Bye, Bye for now Apple, it has been fun!

[zach-coleman]

There is a LOT more since you asked. I will add more as I see fit. Thanks.

Turn off startup with lid opening M2 Macb… - Apple Community

discussions.apple.com

Most of your points are down to personal preference so I don’t see the point of debating them, more power to you. The concerns about ecosystem are for the most part true… (Please cross platform clipboard and “airdrop” between all devices… please… I want this more than RCS.)

However, I will never understand why people are so insistent on shutting their modern MacBooks down between uses. It’s pointless to do so these days, and that’s probably why they’re nudging you to not turn it off. With how long these machines last on a charge, it makes as much sense as turning off your smartphone between uses. The standby is ridiculously good, and you don’t have to wait while it scrambles to catch up to all your changed files between times it was turned on.

If it’s a privacy concern, closing the lid hardware disconnects the microphone.

 

[MacProFCP]

The OP made solid points that absolutely justify the decision.

I may be moving in that direction as well and with it two companies and two large non-profits that I spec machines for. This is a big and expensive move so we’re not quite there yet but it looks like it’s going to be dozens of devices moving away from Apple. It’s been clear for some time that Apple really doesn’t care about making quality products at reasonable prices. Apple does make some good products but the pricing is no longer reasonable for any machine worth its salt in business.

Mac sales are down double digits YOY and it’s going to continue until they can deliver.

 

[Alex Cai]

Turn off startup with lid opening M2 Macb… - Apple Community

discussions.apple.com

You are right, the lid bug tortured me for years and it never got fixed. I need to be careful not to close the lid and open it again in order not to let it get "confused" or a force restart is required

 

[Alex Cai]

Most of your points are down to personal preference so I don’t see the point of debating them, more power to you. The concerns about ecosystem are for the most part true… (Please cross platform clipboard and “airdrop” between all devices… please… I want this more than RCS.)

However, I will never understand why people are so insistent on shutting their modern MacBooks down between uses. It’s pointless to do so these days, and that’s probably why they’re nudging you to not turn it off. With how long these machines last on a charge, it makes as much sense as turning off your smartphone between uses. The standby is ridiculously good, and you don’t have to wait while it scrambles to catch up to all your changed files between times it was turned on.

If it’s a privacy concern, closing the lid hardware disconnects the microphone.

There is a bug, when you press the power button to lock the screen and close the lid and then open it or do some combination of these actions, the M2 MBA would have a black screen (but with keyboard backlight on) and it would not respond. Only a force restart can fix this.

Edit: your first sentence is correct, I never power Macs off completely, I just close the lid or short press the power button.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

24 year Apple everything guy with an aging MBpro nearing end of life. Up to maybe 5 years ago, I wouldn't even think about anything other than a replacement MB. Now, I'm ready to potentially jump to a PC laptop. Why?

RAM & SSD relative pricing from the one "company store" that is now free to charge anything they want for such commodities. Right now it is 3X-5X, but nothing at all stands in the way of that migrating towards becoming 8X-10X. Then why not 15X-20X? The very same rationale the defenders sling about this one work at 8X and 15X too. And without ANY competitive alternatives of both commodities, it's either pay the very fat premium- ANY fat premium- or bail on the whole computer. That latter option is actually an option for every buyer. And I'm right on the edge of actually doing it.

With the death of bootcamp, Macs can no longer be the only computer to be fully compatible with both worlds. For anyone who must have some Windows capability too, that was a tremendous benefit loss. Yes, there's ARM Windows but that's not full Windows. Yes, ARM Windows works great with the mainstream stuff but it only takes one NOT-mainstream-but-needed app to make that fail as a solution.

Working Mac people often have clients that are Windows-oriented, thus Windows tends to be the "need" computer vs. Mac as the "want" computer. If ARM can't cover the need, those people need a Windows PC. In embracing a Desktop Silicon Mac, it influenced other choices like selecting a monitor with more than one input so that I could also use it with a Mac Mini-like PC too. That directly impacted the traditional halo effect of considering only the ASD monitor, since it lacks dual inputs. So an Apple monitor sale was lost in the same considerations. With both Mac & PC hidden behind a Dell 40" Ultra-Wide monitor, my entire visual experience using computers can look like I'm a Dell guy (the only visible piece of the setup).

Thus, I've already added one PC to the mix... "old fashioned bootcamp" if you will. In doing so, I've re-realized 3 key concepts:

1. Windows 11 is quite good- not nearly as bad as Apple fans commonly make it out to be. Old nonsense we recycle that existed in Vista or XP is long-since evolved in 10 and now 11.
2. PC parts competition drives pricing down and thus consumer value UP. I purchased a gaming PC with TEN TBs of fast SSD and 32GB of fast RAM for LESS THAN only the 8TB upgrade of Apple SSD by itself. Competition delivers value for us consumers. No competition means we pay much more than we have to if we buy the lone, "Company Store" option.
3. The rationalization of PPW so that Apple can win that discussion contest every time is great and all... but the counter to that is raw POWER. In other words, when we argue PPW, we're actually arguing Power vs. PPW. When you remove that filter (that is, when you say, I want 'more power' vs. maximum efficiency of power), you get a more powerful computer. More power means faster processing. Faster processing means things get done faster. Yes, "cooking eggs" and "third degree burns" and "fans like jet engines" are all things that may make us feel better about our Apple products, but Intel Macs were fine with all of that while Apple used it. Now that I've got this PC, I find myself giving it more and more of the power-based tasks. Why? It uses a bit more power than the minimum possible to get tasks done FASTER. It's faster computing. Bonus: no nuclear reactor required and my electric bill doesn't even register a noticeable difference.

So here I am: 24-year Apple everything pondering choosing a Windows laptop for "on the road/on the go" tasks and then bringing work back to the desktop where I could do some polish on a desktop Mac. I'd MUCH RATHER buy another MB instead of a PC, but not at the "new, improved" Apple premium. When my existing MB conks is going to force the decision. If that was today, it would likely be PC. Fingers crossed (likely fruitlessly) that Apple Inc wakes up and decides it would be better to throw customers some bones instead of seemingly making every choice for shareholders. There is no 47% maximized, "another record margin" profit in sales NOT made. And customers who choose something else don't come back should Apple decide to up the value proposition in the future. Worse, customers may get used to doing things the other way and just stick... as many of us stick with Apple even if we have to farrrrrrrrr overpay for commodities like RAM & SSD.

Shareholders rejoice!!! 💰💰💰 But consumers do retain that ONE "think different" ("spend different"?) choice. Even if we would rather NOT make that choice, nothing blocks the option to do so.

Many of us got to Apple FROM PC. Why? For some of us, it is because we got fed up with PC/Windows/Microsoft. That same driver can work the other way. Are we fed up with 3X-5X RAM & SSD pricing? How about if it becomes 4X-6X or 8X-10X? With no competition for such things, there is no natural check & balance on our favorite company. They can ask ANY price and if we want "the rest" bad enough, we just roll over and pay. But what if some of us reach that "enough is enough" moment? That's what I read in OPs post... and you've just read in mine.

 

[maflynn]

here is a LOT more since you asked. I will add more as I see fit. Thanks.

Interesting, I've not come across this, I still use my MBP, but I've not really like some of the recent changes, most of the changes are minor annoyances, but they can add up.

I respect the OPs opinions, but vehemently disagree. As someone who was a Windows and Microsoft user, I know how easy the Apple ecosystem is to live in. Things do - by and large - 'just work'.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP isn't talking about "its just works" His frustation is Apple's approach of over charging and upselling. The cost that apple charges for ram upgrades is outragious and they configure the base models with too little ram/storage so you are basically forced to pay their prices.

You're happy with being in the ecosystem, but that doesn't mean that ecosystem is great, its a walled garden and you're at the mercy of apple. Their just works mantra isn't all that accurate. There are plenty of things PCs do that Macs struggle at. A simple one is just Excel and word, the user experience on windows is so much better then on the Mac. There others to be sure, but that's an easy one to pick out.

you may disagree with the OP's choice of leaving the ecosystem but what is your opinion of what he wrote about, about upselling and locking people in?

 

[zach-coleman]

There is a bug, when you press the power button to lock the screen and close the lid and then open it or do some combination of these actions, the M2 MBA would have a black screen (but with keyboard backlight on) and it would not respond. Only a force restart can fix this.

Edit: your first sentence is correct, I never power Macs off completely, I just close the lid or short press the power button.

Oh, my bad. I’ve seen people angry about what I was bringing up so I jumped to conclusions. Sorry.

 

[Japan Ricardo]

I really don't think so.

British sarcasm. Mind you, the EU have done stranger things. They banned powerful vacuum cleaners and bananas that were too curved....

 

[Jim Lahey]

British sarcasm. Mind you, the EU have done stranger things. They banned powerful vacuum cleaners and bananas that were too curved....

EU would ban breathing if they could fine someone for noncompliance.

 

[jwolf6589]

I didn't know how to breach this subject because I am not writing this based on one OS or hardware's superiority. I like Mac's. They are beautiful, functional and powerful. They are a rip off to a certain extent, I hate Apple's business practices and manufacturing. I hate a lot of things within the various OS that Apple develops. But I love a lot of it too. Not the first sentence but the second, The OS is pretty sweet, and the various devices all have great software and hardware. Apple is pretty much King in terms of the "Best". The best security, the best design, the best cpu/gpu in mobile, and so much more. So I am no hater of Apple. But over time things have gotten to a point where I either hobble along and deal with it or I vote with my dollars to hopefully start to make a change.

I am one person so I am meaningless to Apple but if enough people in a similar situation as I am do what I do then it will start to hurt Apple's bottom line and then they might pay attention and start to change.

I am talking about the ladder and lock in. Two things I hate most about Apple right now. There equipment in some cases is objectively better but not in all areas. The ladder is the technique of upselling the customer by holding back certain features that are not costly but hamper user experience in such a way a user wants to go up the ladder to the better model, then they will want better than base specs. Everything pushes you up the ladder and gets progressively more expensive. Ram/SSD upgrades anyone? Pro motion only on a pro device although pro motion would enhance the overall experience of all users and is not a pro level feature in other brand devices. This pushes many consumers to buy an iPad Pro over an iPad Air when they really only need an air for their use case.

Lock in we all know the Apple ecosystem is great. Say you have an iPhone a Mac and an iPad. They all work great together and you can share files, make calls and texts from any device. Say you get an Android phone and keep the rest. Now your entire ecosystem is broken and no longer can you do any of the things you could with your iPhone. Even though you bought the Mac and iPad and should have the same functionality no matter the phone or computer you use but Apple locks you in and gimps your experience on purpose so you don't buy anything other than Apple products. Apple could easily offer some basic compatibility and basic feature sharing but they don't. They could still offer more features for Apple products but give all basic compatibility and save special features for Apple to encourage people to buy Apple rather than just have it wreck their experience.

So it is been a long time coming but I have decided to let go of my Mac and iPad and just go Windows and Android for a while. I don't know if I will go back to Apple because until they change I would be forced to go all in or nothing. I don't want to buy something and have half the features work because of free choice. The convenience for lock in is a bargain I am no longer willing to make and I shouldn't. Apple should want their products to work well with other products just from a business use perspective.

I know a lot of people don't care about this issue or even like it and it makes them feel exclusive or special in a special group or club. But I want to use multiple different devices together and not have to have separate ecosystems. So I will stay on Windows/Linux/Android side of things. I may be back because I still like Apple. Then I could talk cost. I can't afford to keep two separate platforms, it has become too expensive in this economy for me. I can get so much more ram and ssd and better hardware with a couple of exceptions for a lot less than Apple. Sure a 16" MBP with M3 Pro is a better laptop than my 16" Samsung GalaxyBook 4 Pro 360 in some ways but it costs a lot more and is a lot heavier and the Ultra is available if I needed graphic horsepower and it is still cheaper than equivalent MBP. Obviously Intel has not caught up with m series yet. Although Meteor lake is a huge step in the right direction it is NOT YET equivalent to M3 in all areas. But the difference in terms of performance and battery life are so much better than before that Intel is now in m series ballpark. Intel has to get to 4nm probably before they will be competitive directly but by then who knows how advanced Apple m series will be. But in my opinion it is not about having the absolute best but good enough. Specially if I am saving over $1000. I personally think Intel is finally good enough. Room for a lot of improvement-yes. But good enough I can go a whole day without worrying about charging and I can get the same performance on battery as plugged in if I adjust settings and battery life is still good enough. Maybe I get 6-8 hours slamming the machine on battery vs 10-12 if I am not. I can deal with those numbers. What sucked before was 3-6 hours average battery life with 1-2 on heavy use and a big difference throttled on battery no matter the settings. That is a huge improvement.

So I have settled on two devices since I have to have a back up device no matter what platform and I like a 14" and 16" for different taks. I was going to get a 14" chromebook but they suck so much in terms of getting a nice chromebook that doesn't cost $1000. So in order to get a fast and responsive Chromebook with a decent ssd, ram, and processor, decent bright screen and speakers in something other than plastic you are looking at $1000 and the specs still aren't as good as a comparable priced Windows laptop. So I ditched that idea and decided on two Windows laptops, one Android tablet, an Android phone, an android watch and some ear buds. They all work flawlessly together and have more features than are available in an Mac.

So my two laptops have OLED 120hz touchscreens with AR coating and variable refresh rate and a hardened glass. You can't get anything like it on any Mac no matter how much you spend. I have a pencil or stylus with every major device I own. S pen on phone, tablet and PC. Not available on Mac or iPhone. Then there are new AI features like a circle to search feature in Windows!!

I will sell all my Apple stuff and end up paying a little out of pocket but I will be happy with everything I own. Samsung and HP give generous specs for the cost compared to Apple. I have a 2tb drive on the HP and 1tb drive on Samsung and Samsung gave me a free 2tb portable ssd. If I were to try to get just a 2tb drive it would cost a lot.

Apple products are really great but both Android and Windows OEM's have drastically improved on their top end devices the design, quality and materials to get close or even surpass Apple.

If I were to go all in on Apple with only one laptop, one iPad, one watch and ear buds it would cost me at least double and I would half the specs in order to do it with lesser hardware in some areas. M3 would be faster in some ways but not all. M3 Pro or better is faster and better in battery life but at the price point of pro m3 and decent specs cost gets prohibitive specially in the 16" which I would want but it is such a heavy beast. It is close to 5 pounds while my 16" GB4 is only 3.5 pounds. Big difference. And the GB4 still feels solid and has an objectively better screen for everything but brightness.

So while I will miss Apple and I have no hard feelings I am pretty confident with my choice. I have been using computers since before Apple 2 and Windows 95. I remember DOS and green and amber CRT screens. So I am very comfortable in any computing environment from flashy GUI to Text prompts. Apple and Unix have always been more complex for me to use because there are more steps for me to take toa accomplish the same task in Windows. Linux is very similar to Unix but some interfaces can look a lot like Windows. And I really like the ability to use Linux if I want to on my laptop.

I may visit a Chromebook again when they get some more compelling devices. I really like ChromeOS and being able to use a full Linux install within ChromeOS is very cool. The hardware just needs to catch up. I am not paying $600 for a laptop with EMMC storage or a celeron processor. I can't stand 250nits 45%ntsc screens!! Like put an ultra 7 155h 16gb ddr5x ram, 120hz Oled touch screen, minimum 256gb nvme pci4 ssd. all in a nice aluminum build. Priced at say $799. It would be the perfect Chromebook but now we got crap.

So Windows and Android for now....

Ever heard of the word condense? You need to not go into all the details but be more brief. Anyways I love Apple and have owned an Apple product since 1993 and used the Apple II before then in school. I did go to the windows platform in the early 2000’s but was not content and won’t do that again as Apple is the best.

I had Windows 9.X laptops and a Windows CE palmtop.

 

[j26]

British sarcasm. Mind you, the EU have done stranger things. They banned powerful vacuum cleaners and bananas that were too curved....

Ah yes, the UK - that other walled garden.

I'm starting to wonder if there's a correlation between Brexit support and use of Apple devices....

/Irish sarcasm 🙂

 

[za9ra22]

British sarcasm. Mind you, the EU have done stranger things. They banned powerful vacuum cleaners and bananas that were too curved....

Well, not exactly. Bananas have been widely classed by size and shape for many years, and all that EU regulation 2257/94 did was to specify the classification of them within the EU for consistency so that retailers would know what they were getting in the box.

Vacuum cleaners had been subject to a 1600w power use limit for years, which the EU subsequently reduced to 900w for energy conservation purposes. Manufacturers were consulted and backed the move, the objective being to make vacuum cleaners as effective, but at lower energy'.

The EU is certainly imperfect, but unlike Apple, those within it can at least vote to change it.

 

[Kingcoherent]

This is a rude reply
This post is right where it belongs, in the “Alternatives to Mac Hardware” area

A ton of us really longtime Apple users resonate with the OP

Indeed. As with my "******tification" of the ecosystem post here there is a lot that's frustrating.

For me the ecosystem is still the best of a poor bunch.

However, Microsoft are making good software again. And they're humble. That humility goes a long way towards building great products. AI integration will change [the marketplace] a lot and MS have a big advantage over Apple. Anecdotally I'm seeing a lot of developers move back to MS (I image some of this is because the Apple Silicon move has created friction for dual booting/virtualisation that didn't exist before).

My advice to Apple: be very careful with the UX tweaks you make. Trying to wring the last cent out of your user base, instead of just giving them the powerful, capable computers that they need, could seriously erode your user base.

I have seen very little to show me that Apple are learning though. The way they treated their Pro creative user base, and now the significant number of developers using their products, is very poor. And if people stop creating on Mac, it'll affect what people are able to consume on the Mac. At that point you'll get int serious trouble.

 

[Japan Ricardo]

Well, not exactly. Bananas have been widely classed by size and shape for many years, and all that EU regulation 2257/94 did was to specify the classification of them within the EU for consistency so that retailers would know what they were getting in the box.

Vacuum cleaners had been subject to a 1600w power use limit for years, which the EU subsequently reduced to 900w for energy conservation purposes. Manufacturers were consulted and backed the move, the objective being to make vacuum cleaners as effective, but at lower energy'.

The EU is certainly imperfect, but unlike Apple, those within it can at least vote to change it.

So they did ban them, then…

Apple shareholders can vote to change Apple. And Apple customers can vote with their feet…

You can’t vote to change the EU, but you can vote to leave it sometimes…

 

[za9ra22]

So they did ban them, then…

Nope they didn't. Curiously since you seem interested, the banana regulation merely categorized them to make it easier for people to know what they were buying, and the vacuum cleaner regulations had been supported by the British government who (like all member states) could have simply blocked them from implementation if they wished to - they were part of non-binding conservation policies.

 

[TechnoMonk]

TLDR, I tried but lost after first few lines. A summary would be nice. I don’t get emotional about my devices, I haven’t bought a Mac desktop/workstation for over a decade. I have love hate relationship with my Linux/Windows workstation. But upgradability, specifically GPU is important to me.But for my use cases there are no credible alternatives for my MBP, iPad Pro and iPhone. Do what works, if Apple isn’t for you, buy something else. You do t owe an explanation to any one, neither does Apple or other vendors for not offering what you wnat.

 

[Jim Lahey]

i just had a lolcanic eruption at the idea of the EU banning powerful vacuum cleaners to save energy and then allowing the sale of mega-power BEVs that turn energy into tire smoke 🤦‍♂️

 

[JamieLannister]

When I was financially strapped for cash back in the day I would never even look at high priced items regardless of value. But I was smart enough never to pay for top Apple gear instead I invested. Now I got money so much to the point I buy whatever I want and not have to repent with a story online. TLDR is make good money then have disposable money around to buy things. Not a single care in the world then.

 

[Lounge vibes 05]

Well, except with the iPhones. I use an iPhone SE (2015); my wife, until recently, used an iPhone 6. When it stopped updating some apps she needed, she reluctantly moved to Samsung. Why? Because they are comparable function-wise and much, much cheaper.

I seriously still don’t get this narrative.
The galaxy S 24U is $1299.99 US.
The iPhone 15 Pro Max is $1199.99 US.
And even when you go down the line, the prices are pretty comparable.

There’s even an iPhone SE for $429, and you can get iPhones 13, 13 Pro, 14 and 14 Pro for about the same price as most of Samsung‘s mid range phones, especially if you’re going through a carrier or a third-party retailer.
But direct from Apple and direct from Samsung, their phones cost pretty much the same.
And if we include foldable, Samsung has a huge price gap with the iPhones because most of their foldables are hovering between 1000 $502,000.
Maybe it’s just other countries, but I seriously don’t get this huge price discrepancy people talk about.
It’s not necessary to buy the most expensive version of their phones.

 

[Silverstring]

I am not trying to bash Apple but rather call them out.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying you shouldn’t post this or that your feelings aren’t valid…

…but is it really “calling out” if the subject of said callout will never hear/see your points?!?

You’re just complaining on a message board, which is fine, but none of us are “speaking truth to power” here.

 

[Cape Dave]

Interesting, I've not come across this, I still use my MBP, but I've not really like some of the recent changes, most of the changes are minor annoyances, but they can add up.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP isn't talking about "its just works" His frustation is Apple's approach of over charging and upselling. The cost that apple charges for ram upgrades is outragious and they configure the base models with too little ram/storage so you are basically forced to pay their prices.

You're happy with being in the ecosystem, but that doesn't mean that ecosystem is great, its a walled garden and you're at the mercy of apple. Their just works mantra isn't all that accurate. There are plenty of things PCs do that Macs struggle at. A simple one is just Excel and word, the user experience on windows is so much better then on the Mac. There others to be sure, but that's an easy one to pick out.

you may disagree with the OP's choice of leaving the ecosystem but what is your opinion of what he wrote about, about upselling and locking people in?

Correct! Mac pricing is evil.

 

[Lounge vibes 05]

The hoohaa here over opening the iOS store has me questioning whether I made the right choice to jump further into Apples ecosystem. Apple seems determined to prevent freer access and greater interoperability. At this point, if an Android manufacturer came out with a compelling small tablet, I could easily find myself switching from Apple again.

If that has you questioning, you might not want to switch to android because… They’re going through the exact same thing right now.

Google Will Pay $700 Million To Settle Antitrust Suit—And Will Change Play Store Billing

The attorneys general of 36 states and the District of Columbia had sued Google, accusing it of operating its mobile app marketplace as an illegal monopoly.

www.forbes.com

Here's how Android app sideloading & third-party billing will change following settlement

Following a settlement by Google, the terms of how Android app sideloading and billing will change have been revealed.

9to5google.com

Apple and Google seem spooked by bill requiring more app stores and sideloading

Bill would make iOS and Android more open to 3rd-party stores and sideloaded apps.

arstechnica.com

Epic Games Wins Antitrust Lawsuit Against Google Play Store

Epic Games has won its antitrust lawsuit against Google, after the nine-member jury in the case unanimously agreed that the tech giant abused its...

www.macrumors.com

At the end of the day, Google wants you using their App Store and giving them a cut of the profits just as much as Apple does.

 

[Silverstring]

Correct! Mac pricing is evil.

Do I like paying high(er) prices for RAM and storage prices? I don’t.

That said, the premium is still worth it for the Apple experience, for me. That may change one day, but it hasn’t.

I hate the argument that anyone is “forced” to buy/pay for anything, as well as making pricing out to be a moral issue. We’re not talking about life-saving insulin here, we’re talking about computers/devices/services.

Call Apple’s pricing high, or unreasonable, or greedy…but “evil”? Get some perspective.

 

[j26]

If that has you questioning, you might not want to switch to android because… They’re going through the exact same thing right now.

Google Will Pay $700 Million To Settle Antitrust Suit—And Will Change Play Store Billing

The attorneys general of 36 states and the District of Columbia had sued Google, accusing it of operating its mobile app marketplace as an illegal monopoly.

www.forbes.com

Here's how Android app sideloading & third-party billing will change following settlement

Following a settlement by Google, the terms of how Android app sideloading and billing will change have been revealed.

9to5google.com

Apple and Google seem spooked by bill requiring more app stores and sideloading

Bill would make iOS and Android more open to 3rd-party stores and sideloaded apps.

arstechnica.com

Epic Games Wins Antitrust Lawsuit Against Google Play Store

Epic Games has won its antitrust lawsuit against Google, after the nine-member jury in the case unanimously agreed that the tech giant abused its...

www.macrumors.com

At the end of the day, Google wants you using their App Store and giving them a cut of the profits just as much as Apple does.

The difference is I already can, and do, use multiple App Stores (Play Store, Samsung Store, App Gallery), and even have one app that I download directly from the manufacturer (DJI). I, and developers, can avoid the fees entirely.

 

[mannenson]

I tried switching to PC last year being a Macbook user for many years. Didnt like the thick boy the 16inch pro has become. Mostly using laptop for coding web apps the performance of a pro is not needed but the big screen is.

Bought a galaxy book 3 16” and what a dissapointment. Great screen but apart from that speakers, flimsy chassi, flimsy hinge, off center keyboard and worst of all the trackbad that was awful. Bought it in April last year and was back in apple camp as soon as 15 inch air was released.

Lesson learned.