MB vs. MBP

[ictiosapiens]

I've seen the argument you're responding to here, and it's ludicrous -- it's YOUR money, so you get to choose what suits you -- and that's even if it doesn't make sense to others.

The "get an Xbox" one is another I hear often. That's all well and good, but the two markets are very different. Most of the games I really like either don't appear on consoles or I don't enjoy playing them on consoles (FPS games, for example -- they just don't work on a joypad for me.)

I don't think Apple will release a small-form-factor MBP any time soon though, so I'm afraid it looks like you're stuck making a compromise one way or another.

Yeah, that's my point exactly, I don't like to be pushed into buying a larger computer than what I wanted, or sacrificing features if I choose the size that suits. It's like the supplier decides what the consumer gets, and not the other way around... I understand that Apple makes more money by keeping fewer lines running. Well, I guess that if the market sector that I represent isn't big enough for apple to spend money on that's the way it will stay...

 

[-::ubermann::-]

I like to have the possibility of playing a nice round of Half Life 2 every once in a while when I'm bored in some random hotel room somewhere. I know I could carry my NDS with me, but WHY??? why can't I have a computer that covers all my necesities, why do I have to settle for less? Other manufacturers are making this machines(dell, sony, Asus, acer) So why can't apple make this computer?

i think the same, i guess games would run much faster in mac os than windows, so why arent macs popular for games?
im still deciding into getting a mac or a dell, because of video cards
there are also some programs that need windows, but i can emule it, not the case of games which need a lot of resources

personally i hate consoles, too bad resolution, too bad gameplay, bad online gaming,u cant create your own mods, games are so expensive, they simply suck compared to pc's

at least age of empires 3 was announced to mac, but its an exception

 

[generik]

I like to have the possibility of playing a nice round of Half Life 2 every once in a while when I'm bored in some random hotel room somewhere. I know I could carry my NDS with me, but WHY??? why can't I have a computer that covers all my necesities, why do I have to settle for less? Other manufacturers are making this machines(dell, sony, Asus, acer) So why can't apple make this computer?

You get what you pay for. Don't like it? Don't question Apple's offerings, go buy a Dell/Asus/Sony/Acer. Especially Acer. You will enjoy it.

 

[AHDuke99]

i had a time decided as well, but after i sold my 15" PB 1.25ghz for $1100 on ebay, and then found a macbook 2.0ghz black for $1175, I decided to get a macbook and use it till santa rosa. i wanted to wait for core 2 duo, but i figured 15% speed gain wasnt worth passing on the deal. $75 for a new computer is a great buy, IMO. Come next year I'll buy a hopefully redesgined macbook pro with santa rosa chip. for now, i hear i can play halo and call of duty 2 on low settings just as well as i could on my 1.25ghz g4.*

 

[Chone]

i think the same, i guess games would run much faster in mac os than windows, so why arent macs popular for games?
im still deciding into getting a mac or a dell, because of video cards
there are also some programs that need windows, but i can emule it, not the case of games which need a lot of resources

personally i hate consoles, too bad resolution, too bad gameplay, bad online gaming,u cant create your own mods, games are so expensive, they simply suck compared to pc's

at least age of empires 3 was announced to mac, but its an exception

Just what exactly makes you think games would run faster on OSX?

Games on OSX is a lost market because in the PPC days it required a huge amount of portage, that reduced interest for the whole industry, noawadays we have similar hardware but there is still one hurdle: directx.

Apple should be more competitive in terms of performance, for example the MacBook should have a dedicated graphics card and the iMac sure as hell shouldn't have mobile parts in it.

Still all is good, if you want a gaming PC, build it yourself, if you want to play the latest games but in a casual way on your laptop, the specs on the MacBook Pros are more than enough and if you want a full-on gaming laptop... then you are making the wrong purchase

 

[ergle2]

i think the same, i guess games would run much faster in mac os than windows, so why arent macs popular for games?

Currently, that's not the case - WoW, for example, runs significantly faster under Windows than MacOS X on the same hardware.

I've read that the upcoming multithreaded OpenGL work will improve things, but to get the benefits the programs themselves require changes too, so existing games won't improve unless the makers release a new version.

Another reason you don't see games is down to third-party libraries. Havok, Bink, and a whole bunch of others. Some arent available for MacOS X, some are but MacOS constitutes a different platform and thus another six-figure licensing fee -- few if any are willing to take the risk to that degree.

The other option is rewriting parts of the game to function without those libraries. In the case of some (say, sound libraries) it might be possible, but I don't see anyone rewriting a game's physics anytime soon.

Finally, the market size is a problem. Not that many Macs vs Windows PCs, and not that many gamers on Macs (a vicious circle, that one), so...

 

[aristobrat]

Finally, the market size is a problem. Not that many Macs vs Windows PCs, and not that many gamers on Macs (a vicious circle, that one), so...

That's what I was thinking. A niche market of a niche market.

 

[ictiosapiens]

You get what you pay for. Don't like it? Don't question Apple's offerings, go buy a Dell/Asus/Sony/Acer. Especially Acer. You will enjoy it.

"Don't question Apple's offerings" ???? hahahaha... Who's apple? The Lord Almighty??? hahahaha

And I really hope I get what I pay for, because with the £1350 that I'm going to pay for my new notebook, I could buy a second hand car in decent conditions... So I'm expecting a pretty decent notebook. With dell, I haven't had problems yet, and my D800 is over three years old. So, whether I end up buying an apple WITH THE HARDWARE THAT I WANT or a dell, Asus, Sony or Acer I will get quality(or keep sending it back until I get quality). Oh, and before you say anything, the sending it back bit, also applies to apple notebooks, if this forums are anything to guide myself by...

 

[generik]

"Don't question Apple's offerings" ???? hahahaha... Who's apple? The Lord Almighty??? hahahaha

And I really hope I get what I pay for, because with the £1350 that I'm going to pay for my new notebook, I could buy a second hand car in decent conditions... So I'm expecting a pretty decent notebook. With dell, I haven't had problems yet, and my D800 is over three years old. So, whether I end up buying an apple WITH THE HARDWARE THAT I WANT or a dell, Asus, Sony or Acer I will get quality(or keep sending it back until I get quality). Oh, and before you say anything, the sending it back bit, also applies to apple notebooks, if this forums are anything to guide myself by...

Oh yeah? MacOS Tax > Microsoft's Tax, so your comparison between hardware fails on that count

 

[Abstract]

blah blah blah....

You have already said, essentially, that "There's nothing in Apple's lineup that suits my needs," so get something else. Think about it for a second: What you're looking for isn't in Apple's product lineup. What else is there to think about? If you don't like what they're offering, then you can always go to a competitor. Sony makes some nice looking computers, but I wouldn't buy one. Toshiba is good, but not the form factor you're looking for. IBMs are fantastic, but ugly. Acer and Asus make nice looking laptops, and I'm sure they make a small, well specced machine. Dell sells something similar to the MacBook, but that doesn't offer you what you really want.

What you're saying is "ludicrous", as someone else said. Just get the machine that does what you need it to do. That Dell XPS 1210 has an option for an GeForce Go 7400 to be put in. Yes, that laptop costs a lot and has a nice graphics card, but I bet "the fan will turn on once or twice."™

 

[ictiosapiens]

blah, blah, blah pt. 2

On my original post I said that I was waiting for apple to offer the computer I want because like I said, I really like Mac OS, and there's been talk of new products in the near future, that's all... Also, it feels like there's a gap where the powerbook 12'' was. I don't think that the macbook really substitutes it, and if you read around this forum, you'll see that I'm not alone...

The reason I mention the other manufacturers, is to make a point that such machine can be made... And obviously eventually I will have to buy a computer, I don't believe in inconditional brand loyalty, so if I can't get a mac, with the specs I want, I'll go for another...

I don't see why guys like you have to come an invalidate my statements as if you hold the ultimate truth, and if someone says that apple could have included such and such machine in their lineup, you label it ludicrous. Again, I think apple computers do look awesome, and their OS is fantastic, but they are not flawless and there're a lot of people out there who bought an apple that was missing features thay wanted just because of their brand loyalty and Mac OS addiction.

That Dell XPS 1210 has an option for an GeForce Go 7400 to be put in. Yes, that laptop costs a lot and has a nice graphics card, but I bet "the fan will turn on once or twice."™

It's £250 more than the high end macbook, including the 7400, Core 2 Duo, 3 years warranty and 2GB of ram... Here in the UK, for apple care alone I would have shell £199... so, no, not more expensive...

The noise from the fans, yep, you are probably right, but it won't be cooking my privates

 

[sierra oscar]

...I really like Mac OS, and there's been talk of new products in the near future, that's all... Also, it feels like there's a gap where the powerbook 12'' was. I don't think that the macbook really substitutes it, and if you read around this forum, you'll see that I'm not alone...
...invalidate my statements as if you hold the ultimate truth, and if someone says that apple could have included such and such machine in their lineup, you label it ludicrous. Again, I think apple computers do look awesome, and their OS is fantastic, but they are not flawless and there're a lot of people out there who bought an apple that was missing features thay wanted just because of their brand loyalty and Mac OS addiction.

Well said actually.

I admit to having an OSX addiction (and 'Classic' before that) and will buy whatever Apple puts out - and this isn't the wisest thing to do - it's an emotional decision - I acknowledge that. I love macs (but they aren't perfect). Nor am I in my apple product opinions either - and I think we all deserve to be heard in a forum like this - 'truths' are personal I believe (in everything) - sometimes when we are passionate about something - we can forget that.

Getting back to the MBP versus MB question
Any mac lover I think - would rub their hands with glee at the MBP (maybe an emotional reaction again) but for me - the MB is the 'right' one for me. I do need a solid workhorse for research, and the MB is enough bang for my dollar (dollar for dollar that is).

Put it this way... if I get a revA (and problematic) MBP on my post grad budget - that's all I can really get - so it better be perfect (which not all things are).

If I get a MB, I can get a decent 8 megapixel camera, keyboard skin, screen protector, ext keyboard, new speakers, new MacTruck work in case, new mouse, possibly a shuffle - all well under the entire price of the low end MBP. Whilst the MB is also revA and problematic too - it's less cash to jeopardise until all the bugs are worked out. I can't afford to lose cash or time more importantly in repairs. I know I can better take the MB price hit than the MBP - if machine longevity isn't going to happen for me - as I use all my equipment until it dies.

 

[brikeh]

Whilst the MB is also revA and problematic too - it's less cash to jeopardise until all the bugs are worked out. I can't afford to lose cash or time more importantly in repairs.

Huh? This makes no sense. If its going in for repair you loose time. Time=money...whatever machine you send in for repair. Id say MBs are more problematic than MBPs. Theyre not as well built as the MBPs. You get what you pay for.

 

[sierra oscar]

Whilst the MB is also revA and problematic too - it's less cash to jeopardise until all the bugs are worked out. I can't afford to lose cash or time more importantly in repairs.QUOTE]

Huh? This makes no sense. If its going in for repair you loose time. Time=money...whatever machine you send in for repair. Id say MBs are more problematic than MBPs. Theyre not as well built as the MBPs. You get what you pay for.

The 'spirit' of my post was that I can afford to lose the MB as it is less capital investment - for a RevB of something later on if it's a problem machine ... sort of don't understand why your response had to be framed in a condescending way...

 

[ictiosapiens]

The 'spirit' of my post was that I can afford to lose the MB as it is less capital investment - for a RevB of something later on if it's a problem machine ... sort of don't understand why your response had to be framed in a condescending way...

Because apparently that's the way you express yourself in macrumors... you are wrong and I'm right sort of thing... lol

People forget that the point of a discussion is hearing other people's take on topics, possibly finding real answers, and end up focusing on getting their points across just for the sake of somehow "wining" the argument(like is some kind of match)

 

[ergle2]

People forget that the point of a discussion is hearing other people's take on topics, possibly finding real answers, and end up focusing on getting their points across just for the sake of somehow "wining" the arguement(like is some kind of match)

That's the difference between debate and argument.