Apple Must Let Dating Apps Offer Alternative Payment Methods in App Store, Dutch Regulator Says

[SFjohn]

It isn’t, member states can’t break EU privacy laws and citizens can take their state to the EU Human rights court . EU doesn’t have a legal authority or ability to monitor citizens private data.

Still your comment doesn’t address the need to keep the US governments nose away from where it doesn’t belong.

You insist that the EU doesn’t monitor because it’s against the law. It remains against the law in the US, but that doesn’t stop them. There are other countries outside the EU that want your private data and they don’t care about the EU laws. They will happily piggy back on all these side loaded apps the EU finds necessary to get that data. Russia, China, USA, some terrorist group in the Middle East working in or outside the EU. If you think laws and legal processes protect you and your privacy 100% you’re mistaken, and likely deluding yourself.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

You insist that the EU doesn’t monitor because it’s against the law. It remains against the law in the US, but that doesn’t stop them. There are other countries outside the EU that want your private data and they don’t care about the EU laws. They will happily piggy back on all these side loaded apps the EU finds necessary to get that data. Russia, China, USA, some terrorist group in the Middle East working in or outside the EU. If you think laws and legal processes protect you and your privacy 100% you’re mistaken, and likely deluding yourself.

I insist because EU doesn’t have a federal organization that can do this monitoring you talk about.

USA just have very weak laws with security. In EU every state have supreme authority over their citizens information and would not take kindly to illegal espionage by EU. Just as EU did not take kindly to US espionage.

Laws are what we have to prosecute those who breaks the law. Apps are the dumbest way to try and spy on users compared to normal social engineering or compromised websites.

Side loading won’t change this as Pegasus have shown.

European Parliament opens spyware investigation as hacks revealed

In Spain, at least 65 people, including four Catalan MEPs, are said to have been spied on between 2017 and 2020. #EuropeNews

www.euronews.com

 

[SFjohn]

I insist because EU doesn’t have a federal organization that can do this monitoring you talk about.

USA just have very weak laws with security. In EU every state have supreme authority over their citizens information and would not take kindly to illegal espionage by EU. Just as EU did not take kindly to US espionage.

Laws are what we have to prosecute those who breaks the law. Apps are the dumbest way to try and spy on users compared to normal social engineering or compromised websites.

Side loading won’t change this as Pegasus have shown.

European Parliament opens spyware investigation as hacks revealed

In Spain, at least 65 people, including four Catalan MEPs, are said to have been spied on between 2017 and 2020. #EuropeNews

www.euronews.com

A federal government isn’t required. You all ready have issues. Pegasus is OLD news. There is much more sophisticated stuff out there. As you’ve mentioned social engineering, compromised websites, corrupt politicians are bad. Cracking open Apple devices will have the opposite effect from what these EU lawmakers say. The EU is weak, it’s lawmakers are focused on Apple while the EU can’t get off of Russian fossil fuels, and looses a country on a whim. There are really wonderful things about the EU. This rule-making for Apple devices isn’t one of them.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

A federal government isn’t required. You all ready have issues. Pegasus is OLD news. There is much more sophisticated stuff out there. As you’ve mentioned social engineering, compromised websites, corrupt politicians are bad. Cracking open Apple devices will have the opposite effect from what these EU lawmakers say. The EU is weak, it’s lawmakers are focused on Apple while the EU can’t get off of Russian fossil fuels, and looses a country on a whim. There are really wonderful things about the EU. This rule-making for Apple devices isn’t one of them.

I didn’t say federal government. You have the FBI and CIA as federal agencies to abuse you against the will of the state. We have Interpol who can only act according to member states will.

Russian gas is a German problem. And a member state leaving is a democratic legitimacy. And largely seen as good that Uk left, as they shared little to no values or goals of the other EU members, and just acted as a breaking pad.

And lawmakers aren’t concentrating on apple but the market itself. And you don’t seem to know what the regulators want to do. A healthy market is different from a secure one. Perhaps you should listen to your founding fathers more.

 

[SFjohn]

I didn’t say federal government. You have the FBI and CIA as federal agencies to abuse you against the will of the state. We have Interpol who can only act according to member states will.

Russian gas is a German problem. And a member state leaving is a democratic legitimacy. And largely seen as good that Uk left, as they shared little to no values or goals of the other EU members, and just acted as a breaking pad.

And lawmakers aren’t concentrating on apple but the market itself. And you don’t seem to know what the regulators want to do. A healthy market is different from a secure one. Perhaps you should listen to your founding fathers more.
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It’s way more than Germany. May you have a happy life in your simpleton EU utopia. I’m done with you.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

It’s way more than Germany. May you have a happy life in your simpleton EU utopia. I’m done with you.

And you in the American hellscape. Indeed it’s anEU problem as we have a common energy market explosively made worse by German dependency on Russian gas

 

[gregohb]

Well, personally, I always think on a date the dude should pay. But I don’t know if this counts as an alternate method?

You never heard of "going Dutch"?

 

[gregohb]

There would likely be less pressure for this if Apple’s commission were less.

I think Apple is a little too self serving in claiming that they are magnanimously giving so much to the app developers. Yes, without Apple the developers would not have a marketplace but without the app developers, the app store would be a failure. It should be more of a partnership with Apple recognizing the contributions of the app developers, too.

Apple sometimes acts like a struggling little company who needs every scrap of revenue they can get. They would have a lot less of problems like this if they were a little more magnanimous. Otherwise these kinds of things will just keep building and spreading and Apple will be forced to do a complex patchwork of solutions and still will not resolve the tensions.

Apple offers four things "for free" to these companies.
1. The Xcode/swift compiler and developer environment
2. The App Store - so developers do not need to advertise to be found
3. The payment system - developers don't need to take credit card payments or deal with collections
4. an implicit guarantee that their app is verified and bonafide by being checked by apple

 

[Tagbert]

Apple offers four things "for free" to these companies.
1. The Xcode/swift compiler and developer environment
2. The App Store - so developers do not need to advertise to be found
3. The payment system - developers don't need to take credit card payments or deal with collections
4. an implicit guarantee that their app is verified and bonafide by being checked by apple

Yes, though developers do pay $99 per year for part of that. Publishers definitely still need to advertise as it is hard to be noticed in the App Store. Not every publisher wants to use Apple's payment system. Apple's 30% fee is more than the profit margin of many apps. Apple does not do all of that out of charity. Apple benefits greatly from the efforts of all those developers.

The developers provide Apple with a wide variety of apps that make Apple's devices more valuable to their customers. Without the apps provided by those developers customers would find Apple devices much less fun and useful. Microsoft found that out when they tried to get phone makers and customers on board with their Windows Phone devices. The devices were good and the OS was competitive but there were almost no apps and Microsoft was never able to get enough developers to build apps and the platform failed.

This should be a partnership, but Apple often seems like they see the developers as parasites that must be tolerated and while Apple tries to extract as much wealth as they can from those apps.

 

[Michael Scrip]

This should be a partnership, but Apple often seems like they see the developers as parasites that must be tolerated and while Apple tries to extract as much wealth as they can from those apps.

It's already a partnership where developer get to keep 70% or 85% of every sale. It favors the developer.

But I guess that's not enough then? So what should the number be?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[I7guy]

It's already a partnership where developer get to keep 70% or 85% of every sale. It favors the developer.

But I guess that's not enough then? So what should the number be?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

100%? Because apple is entitled to exactly 0%?

 

[Michael Scrip]

100%? Because apple is entitled to exactly 0%?

Ok... we have 100%

Are there any other suggestions?

 

[mrochester]

100%? Because apple is entitled to exactly 0%?

That doesn’t sound like a partnership!

 

[Sophisticatednut]

It's already a partnership where developer get to keep 70% or 85% of every sale. It favors the developer.

But I guess that's not enough then? So what should the number be?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

A partnership needs mutual respect. Currently apple makes all the demands and developers only obey. Dissent is seen as greed or parasitical behavior. There’s zero respect and a one sided partnership.

 

[I7guy]

A partnership needs mutual respect. Currently apple makes all the demands and developers only obey. Dissent is seen as greed or parasitical behavior. There’s zero respect and a one sided partnership.

If one as a dev doesn’t like the t&c good thing there are a multiple of ways to make your living.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

If one as a dev doesn’t like the t&c good thing there are a multiple of ways to make your living.

I guess a strong union of developers can then gain an advantage to force apple to change or negotiate a better terms

 

[I7guy]

I guess a strong union of developers can then gain an advantage to force apple to change or negotiate a better terms

Sure, that’s one way to go about it. When you enter someone’s house you have to play by their legal rules.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Sure, that’s one way to go about it. When you enter someone’s house you have to play by their legal rules.

You should always be able to negotiate the rules. Or do you think unions shouldn’t have a say in how a business is run?

 

[mrochester]

You should always be able to negotiate the rules. Or do you think unions shouldn’t have a say in how a business is run?

I don’t think a union would help here. App developers are all businesses in their own right and are not employees of Apple. Their recourse to effect change is to not do business with Apple the same way any contractor is free to do or not do business with someone.

 

[I7guy]

You should always be able to negotiate the rules. Or do you think unions shouldn’t have a say in how a business is run?

Sure. I believe the top customers get to negotiate some rules.

Do you get to negotiate your own TOS on MacRumors? If you believe you can, see if you can dodge the bullet with trolling and insults.