Apple 'Concerned' About China's New App Store Rules Banning Unregistered Foreign Apps

[AppliedMicro]

"Are these websites available?" Yes (VPN)
"Are these websites blocked?" Yes (Great Firewall)

Two different questions.

See? It's a reading comprehension problem (aka, not my problem). It's actually quite simple when you break it down because the original guy asked "is X available?" which is not the same as "is X banned?", the latter of which he already answered in his post.

They may be factually available if you're tech-savvy enough. Though the government does everything in their power (without cutting off China from the internet entirely) to make sure VPNs aren't allowing such access.

As you said yourself: Their blocking gets the "job done". Cause it's unavailable to a critical mass of people.

The rest is mental gymnastics.

 

[I7guy]

Apple gets almost 20 percent of their total sales from China. For Apple's 2022 fiscal year, net sales in Greater China was $74.2 billion. As of July 1, 2023 (the end of Apple's 3rd quarter for fiscal 2023), net sales in Greater China stood at $57.475 billion.

If Apple's willing to sell their principles of privacy to Alphabet for between $15 billion and $20 billion a year to make Google the default search engine, Apple's not going to leave the China market. Ever.

Hmmm. Does anything change when a person types in www . Google . Com into their browser?

Two things are happening:
1. Apple will tax google as long as they can get away with it.
2. Apple will leave the eu before china

 

[wegster]

You are free to say and do as you'd like in China too, of course to a degree. That's the same in the US. You think I can say and do whatever I want in the US? No, I can be fired, imprisoned, or debanked for having the wrong political ideas. We have over a hundred years of precedent proving we do not allow dissidents to say or do whatever they want including how our government CRUSHED labor movements in the 1920's and 1930's or how we destroyed the Black Panther Party. A more recent example of this were the rail strikes.

Fired for political beliefs? Possible in reality, but with legal protections and very likely a mess that few companies want to get into.

Certainly fair game to bring up some historic issues, but then Tiananmen square is certainly also fair game in more recent times as well, no? Seems like an almost universal thing - governments and those in power wish to remain so. The US doesn’t typically bring in tanks, although yep, there’s lots I’d love to see improved with the US government, including the no special two party system beholden to big $.

And how do you spin Hong Kong and their ongoing desire to remain politically free of China? Thailand? Everyone just ‘a big happy family’ that just doesn’t want to be in the family so is or will be forced to be so?

Did you know that there are anti-Xi factions within the CPC? They are openly against him and Xi Jinping Thought, some are very pro West for example and wish for China to align itself with Western liberal values -- the majority do not agree with this of course. The one party system does not eviscerate opposition to the majority's position. If China were so deathly afraid of their citizenry accessing Western sites, why have they been so lenient on VPNs? Why not outright outlaw accessing all Western sites?

China is well known for their IP theft, which has been baked in over time to various agreements with companies loonies for lower-cost outsourcing to China. I’d expect at least part of it is playing ‘nice-ish’ from both a political and business standpoint.

I’ll be the first to admit however, I don’t track or keep up on what sites China does nor does not allow.

Is any of China‘s press freely critical of the government today? (a serious question).

The Great Firewall has done well to protect China from external disinformation, the majority of Chinese people recognize and understand this because again, it turns out that contrary to what we're being told, China do something to help their own people and openly document the whole thing for everyone in their country to witness. The CIA concluded many years ago that infiltrating the Chinese citizenry is now next to impossible, thanks in part to the Great Firewall. Seems like the Great Firewall has been a big win in stopping foreign bots!

Anyway before long half the people talking about the evils of the Great Firewall will welcome our own equivalent of it in order to block "Russian bots" or whatever we're supposed to be scared of this time.

 

[wegster]

People in China don’t walk around in fear of criticizing their government. If they post something on Weibo that the government deems subversive, they’re going to get a text which roughly translates to “comment not make good feeling China nation. Please continue make good happiness toward China people for healthy nation.” And I’m not speaking broken English in a mocking way, it’s that the language does not translate over well.

Good to see no repeat of Tainenmen square - are you sure this no longer ‘can’ happen, or just hasn’t recently?

Meanwhile it doesn’t see the press is actually free. You may dislike the link source (I’m not a huge fan myself), but there are others.

Media Censorship in China

China’s central government has cracked down on press freedom as the country expands its international influence, but in the internet age, many of its citizens hunger for a free flow of information.

www.cfr.org

I believe this is codified somewhere in Chinese law (re buried in wikipedia here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech_by_country

No unit or individual may use the Internet to create, replicate, retrieve, or transmit the following kinds of information:

1. Inciting to resist or violate the Constitution or laws or the implementation of administrative regulations;
2. Inciting to overthrow the government or the socialist system;
3. Inciting division of the country, harming national unification;
4. Inciting hatred or discrimination among nationalists or harming the unity of the nationalities;
5. Making falsehoods or distorting the truth, spreading rumours, destroying the order of society;
6. Promoting feudal superstitions, sexually suggestive material, gambling, violence, murder;
7. Engaging in terrorism or inciting others to criminal activity; openly insulting other people or distorting the truth to slander people;
8. Injuring the reputation of state organs;
9. Other activities against the Constitution, laws or administrative regulations.

Numbers 1-5 are particularly interesting, as who actually determines if the intent of the law/rule was broken - of course, the government setting the policy in the first place. This could effectively be easily taken as - no disagreement with your overlords/government are tolerated.

Whereas in the U.S. if you go around criticizing the power structure the government contracts private companies to censor you and have you removed from society and close your bank account, and hides behind the guise of a so-called free market, with gigantic companies who’s CEOs visit the White House on a regular basis saying that private companies have a right to do business with whomever they choose. Now try to refuse to bake a cake for an LGBT wedding.

Any sources or links to these things other than the LGBT cakes, which yeah, I think a fair number of politics and people in the US are bit ‘extra’ all around, although ‘the right to refuse service’ is a core of numerous businesses.

The US, fed by its ‘conservatives’ (numerous kinds nowadays, but certainly most Republicans to differing degrees) certainly uses the ‘socalism boogeyman’ far too often. Education system, school busses, you name it is technically ‘socialism’ and not the end of the world. Meanwhile, for mediocre medical results and crazy $ - this is not single payer or socialized (and should be IMO) because of the political FUD (fear uncertainty and doubt) constantly sown by right-leaning politicians and pawns, and those that just don’t know any better. (There are debates to be had there, but most of them never happen, kind of like th fallback argument of ‘omg but think of the children!’ on the left side..)

So yeah, out of the gate, it’s still easier to believe the questionable politicians and news about any communist or socialist country as it effectively leaps to ‘the big evil empire‘ mentally and emotionally. China has absolutely made incredible leaps in technology and infrastructure over the years, but claiming they are ‘wonderful’ and are completely altruistic while bashing everyone else’s - isn’t too likely to lead to changed impressions. BUt hey, you keep doing you, I guess.

 

[wegster]

Yes, and American lives mean so much to the USA, right? Take a look around you. All of our cities are crumbling to the ground while China has built more high speed rail and highways in the last ten years to make Europe blush. Pathetic, this little box you "live" in.

Yep, this one’s true. Some Chinese questionable buildings, but nonetheless they’ve done a lot. I’d be curious about knowing more on the hows and end to end funding of it, as things go blur together when China has controlling stakes or ownership of large chunks of industry. This does not negate the statement that China has built like mad - while US seriously can’t get off it’s pulpit to remember the government is FOR the people, not for the power, and ‘bad jokes’ like Flint, Michigan water system, lacking infrastructure refreshes, etc. are all paying as a result.

 

[wegster]

While we were on the whole ‘all of China loves everything and VPNs aren’t an issue’ etc., I came across this - lies or not then?

Chinese programmer ordered to pay 1m yuan for using virtual private network — Guardian US

Police confiscate ‘illegal income’ of developer deemed to have used ‘unauthorised channels’ to connect to international networks

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