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dave72

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 29, 2021
31
13
Was there ever a convincing argument for Lightning cable for iPhone?

My own opinion is that Apple did this because they could; nothing more.

I have been put off updating my iPhone until USB-C is introduced; I suspect that there are others in a similar mindset.

I find it frustrating that I have two types of charger for my MBA M1 and iPhone 12.
 
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dave72

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 29, 2021
31
13
Of course there was. And in many ways there still is.

It was either MicroUSB or Lightning and obviously Lightning was far superior.

Thank you for your feedback.

I have found that the Lightning cable needed replacing alot more than USB-C cables, even with my being ultra-careful with usage.
 
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dave72

macrumors member
Original poster
Oct 29, 2021
31
13
If you're aware of this, then why ask for a convincing argument? All other connectors at the time were either to big or flimsy (or both).

From the non-technical perspective that USB-C appears popular with almost everything else I own/use. I had a reasonable expectation that Apple would have made the change (to USB-C) without there needing to be a (regulatory) court case.
 

RRC

macrumors 68000
Nov 3, 2020
1,512
2,373
Other than data transfer I'd still be happy to keep lightning. I've got so many of them already, in my car, house, work etc. These cables will then become waste going forwards, which is counterintuitive to what the EU law was making as a point for the change.
 

antiprotest

macrumors 601
Apr 19, 2010
4,071
14,357
From the non-technical perspective that USB-C appears popular with almost everything else I own/use. I had a reasonable expectation that Apple would have made the change (to USB-C) without there needing to be a (regulatory) court case.
Lightning was released in 2012. USB C 1.0 was finalized in 2014. I might be wrong. Just a quick look up.

If correct, there was a strong case for lightning. But you can say that Apple waited too long to switch to USB C to be customer friendly.
 
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MajorFubar

macrumors 68020
Oct 27, 2021
2,113
3,734
Lancashire UK
Lol, why would using a lightning cable be the deal breaker for you? Bit of a mountain out of a molehill, tbh.
For more or less the same reasons it created an uproar in 2015 when Apple forced new Mac users to embrace it, except the polar opposite.

Apple are now being forced by European law to use a port on future iPhones which they actually shoved onto an unsuspecting Mac-buying public in 2015 when virtually no accessories existed to natively plug into it. Just how bizarre that is, when we're talking about the same company making both products, can't be overstated.
 
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nStyle

macrumors 65832
Dec 6, 2009
1,503
1,047
I’ve never had a problem with lightning cables on any of my devices.

Anecdotal, but me either. Actually, I’ve never broke any cable ever. The only cable that came close to breaking on me was the old MagSafe charger which was basically designed to wear out.

What’s more mind blowing to me nowadays is not that Apple hasn’t fully switched to USB-C but that there are still devices shipping with MicroUSB….at least some mice and headphones that I’ve bought in the past few years.
 
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8079703

Cancelled
Nov 13, 2012
20
10
Ok, lightning was both great and it's obviously overdue for replacement, but the timeline seems to be muddy for a lot of people, who just seem angry that two types of cables exist, or angry that they will have to use only one in the future, or just angry. That's fine, but as an elder of almost a half century in age, I lived through the transition and do hve a perspective. Please skip this tl;dr entry if you wish.

Lightning was great when it was introduced -- the iPhone 5 made the switch, and previous phones (and iPods, and accessories) were all the old 30-pin iPod dock connector. There was tremendous hue and cry at the time, wailing and gnashing of teeth, as people loudly lamented online that Apple was forcing everyone to buy newer cables after more than a decade of the old one which was fine and worked perfectly and didn't need to be replaced, etc etc. Apple would be milking their partners for that sweet MFI money -- and they would, of course. But they already were.

Yes, cables failed. None of mine ever have, but others in the family, and in my mom's case, exactly the same ways as the old dock cables failed -- usually where the connector was attached to the cable because people disconnect by tugging the cable out of the phone. Second hand cables were usually stronger and what I usually used and gave away as people's official ones failed. At the time -- this was the far off year of 2012 -- my most reliable 30-pin cable was one by Belkin or some other third party, and I got about a half dozen of the monoprice lightning cables as soon as they were available in early 2013 (they were some of the first on the market, and I still have two of those that I use regularly -- the rest having over the years been passed off to friends and relations-- if I'm not mistaken only one of them failed, and I asked them for a replacement -- poor monoprice, whatever happened to them?).

There was no USB-C at the time. The alternatives were all proprietary (cf. Zune's proprietary cable, Sandisk's Sansa dock cable, and dozens of others at the time). Android phones were usually using micro USB, lots of things were using mini USB, but lightning was a well-designed connector that solved many annoyances of not only Apple's older cables but what was wrong with all the other options too. Simple, reversible. Few moving parts. I liked it.

Very quickly there was talk of a new standard (this calls for that old xkcd "there are 14 competing standards..." comic), that would be like lightning but not. Reversible and all that. Higher bandwidth. Able to support multiple data streams, audio, a huge list of things. The standards body is the USB-IF, and among it's notable members -- one with a huge market share and lots of engineering resources -- is Apple. So in the end we get a pretty nice and useful connector, almost as small as lightning, potentially much more versatile, and certainly better than the micro-USB you'd find on all the Android phones at the time. Of course, Apple itself was an early proponent of USB-C, and introduced hardware in which that was the only connection option. And now, slightly longer than a decade after lightning's introduction, it's poised to transition to USB-C on the iPhone.

USB-C isn't perfect (Does this cable support power delivery? Thunderbolt 3 or 4 or neither some half-way point? Will just plugging it in fry my Nexus 6P or my MacBook if I connect it though the PD port on this Anker expansion dock -- both of those real things that happened and were covered widely in the tech press, and in the case of the Anker dock is one I worry about because I use one of those). As transitions go, it's weird -- sometime I can connect something, but it doesn't always work as expected, or at all, or as fast as I wish. All of which are familiar problems with any connecter unfortunately. On the whole, I like USB-C as much, if not more, than lightning (and lightning was great -- plugging in my iPhone 5 for the first time was quite pleasant, and I'm not one to gush about tech too much, despite reading and following a site like MacRumors). That tiny plug going into that slender phone after using an iPod touch 2 and a flip phone for a few years as my primary mobile communications means was revolutionary (and you know neither of those used the same cable -- I kept an extra 30-pin and an extra -- also absurdly priced -- LG phone cable for those two). Switching to USB-C won't be overnight and may not -- in fact, I'd go so far as to say will not -- be the last tech transition we all make.

But I'll be happy to pour one out for lightning when I replace the last of my devices that uses it -- but I would bet I'll keep a few around because someone I know will be using something that uses it. As it is, I have an iPod cable and various micr and mini USB cables in my laptop bag because I still have junk that uses those. Oh well. Looking forward to whatever is next.
 

mikehalloran

macrumors 68020
Oct 14, 2018
2,239
666
The Sillie Con Valley
USB-C is worse than lightning because there's no standard cable. In short, USB-C is a port shape only, there is no protocol. Some don't carry bus power while others can handle 100W. The cheapest carry USB 2 only — and that's going to disappoint a whole lot of people who shop price alone. Others are rated USB 3, 3.1, 3.2, USB 4. HDMI, DP, Thunderbolt 3 (60W) and TB4 (100W) and then there's that 3.2 gen 1, gen 2 crap introduced because enough consumers were starting to understand the different standards and the manufacturers were not going to stand for that! Not one is backward compatible to everything. And here's the fun part: we already see "Thunderbolt compatible" marketing nonsense that doesn't mean a thing—use one of those where you need TB3 and nothing will work.

Now, if someone reads specs carefully and pays attention, getting the right cable will be no problem. The Apple cable will work, of course, but it will be more expensive than others that meet the same requirements.

I predict between 300–1000 threads within the first few weeks when the USB-C iPhone ships.

Was there ever a convincing argument for Lightning cable for iPhone?

My own opinion is that Apple did this because they could; nothing more.

I'm trusting that you've read enough other posts to know that your basic premise is wrong. Before Lightening, there was the 30-pin that could be inserted one direction only.

Lightening is as old and outdated as 30-pin was before—no argument there. Anyone using one of those micro-usb cables (the old EU standard) on an Android phone knows what a fragile PIA those are.

Apple should have come up with a truly decent 3rd gen iOS cable, then tell the EU to go screw themselves and wait to those consumers put enough pressure on the politicians to let the free market rule.

USB-C is a mess with no standards and the connector is not nearly as good as Lightning (how many have broken USB-C plugs? It's easy to do). This will just make a bad situation worse.
 

LIVEFRMNYC

macrumors G3
Oct 27, 2009
8,780
10,844
USB-C is worse than lightning because there's no standard cable. In short, USB-C is a port shape only, there is no protocol. Some don't carry bus power while others can handle 100W. The cheapest carry USB 2 only — and that's going to disappoint a whole lot of people who shop price alone. Others are rated USB 3, 3.1, 3.2, USB 4. HDMI, DP, Thunderbolt 3 (60W) and TB4 (100W) and then there's that 3.2 gen 1, gen 2 crap introduced because enough consumers were starting to understand the different standards and the manufacturers were not going to stand for that! Not one is backward compatible to everything. And here's the fun part: we already see "Thunderbolt compatible" marketing nonsense that doesn't mean a thing—use one of those where you need TB3 and nothing will work.

Now, if someone reads specs carefully and pays attention, getting the right cable will be no problem. The Apple cable will work, of course, but it will be more expensive than others that meet the same requirements.

I predict between 300–1000 threads within the first few weeks when the USB-C iPhone ships.



I'm trusting that you've read enough other posts to know that your basic premise is wrong. Before Lightening, there was the 30-pin that could be inserted one direction only.

Lightening is as old and outdated as 30-pin was before—no argument there. Anyone using one of those micro-usb cables (the old EU standard) on an Android phone knows what a fragile PIA those are.

Apple should have come up with a truly decent 3rd gen iOS cable, then tell the EU to go screw themselves and wait to those consumers put enough pressure on the politicians to let the free market rule.

USB-C is a mess with no standards and the connector is not nearly as good as Lightning (how many have broken USB-C plugs? It's easy to do). This will just make a bad situation worse.

I can guarantee that users have far less issues from purchasing cheap random USB-C cables VS purchasing cheap random Lightning cables.

The average iPhone user most likely has several devices that already use USB-C. It's not like USB-C is some brand new standard. If someone purchases a non-compliant or cheap bad cable, they will quickly know. Same thing when Micro-usb was king.

The thing with the Lightning Cable and the old 30 pin charger was that it's proprietary. So users think all should work the same, even the non-certified cheap ones. Users will not have that blind expectation with USB-C, because most already have experience with it with multiple devices.
 

Pakaku

macrumors 68040
Aug 29, 2009
3,157
4,505
I preferred the plug design not wrapping around a piece inside the port, no real reason for it other than preference.
 
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akash.nu

macrumors G4
May 26, 2016
10,825
16,935
From the non-technical perspective that USB-C appears popular with almost everything else I own/use. I had a reasonable expectation that Apple would have made the change (to USB-C) without there needing to be a (regulatory) court case.

Did you know that Apple helped develop USB C?


USB-C is a mess with no standards and the connector is not nearly as good as Lightning (how many have broken USB-C plugs? It's easy to do). This will just make a bad situation worse.

This I agree with 100%. People just don’t know what a mess USB C is at present.
 
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LIVEFRMNYC

macrumors G3
Oct 27, 2009
8,780
10,844
As I already posted, USB-C is a port only. The cables are built to many different protocols and they are often incompatible.

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO STANDARD!


There doesn't need to be a damn standard. I have a ton of USB-C cables that I use on many differ devices, including my iPad Pro. I know which ones work best at charging, and which ones are thunderbolt. Even my non-techy family members have easily figured it out. It's not rocket science.

I've had the iPad Pro 11" since 3rd gen, and currently using a M1 iPad Pro 11". Never had an issue using multiple differ USB-C cables. Any USB-C cable that doesn't charge fast are usually older cables that are barely for sale anymore, cause higher rated USB-C cables are also dirt cheap. 60W are being sold for dirt cheap, 100W are still cheap, and thunderbolt cables are very affordable. Anyone that buys new USB-C cables are most likely to never have any issues. And the majority of Thunderbolt 3 and 4 cables are clearly marked as thunderbolt.

Yes differ rated cables provide differ transfer speeds, and Thunderbolt for external display. But the average user can easily figure that out on their own. Just as they did with Micro-USB.

You are making something out of nothing. There's no need for a USB-C to have one standard.
 
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Samuel Bradshaw

macrumors member
Jun 10, 2014
68
29
I have a ton of USB-C cables that I use on many differ devices, including my iPad Pro. I know which ones work best at charging, and which ones are thunderbolt. Even my non-techy family members have easily figured it out. It's not rocket science.
The main argument put forward for why Apple should switch to USB-C is because then we'll supposedly be able to use one cable for everything. If you have multiple USB-C cables that you have to manage and switch between for different purposes, how is that better than having a USB-C cable and a lightning cable that you switch between? Wouldn't it be better to have a cable that looks different so you can tell at a glance which is which?
 
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