EU Fines Apple $2 Billion for Anti-Competitive Behavior Toward Spotify

[d686546s]

I'll pay you $100 per year for using your car. And I'll drive it for Uber and make a lot of money on it. Incase there is a repair, the cost is on you. Is that a fair deal?

That's a rather poor analogy, but in any case what does it matter? You are the one who gets to set the price.

The reason it's a poor analogy is that Apple doesn't provide all the support they do for altruistic reasons. They do that so that the hardware they want to sell you is a viable product and we all already pay for that through Apple's sizeable margins. I'm not complaining, I'm just stating the obvious.

Beyond that they should absolutely be able to provide additional services to run on that platform and be compensated for them, but the iPhone isn't a store. Neither is iOS.

 

[DaPhox]

Just a way for the EU to generate revenue.

Have to increase revenue for increased ”influx”…

 

[senttoschool]

The EU has always been about open markets and competition which is why there is always problems with numerous industries within the EU that persistently complain of cheap imports. Farmers within the EU seem to be the biggest complainers and then steel manufacturers who complain of cheap steel coming in from China. These complaints always fall on deaf ears because the EU wants open competition with in all it's industries.

Nope. EU is in protectionist state of their economy.

They're protecting their companies and repelling foreign competitors.

 

[Herrpod]

Good start, but the fine should have been larger.

 

[vegetassj4]

🤣🤣🤣🤣

Here comes the “PULL OUT OF THE EU, THAT’LL SHOW EM” crowd.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Tim and Apple are late 90s Microsoft

Siri,

I am your father....

 

[AndiG]

Imagine video streaming services suing Apple for the same now 🙊

Everyone will sue em. Prime already had a special deal, but e.g. Netflix just to name one big player.

 

[wbeasley]

Can we just rename MacRumors.com to AppleHaters.com?

Once upon a time people were excited to hear what new hardware and software we had to look forward to...

 

[Timo_Existencia]

Apple, it's time to play hardball. The EU has become a silly regime; they can't compete on tech, so they're trying to extort with fines. And they can't even compete on the merits of their own arguments, so they simply make the rules up as they go along.

 

[cardfan]

$2 billion is a lot of cheddar. While I am a believer of openness on where apps can be installed from (like the Macintosh framework), I have to wonder if Apple will eventually consider stopping business in the EU as there is the potential for these massive fines.

Apple couldn’t afford to do so. More countries will start suing Apple as well. It’s just a matter of when. You should wonder instead when Apple will change its illegal business practices.

 

[CJM]

Soooo…..are we still all defending Apple in this monopoly stuff?

The shareholder commenters haven’t woken up yet.

 

[tcgjeukens]

Just sell 400,000 shoes to compensate the 2bUSD.

 

[djphat2000]

I find it hard to believe that a "large part of [Spotify's] success is due to the App Store."

The rise of the smartphone has helped them a lot for sure, but I think Apple here massively overstates its own importance. That is not to say that Apple doesn't provide lots of support to make sure there are good apps and services on its platform, but I find it frustrating how Apple now suggests that this isn't for anything other than pure self interest. Apps like Spotify and many many others have made the iPhone the platform that it is. It's a symbiotic relationship and Apple isn't the benign benefactor it makes itself out to be.

I wouldn't have a massive issue with their anti-steering provisions if there were good alternatives as there are on the Mac. They can gatekeep in their store as much as they want as long as I can just download from the developer directly or from a trusted alternative store (like Steam).

But otherwise I'm happy that there is more scrutiny of Apple's practices, and for the record not just Apple alone.

Can't have it both ways. Either Apple helps or they do not. If it is true that Spotify does not pay Apple anything AND enjoys a 56% marketshare in the EU. Then how can you also say Apple has no hand in helping Spotify in being so successful?

We can certainly argue that not allowing Spofity to notify customers of different pricing is an issue. Which is somewhat easily rectifiable. Note that they don't let users sign up on the app due to that. So Spotify pays Apple nothing, while getting access to all of Apple's iPhone customers.

If your argument is that Spotify shouldn't pay Apple anything. Then how to you support the store?

 

[Timo_Existencia]

Can we just rename MacRumors.com to AppleHaters.com?

Once upon a time people were excited to hear what new hardware and software we had to look forward to...

Yeah, this site has become ever more tedious. Every thread is now filled with "Apple is evil!" graffiti and specious, poorly crafted arguments that do nothing but derail substantive conversation.

 

[Onelifenofear]

Further proof that Spotify is evil.

1 Billion Snoop Dogg streams... $45k

 

[AlexESP]

I find it a bit ironic that Apple seems to be more at odds with the EU than with China. For real - I don't see Apple being punished as harshly by Chinese regulators.

You’re right, but I guess we all expect more from Europe than China. We know what kind of country China is, and what conditions companies need to meet in order to operate there; we europeans are supposed to have a more open society and market.

 

[Zimmy68]

I never had a big issue with Apple wanting to skim 30% on its app store.
What I have a huge problem with is Apple not letting the App owners show other ways to sign up for the app.

 

[Xiao_Xi]

What rules?

The European Union competition enforcer said Apple's restrictions constituted unfair trading conditions

https://www.reuters.com/technology/apple-hit-with-over-18-bln-euro-eu-antitrust-fine-spotify-case-2024-03-04/

 

[djphat2000]

Can someone help me why Apple now often argues this way? I always thought the $99 or $299 they charge for the Apple Developer Program were exactly for the features they call "free"? My question is not intended to sound sarcastic or snarky, I'm really curious.

free if your app is free. Including not charing (IAP, In app purchases). So you make money on Ad's within the app only.
If you "sell" something on the store. You pay up to 30% of sale price.

The $99 fee will go up if Apple can't collect via the 70/30 split. Most likely to a sliding scale based on revenue of the developer.

Pick your poison.

 

[AndiG]

Can someone help me why Apple now often argues this way? I always thought the $99 or $299 they charge for the Apple Developer Program were exactly for the features they call "free"? My question is not intended to sound sarcastic or snarky, I'm really curious.

This all Apples fault. If I had to decide i would offer:

A "free" subscription that includes
- Push Notifications
- AppStore Hosting
- you name it ...
- Costs 30% using InApp Payment

A professional/payed subscription:
- Push notifcation fee (compare this to AWS/Azure/... cloud fees)
- Hosting fee
- you name it ...
- Free choice of payment service for InApp payment

That's basically it. I guess the second/professional version wouldn't generate as much money as the first version does, but it would be fair.

 

[Timo_Existencia]

We can certainly argue that not allowing Spofity to notify customers of different pricing is an issue.

We can? Spotify has no means of advertising their service to the world? What prevents Spotify from advertising their services, on their own, through every single available outlet minus one?

 

[nickgovier]

Apple listed a large number of services that it provides to Spotify for free, such as distribution, APIs, frameworks, TestFlight, App Review, and in-person engineering assistance.

Why does Apple give all this to Spotify for free when I have to pay £79 per year for it?

Instead, Spotify wants to bend the rules in their favor to exercise their legal right under anti-steering provisions in EU antitrust law by embedding subscription prices in their app without using the App Store's In-App Purchase system.

FTFY

 

[AppliedMicro]

quite telling that the EU is protecting Spotify (EU company), which has a monopoly on music streaming.

There are way more music streaming services for iOS than App Stores (or relevant mobile OS, for that matter.

Can we just rename MacRumors.com to AppleHaters.com?

Why? You’re writing here, and you’re clearly not an Apple hater, are you? 🤷‍♀️

 

[Timo_Existencia]

I never had a big issue with Apple wanting to skim 30% on its app store.
What I have a huge problem with is Apple not letting the App owners show other ways to sign up for the app.

Apple prevents Spotify from communicating through any other means with their own customers? So, besides everything else Apple does for Spotify, you want Apple to hand-hold IOS users to be able to type in s-p-o-t-i-f-y-.-c-o-m?

And how has spotify gained such a large marketshare, then, if they are unable to communicate these issues to their own customers?

 

[wbeasley]

Apple couldn’t afford to do so. More countries will start suing Apple as well. It’s just a matter of when. You should wonder instead when Apple will change its illegal business practices.

Time for Apple to readjust the "exchange rates" in EU countries.

2% increase should cover it... fines absorbed. profit stays the same.

And time to knuckle down harder on that app to seamlessly move Spotify playlists to Apple Music.
Soon as they get that working, I'll be converting my paid Spotify account to Apple Music.
Perhaps Tim can offer a nice sweet deal to encourage switchers? In a non noncompetitive way of course...

 

[djphat2000]

I never had a big issue with Apple wanting to skim 30% on its app store.
What I have a huge problem with is Apple not letting the App owners show other ways to sign up for the app.

This is fair.
My only argument against this would be how any other store works. You generally don't see competing prices within say Store A showing what Store B is charging for the same item. And vendors/developers offen don't show you (the customer) where their products are the cheapest. "You" generally have to go look. Sure they offer coupons or sales across various distribution they sell to. Even direct. But, if I walk into a 7-11 or a Target. I will not see the competing price of the other store for the same item.