Apple Launches Employee Program for COVID-19 Vaccinations

[DanTSX]

There's a lot to unpack here, but it is Saturday and I have other plans, so quikly: Your fact-check only talks about one specific study, but here are some studies that show it definitely happened:

SARS vaccine linked to liver damage in ferret study

www.cidrap.umn.edu

A perspective on potential antibody-dependent enhancement of SARS-CoV-2 - Nature

The antibody-dependent enhancement of disease is reviewed, with an emphasis on implications for the prevention and treatment of SARS-CoV-2 infection.

www.nature.com

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3335060/?fbclid=IwAR3MwuDPVSxxNGjaCafSZAQQ0eHLj-bT258y7oJLJn54J8EBQ3egCHsuds0

Which brings me to another point that worries me greatly: big tech and corporate media censorship and narratives. When you google this stuff, you won't find it in the search results until page 20 or something, with the first pages all 'debunking' stuff. this is relevant scientific and medical info, I can only guess as to why it's being buried. I have a pretty good idea, but that's all conjecture and this is not the place to discuss that.

About mRNA not being a vaccine, here is a presentation by the Chief Medical Officer of Moderna: https://www.ted.com/talks/tal_zaks_the_disease_eradicating_potential_of_gene_editing

This is not a vaccine in the traditional sense of the word. Vaccines and mRNA are both being injected into the body, but that's all they have in common.

As for your assertion that taking the vaccine is less risky than the virus, I say: we don't know. There is NO long-term data on efficacy and side-effects for the vaccine, and what about people that had covid and got better? They have the antibodies, do they need the vaccine too?

And finally, while I agree with the "greater good" in principle, we live in a democratic society, and I think something of this magnitude should be decided by the people. Last I heard about 38.5% of the US population has been vaccinated, and they're having trouble getting others to take it. It's too soon to tell, but if that implies that without coercion 6 out of 10 people do not want the vaccine, I think it is unconscionable to impose the will of the minority on the majority.

Before I sign off, I'd like to leave you with this video about virtue:

I love it when science disproves science.

 

[Whathappened]

Surprised it’s voluntary.

EDIT: FYI - I don't want it.

Wondering why so many people that “don’t want it” cannot simply stay away from it without letting everyone know.

 

[9927036]

Semantics, still approved for use by the FDA and CDC. Because of science, not what they heard from a blogger on the internet.

You are blogger on the Internet and you are wrong! CDC does not regulate vaccines or any other drug. This is a pretty basic error.

 

[supercoolmanchu]

Agree completely. I'm particularly troubled by people who cite statistics about the relatively lower likelihood of significant short term symptoms or death in younger populations as reasons why universal vaccination isn't needed, not to mention nonsensical statements about gene therapy and other supposed vaccine risks.

To those who counter that they have a right not to be vaccinated, I say fine, but that choice doesn't extend to putting others at risk. There are indeed some individuals, albeit very few, who have legitimate medical reasons to not be vaccinated. But if enough people in a population have immunity from vaccination or infection, transmission eventually will not be a concern as long as vigilance is maintained.

I sometimes wonder how anti-vaxxers deal with other therapies for illness, whether it's antibiotics for bacterial infection, chemotherapy for malignancy, or any one of millions of pharmaceutical and other treatments. I encourage patients to do some research on their own, ask questions, and seek second opinions if needed. But never in my career have I seen anything like the response to COVID-19 and vaccines for it, largely fueled by disinformation and willful ignorance.

It’s always highly amusing to see humans locked into this false dichotomy over some imagined pro-vaccine vs anti-vaccine camps.

Did it ever occur to these glued into intellectual paralysis that one can be for example pro-automobile, but really not into old junkers or crappy models?

You can love Mexican food, but totally be anti-that-one-gross-burrito-stand-at-the-shopping-mall.

Who wants a crappy vaccine? Who wants a car that sucks or breaks down? Who wants that burrito that always gives you diarrhea? “Hey Jim, you don’t want to eat at El Cheapos? Then you are either suffering from diarrhea hesitancy, or just be one of those anti-burrito types.”

Who is this person who believes that all vaccine products are good? That standard doesn’t apply to anything else on your planet.

You know what we call the belief that all vaccine products are magically great... superstition. Which is exactly the thing many humans turn to with religious fervor in any panic. Step two is divide and persecute the faithful from the unfaithful. Funny stuff!

The real comedy gold in all this is the stunning lack of any intellectual curiosity by most locked into fear and hysteria over a virus. They recycle a few topical canards gleamed from media and political (mostly lawyers) sources, but haven’t bothered to dig any deeper into the field of study of microbiology?

A lot of people would probably love a new car, but how about when you’re pre-paying for one that didn’t work last year, with just a new shiny sticker on it?
Rejecting that old clunker would make you anti-automobile?

What? You don’t want this awful tasting burrito made from substandard ingredients, stored next to the
mall floor and bathroom cleaning products? That makes you anti-Mexican food?

Humans are predisposed to superstition, your entire history shows this. The smarter among you will admit that you’re barely at the “the fireball in the sky must be Zeus’ rath” stage of microbiology. “But but but... we might have seen a goblin... and we gave it a technical name... run and hide!” Terrible at science, but gotta give it humans, they do slapstick comedy better than most species. Lololol

Accuracy rates on the scopes, conducting the research at this scale? Nobody asks? A year around your sun while cowering in your caves... and nobody bothers to even question the base microbioligcal capabilities in the field? Lol.

Political clown parades... yes.

Any kind of intellectual curiosity beyond popular viral fear porn... no.

Back to clubbing each other over superstitious level “beliefs” spoon fed by your medical “priests”... YES!

Lolololol. Too funny.

 

[kildraik]

Always amazing to see the push for a yet-to-be-approved vaccine that may or may not protect you from contracting or transmitting a disease, that may may or may not cause infertility in women, that may or may not need more than three doses, that may or may not be safe, and that may or may not cause other disease, for a virus who’s testing may or may not be accurate, where a person has a 99.996% chance of survival if contracted, and if they do, carries antibodies for a still unknown period of time, to which most still have them after over a year.

SCIENCE!

 

[supercoolmanchu]

Always amazing to see the push for a yet-to-be-approved vaccine that may or may not protect you from contracting or transmitting a disease, that may may or may not cause infertility in women, that may or may not need more than three doses, that may or may not be safe, and that may or may not cause other disease, for a virus who’s testing may or may not be accurate, where a person has a 99.996% chance of survival if contracted, and if they do, carries antibodies for a still unknown period of time, to which most still have them after over a year.

SCIENCE!

Woooo! Funny funny! Always love the antics at the human zoo!

 

[blackcrayon]

Always amazing to see the push for a yet-to-be-approved vaccine that may or may not protect you from contracting or transmitting a disease, that may may or may not cause infertility in women, that may or may not need more than three doses, that may or may not be safe, and that may or may not cause other disease, for a virus who’s testing may or may not be accurate, where a person has a 99.996% chance of survival if contracted, and if they do, carries antibodies for a still unknown period of time, to which most still have them after over a year.

SCIENCE!

Literally every vaccine, or medicine in general, is a "may or may not" deal. Ibuprofen may or may not relieve your knee pain. It also may or may not kill you. At least be more complete and compare potential vaccine harm to potential harm from the virus (death isn't the only possible way it can harm you).

 

[EricNau]

There's a lot to unpack here, but it is Saturday and I have other plans, so quickly: Your fact-check only talks about one specific study, but here are some studies that show it definitely happened:

SARS vaccine linked to liver damage in ferret study

www.cidrap.umn.edu

A perspective on potential antibody-dependent enhancement of SARS-CoV-2 - Nature

The antibody-dependent enhancement of disease is reviewed, with an emphasis on implications for the prevention and treatment of SARS-CoV-2 infection.

www.nature.com

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3335060/?fbclid=IwAR3MwuDPVSxxNGjaCafSZAQQ0eHLj-bT258y7oJLJn54J8EBQ3egCHsuds0

Which brings me to another point that worries me greatly: big tech and corporate media censorship and narratives. When you google this stuff, you won't find it in the search results until page 20 or something, with the first pages all 'debunking' stuff. this is relevant scientific and medical info, I can only guess as to why it's being buried. I have a pretty good idea, but that's all conjecture and this is not the place to discuss that.

About mRNA not being a vaccine, here is a presentation by the Chief Medical Officer of Moderna: https://www.ted.com/talks/tal_zaks_the_disease_eradicating_potential_of_gene_editing

This is not a vaccine in the traditional sense of the word. Vaccines and mRNA are both being injected into the body, but that's all they have in common.

It's Saturday for me too, so I'll do my best to reply in kind so we can both get on with our weekends.

I'm not going to claim to be an expert; I'm certainly not qualified to speak to these articles. And I'm happy to listen to what the experts in the medical field are saying, and the overwhelming majority claim these vaccines are safe (and necessary to put this pandemic behind us!), and they were happy to be first in line to be vaccinated. I'm not going to pretend to know more than they do—they've devoted their lives to the endeavor of making us safer.

However, I did notice that two of the articles were nearly a decade and two decades old, which is a lifetime in medical research. (Which might also be why they aren't at the top of your Google searches—no mass conspiracy needed.) And weren't addressing mRNA vaccines specifically, either. Which is all to say, it's not nearly as convincing as the evidence coming out in favor of these vaccines, and also seems a lot more tame than the Facebook articles suggest, I might add.

As for your assertion that taking the vaccine is less risky than the virus, I say: we don't know. There is NO long-term data on efficacy and side-effects for the vaccine, and what about people that had covid and got better? They have the antibodies, do they need the vaccine too?

I will simply say again: it is not rational to be afraid of the long term effects of the vaccine (of which there is no indication that any will materialize), and NOT be more afraid of the long-term effects of contracting covid (of which there is PLENTY of evidence of long term effects, including some that appear permanent—even for those that were "fine.")

And finally, while I agree with the "greater good" in principle, we live in a democratic society, and I think something of this magnitude should be decided by the people. Last I heard about 38.5% of the US population has been vaccinated, and they're having trouble getting others to take it. It's too soon to tell, but if that implies that without coercion 6 out of 10 people do not want the vaccine, I think it is unconscionable to impose the will of the minority on the majority.

I think this is over simplified. In most parts of the country we haven't yet reached a point where we're having trouble getting others to take it. There are many reasons why someone might not be vaccinated yet, and access / convenience is still the driving factor.

This Bloomberg article says vaccine hesitancy is closer to 1 in 7.

FWIW, I'm not anti-vaccine. I've been vaccinated to the hilt for all kinds of stuff, but I think people are right to have concerns about vaccines that were put to market this quickly, with its makers exempt from any liability. Especially for a disease from which the majority of healthy people seem to recover just fine.

Before I sign off, I'd like to leave you with this video about virtue:

"The majority of healthy people seem to recover just fine" is a shockingly low bar. Shouldn't people with pre-existing conditions be able to go to the movies without contracting covid and dying? Are we saying it's ok if 49% of healthy people don't recover just fine? How bad does a disease have to be before vaccines are warranted?

I'm being a little facetious because I'm sure that's not what you meant. But I want to stress that herd immunity is the only way society can attempt to return to normal. And vaccine hesitancy puts us all at risk—which is why society has the right to limit the ways vaccine-refusers are able to participate in our society.

There's a reason why the WHO considers vaccine hesitancy to be one of the top 10 threats to world health.

 

[Macbookprodude]

I’m really surprised by how many are pushing for an unapproved vaccine.

I am surprised that the truth is not known about this virus - a vaccine with a virus that has 99.9 percent recovery rate ? I think all this is a way to oppress people.

 

[norbinhouston]

You are blogger on the Internet and you are wrong! CDC does not regulate vaccines or any other drug. This is a pretty basic error.

The FDA and the CDC would prevent the use of the vaccine if it wasn't effective or dangerous. Like the crack pot suggestions of the previous president.

 

[zooby]

So sad to see that this needs to be in the political section on MR. That being said, I’m glad that it’s not mandatory. Things like this should be voluntary. (If you believe in it, then get it by all means. But if you don’t believe in it, then you shouldn’t be forced to get it to be employed).

Don't get it, but you can at least wear a mask if you refuse to get the vaccine...

Oh, but the mask is an issue too to those same people who refuse it

 

[hagar]

So much ignorance and misinformation in this thread. Ofcourse US states can legally enforce people to be vaccinated. Similar to how all states mandate immunizations for children in order to enroll in public school. But they don’t because enforcing something should be a last resort.

Meanwhile, stop complaining and inventing conspiracy theories and be glad we have these vaccins that will allow us to get past this pandemic.

 

[JoeG4]

I see MacRumors is still letting the same ~3-4 people dominate every thread that has a remotely political tone to it and control the conversation lol. Might as well make them mods.

 

[Macbookprodude]

I am surprised that the truth is not known about this virus - a vaccine with a virus that has 99.9 percent recovery rate ? I think all this is a way to oppress people.

Spoken like a true Communist. Sorry, I did not mean this to be political but you sound like one of them. Anyone can see this is being used as oppression. Yes, I am an america first supporter and support a Free USA, and not the Union of American Socialist States where communist marxist tyranny is being used to oppress the people with this stupid mask wearing thing. Any true person who knows about COVID19 should know MASKS DON'T PROTECT AGAINST JACK !

 

[Macbookprodude]

I am surprised that the truth is not known about this virus - a vaccine with a virus that has 99.9 percent recovery rate ? I think all this is a way to oppress people.

The true plan they use to destroy america:

 

[Macbookprodude]

Since this is in the political section of MR, I want to make it clear. Having come from a true Communist nation called the Soviet Union many years ago, the very nation that the USA wanted to destroy is now becoming one. Its evident that Biden is a stupid fool, an illegitimate president who stole the election from our President Donald John Trump who wanted to bring an end to this covid mess. I am not going to call it the ch*** virus, because that would be racist and I am not racist, just a patriot who supports the Constitution of this great nation - nonetheless, still a nation that needs to stop socialism and communism by ending mask mandates for a virus which is being taken too far. I have plenty of evidence of this. I know what tyranny is, but you all don't and you take your freedoms for granted.. As a Ukrainian who lives in the USA I know that this nation is under attack from the Marxist-Leninist Communist Party left which used to be the Democratic Party who are ADVANCING these stupid mask mandates... I don't wear a mask and as such will fight to end mask mandates in the state I live. I am endorsing republicans in MD to stop mask mandating.

This is no longer considered a pandemic, but rather its a way to oppress and use TOTALITARIAN COMMUNISM to enslave the people. Nothing racist about it. But then again, its RULES FOR me, but not for thee. Sad, that people don't see the lies of BLM and ANTIFA - the true enemies of the nation.

 

[supercoolmanchu]

Don't get it, but you can at least wear a mask if you refuse to get the vaccine...

Oh, but the mask is an issue too to those same people who refuse it

“Just wear a mask. What type, what grade material, what thickness fabric of paper doesn’t matter”

Wow, thank you for this detailed life saving advice!

If anything ever sounded like sound science and totally not a useless ritual, this is it, right?

Your lives are “literally in danger” being exposed to tiny particles, but the details don’t matter at all, like the effectiveness of any material or thickness or how long they can be worn before the material is moistened enough to render it useless (hours? minutes? seconds?).

Not even the slightest concern with any important details that might actually matter, because just stick to the approved behavior and the evil microbes will say, “Gosh darn it, there’s an upstanding moral individual signaling his part and genuflecting respectfully with his behavioral totem, science be damned, I can never defeat such a holy divine blessing. I am foiled, live He shall!”

It’s not like the CDC, past research into the ineffectiveness toward much larger bacterial microbes, and the manufacturers’ own disclaimers on the packaging warning that they won’t protect you... just do it!

And above all, it shows people like me and zooby, that you really care in your heart, which is all we really need and not scientific or medically sound or any kind of realistic micro biotic particle physics specifics.

Isn’t love all that really matters anyways?

Some other top quality emergency health advice:

-In the event of your airplane’s water landing, swim.

-Avoid falling and stuff.

-When attacked by bees, try as much as possible to not get stung.

These tips, when combined, shall save your life one day. Details don’t matter at all, because you will be armed with these generalized sayings that are the only things that matter in any emergency.

And you know what... Damn, I feel so good about myself now too. Just saying some stuff, now I can say I’m helping others, and activate my super invisi-moral superiority field when pointing fingers at others I don’t like. Also finally I can cheese win arguments against better informed level bosses with my new “I care so very much for everyone and you don’t” unlocked skin.

That’s the power of love.

 

[Macbookprodude]

Dude, CDC doesn't care about you, me, or anyone.. they just are advancing their communist-tyrannical repression by making this pandemic apart of the New World Order. Sorry, but also CDC is wrong - wearing masks does not stop covid 19. Covid19 itself is like all other viruses and flu - JUST LOOK AT GOV WHITMORE and what that communist whore is doing to her state ??? Even Desantis in FL sees the true reality of this oppression. Thats why FL is alot more free than rest of the USA. Sadly, i LIVE in the People's Republic of Maryland and the governor here is a communist, tyrant and also getting paid for lying to people in this state.

 

[Td1970]

Unless something has changed in the last 5 plus years, a hospital employee is encouraged to get the flu vaccine but not forced.

I have no choice. I must get it for I will be let go. They only exception is a true medical reason

 

[Td1970]

VAERS is under reported.​

 

[Frantisekj]

Even IF you believe that (which goes against the vast preponderance of evidence and consensus of the scientific community), I don’t know why you WOULDN’T want to be vaccinated against a deadly virus, regardless of its origins.

If an adversary were to release a mutated version of Smallpox as a weapon against your country, and your country was lucky enough to create a vaccine, why wouldn’t you want it?

The Covid vaccines available today are extremely safe and we’re fortunate that they are very effective—against a disease that’s killed millions worldwide, including many who didn’t have “weak immunity” as you say.

I do not wanna start any flame here. Anyone feeling there is deadly virus that can take down human with healthy immunity can run for jab.
Those who thinks that it can only people with weak immunity or severe ill are working on their immunity and trust. Stress, fear and lack of oxygen will kill your immunity more then anything else.
Of course, in case some real sh.... here I would evaluate jab as well.
If anyone thing there is any consensus it is right, probably listen just to one side. Hope there will be consensus soon that Fauci financing Wuhan lab is completely wrong.

 

[Frantisekj]

WWDC = We Will Destroy Covid

I would say competition

 

[I7guy]

I am surprised that the truth is not known about this virus - a vaccine with a virus that has 99.9 percent recovery rate ? I think all this is a way to oppress people.

We don’t know if the 99.9% recovers as if recovery was from a common cold or if they lived but wound up (or will wind up) with long term health affects.

 

[incoherent_1]

This thread and others like it are an interesting test of MR to see the extent to which they’ll allow pseudo-science and — in some cases — downright treasonous views to be sprayed around on their site.

I’m thinking it may be time for me to find a new place to discuss tech, although sadly few places want to do that without opening a door to insanity.

 

[Macbookprodude]

This thread and others like it are an interesting test of MR to see the extent to which they’ll allow pseudo-science and — in some cases — downright treasonous views to be sprayed around on their site.

I’m thinking it may be time for me to find a new place to discuss tech, although sadly few places want to do that without opening a door to insanity.

Want to talk tech ? Pass 232.. to limit tech giants from censoring. I agree, a new place is needed to discuss tech in general.