Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Are you going to upgrade to V2?

  • Yes

    Votes: 18 50.0%
  • No

    Votes: 6 16.7%
  • Not decided yet

    Votes: 12 33.3%

  • Total voters
    36

Herbert123

macrumors regular
Mar 19, 2009
227
241
Can it do video painting or 4K animations with any length timeline?

I was thinking of buying TV Paint but it's very expensive and no Apple Silicon version yet I don't think.
An open source & free excellent alternative to TVPaint would be OpenToonz. Video can be imported in one layer and painting (rotoscoping) in another layer (either vector or bitmap). Excellent onion skinning is of course also featured.

A Silicon version doesn't exist (yet?), but it comes as a universal binary.

Perhaps not immediately apparent, but Blender also allows for rotoscoping video and drawing over the video frames using Grease Pencil.

And don't forget Clip Studio Paint EX, which also imports video and allows for rotoscoping. And is much nicer to paint and draw in than TVPaint (in my opinion). Not free, though. But worth it. Is Silicon ready, as far as I am aware.
(Do not get the Pro version which is only capable of animating 24 frames.)
 
  • Like
Reactions: enterthemerdaverse

enterthemerdaverse

macrumors 6502
Nov 14, 2022
409
796
Warsaw
An open source & free excellent alternative to TVPaint would be OpenToonz. Video can be imported in one layer and painting (rotoscoping) in another layer (either vector or bitmap). Excellent onion skinning is of course also featured.

A Silicon version doesn't exist (yet?), but it comes as a universal binary.

Perhaps not immediately apparent, but Blender also allows for rotoscoping video and drawing over the video frames using Grease Pencil.

And don't forget Clip Studio Paint EX, which also imports video and allows for rotoscoping. And is much nicer to paint and draw in than TVPaint (in my opinion). Not free, though. But worth it. Is Silicon ready, as far as I am aware.
(Do not get the Pro version which is only capable of animating 24 frames.)

I know all these. The problem with Toonz is it has a very outdated cross platform interface. Just wish we could have something just as capable as TV Paint and OpenToonz but with a native macOS interface. I played with ToonBoom a few times but I prefer the potential of the others.
 

Herbert123

macrumors regular
Mar 19, 2009
227
241
@enterthemerdaverse The GUI itself or the usability thereof isn't an issue with OpenToonz in my opinion: the animation timeline is very intuitive and simple/effective to animate with.

The GUI is also quite configurable and works great on multiple screens unlike 'modern' GUIs of a lot of current software that is doing the rounds in which it is not even possible to reposition the tool and property panels anymore.

It may look snazzy, but trades usability and flexibility in configuration for GUI eye candy. I blame the influence of iOS and mobile platform GUI rigidness.

I feel too many users often allow themselves to be distracted by the varnish and gloss of a GUI. It is well established from UX research that the identical GUI presented as two different versions (one with a nice varnished look and the other identical but without the eye candy) have absolutely no impact on the usability and effectiveness of a GUI - even though users may convince themselves that the nicer looking GUI works better.

Anyway: I agree it would be nice to have a more Mac-like basic look. But not when it is detrimental to usability. A good example is Affinity 2, which introduced a number of very questionable GUI design decisions in that version. With Affinity I wonder sometimes if the development team includes a GUI/UX designer at all (I do not think there is one).

The real issue with OpenToonz (and many other open source apps) is that it relies on OpenGL for its view rendering, and since Apple decided to depreciate that API form its OS it may become problematic in the near future for it to run on the MacOS platform.
 

enterthemerdaverse

macrumors 6502
Nov 14, 2022
409
796
Warsaw
@enterthemerdaverse The GUI itself or the usability thereof isn't an issue with OpenToonz in my opinion: the animation timeline is very intuitive and simple/effective to animate with.

The GUI is also quite configurable and works great on multiple screens unlike 'modern' GUIs of a lot of current software that is doing the rounds in which it is not even possible to reposition the tool and property panels anymore.

It may look snazzy, but trades usability and flexibility in configuration for GUI eye candy. I blame the influence of iOS and mobile platform GUI rigidness.

I feel too many users often allow themselves to be distracted by the varnish and gloss of a GUI. It is well established from UX research that the identical GUI presented as two different versions (one with a nice varnished look and the other identical but without the eye candy) have absolutely no impact on the usability and effectiveness of a GUI - even though users may convince themselves that the nicer looking GUI works better.

Anyway: I agree it would be nice to have a more Mac-like basic look. But not when it is detrimental to usability. A good example is Affinity 2, which introduced a number of very questionable GUI design decisions in that version. With Affinity I wonder sometimes if the development team includes a GUI/UX designer at all (I do not think there is one).

The real issue with OpenToonz (and many other open source apps) is that it relies on OpenGL for its view rendering, and since Apple decided to depreciate that API form its OS it may become problematic in the near future for it to run on the MacOS platform.

That's the problem I have and you saying it more detailed terms. If they updated it to a modern native Mac app then naturally they would also use Metal. I just don't see it happening any time soon so I worry the app would break in some future macOS.
 

Herbert123

macrumors regular
Mar 19, 2009
227
241
I worry the app would break in some future macOS.
This actually is the case with the excellent free (and open source) Storyboarder (a wonderful storyboarding app with a shot generator that utilizes 3d characters to quickly work out shots).

I last checked on our Mac Studios at work, and the shot generator just won't work. It crashes or comes up empty. All because of OpenGL issues.

A real shame. Also the reason why I have a Windows workstation at home, because Macs are a bit too volatile for my taste for 3d work and animation. It will take a few years yet to fix all the software issues caused by the move to Silicon (as it did before when Apple transitioned from 68xxx to Arm, and after that to Intel.

(say what you want about Windows: I can still run software from almost three decades ago... Which does come in handy at times)
 

JaredJenkinsDesign

macrumors member
Jul 19, 2022
96
78
I'm thinking about moving to the entire suite once my Adobe CC annual subscription ends. I was impressed with how fast V1 was awhile back although the lack of features like Smart Objects was a bit of a disappointment (not sure if that has changed).

I think ideally I would have the suite replace Photoshop/Illustrator/InDesign for my home and freelancing needs. I'm kinda stuck with buying just a monthly subscription with After Effects which is a bummer but it at least saves me some money from buying the entire suite again.
 

dpny

macrumors 6502
Jan 5, 2013
268
105
I'm thinking about moving to the entire suite once my Adobe CC annual subscription ends. I was impressed with how fast V1 was awhile back although the lack of features like Smart Objects was a bit of a disappointment (not sure if that has changed).

I think ideally I would have the suite replace Photoshop/Illustrator/InDesign for my home and freelancing needs. I'm kinda stuck with buying just a monthly subscription with After Effects which is a bummer but it at least saves me some money from buying the entire suite again.
I wouldn't replace it for your freelancing needs if your clients expect the get ID, AI, and PS files from you.
 

JaredJenkinsDesign

macrumors member
Jul 19, 2022
96
78
I wouldn't replace it for your freelancing needs if your clients expect the get ID, AI, and PS files from you.
Yeah that does concern me a bit even though I've only had a few request the working files from me. I can probably get away with EPS for AI files and I think Affinity Photo can export PSDs (correct me if I'm wrong) but InDesign could be problematic.
 

dpny

macrumors 6502
Jan 5, 2013
268
105
Yeah that does concern me a bit even though I've only had a few request the working files from me. I can probably get away with EPS for AI files and I think Affinity Photo can export PSDs (correct me if I'm wrong) but InDesign could be problematic.
Affinity Photo can export PSDs, but I've never actually checked to see if they present any problems when opened in PS, so do that if you're serious. And, yeah, ID is a problem.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JaredJenkinsDesign

rhett7660

macrumors G5
Jan 9, 2008
14,225
4,307
Sunny, Southern California
I was on the fence with getting V2, however now that I upgraded to a newer machine, I will be upgrading on the next go around of discounts. Kinda wished I bought it anyways at this point. Dang it.
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.