Did anyone else feel hoodwinked when the Intel switch was announced ?

[mode11]

Would a complementary offer have led to cannibalism?

It certainly seemed to during the Mac clone days. The scheme was the first thing Steve cancelled on his return, so it seems odd for him to have (allegedly) been courting Sony to this end a few years later.

I guess if Sony only offered models that Apple had no interest in making / was unable to with PPC, such as an ultra-light laptop, they might not have stepped on each other's toes. But if x86 led to better laptops, it would undermine the whole PPC-think-different thing.

 

[TheShortTimer]

Not arguing here - it's all speculation. Thanks for playing along!

My pleasure.

Makes sense for Sony, though what would be in it for Apple? They'd get a licensing fee I guess.

They'd have in Sony, an extremely reliable and competent partner with a ready-made inventory of high quality x86 hardware - which would crucially eliminate or at least significantly minimise their R&D outlay in such a venture because Apple would merely need to provide the drivers and not have to worry about developing anything from scratch on the hardware end.

Not sure how much of a selling point being able to boot into Mac OS would have been to PC buyers in the early 2000's, though. It sure wouldn't be for the games. In this scenario, would there also be Apple laptops?

Remember the phase during the mid 90s prior to Jobs' return where Apple launched an advertising campaign that sought to promote the Mac (with particular focus on the 6100 models) as a viable and serious alternative for organisations that traditionally would've purchased PCs by highlighting the option to also run DOS/Win software (via the DOS Compatibility Card)?

The angle could've been revisited with a much more effective outcome in the hands of Sony - or in conjunction with the recently reinvigorated Apple and an appropriately savvy marketing strategy.

That just makes it sound like the Intel switch should have happened earlier.

That's a good point. From my experiences, PPC CPUs on Macs didn't even match the 400-450 Mhz Pentium II's in many respects till the G4 reached the gigahertz range. Though I have to acknowledge that with the G5, IBM surpassed the x86 equivalents because I have a PC with the fastest iteration of the Pentium 4 and my PM G5 effortlessly trounces it - and also my Core Duo Macs for that matter.

This is what makes me think it would have been a case of outsourcing to Sony, with some kind of joint branding (ViaoBook!?). It may have helped drive adoption of OS X, perhaps, but that's about it. Having created an iconic design language, Apple would be ceding that role to Sony's design studio.

Unless, perhaps, the styling would be done by Apple and the underlying engineering by Sony, using x86 parts? Even today, I've got no idea how much of the detail design of e.g. logic boards is done by Apple, and how much is done by Foxconn.

Sony were pivotally responsible for the resounding success of the PowerBook 100 - it was rated in 2005 by Mobile PC magazine as "the greatest gadget of all time." The baton would've definitely been in safe hands had Apple ceded that side of things to them.

 

[mode11]

The baton would've definitely been in safe hands had Apple ceded that side of things to them.

But then what would have been left for Apple to do? Just become an OS developer, like Microsoft? So much of what they do is hardware. It would be somewhat like BMW outsourcing car production to Honda.

 

[TheShortTimer]

But then what would have been left for Apple to do? Just become an OS developer, like Microsoft? So much of what they do is hardware.

Microsoft is a player on the hardware scene, lest we forget the Xbox or the not so memorable Zune, their dalliance with mobile phones but their tech is nearly always developed by others - so too their software very often but that's another topic in itself...

Perhaps Apple would've focused on specialised and higher-end products like Xserve and the Mac Pro and at the consumer electronics level, the iPhone, iPod and iTouch etc? Plus Mac accessories and peripherals.

It would be somewhat like BMW outsourcing car production to Honda.

To Lexus.

 

[B S Magnet]

Microsoft is a player on the hardware scene, lest we forget the Xbox or the not so memorable Zune, their dalliance with mobile phones but their tech is nearly always developed by others - so too their software very often but that's another topic in itself...

Perhaps Apple would've focused on specialised and higher-end products like Xserve and the Mac Pro and at the consumer electronics level, the iPhone, iPod and iTouch etc? Plus Mac accessories and peripherals.



To Lexus.

BMW have a peculiar history of trying that, except it didn’t go so well. Toyota, creator of their Lexus marque, have outsourced to BMW in recent years.

I really don’t know why I know this stuff (especially owing how I will probably never own a car ever again), but I’m thinking it may be a consequence of being raised around an older cousin, who was heavily into things like cars, crotch rockets, and freestyle bikes. He would “recruit” as his younger, in-house help to work on his car when I was a teen. He knew I was enough of a tomboy to not be cowed by grease and smoke and all the other junk to come from an ICE vehicle.

He, however, could not recruit me to appreciate his pop culture tastes, which were — uh — abysmal, pedestrian, and truly alienating for girls and women. I loved him dearly, but we couldn’t see eye to eye on any of that. But paying notice to vehicles — it is transportation planning-adjacent, in my defence — sort of stuck with me after years of him pointing out the most trifling of differences between two variations of what looked like the same car. In that sense, he taught me to pay especial care and notice to exceedingly fine details.

 

[mode11]

Microsoft is a player on the hardware scene, lest we forget the Xbox or the not so memorable Zune, their dalliance with mobile phones but their tech is nearly always developed by others - so too their software very often but that's another topic in itself...

Microsoft are primarily a software company (clue's in the name!), so it wouldn't be a big deal if they subcontracted Xbox hardware design to another company. Their role is to supply the cash, make strategic decisions, direct marketing - and of course handle the software engineering / server stuff. Having said that, their Surface line does act as something of an exemplar to the Windows ecosystem; their input devices have generally been pretty solid too.

Apple are of course partly a software company, and for me at least, macOS is their crown jewel (if initially brought in with NeXT). But arguably, they are more a hardware company - they don't sell their OS separately, even to Mac users, and their products derive a lot of their appeal from the tight integration of hardware and software. Every product has 'Designed in California by Apple' proudly printed on it.

Going back to their proposed tie-up with Sony in 2001 - if Apple laptops had maintained a distinct identity, even if wholly designed by Sony behind the scenes, that would be one thing. But if they were generic VAIOs running Mac OS, that would have been a step too far. Sony have their own design language, and ceding product design to Sony would have ripped out Apple's soul. It would have caused a crisis of confidence - why would they then imagine they could design a smartphone? Why not leave that to Sony too?

History has since validated the decision to keep designing their own products; Apple have largely set the pace for the computer / music player / smartphone industry for the past couple of decades (for good and ill), whereas Sony sold off its VAIO business a decade ago, and its Android phones aren't especially prominent. And despite their heritage with the Walkman in the 80's / 90's, their MP3 players were a blip compared to the supremacy of the iPod.

Perhaps Apple would've focused on specialised and higher-end products like Xserve and the Mac Pro and at the consumer electronics level, the iPhone, iPod and iTouch etc? Plus Mac accessories and peripherals.

This would have left a laptop-sized hole in the Mac range, which seems a bit odd given they're the volume seller (Apple since discontinued the Xserve of course, and have all but discontinued the Mac Pro). If they had given up on laptops, they may as well have given up on Mac hardware completely, and just sold Mac OS bundled with specific, validated hardware e.g. Sony VAIO laptops and HP workstations.

To Lexus.

I didn't choose Honda to imply a 'lesser' brand (merely a Japanese one). I just meant that if BMW outsourced car production - their core competence - to another company, in what sense would BMW still meaningfully exist? Lots of car companies use 'badge engineering' e.g. most of the VW Group. But BMW market themselves as something special - the 'Ultimate Driving Machine'. They use rear wheel drive, when most other brands would just save cost / packaging hassles and stick with front wheel drive. But if you take short cuts like that, it erodes the brand - customers aren't complete idiots. It starts with the enthusiasts, but the message eventually gets round.

 

[ToniCH]

Did anyone else feel hoodwinked when the Intel switch was announced ?

I don't even know what hoodwinked means but I can make a guess.

No, it didn't bother me much. I had already experienced the 68K->PPC thing. And my days of running top of the line PowerMacs were behind me already. I was happily running a 2004 Powerbook G4 12" at the time (came with Jaguar). Then I bought the 2007 Mac Mini C2D (came with Tiger) but continued using the PB 12" as my main laptop for couple of more years. Software I needed for work worked on both machines so no big deal for me. The processor architecture was pretty much irrelevant, only the ability to run my sw mattered. Also, then it was expected that the machines would speed up due new processors and that was only a good thing in my opinion.