaper configurations for people who don’t need as high of specs.