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VirtuallyInsane

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Nov 16, 2018
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Does anyone know how to get TenFourBird or any email client to work on Tiger? I have the TenFourBirdG5 and it worked fine on my iMacG5 the last time I checked it. The TenFourBirdG4 7450 doesn't work properly on my PBG4 15" running Tiger (10.4.11, all up to date). I go to login my account (either outlook, or gmail), and all the stmp and imap settings are correct, and my password is typed correctly, yet it says its not typed correctly.

What am I doing wrong, or is there another email client that can work?

Thanks.
 

Doq

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Dec 8, 2019
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Insufficient support for either the TLS the mail server requires or missing app passwords.

IIRC, Outlook and Gmail require too new standards for old PPC clients to connect without translation proxy.

Only option are the web interfaces, if they will even load (Gmail at least has basic HTML, Outlook may be a no-go).
 
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TheShortTimer

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Insufficient support for either the TLS the mail server requires or missing app passwords.

IIRC, Outlook and Gmail require too new standards for old PPC clients to connect without translation proxy.

Only option are the web interfaces, if they will even load (Gmail at least has basic HTML, Outlook may be a no-go).

Yeah, I experienced this issue with High Sierra and Mail. On that particular Mac I had to use a web interface as the easiest solution.
 
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eyoungren

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With Google it's down to they are starting to exclude older OS and apps for security reasons. You can't get Gmail on an iOS 12 device either and while you can still download the actual Gmail app, it won't let you login.

Frankly, I was forced to stop using Entourage 2004 some time in 2019 when security finally broke a lot of my email accounts.
 
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Certificate of Excellence

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Feb 9, 2021
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Insufficient support for either the TLS the mail server requires or missing app passwords.

IIRC, Outlook and Gmail require too new standards for old PPC clients to connect without translation proxy.

Only option are the web interfaces, if they will even load (Gmail at least has basic HTML, Outlook may be a no-go).
I have used HTML gmail in a box/fluid instance for ages as my email solution on PPC. Sadly, google is planning to discontinue that basic view support this month pushing everyone to their bloated and ugly standard interface which is frustratingly stupid.

FYI, it runs like absolute you know what in a PPC box.
 
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VirtuallyInsane

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Nov 16, 2018
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Insufficient support for either the TLS the mail server requires or missing app passwords.

IIRC, Outlook and Gmail require too new standards for old PPC clients to connect without translation proxy.

Only option are the web interfaces, if they will even load (Gmail at least has basic HTML, Outlook may be a no-go).

Is there anything in Macports at all that can help with the TLS security? Or anything that Macports can do it, or is it all totally dead now? I think the web interfaces aren't going to be much use if they are changing them soon. :/

Yeah, I experienced this issue with High Sierra and Mail. On that particular Mac I had to use a web interface as the easiest solution.

Wow, high sierra? Not good news for me on Mojave then... but I don't wanna have to upgrade for Mail. Come on. I will use the web interface if that ever happens. At least you still can do it on High Sierra.

With Google it's down to they are starting to exclude older OS and apps for security reasons. You can't get Gmail on an iOS 12 device either and while you can still download the actual Gmail app, it won't let you login.

Frankly, I was forced to stop using Entourage 2004 some time in 2019 when security finally broke a lot of my email accounts.

That's annoying... I remember I could login to iOS 6 email on my iPod Touch 4 no problem a few years ago. This planned obsolescence under the guise of 'security' is annoying. Who is really going to want to hack a PPC either these days? Or an iPod Touch.

I have used HTML gmail in a box/fluid instance for ages as my email solution on PPC. Sadly, google is planning to discontinue that basic view support this month pushing everyone to their bloated and ugly standard interface which is frustratingly stupid.

FYI, it runs like absolute you know what in a PPC box.

Yeah, I was going to ask about running it in a PPC Box app. It if can't then I guess there's no hope for it. It's annoying the way that google want to push people into a less efficient, ugly interface. I went to go and try find HTML View, which worked last year on my Tiger machine, and I couldn't find it. Found it was gone forever.

Pity Google can't just have an old.gmail.com domain like Reddit has an old.reddit.com domain. But again, they will try and say that they can't justify it because everything is becoming modern. Or something like that.
 
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Doq

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Is there anything in Macports at all that can help with the TLS security? Or anything that Macports can do it, or is it all totally dead now? I think the web interfaces aren't going to be much use if they are changing them soon. :/
Strong maybe at best. If you can find a complete mail app on MacPorts-- you cannot simply install some newer library, you must install the entire application-- then by all means try it.
This planned obsolescence under the guise of 'security' is annoying. Who is really going to want to hack a PPC either these days?
You're looking at the scope wrong. Hackers don't want your PPC, they want your email, and if they get that, you're hosed.

Leaving legacy implementations is always a security risk, and it's always a tradeoff between security and convenience. Outlook and Gmail are the two largest email platforms, and believe me when I say that it is always a cat-and-mouse game between their security team and malicious actors.

Removing legacy or oft-unused features also reduces the platform's attack surface, which is automatically more secure by default no matter how public perception is. At some point, upkeep of these legacy features becomes a maintenance nightmare and when they do they will be discarded.

Unless you feel like moving your mail operations to a service that still has these legacy features, your options are getting more and more slim by the day. We are the 0.1%, it is up to us to create solutions and workarounds. The moment the last developer, tinkerer, or maintainer leaves, that's it, it's over, time to move on.
 
Strong maybe at best. If you can find a complete mail app on MacPorts-- you cannot simply install some newer library, you must install the entire application-- then by all means try it.

You're looking at the scope wrong. Hackers don't want your PPC, they want your email, and if they get that, you're hosed.

This suggests the ongoing battle between hackers/crackers and SaaS providers like Google lies not so much where the email data might live, but in the disruption of delivery provision for that email data itself — i.e., MitM access (or authentication-spoofing) to email data stored on the SaaS cloud server and accessed by the end user on an as-requested basis.

I think back to the model of retrieving mail locally and keeping that locally, deleting at the server. This, of course, means being confined to access that email at one node — the client system storing that email data. The trade-off is one cannot use any device they possess to view email anywhere, anytime. The problem here, however unwieldy, is the expectation of accessing email data anywhere, anytime, comes with a lot of high-complexity authentication measures (2FA, crypto key, biometrics, etc.) to maintain that convenience.

Yet as this was never a “convenience” feature at the inception of email, or for the generations of folks to have used email before the rise of web mail services like Hotmail, Yahoo Mail, Lycos Mail, and Gmail, our general vulnerability in the decades since fell to the temporary delivery of requested email, as served by a database-driven web portal. Prior to, the vulnerability fell almost entirely (at least after SSL/TLS-based) one-time encryption of delivering that email data to a destination, leaving the vulnerability to the end user’s management and security for their own device (as well as, well, backing it up faithfully).

Hackers/crackers now need not worry about drilling into an end user’s device so much as drilling into the medium between server and end user (or, more accurately, “product”). This is a trade-off the tech sector made for the end user, whether or not the end user/product requested it.

tl;dr: It didn’t have to be this way.

Leaving legacy implementations is always a security risk, and it's always a tradeoff between security and convenience. Outlook and Gmail are the two largest email platforms, and believe me when I say that it is always a cat-and-mouse game between their security team and malicious actors.

Removing legacy or oft-unused features also reduces the platform's attack surface, which is automatically more secure by default no matter how public perception is. At some point, upkeep of these legacy features becomes a maintenance nightmare and when they do they will be discarded.

Unless you feel like moving your mail operations to a service that still has these legacy features, your options are getting more and more slim by the day. We are the 0.1%, it is up to us to create solutions and workarounds. The moment the last developer, tinkerer, or maintainer leaves, that's it, it's over, time to move on.

Or, however unusual it might seem, any personal or business budgeting for, say, Google premium cloud services could instead go toward an independent web hosting provider, in which email can be handled by an application. Horde groupware comes to mind. Email is delivered, via POP3/IMAP encryption, to a destination, where it is stored by the end-user at destination and either deleted or saved upstream, but not a requirement to need to always have that email data stored on the cloud (and accessible only on an as-needed basis through encryption techniques which, once cracked, renders the entire delivery system prone to exploits).

I often ponder the question, “Did we really ever need our digital lives on the cloud to work within a digital realm, or were we steered that direction by a model of business designed to exploit the end user as a product?” This is such an example, one I had to re-visit the moment I could no longer access a couple of my lesser-used Gmail accounts I’d held since 2004–05. Fortunately, for all email received prior to that last successful login, I still have all that email data locally (and backed up along with other local data).

Without that, years of my email data would have been permanently inaccessible, forever, all due to an unrequested change in service protocols as a fix to other cloud-oriented security kludges, all because someone in Silly Valley concluded we must have our personal data on the cloud and accessible from anywhere, on any device, for — ::flails arms in the air like a Muppet::reasons. 😤
 

barracuda156

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Is there anything in Macports at all that can help with the TLS security? Or anything that Macports can do it, or is it all totally dead now?

1. I believe, pretty much everything related without GUI should work on PowerPC, though Tiger may have issues with getting to the point of building needed libs. (Worth trying though.)
2. GUI apps are likely to have issues, depending on what they rely on. Qt4 is reliable generally (most of stuff will work, some features may not), if anything exists for it, Qt5 is a no-go presently (however it could be the case that Qt5-using port in fact can support Qt4, just no one bothered to fix that), WxWidgets, GTK and X11 apps may or may not be broken (neither worked for me so far, but to be honest I did not devote any time to setting it up properly, which seems to be required and may not be completely trivial), ncurses apps should work as long as codebase is sane (not guaranteed, needs to be tried out), Cocoa is likely broken or requires falling back to much older versions (which are unlikely to work for anything web-related).

I would try the following:
– If no GUI required, easy case, CLI-based client should work.
– If ncurses GUI suffices, easy case, try building, if it fails, report on Trac, we gonna try fixing it.
– If full-scale GUI is desired, look for Qt4 ports, try those; if only Qt5-based ones are there, report on Trac asking Qt4 support, that might work.
– X11, GTK and WxWidgets are the last resort, but might work. Notice, WxWidgets should be < 3.2, since 3.2 is broken at the moment. GTK builds fine, up to 4.x (i.e. the current version), but whether it gonna work is another question. X11-based stuff should not require modern xorg-server, that one is broken.

Any Macports apps to consider here? I can try fixing some stuff, if needed, and provided it is not Cocoa, Qt5+ and WxWidgets 3.2 :)
 

barracuda156

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Could anyone do me a favor and check if this builds on any PowerPC macOS?


No access to my PowerPC machines for a while, so cannot test myself. From the looks of things there is nothing to prevent it from working.
 

barracuda156

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Could anyone do me a favor and check if this builds on any PowerPC macOS?


No access to my PowerPC machines for a while, so cannot test myself. From the looks of things there is nothing to prevent it from working.

PR merged, so the port is available normally now via sudo port install nmail.

If someone could try installing it, please, and let us know if it works. If it fails, the log will be very helpful.
 

za9ra22

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Sep 25, 2003
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That's annoying... I remember I could login to iOS 6 email on my iPod Touch 4 no problem a few years ago. This planned obsolescence under the guise of 'security' is annoying. Who is really going to want to hack a PPC either these days? Or an iPod Touch.
One thing that isn't often understood is that these 'security' changes are almost invariably the result of the need to tighten holes being constantly found and exploited in communication services. As a user, when using supported platforms, the software will be updating too, to keep track, but as OS and software belonging to it pass their end of life and stop getting further support, they stop working at some point simply because a security hole in a service is patched, and the software no longer can function.

In a case where the correct ID and password is entered and results in an error, this is usually what has happened.

Email is actually a big problem in this regard, because it can only work at all if the server/client relationship exists around known and fixed ports to facilitate them communicating. This means that the bad guys already know what those ports are, so they have known-good lines of attack to focus on. In turn, that means security has to be updated frequently.

For users this is frustrating, and it's easy to think that something like a PPC Mac is sufficiently old that nobody is going to waste their time hacking it. In its own way that's largely true, but it doesn't help, because breaking into an old system isn't the aim, it's getting access to the data. Providers of server-side services are also well aware of the constant threat of litigation if they don't demonstrably show intent to secure customer data, which means they sometimes over engineer their solutions. It also helps to mitigate the risk of reputational damage, which in this industry is crucial.

There is an added problem too, which @B S Magnet hints at, and that is the degree to which the larger of the service providers tend to go outside/beyond conventions and protocols as the perceive themselves to be above adherence to industry standards.
 

VirtuallyInsane

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Nov 16, 2018
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PR merged, so the port is available normally now via sudo port install nmail.

If someone could try installing it, please, and let us know if it works. If it fails, the log will be very helpful.
I tried it on my Powerbook G4 running Tiger, and it says that the port can't be found. *nmail not found*.
 

barracuda156

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I tried it on my Powerbook G4 running Tiger, and it says that the port can't be found. *nmail not found*.

Hmm, it should be available as long as you ran sudo port sync.
Here is the port: https://ports.macports.org/port/nmail

However, wait a bit nevertheless with building, since there is an issue to be addressed for it to build on < 10.7.
Discussion here: https://github.com/d99kris/nmail/discussions/153
 

VirtuallyInsane

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Update: After some tinkering around, I think I might have come up with a temporary solution (this is an older account, and not my main one):

> I opened up TenFourBird, and it didn't work either like Thunderbird. I tweaked the settings and made sure that they were accurate, an that didn't help much either.

> After some debating and thinking, I went to tinker about with various ports on Macports to see what email clients/fixes I could install.

> Most of them didn’t work because they were too new, so I kept on looking for some more. I tried to look for ones that seemed older looking based off their websites/descriptions.

> Eventually, I installed a port called Openstmpd (https://www.opensmtpd.org/) which I came across, and decided to try it out to see if it could actually "exchange emails with other systems speaking the SMTP protocol."

> I checked the default IMAP settings for receiving mail based off the Outlook servers after it had installed, not expecting anything much, but was glad that it had installed. It didn't take that long either.

> After re-checking the settings and saving them, my email suddenly worked on Tiger and started loading into my inbox. It's working well now.

All the images load fine, and I can read/reply to email on my Powerbook now.
Picture 4.png


So it seems like some ports can make older PowerPC machines talk to modern servers through some modification? This is pretty cool, if it keeps working and stays working. Means I can reply to emails on my Powerbook and surf the web on my Macbook Pro at the same time.

Also, thanks to everyone's suggestions and their responses. I am also going to test out @barracuda156 's port. I didn't sync the ports, and now it seems to be working (thanks for the reminder).

Well, after a few hours it failed. This is the error code, maybe I am missing a few files:

Picture 5.png


I will try again tomorrow, and do all the codes.
 

barracuda156

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Also, thanks to everyone's suggestions and their responses. I am also going to test out @barracuda156 's port. I didn't sync the ports, and now it seems to be working (thanks for the reminder).

Well, after a few hours it failed. This is the error code, maybe I am missing a few files:

View attachment 2355165

I will try again tomorrow, and do all the codes.

Thank you for your efforts.

To the issue:
1. What you see is not an error, it is expected behavior. You just need to do what the message advises: sudo port deactivate libunwind-headers. Then proceed with whatever.
2. Building gcc7 takes a lot of time on G4. Be ready. It is useful to do regardless of a specific port, however. Pretty much anything modern requires C/C++11-capable compilers, so it makes sense to have such installed.
3. It will take a while to get to the point of building nmail itself. I hope we get a fix for it in a few days, there is a minor issue to be addressed with it.
 
Update: After some tinkering around, I think I might have come up with a temporary solution (this is an older account, and not my main one):

> I opened up TenFourBird, and it didn't work either like Thunderbird. I tweaked the settings and made sure that they were accurate, an that didn't help much either.

> After some debating and thinking, I went to tinker about with various ports on Macports to see what email clients/fixes I could install.

> Most of them didn’t work because they were too new, so I kept on looking for some more. I tried to look for ones that seemed older looking based off their websites/descriptions.

> Eventually, I installed a port called Openstmpd (https://www.opensmtpd.org/) which I came across, and decided to try it out to see if it could actually "exchange emails with other systems speaking the SMTP protocol."

> I checked the default IMAP settings for receiving mail based off the Outlook servers after it had installed, not expecting anything much, but was glad that it had installed. It didn't take that long either.

> After re-checking the settings and saving them, my email suddenly worked on Tiger and started loading into my inbox. It's working well now.

All the images load fine, and I can read/reply to email on my Powerbook now.
View attachment 2355114

So it seems like some ports can make older PowerPC machines talk to modern servers through some modification? This is pretty cool, if it keeps working and stays working. Means I can reply to emails on my Powerbook and surf the web on my Macbook Pro at the same time.

Also, thanks to everyone's suggestions and their responses. I am also going to test out @barracuda156 's port. I didn't sync the ports, and now it seems to be working (thanks for the reminder).

Well, after a few hours it failed. This is the error code, maybe I am missing a few files:

View attachment 2355165

I will try again tomorrow, and do all the codes.

On a lark, based on your sucess, I decided to try whether the opensmtpd port would install on either my G3 running Tiger or one of my G4s running Leopard. Both failed.

In the log from the G4 build, things went south at this point:

1709535183205.png


Leaving with the following error details:

1709535221235.png


The same was the case with the G3 effort (only the point of error shown; the error details were the same):

1709535459933.png


Currently, both the G3 and G4 have the following build environments:

cctools (949.0.1.3)
gcc7 (7.0.5.4)
mp-clang-3.4 (3.4.2.17) (installed, but select doesn’t work, defaulting to “none”; apparent registry error stating mp-clang-3.4 is not installed)
mp-llvm-3.4 (3.4.2.16)
python27
python311 (on the G3) and python 312 (on the G4)

Would you be able to share any of the relevant building tools (i.e., python, etc.) and the versions to which you have them set? I’m curious to understand why I’m running into this across two different systems with two different levels of macports installed. Maybe this could also be for @barracuda156 to chime in with what they know.

Cheers.


EDIT to add: I also tried to build on my G5. That failed in the same spot.
 
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barracuda156

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On a lark, based on your sucess, I decided to try whether the opensmtpd port would install on either my G3 running Tiger or one of my G4s running Leopard. Both failed.

In the log from the G4 build, things went south at this point:

View attachment 2355245

Leaving with the following error details:

View attachment 2355246

The same was the case with the G3 effort (only the point of error shown; the error details were the same):

View attachment 2355247

Currently, both the G3 and G4 have the following build environments:

cctools (949.0.1.3)
gcc7 (7.0.5.4)
mp-clang-3.4 (3.4.2.17) (installed, but select doesn’t work, defaulting to “none”; apparent registry error stating mp-clang-3.4 is not installed)
mp-llvm-3.4 (3.4.2.16)
python27
python311 (on the G3) and python 312 (on the G4)

Would you be able to share any of the relevant building tools (i.e., python, etc.) and the versions to which you have them set? I’m curious to understand why I’m running into this across two different systems with two different levels of macports installed. Maybe this could also be for @barracuda156 to chime in with what they know.

Cheers.


EDIT to add: I also tried to build on my G5. That failed in the same spot.

It is very much advisable to add complete logs whenever there is a build error. From the screenshots it is not even clear what compiler is being used.

I am willing to assist with making it work, but I need more inputs.

Besides, you should not need any clang on Leopard ppc, nothing should invoke clang or depend on it, if something asks for clang, it is a bug to be fixed. (Since 10.6 ppc is not officially supported, compiler choice may not work correctly there in some select instances, but on 10.5 everything should work from the box. And for 10.6 ppc we got fixes too.)

UPD. The error you quote looks like this one: https://github.com/lunarmodules/luasocket/issues/242
Should be easily fixable, though I have no idea if that gonna suffice to make it work.

UPD2. I can open the issue with upstream, but that also requires a proper log.
Or you could open an issue directly, if you prefer, here: https://github.com/OpenSMTPD/OpenSMTPD
 
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It is very much advisable to add complete logs whenever there is a build error. From the screenshots it is not even clear what compiler is being used.

That’s fair and makes complete sense.

I am willing to assist with making it work, but I need more inputs.

Thank you. I’m going to attach the logs from each of the G3, G4, and G5 attempts, if that might be useful. They all errored out the same way.

Besides, you should not need any clang on Leopard ppc, nothing should invoke clang or depend on it, if something asks for clang, it is a bug to be fixed. (Since 10.6 ppc is not officially supported, compiler choice may not work correctly there in some select instances, but on 10.5 everything should work from the box. And for 10.6 ppc we got fixes too.)

This is very handy to know. I vaguely remember one of the standard build tools being applicable to either older (PPC) or newer (Intel) Macs, but couldn’t recall which (I had thought it might have been cmake, but I haven’t really looked into it). This should clear that up. Cheers. :)
 

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barracuda156

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Thank you. I’m going to attach the logs from each of the G3, G4, and G5 attempts, if that might be useful. They all errored out the same way.

This is very handy to know. I vaguely remember one of the standard build tools being applicable to either older (PPC) or newer (Intel) Macs, but couldn’t recall which (I had thought it might have been cmake, but I haven’t really looked into it). This should clear that up. Cheers. :)

Thanks for logs, will look into that.
UPD. Opened an issue with upstream: https://github.com/OpenSMTPD/OpenSMTPD/issues/1246
Let’s see if they advise something from their side. I am still away from my PowerMacs, so cannot try anything locally.

One thing which you could try though is building it with gcc7:
Code:
sudo port -v build opensmtpd configure.compiler=macports-gcc-7


To other points:

1. The only notable difference in this context between G3 vs G4/G5 is that the former has no Altivec. Lack of support for Altivec may break some ports, where the build system assumes it is available without checking. AFAICT, this mostly happens with multimedia-related stuff. Since presumably nobody tests on G3, it is unclear which ports may be affected.
In some rather esoteric cases (when native optimizations are used) it could matter if the build runs on G4 vs G5, but normally this should be inconsequential (obviously, for ppc, since ppc64 binaries can only run on G5).
This is to say that in most cases it is sufficient to test either on G5 or G4.

2. Macports is supposed to pick the right tools to build something, conditional on architecture and OS version. Admittedly, this does not work perfectly. So if some incoherent behavior is seen, it makes sense to report it on Trac.
Clangs should literally never be invoked on PowerPC, since they do not work there.

P. S. I am a bit surprised if you have clang-3.4 even built for ppc. (It is pointless to build it anyway, but feasible; however, I think the current version of the port will not build as-is, though on 10.5 it could be different.)
If you have it, perhaps rather deactivate it or uninstall. It is not usable on PowerPC, and we do not want it to be picked.
 
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Thanks for logs, will look into that.
UPD. Opened an issue with upstream: https://github.com/OpenSMTPD/OpenSMTPD/issues/1246
Let’s see if they advise something from their side. I am still away from my PowerMacs, so cannot try anything locally.

One thing which you could try though is building it with gcc7:
Code:
sudo port -v build opensmtpd configure.compiler=macports-gcc-7

I gave this a run on the G5. Build failed. Log attached.

I was intrigued by the part of the command you appended above. Owing how gcc7 was selected beforehand, what it echoed just after entering the command was something I’d never seen before with installing a port. That’s the second txt file attached.


To other points:

1. The only notable difference in this context between G3 vs G4/G5 is that the former has no Altivec. Lack of support for Altivec may break some ports, where the build system assumes it is available without checking. AFAICT, this mostly happens with multimedia-related stuff. Since presumably nobody tests on G3, it is unclear which ports may be affected.

That checks out. For something like email-adjacent components, I would doubt AltiVec would factor into it much.

In some rather esoteric cases (when native optimizations are used) it could matter if the build runs on G4 vs G5, but normally this should be inconsequential (obviously, for ppc, since ppc64 binaries can only run on G5).
This is to say that in most cases it is sufficient to test either on G5 or G4.

Interestingly, I first tried to install opensmtpd on the G3, given the above success was able to do it on Tiger.

2. Macports is supposed to pick the right tools to build something, conditional on architecture and OS version. Admittedly, this does not work perfectly. So if some incoherent behavior is seen, it makes sense to report it on Trac.

The trouble (and discouragement) of reporting to Trac is I lack the technical know-how to articulate the issue when it goes beyond the standard port commands. That is, I might try to describe the issue, but the response, when there is one, tends to be not very instructive and/or a severe asymmetry between what the maintainers know and what some lay person like me knows. You weren’t quite here yet, but the back-and-forth I had with one of macports’s maintainers on here got really heated, and I just gave up after what came across as dismissiveness toward my level of competency with the back-end of the project.

This is to say: unless I’m tinkering under the bonnet, which I’m not, I can’t know whether what I might try to post to Trac will get dismissed or, alternately, be instructed to do something which is vague and implies I already know the intermediary sub-steps before implementing the suggestion. So I just don’t.


P. S. I am a bit surprised if you have clang-3.4 even built for ppc. (It is pointless to build it anyway, but feasible; however, I think the current version of the port will not build as-is, though on 10.5 it could be different.)

Well, it built, but it can’t be selected. Anything beyond, such as 3.7, gets the unsupported architecture message.


If you have it, perhaps rather deactivate it or uninstall. It is not usable on PowerPC, and we do not want it to be picked.

Sure thing. Cheers.
 

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barracuda156

macrumors 68000
Sep 3, 2021
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The trouble (and discouragement) of reporting to Trac is I lack the technical know-how to articulate the issue when it goes beyond the standard port commands. That is, I might try to describe the issue, but the response, when there is one, tends to be not very instructive and/or a severe asymmetry between what the maintainers know and what some lay person like me knows. You weren’t quite here yet, but the back-and-forth I had with one of macports’s maintainers on here got really heated, and I just gave up after what came across as dismissiveness toward my level of competency with the back-end of the project.

This is to say: unless I’m tinkering under the bonnet, which I’m not, I can’t know whether what I might try to post to Trac will get dismissed or, alternately, be instructed to do something which is vague and implies I already know the intermediary sub-steps before implementing the suggestion. So I just don’t.

The point of reporting something broken on Trac is to let maintainers and other interested people know that the problem exists in the first place. Many ports are broken not because it is something unfixable but simply because no one bothered to test. Literally, in many instances all that is needed is a single line in a portfile to ensure the right compiler is picked (typically, requiring C++11).

Reporting itself takes little: we only need a meaningful ticket title and attached log from the build. (It is desirable to add a tag for OS version affected, but not required.)
If a port has a maintainer, assign it to maintainer. If it is about PowerPC, you may add me into CC field.

P. S. Personal communication may not go perfectly in every instance, this is something expectable. Please keep in mind that a) it may be genuinely unclear what someone knows or knows not, b) people have limited time and often no easy way to test something for an old system or uncommon architecture.
 
The point of reporting something broken on Trac is to let maintainers and other interested people know that the problem exists in the first place. Many ports are broken not because it is something unfixable but simply because no one bothered to test. Literally, in many instances all that is needed is a single line in a portfile to ensure the right compiler is picked (typically, requiring C++11).

Reporting itself takes little: we only need a meaningful ticket title and attached log from the build. (It is desirable to add a tag for OS version affected, but not required.)
If a port has a maintainer, assign it to maintainer. If it is about PowerPC, you may add me into CC field.

P. S. Personal communication may not go perfectly in every instance, this is something expectable. Please keep in mind that a) it may be genuinely unclear what someone knows or knows not, b) people have limited time and often no easy way to test something for an old system or uncommon architecture.

I’ll keep this in mind. Cheers.
 
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