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Dmunjal

macrumors 68000
Jun 20, 2010
1,533
1,543
I still don't think that's feasible on a 9.7" screen.

Feasible or not, people want to do it. How about two chat sessions? Plenty of use cases that work on a small screen. The hard part is getting the UI right.
 

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
I guess the real question to be asked is if features like this are so high in demand, how come these competing tablets are such spectacular failures? There can only be three possibilities I can think of:

1) people are too invested in ios apps, and are now miserably buying the new Apple gear every year even though they dislike it but just can't break out of the ecosystem because of all the apps they bought -- well wait a minute, if you can spend money buying an iPad every yr, surely you can buy the "better" and cheaper competitors and just rebuy the apps you need. Yeah this theory holds no water.

2) Apple has a mind control ray which they bathe the United states and the rest of the world with every qtr. You don't actually want Apple products but you've actually been brainwashed. You despise the product but Apple execs moonlight as Jedi knights and you have no choice but to buy Apple - now wait a minute. We're not six year olds. This theory doesn't hold any water.

3) people are weighing the Pros and cons, and they prefer an iPad -- hmmm. Bingo.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
Feasible or not, people want to do it. How about two chat sessions? Plenty of use cases that work on a small screen. The hard part is getting the UI right.

My belief is that if it could be done well, Apple would have implemented it by now.

I'm not saying it can't be done, just that I don't believe there's a real need/case for it, that's all.

----------

Feasible or not, people want to do it. How about two chat sessions? Plenty of use cases that work on a small screen. The hard part is getting the UI right.

When you say "people", how many do you *know* (100%) that absolutely *need* it and won't use an iPad until it does it?

I just don't think there's a need/case for it, if the iPad didn't do the things that people do genuinely want/need it to do (well), they simply wouldn't buy it.
 

Dmunjal

macrumors 68000
Jun 20, 2010
1,533
1,543
My belief is that if it could be done well, Apple would have implemented it by now.

I'm not saying it can't be done, just that I don't believe there's a real need/case for it, that's all.

----------



When you say "people", how many do you *know* (100%) that absolutely *need* it and won't use an iPad until it does it?

I just don't think there's a need/case for it, if the iPad didn't do the things that people do genuinely want/need it to do (well), they simply wouldn't buy it.

There is a difference between want and need. I would put split screen in the want category. As I said before, I do see many people multitasking naturally with two devices. Is it enough to get people off the iOS ecosystem? No. Will Apple offer it soon to better compete against Samsung? Yes.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Is this post in jest? I assure you no company has board meetings where they say "we need to increase our marketshare, regardless of how much money we hemorrhage!!!"

This is exactly what goes on in the board rooms of Amazon, Gillette, Coca Cola and any other company who live off massive market share and razor thin margins.
 

ecrispy

macrumors regular
Oct 27, 2013
187
29
They were convicted in one of the largest patent infringement cases in world history. I think that destroys their reputation for being "original" for a long, long while.

Samsung should be doing a string of "reputation building" ads instead of touting their innovation, which has been proven in a court of law to be suspect.

The case as you well know was a total joke - biased judge who refused to even admit Samsung's evidence, biased US jurors who are blinded by hype and probably own Apple products.

And similar cases in other countries, Apple lost. Only the US allows Apple's invalid patents like patenting rectangular corners, black borders, slide to unlock, all of which have prior art and should never have been awarded.

Apple makes stylish versions of tech invented by other companies. Samsung is a huge corporation that makes pretty much everything you can think of.

----------

I guess the real question to be asked is if features like this are so high in demand, how come these competing tablets are such spectacular failures? There can only be three possibilities I can think of:

1) people are too invested in ios apps, and are now miserably buying the new Apple gear every year even though they dislike it but just can't break out of the ecosystem because of all the apps they bought -- well wait a minute, if you can spend money buying an iPad every yr, surely you can buy the "better" and cheaper competitors and just rebuy the apps you need. Yeah this theory holds no water.

2) Apple has a mind control ray which they bathe the United states and the rest of the world with every qtr. You don't actually want Apple products but you've actually been brainwashed. You despise the product but Apple execs moonlight as Jedi knights and you have no choice but to buy Apple - now wait a minute. We're not six year olds. This theory doesn't hold any water.

3) people are weighing the Pros and cons, and they prefer an iPad -- hmmm. Bingo.

4) the power of marketing, branding and hype, and owning a status symbol.

Or do you really thing designer jeans that cost 10x are actually better than regular plain jeans? Same thing applies in every market and product segment - Apple caters to the luxury status symbol segment, markets it as such, and people lap it up.
 

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
The case as you well know was a total joke - biased judge who refused to even admit Samsung's evidence, biased US jurors who are blinded by hype and probably own Apple products.

And similar cases in other countries, Apple lost. Only the US allows Apple's invalid patents like patenting rectangular corners, black borders, slide to unlock, all of which have prior art and should never have been awarded.

Apple makes stylish versions of tech invented by other companies. Samsung is a huge corporation that makes pretty much everything you can think of.

----------



4) the power of marketing, branding and hype, and owning a status symbol.

Or do you really thing designer jeans that cost 10x are actually better than regular plain jeans? Same thing applies in every market and product segment - Apple caters to the luxury status symbol segment, markets it as such, and people lap it up.

Yeah that doesn't work, because if a product sucks and people dont like it no amount of marketing and hype will save it. If the designer jeans tear apart after first use, no one will buy them. Unless of course youre suggesting that the millions upon millions of people who buy apple are just mindless drones who just follow the hype and dont care how crappy the product is. (If you are suggesting that, there's really no reason for you to even respond further)
 

blackcrayon

macrumors 68020
Mar 10, 2003
2,262
1,829
Apple makes stylish versions of tech invented by other companies. Samsung is a huge corporation that makes pretty much everything you can think of.


Hilarious. All of the other computer companies should just make "stylish" versions of their tech and duplicate Apple's success. That's all it takes, right? By your definition of "invented", just about nothing is ever invented by anyone, anywhere :rolleyes:
 

RenoG

macrumors 65816
Oct 7, 2010
1,275
59
4) the power of marketing, branding and hype, and owning a status symbol.

Or do you really thing designer jeans that cost 10x are actually better than regular plain jeans? Same thing applies in every market and product segment - Apple caters to the luxury status symbol segment, markets it as such, and people lap it up.

Yes this works for those that are into status and who are materialistic, however I know waaaay to many people who are the complete opposite in fact some who are anti status symbol, tightfisted type who have hundreds of thousands in the bank yet drive a corolla and look halfway homeless by choice, and yet will touch nothing but apple, again it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with apples luxury marketing pitch or whatever.
 

tdale

macrumors 65816
Aug 11, 2013
1,293
77
Christchurch, N.Z.
Yes this works for those that are into status and who are materialistic, however I know waaaay to many people who are the complete opposite in fact some who are anti status symbol, tightfisted type who have hundreds of thousands in the bank yet drive a corolla and look halfway homeless by choice, and yet will touch nothing but apple, again it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with apples luxury marketing pitch or whatever.

Yes, many seem to lap up the status argument. Applies to some clearly, but many of us prefer a real ecosystem, security, and the ability to update the phone
 

RenoG

macrumors 65816
Oct 7, 2010
1,275
59
Applies to some clearly, but many of us prefer a real ecosystem, security, and the ability to update the phone

Yup and This is me 100%. The last time my contract was up I really wanted to try out the windows phone I thought it was pretty interesting and worth a shot, but as I thought it out after some time I realized that the mobile phone was realistically only about 50% of the total value of the the whole. The ecosystem is real and I've come to understand that no mater how sweet a different phone is it's nothing of value to me if it doesn't come with a strong/competitive ecosystem package.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Yes, many seem to lap up the status argument. Applies to some clearly, but many of us prefer a real ecosystem, security, and the ability to update the phone

Except maybe for some Chinese no-name droids and "competing alternatives" such as Jolla/Sailfish and Tizen, you get all of that from all major players.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
Yes, many seem to lap up the status argument. Applies to some clearly, but many of us prefer a real ecosystem, security, and the ability to update the phone

I completely agree.

I'm self employed and use my phone for business.

I like having the assurance that if I get up one day and my phone's dead, I can get it replaced in an Apple store that same day and be up and running (thanks to an iCloud restore in the Apple store) not long after that.

Where/how do Galaxy owners get that same reassurance from?

I'm not knocking the Galaxy, I'm just saying that Apple offers features that appeal to me, that Samsung et al don't.

A lot of time, it's not just about the tangible product you have in your hand, it's about everything 'behind the scenes' that goes with it (AppleCare +, retail stores, secure O/S, great ecosystem etc) and that (for ME) is where Apple wins everytime and why they will continue to get my business.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Where/how do Galaxy owners get that same reassurance from?

The same place. Enter your Google account details in the new phone, wham, you're good to go.

EDIT: Not to mention that with Android you can backup/restore your phone in any number of ways, down to selecting individual files if that's how you like to roll. Waaaay more options available for that than for an iPhone, but the standard behavior is the same.

Same goes for Windows Phone. Everything down to draft SMS-messages get restored by just, well, doing nothing when you activate the phone.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
The same place. Enter your Google account details in the new phone, wham, you're good to go.

Sorry, I meant the bit about going in to a retail store to get the phone replaced, not the restore process.

If you wake up and your Galaxy is dead, what's the repair/replace process, can you go into a store somewhere and get it repaired/replaced?
 

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
I completely agree.

I'm self employed and use my phone for business.

I like having the assurance that if I get up one day and my phone's dead, I can get it replaced in an Apple store that same day and be up and running (thanks to an iCloud restore in the Apple store) not long after that.

Where/how do Galaxy owners get that same reassurance from?

I'm not knocking the Galaxy, I'm just saying that Apple offers features that appeal to me, that Samsung et al don't.

A lot of time, it's not just about the tangible product you have in your hand, it's about everything 'behind the scenes' that goes with it (AppleCare +, retail stores, secure O/S, great ecosystem etc) and that (for ME) is where Apple wins everytime and why they will continue to get my business.

To be fair, you can just go to your carriers store and get it replaced the same day too, free if still under warranty.

I think there are other benefits to the apple ecosystem but repair wise they're both mostly the same.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Sorry, I meant the bit about going in to a retail store to get the phone replaced, not the restore process.

If you wake up and your Galaxy is dead, what's the repair/replace process, can you go into a store somewhere and get it repaired/replaced?

Don't see why you couldn't. And standard lead time for getting an iPhone replaced over here is two weeks, so what you are describing is not a universally applicable benefit.

Although for business use, I'd make sure that I get onsite service/replacement, something Apple at least used to suck at providing.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
To be fair, you can just go to your carriers store and get it replaced the same day too, free if still under warranty.

I think there are other benefits to the apple ecosystem but repair wise they're both mostly the same.

I'm not sure where you are located (USA?), but here in the UK that doesn't happen, I'm pretty sure it's only Apple that repair/replace on the spot.

We have network retail stores (Vodafone, O2, EE, 3), but they don't repair phones and they don't carry the stock for replacements, as A) they are often small physical stores and B) are there to primarily sell things such as contracts and accessories.

I'm certain that if you went in to any of the stores above with a dead Galaxy (or any phone for that matter), they'd simply offer to send it away for repair for you.

The only difference would be if it was under 1 month old, where the law says you are then entitled to a refund/replacement at your discretion.

We also have non specific mobile phone shops (Carphone Warehouse and Phones 4 U for example), but the same applies to them.

Another reason for the 'we send for repair' is that they try and sell you up front is their horrendously expensive insurance policy.

That may well give you a replacement on the spot, or within 24 hours, but otherwise you're out of luck unless you've got an iPhone.
 
Last edited:

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
I'm not sure where you are located (USA?), but here in the UK that doesn't happen, I'm pretty sure it's only Apple that repair/replace on the spot.

We have network retail stores (Vodafone, O2, EE, 3), but they don't repair phones and they don't carry the stock for replacements, as A) they are often small physical stores and B) are there to primarily sell things such as contracts and accessories.

I'm certain that if you went in to any of the stores above with a dead Galaxy (or any phone for that matter), they'd simply offer to send it away for repair for you.

The only difference would be if it was under 1 month old, where the law says you are then entitled to a refund/replacement at your discretion.

We also have non specific mobile phone shops (Carphone Warehouse and Phones 4 U for example), but the same applies to them.

Another reason for the 'we send for repair' is that they try and sell you up front is their horrendously expensive insurance policy. That may well give you a replacement on the spot, or within 24 hours, but otherwise you're out of luck unless you've got an iPhone.

I'm in the US, and havent had a problem with getting a replacement if its under warranty. If its not yes they'd have to repair it and send it away. Does the apple store fix the same day? I dont have an iPhone but if that's the case then yeah that's a good thing.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
Don't see why you couldn't. And standard lead time for getting an iPhone replaced over here is two weeks, so what you are describing is not a universally applicable benefit.

Who are you referring to that has a 2 week lead time for replacing an iPhone?

I'm pretty sure you must be referring to a carrier (ATT&T/Verizon)?

If you went in to an Apple store, they'd repair/replace on the spot, there wouldn't be any 2 week wait.

Although for business use, I'd make sure that I get onsite service/replacement, something Apple at least used to suck at providing.

But Apple offer that now, as part of owning an iPhone.

I recently had an issue with my 5S, took it in, got it inspected, got it replaced (I was in and out within an hour with working phone).

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I'm in the US, and havent had a problem with getting a replacement if its under warranty.

Ah ok.

Do you have a Galaxy and is that an 'on the spot' replacement (and from where)?

If its not yes they'd have to repair it and send it away.

So if you woke up on a Sunday morning with a dead phone (Galaxy?), you can go into a store and get it replaced on the spot under warranty?

Does the apple store fix the same day? I dont have an iPhone but if that's the case then yeah that's a good thing.

Yes, on the spot. They check it out, maybe repair (replace faulty battery for example), or replace.

You can then also use the free in store wifi to connect to iCloud and restore your phone.
 

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
Ah ok.

Do you have a Galaxy and is that an 'on the spot' replacement (and from where)?

I have a g3, its new so havent had to replace it, but I've had other android phones and yes if its under warranty, they will replace on the spot in the carriers store. If they don't have your phone in stock they will overnight you one.



So if you woke up on a Sunday morning with a dead phone (Galaxy?), you can go into a store and get it replaced on the spot under warranty?

Provided the store was open on Sunday, yes on the spot if under warranty.



Yes, on the spot. They check it out, maybe repair (replace faulty battery for example), or
You can then also use the free in store wifi to connect to iCloud and restore your phone.

This is great, and no you wouldn't get repairs on spot at the carriers store. I see the benefit you're talking about based on that alone.
 

zipa

macrumors 65816
Feb 19, 2010
1,442
1
Who are you referring to that has a 2 week lead time for replacing an iPhone?

If you went in to an Apple store, they'd repair/replace on the spot, there wouldn't be any 2 week wait.

Everyone who sells them, since they all use the same service provider. There are no Apple stores in Finland, so going into one is not an option.
 

Azzin

macrumors 603
Jun 23, 2010
5,425
3,724
London, England.
I have a g3, its new so havent had to replace it, but I've had other android phones and yes if its under warranty, they will replace on the spot in the carriers store. If they don't have your phone in stock they will overnight you one.

Ok gotcha!

In the UK, if you haven't forked out for their stupidly expensive insurance, it simply goes away for repair...

Provided the store was open on Sunday, yes on the spot if under warranty.

Good info, thanks-any idea if that applies to all carriers?

Also, do you have phone stores that sell all the carriers (equivalent to Carphone Warehouse & Phones 4 U in the UK for example)?

This is great, and no you wouldn't get repairs on spot at the carriers store. I see the benefit you're talking about based on that alone.

No worries, we got there in the end! :D

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Everyone who sells them, since they all use the same service provider. There are no Apple stores in Finland, so going into one is not an option.

Aha!

What about if you phoned Apple?

For example, in the UK you can get a replacement couriered to you (and the dead phone collected at the same time) if going to an Apple store isn't an option for you.
 

Trapezoid

macrumors 65816
Mar 19, 2014
1,429
0
Ok gotcha!

In the UK, if you haven't forked out for their stupidly expensive insurance, it simply goes away for repair...

even if under warranty? I'm sure if its something like broken screen or water damage they won't replace without insurance, but if it's a defect they will.

Good info, thanks-any idea if that applies to all carriers?

Good question, im not sure. I have Verizon and that's who I'm talking about.

Also, do you have phone stores that sell all the carriers (equivalent to Carphone Warehouse & Phones 4 U in the UK for example)?



No worries, we got there in the end! :D

Yes, at least in nyc I've seen such stores that sell everything. Although, I'm not sure what their repair n replacement policy would be...
 
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