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FurryToes

macrumors newbie
Sep 29, 2011
4
0
Damn, I was so expecting a solution at the bottom of this thread... :)
I have the problem too - I guess pretty much everyone with an external FW drive has... and we'll have to wait for some kind of a bug fix.

My WIFI stopped working on installing Lion, it took until Mountain Lion for it to be fixed... so not holding my breath.
 

gr8tfly

macrumors 603
Oct 29, 2006
5,333
99
~119W 34N
Over at the Apple Discussions forum, there is a similar thread regarding external drives not sleeping - however, the ones they are referring to are native Thunderbolt drives/enclosures.

This leads me to suspect it's actually Thunderbolt that has the issue. FW800 is just fallout from that.
 

flopticalcube

macrumors G4
Over at the Apple Discussions forum, there is a similar thread regarding external drives not sleeping - however, the ones they are referring to are native Thunderbolt drives/enclosures.

This leads me to suspect it's actually Thunderbolt that has the issue. FW800 is just fallout from that.

Nope since my mini has no TBolt but does have native FW800. It could be both.
 

Gochugogi

macrumors regular
Oct 27, 2013
223
26
Sandwich Isles
Damn, I was so expecting a solution at the bottom of this thread... :)
I have the problem too - I guess pretty much everyone with an external FW drive has... and we'll have to wait for some kind of a bug fix.

My WIFI stopped working on installing Lion, it took until Mountain Lion for it to be fixed... so not holding my breath.

Well, there is a solution: turn off FW drives before you leave the house or go to bed. I got tired of that fast. The best solution is to pull the FW cables and use the USB ports if you have a duel interface drive.
 

flopticalcube

macrumors G4
Well, there is a solution: turn off FW drives before you leave the house or go to bed. I got tired of that fast. The best solution is to pull the FW cables and use the USB ports if you have a duel interface drive.

Considering the speed and CPU penalties that USB incurs over FW800, or even 400, I'd rather switch the drives off each night until 10.9.1 comes along.
 

Gochugogi

macrumors regular
Oct 27, 2013
223
26
Sandwich Isles
I can live with a little speed hit for a month or whenever 10.9.1 appears. It's better than forgetting to turn off the drives and frying them during a weekend holiday. I didn't notice the problem for 3 days and my two externals were really hot. Now they're cool as a cucumber.
 

flopticalcube

macrumors G4
I can live with a little speed hit for a month or whenever 10.9.1 appears. It's better than forgetting to turn off the drives and frying them during a weekend holiday. I didn't notice the problem for 3 days and my two externals were really hot. Now they're cool as a cucumber.

Mine are cool as a cucumber even after I left them on overnight. I guess it depends on the drive/enclosure.
 

ujE3vyVG8xh?tz

macrumors newbie
Oct 29, 2013
18
8
Some do and some don't

I have a Seagate GoFlex hard drive and a OWC Mercury Elite on my FW800 bus. The Seagate goes to sleep, but the OWC won't. Strange.
 

ssls6

macrumors 6502a
Feb 7, 2013
592
185
I have a Seagate GoFlex hard drive and a OWC Mercury Elite on my FW800 bus. The Seagate goes to sleep, but the OWC won't. Strange.

GoFlex drives are infamous for sleeping when they shouldn't. Funny but this doesn't surprise me.
 

csteelooper

macrumors newbie
Feb 27, 2011
27
2
Disappointed, though lucky to find that I'm not alone…

Got the same issue here, though only with ONE of my FW drives. I have 2 FW800 drives; one G-Drive connected straight to my mac (that goes to sleep perfectly well, albeit after ~30 seconds instead of simultaneously with the system itself, as was the usual behaviour in <10.9. Then I have an iOmega eGO 1TB Mac drive (the one that has FW400/800 support), which is daisy-chained to the G-Drive. All the way up to 10.8.5, that drive would also go straight to sleep when my system went. Now, with Mavericks, that's the drive that just acts like it's high on caffein or something, because it won't go to sleep. I just hope I won't be without it prior to Apple releasing 10.9.1 (if that is to fix this issue), because I would be devastated for loosing this drive. Trouble is, I would have easily switched it off if I could, but there's no switch on the drive, and it's bus-powered. What's more, it won't spin down if I unmount/eject it… The only way to have it spinning down is actually to turn the computer off completely… Something I have NEVER done since getting my Mac in 2007… So one could say I'm slightly disappointed, at the very least.

Too bad that this issue is actually the only one that I'm encountering; all of the other features are pure bliss, and my Mac is actually performing better on Mavericks than it was on Mountain Lion (which was like a breath of fresh air compared to Snow Leopard; and even Snow Leopard was a huge leap compared to Leopard)… So there's been improvement for me with every major release, save from this issue…

I really hope Apple is going to fix this… Taking all of what I said into consideration, is there anything I can do to have the drive spinning down without turning the computer off completely? Obviously, I could disconnect the cable, but I'd rather avoid that as well, as I find FW800 cables a Pain In The Proverbial to connect…:(
 

mzd

macrumors 6502a
Jul 25, 2005
951
41
Wisconsin
i'm having this problem too. one FW400 drive for TimeMachine and another FW800 drive for storage won't power down. they aren't chained together.
i guess i can try to switch the FW800 to USB2, but i don't think i have that option on the FW400 drive.
lame. didn't Apple "invent" FireWire???
 

Gochugogi

macrumors regular
Oct 27, 2013
223
26
Sandwich Isles
Various examples of data loss on some FW drives under Mavericks now reported on apple forum, recommend caution.

Most of the data loss problems are tied to use of WD (Western Digital) software apps for backup, RAID, etc. WD officially recommended removing these apps from your system before upgrading to 10.9. I feel like I a dodged a bullet as earlier this fall I purged all WD apps and reformatted my Costco deluxe external My Book drive with the Apple Disk Utility. Didn't know a storm was coming but I tossed the apps because they were basically crapware with chunky interface and unreliable operation. Obviously WD didn't bother to update their apps to work with 10.9.:confused:

Don't merely throw away the WD apps: dig all WD files out of application support in your library to keep things from going haywire.
 

csteelooper

macrumors newbie
Feb 27, 2011
27
2
Typical WD…

Most of the data loss problems are tied to use of WD (Western Digital) software apps for backup, RAID, etc. WD officially recommended removing these apps from your system before upgrading to 10.9. I feel like I a dodged a bullet as earlier this fall I purged all WD apps and reformatted my Costco deluxe external My Book drive with the Apple Disk Utility. Didn't know a storm was coming but I tossed the apps because they were basically crapware with chunky interface and unreliable operation. Obviously WD didn't bother to update their apps to work with 10.9.:confused:

Don't merely throw away the WD apps: dig all WD files out of application support in your library to keep things from going haywire.

Typical… This is why, a while back, I decided to avoid WD from then on… I have a WD My Passport 500GB FW drive (WDMP) that I just cannot use because it tends to go to sleep whenever it mustn't… And, to add injury to insult, it doesn't even matter whether I use FireWire (800 or 400) or USB. So it definitely isn't a FireWire issue in this case, and it also started way back when Leopard came onto the market. First, WD recommended to INSTALL the 'turbo' drivers to alleviate the issues, then their stance changed from that to UNINSTALLING the aforementioned crapware, then they just claimed that there were certain configurations they deemed 'incompatible' with their devices, and so on…
What they didn't know at first (though I pointed it out to them afterwards) is that I had similar problems on ALL of my computers (or indeed other devices) that I used the WDMP with. Whether these be Windows, OS X, or *NIX operated PCs, or indeed PVRs… All showed the very same set of problems. Also, the file systems used on the WDMP didn't make any difference whatsoever. Whether I used old school FAT for Windows or the PVRs, or NTFS/HPFS, Or HFS+, or EXT2/3/4 didn't matter one single bit… The drive just didn't seem fit for purpose…

I felt like I'd been duped at the time, and I could't do anything about it, because WD's warranty only covered the country in which the WDMP was originally bought, and I lived some place else…

So, to me, it doesn't seem surprising at all to hear that most of the worst problems (data loss and the like) seem to affect WD drives. And especially those of users who've been using WD's own management software…

It's strange, though, because WD's internal drives are still top of the range, and don't present any problems as severe as those I've had with my WDMP, or those of the users now suffering Data Loss Issues with Mavericks. I'm telling you: if the only problem with most other HDD's is that they're not spinning down/sleeping, whilst WD externals suffer from Data Loss, this makes the sleeping issues seem like child's play…

And to hear WD stating that users should actually remove their software off their systems, instead of releasing an update for it, certainly doesn't improve matters. Taking all this into account surely doesn't take me off of avoiding Western Digital external drives for a long while…
 

Radiomarko

macrumors member
May 6, 2008
83
27
UK & Russia
There are a few reports of Lacie and other drives losing data, that why I said "various reports".... if in doubt don't is my motto with data.

I have never used Lacie or WD supplied software, so I could be ok....

With the release of Panther I think it was any firewire drive with an Oxford 922 bridge chip in the case would crap out and if you were really unlucky you lost your data - so it's not the first time. Blame laid at the door of the chip makers.

For those who remember scsi, they will also remember real pain.
 

ssls6

macrumors 6502a
Feb 7, 2013
592
185
i'm having this problem too. one FW400 drive for TimeMachine and another FW800 drive for storage won't power down. they aren't chained together.
i guess i can try to switch the FW800 to USB2, but i don't think i have that option on the FW400 drive.
lame. didn't Apple "invent" FireWire???

Yeah, it's pretty lame. It's the one biggest reason I haven't gone all in with Mavericks.
 

patH72

macrumors newbie
Oct 24, 2013
2
0
I filed a bug on this and got a notice today from Apple that the bug had been closed because it's a duplicate of another bug. So at least Apple is looking at this. There should have been a fix by now, however.
 

Eithanius

macrumors 68000
Nov 19, 2005
1,550
418
I filed a bug on this and got a notice today from Apple that the bug had been closed because it's a duplicate of another bug. So at least Apple is looking at this. There should have been a fix by now, however.

Or they probably ignored the bug by saying it's a standard feature and work as intended… :confused:
 

Negritude

macrumors 6502
Jul 14, 2011
297
199
Make sure system preferences is closed, open a terminal, then rename this file and reboot:

sudo mv /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.PowerManagement.plist /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.PowerManagement-old.plist

There seem to be some common problems with sleep initially when upgrading to Mavericks from previous OSes (as opposed to a clean install). You need to reset the power management preferences to get things working correctly.

Also, I assume that everyone here knows that Western Digital and many other drives have their own sleep settings in firmware, which can cause sleep issues like this. The best solution is to disable the drive's internal sleep setting and let the OS send sleep commands as needed.
 

Eithanius

macrumors 68000
Nov 19, 2005
1,550
418
Make sure system preferences is closed, open a terminal, then rename this file and reboot:

sudo mv /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.PowerManagement.plist /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/com.apple.PowerManagement-old.plist

There seem to be some common problems with sleep initially when upgrading to Mavericks from previous OSes (as opposed to a clean install). You need to reset the power management preferences to get things working correctly.

Are you referring to sleeping the Mac or sleeping the drives…? :confused:

As far as I can tell, regardless of clean install or upgrade from previous OSes, external drives with FireWire connection will refuse to sleep or spin down...
 

RhinoMac

macrumors newbie
Dec 8, 2012
6
0
I have an external LaCie connected to a late 2012 iMac through a Thunderbolt to FireWire 800 adaptor.

If I put my iMac to sleep or unmount the external drive, the external drive will spin down. However, the external drive never spins down on its own.

I tried unplugging the adaptor from one Thunderbolt port, plugged in the other port, turned on the LaCie, went to System Prefs, unchecked hard drives sleep, closed prefs, got this:
Code:
11/4/13 2:38:19.000 PM kernel[0]: IOThunderboltSwitch<0xffffff8020fb3800>(0x0)::listenerCallback - Thunderbolt HPD packet for route = 0x0 port = 1 unplug = 1
11/4/13 2:38:19.000 PM kernel[0]: [ PCI configuration begin ]
11/4/13 2:38:19.000 PM kernel[0]: [ PCI configuration end, bridges 13, devices 17 ]
11/4/13 2:38:19.655 PM UserEventAgent[220]: FIXME: IOUnserialize has detected a string that is not valid UTF-8, "�<��".
11/4/13 2:38:19.000 PM kernel[0]: Fixing incorrect zfree from zone kalloc.16 to zone kalloc.32
11/4/13 2:38:23.000 PM kernel[0]: IOThunderboltSwitch<0xffffff8020fb3800>(0x0)::listenerCallback - Thunderbolt HPD packet for route = 0x0 port = 3 unplug = 0
11/4/13 2:38:25.000 PM kernel[0]: [ PCI configuration begin ]
11/4/13 2:38:25.000 PM kernel[0]: [ PCI configuration end, bridges 15, devices 17 ]
11/4/13 2:38:25.000 PM kernel[0]: FireWire runtime power conservation disabled. (3)
11/4/13 2:38:25.000 PM kernel[0]: FireWire (OHCI) Lucent ID 5901 PCI now active, GUID 000a2702004781e5; max speed s800.
11/4/13 2:38:25.968 PM UserEventAgent[220]: FIXME: IOUnserialize has detected a string that is not valid UTF-8, "�<��”.
...
11/4/13 2:41:15.943 PM System Preferences[875]: FIXME: IOUnserialize has detected a string that is not valid UTF-8, "�<��".
 

mzd

macrumors 6502a
Jul 25, 2005
951
41
Wisconsin
i'm having this problem too. one FW400 drive for TimeMachine and another FW800 drive for storage won't power down. they aren't chained together.
i guess i can try to switch the FW800 to USB2, but i don't think i have that option on the FW400 drive.
lame. didn't Apple "invent" FireWire???

update. so i repaired permissions due to another problem (system help wouldn't load in any application). now my rather aging FW400 (Maxtor) TimeMachine drive sleeps as before Mavericks. my newer OWC FW800 drive still does not.
today i switched the FW800 to USB2 and it now sleeps right away as expected, as does the FW400 TM drive.
it is just much slower now and my Lightroom photos are all on that drive. :mad:
 
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