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bsolar

macrumors 68000
Jun 20, 2011
1,534
1,735
How dare both sides be allowed to explain the pros and cons of the issue at hand! Censor Apple so those retail workers won’t ever know what they don’t know. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

Apple would still be allowed to explain its position, the only difference being that workers would be free not to hear it if they chose so.

"Freedom of speech" does not equal others have "duty to hear", so it would clearly not be censorship to prohibit the mandatory nature of the meetings.
 

lovehateapple

macrumors 6502a
Oct 15, 2015
600
886
USA
Source for your wild accusation?
This is the nature of all government agencies. Once they're created they have to find ways to justify their existence. Administrators / bureaucrats always seek more power and more funding. Unfortunately, it's human nature.
 
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lovehateapple

macrumors 6502a
Oct 15, 2015
600
886
USA
Pretty damn bad if this really happened.
Might just be a case of bad law being enforced badly. Sorta depends on the "techniques" apple used. Back in the early 1900s I'm sure physical violence was used on both sides of the union debate. I highly doubt physical violence was even threatened in this case.

If conditions are that terrible, employees are always free to find work at a better employer. On the other hand, apple has an incentive to hire and retain all the best employees it can, so it has to offer competitive wages and benefits, otherwise workers will vote with their feet and leave.
 

coolfactor

macrumors 604
Jul 29, 2002
7,088
9,820
Vancouver, BC
Spoken like a true anti-worker rights employer.

I’ve never been part of a union or had access to them in my career but I’d support unions for any of my employees. Granted I’ve never been such a terrible employer that I’d have to actually negotiate with one.

Apple is a nearly trillion dollar entity. They CAN afford to provide improved working conditions and even pay their staff a little more.

Enough with the corporate and individual greed.

You can't see the forest for the trees, though.

Answer this — if Apple could _not_ afford to provide improved working conditions, would your sympathies change sides? The fact that Apple is making a tons is what is creating the very "demands" (aka. greed) that unions "represent". Profits do not equate the quality of working conditions. Profits are due to successful sales. Period.
 

DMG35

Contributor
May 27, 2021
2,230
7,021
I love Apple, and I would say they are the only brand really in my life technology wise that I am loyal too. When I read things like this it makes my stomach turn a little bit when I think about the image they try to project onto the public. They do some really shady things (The China AirDrop situation really bothered me). It is disheartening to read...
 
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monster620ie

macrumors regular
Jul 19, 2004
131
145
you think Apple is not coercing it's employees? Then you must be living in a pretend world.
It is because of unions that you got some of the rights many employees take forgranted today.
 

Zab the Fab

macrumors regular
Nov 26, 2003
145
121
My guess is that any coercion they claim happened was actually just mandatory meetings where they talked about the benefits and other 'pros' from being employed with Apple today. I went through this with a previous employer. They were allowed to tell us their opinions. And the union was allowed to tell us theirs. But it isnt like the company has to keep their mouths shut. They can tell their side as well.......

Unions are only valuable to bad employees and the union bosses. All others benefit more without them involved. Thank goodness I live in a right to work state which means I can not be forced to join a union as can happen today in non-right to work states. Either join the union or you find another line of work. THAT sounds fair and beneficial???
"Unions are only valuable to bad employees and the union bosses", you got that right. It's a workers mafia terrorising business owners with coercion and force. Karl Marx knew what he was doing when he invented it as part of the Communist manifesto, along with Central Banking and other things. Destroy the economy as much as possible, undermine the free market, so eventually there will be a workers revolution and Communism can be installed.

Didn't quite go as planned though ....yet.
 

VulchR

macrumors 68040
Jun 8, 2009
3,393
14,269
Scotland
...
Apple doesn’t make a trillion dollars and the money they do earn isn’t theirs to give away to employees. It belongs to millions of shareholders, and employees can own a piece of the company if they so desire.
After initial offerings, shareholders who subsequently buy stock are wholly irrelevant to progressing the work of a company. The company gets money directly when first selling shares, but, after that, the company no longer benefits from what amounts to legalised gambling on its shares. Moreover, arguably manoeuvres meant to mollify stockholders, like stock buy-backs, starve companies of investment. So, explain to me why such shareholders' interests should take precedence over the workers responsible for the productivity of the company? The 'fiduciary responsibility to stockholders' that people keep citing is actually an urban myth not enshrined in law.

Anyway, I find it paradoxical that right-wing people in the US glorify the past (MAGA for example), when unions were far, far stronger than they are today. And most people commenting here against unions seem to have never belonged to one. Besides, if Apple broke the law, there should be consequences
 
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SnappleRumors

Suspended
Aug 22, 2022
394
515
Apple doesn’t make a trillion dollars and the money they do earn isn’t theirs to give away to employees. It belongs to millions of shareholders, and employees can own a piece of the company if they so desire.

I hold a very unpopular opinion about fiduciary responsibility. I feel a company should have a fiduciary duty balanced between both the stockholders and employees.
 
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PlayUltimate

macrumors 6502a
Jul 29, 2016
927
1,704
Boulder, CO
The 'fiduciary responsibility to stockholders' that people keep citing is actually an urban myth not enshrined in law.
Not completely urban myth. There are lots of large stock holders that do have say on the Board et al. Apple is owned by someone(s). And those someone(s), depending on how many shares are owned, do have some say.
And since Apple pays a dividend, ownership of the stock does convey a level of benefit in line with Apple's profitability.
 

NY Guitarist

macrumors 68000
Mar 21, 2011
1,585
1,581
When it comes to workers seeking representation the opposition's authoritarian-apologist propaganda is strong on MR.
 
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VulchR

macrumors 68040
Jun 8, 2009
3,393
14,269
Scotland
Not completely urban myth. There are lots of large stock holders that do have say on the Board et al. Apple is owned by someone(s). And those someone(s), depending on how many shares are owned, do have some say.
And since Apple pays a dividend, ownership of the stock does convey a level of benefit in line with Apple's profitability.
Sure, but there is no law that says Apple must prioritise stockholders over employees (or customers). This is about power, not law, which is why unions are necessary IMO. Any company that breaks union-busting laws should get heavily penalised. If Apple did break the law, I hope the company gets the book thrown against them so that maybe the people who made the decisions get fired.
 
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