2019 Formula 1 Season Thread

[apolloa]

Not to be a dick here, but that's unreasonable. Every car is over the bumps on that corner, and only one has failed. Track limits are defined on a per corner (seriously) basis by the race director for each weekend. It is not the drivers to blame. And it certainly isn't Vettels fault that his car broke - he isn't even the worst "offender" for it.

New rules won't close the performance gaps between the cars. Just makes them easier to follow. If you think this is spread out then go back to the 90s without rose tints and read the results. Cars being 2-3 laps down was completely normal.

Firstly they were ALL cheating going off track limits, the commentators pointed it out quite correctly, but if they didn’t do it they wouldn’t be in such bumpy parts.

And secondly the new rules are designed EXACTLY to make the racing much much much closer and not allow teams to stream ahead like they are, no idea why you think otherwise.. it will put a LOT of control in them and what they can do. Rightfully so, next year I only see viewing figures dropping even lower then they already have.

 

[nebo1ss]

There is a point of view floating around that Ferrari was doing something with the fuel flow and after a complaint from Red Bull they had to remove it. Hence why they not so good this weekend.

 

[Akrapovic]

They weren’t cheating. As pointed out by the commentators, 3 track limits violations that gain time lead to a penalty. They were not penalised so this was clearly not cheating. No offence, but just because you don’t like it, doesn’t make it cheating. It was clearly within the limits defined by the race director in the drivers briefings.

Secondly, the new rules make it easier to follow. It won’t somehow stop good teams having better cars and driving off. Anyone who thinks that is going to be severely disappointed. They also need to check up on F1 history and see what sort of gaps there has been in previous generations. This is far closer than it ever has been.

I can’t believe it’s even a discussion to be honest. Anyone who thinks huge rule changes bring things closer together has never been through an F1 rule change. It allows teams with budgets to make the best of the regulations quicker. The one exception to this was 2009 and that was purely the double diffuser that stopped that once that was sorted, Red Bull dominated. But those rules were going to bunch everyone up and make it better...until Vettel and RBR came along. And then the turbos and bigger wings would do it...until Mercedes came along. And this next rule set will have the same effect.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Congratulations to Lewis and Mercedes. Do you not have access to Now TV. I took a three month subscription to Sky sports on now TV at a special price of £16 per month just to watch the F1 racing.

I can’t record off it that’s my issue. I can’t usually watch races live as I’m a family man and busy at weekends. I used to record the races and watch delayed at my leisure. I did have a streaming box for years which ripped off the sky feed but the lack of recording meant I rarely watched it. I think the sport is making its way back to terrestrial anyway so i’ll be back on it in a few years no doubt.

 

[apolloa]

I can’t record off it that’s my issue. I can’t usually watch races live as I’m a family man and busy at weekends. I used to record the races and watch delayed at my leisure. I did have a streaming box for years which ripped off the sky feed but the lack of recording meant I rarely watched it. I think the sport is making its way back to terrestrial anyway so i’ll be back on it in a few years no doubt.

Sky have exclusive rights till 2024 I believe so don’t expect it back on terrestrial anytime soon unfortunately.
[automerge]1572819125[/automerge]

They weren’t cheating. As pointed out by the commentators, 3 track limits violations that gain time lead to a penalty. They were not penalised so this was clearly not cheating. No offence, but just because you don’t like it, doesn’t make it cheating. It was clearly within the limits defined by the race director in the drivers briefings.

Secondly, the new rules make it easier to follow. It won’t somehow stop good teams having better cars and driving off. Anyone who thinks that is going to be severely disappointed. They also need to check up on F1 history and see what sort of gaps there has been in previous generations. This is far closer than it ever has been.

I can’t believe it’s even a discussion to be honest. Anyone who thinks huge rule changes bring things closer together has never been through an F1 rule change. It allows teams with budgets to make the best of the regulations quicker. The one exception to this was 2009 and that was purely the double diffuser that stopped that once that was sorted, Red Bull dominated. But those rules were going to bunch everyone up and make it better...until Vettel and RBR came along. And then the turbos and bigger wings would do it...until Mercedes came along. And this next rule set will have the same effect.

Oh ok, so the commenters in your world said the exact opposite to what they actually claimed.. and just because they aren’t penalised doesn’t mean they aren’t cheating.. when everyone is doing it..
as for your comment on the 2021 rules, I don’t think you paid any attention to them, their aim, what they are and what they involve, not one bit actually.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

Sky have exclusive rights till 2024 I believe so don’t expect it back on terrestrial anytime soon unfortunately.

That’s what I mean, a few years time. Well it’s their loss as there’s millions like me lol which is why Liberty Media have commented on how the PPV companies are limiting outreach for the sport. I’ll wait for now and enjoy other sports I have access to and continue following F1 through write ups and news notifications.

 

[apolloa]

That’s what I mean, a few years time. Well it’s their loss as there’s millions like me lol which is why Liberty Media have commented on how the PPV companies are limiting outreach for the sport. I’ll wait for now and enjoy other sports I have access to and continue following F1 through write ups and news notifications.

They have at least agreed to allow channel 4 carry on as they are showing the highlights. I would ditch Sky in our house if it was my choice and use Now TV and Channel 4. I dislike supporting monopolies on sports viewing.. it’s not exactly a free or fare market. Then again if the BBC wasn’t such a disaster and had to sell F1 to save them from bankruptcy it would still be on terrestrial TV..

 

[BenTrovato]

Today’s race was tough to watch. I was in Austin for the 2017 race and watching it on tv I felt like I was in heaven that I didn’t have to do that trek from COTA back to the hotel, especially after such a dull race.

F1 has always been like this. We get great races, and then we get ones like this. I think the problem is the sport doesn’t do enough to make it more competitive. Mercedes switched their development to next years car 3 months ago and is still wiping the field. I want to be excited for 2021 but I can’t see how it won’t just be more of the same with an extra overtake here and there.

Last one.. I’m kinda getting tired of drivers asking for more power on the radio and the delta they should be driving to maximize the tyres. I’d rather see the drivers pushing flat out every lap and them making the decision when to pit. It feels too engineered.

 

[Apple fanboy]

The rule changes won’t make them closer. It will do the opposite. Ferrari and Mercedes are already working on their 2021 car. Williams are not. So they won’t start at the same place.
When the current regulations came in Mercedes were miles ahead. Now the field has closed up significantly. There can be any one of three teams on pole or winning the race.
That’s unusual for F1. McLaren don’t seem far off that group either. With the right development Renault could make the leap as well.

But hopefully it will allow the teams to drive closer to each other. But let’s be honest do you prefer to see overtakes when the car behind lunges into the corner and breaks later than the other guy, or hit the DRS switch and just drive by on the straight like a motorway pass? I know which I prefer.

Congratulations Lewis on number 6. He could already be on 7 if it wasn’t for that year of unreliability with Nico.

Will he win again next year? I don’t know. Ferrari have made a lot of improvements this year. If they had a driver as consistent as Lewis I think they could do it.
But if they continue to make bad calls on tactics or back the wrong driver, possibly not.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

They have at least agreed to allow channel 4 carry on as they are showing the highlights. I would ditch Sky in our house if it was my choice and use Now TV and Channel 4. I dislike supporting monopolies on sports viewing.. it’s not exactly a free or fare market. Then again if the BBC wasn’t such a disaster and had to sell F1 to save them from bankruptcy it would still be on terrestrial TV..

Don’t forget channel 4 originally approached Bernie in 2011 to share coverage with the BBC which would have kept it all on FTA. The dwarf blocked it and went with Sky so we’ve got that tosser to thank all these years on.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Don’t forget channel 4 originally approached Bernie in 2011 to share coverage with the BBC which would have kept it all on FTA. The dwarf blocked it and went with Sky so we’ve got that tosser to thank all these years on.

The highlights show is fine most of the time. But when it starts at 11 in the evening, I struggle.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

The highlights show is fine most of the time. But when it starts at 11 in the evening, I struggle.

Difficult to avoid the result in situations like that. I tend to just read a BBC article on the race if I know the dismissing positions. Not exactly a great situation for fans of the sport and a lot of other countries have to put up with this sort of monopoly too. The days of PPV are numbered on the scale Sky charge and hopefully at worst the likes of Amazon or Netflix acquire sport and offer at nominal cost of terrestrial can’t do it.

 

[Apple fanboy]

Difficult to avoid the result in situations like that. I tend to just read a BBC article on the race if I know the dismissing positions. Not exactly a great situation for fans of the sport and a lot of other countries have to put up with this sort of monopoly too. The days of PPV are numbered on the scale Sky charge and hopefully at worst the likes of Amazon or Netflix acquire sport and offer at nominal cost of terrestrial can’t do it.

Avoiding it on the day isn’t a problem for me. But we have lots of F1 fans at work so watching it the following evening doesn’t work.
Plus if I’ve been at work all day I don’t want to come home and blank Mrs AFB for 2 and a half hours whilst I catch up on the racing.

 

[apolloa]

The rule changes won’t make them closer. It will do the opposite. Ferrari and Mercedes are already working on their 2021 car. Williams are not. So they won’t start at the same place.
When the current regulations came in Mercedes were miles ahead. Now the field has closed up significantly. There can be any one of three teams on pole or winning the race.
That’s unusual for F1. McLaren don’t seem far off that group either. With the right development Renault could make the leap as well.

But hopefully it will allow the teams to drive closer to each other. But let’s be honest do you prefer to see overtakes when the car behind lunges into the corner and breaks later than the other guy, or hit the DRS switch and just drive by on the straight like a motorway pass? I know which I prefer.

Congratulations Lewis on number 6. He could already be on 7 if it wasn’t for that year of unreliability with Nico.

Will he win again next year? I don’t know. Ferrari have made a lot of improvements this year. If they had a driver as consistent as Lewis I think they could do it.
But if they continue to make bad calls on tactics or back the wrong driver, possibly not.

I think you’ll be surprised at 2021, did you watch my video? You should in full as they address all your questions, their aim is to make it much closer and fairer and more level. Teams will not be able to change the cars as much as they currently do, the engine in a Ferrari will have to be the exact same as one they’ve sold to another team etc..

Don’t forget channel 4 originally approached Bernie in 2011 to share coverage with the BBC which would have kept it all on FTA. The dwarf blocked it and went with Sky so we’ve got that tosser to thank all these years on.

Ah yes good ol Bernie, the man who kinda ruined the sport to make his billions.. I don’t like him much I have to say.

 

[Apple fanboy]

I think you’ll be surprised at 2021, did you watch my video? You should in full as they address all your questions, their aim is to make it much closer and fairer and more level. Teams will not be able to change the cars as much as they currently do, the engine in a Ferrari will have to be the exact same as one they’ve sold to another team etc..



Ah yes good ol Bernie, the man who kinda ruined the sport to make his billions.. I don’t like him much I have to say.

I’ve seen the party political video on behalf of Liberty yes.
But the fact still remains that a top team will have a lot more resources than a bottom team. For example your own wind tunnel as opposed to renting one.

I understand they want to make it closer. But by F1 standards it’s pretty close now. There has never been 20 cars on the grid who can all win. That’s just not how it works.

 

[robbieduncan]

First of all well done Lewis! I think he will be pushing like anything next year to get to 7!

And I agree with those saying the new rules will magically catch Williams and Haas back up. If anything new rules tend to expand the gaps as the lower order teams simply can't do as much work as quickly

 

[Akrapovic]

Finally, some people who understand how and why rule changes cause gaps to widen. It happens every time without fail. The one exception was 2009 due to double diffusers. Once that was settled, the gaps went out again.

Been through countless rule changes. It's always the same, for the same reasons. And that isn't specific to F1 either. LMP1 and LMP2 just went through the exact same thing. IMSA went through it too.

But don't worry, Liberty has a fancy video saying it isn't so!

 

[Apple fanboy]

Finally, some people who understand how and why rule changes cause gaps to widen. It happens every time without fail. The one exception was 2009 due to double diffusers. Once that was settled, the gaps went out again.

Been through countless rule changes. It's always the same, for the same reasons. And that isn't specific to F1 either. LMP1 and LMP2 just went through the exact same thing. IMSA went through it too.

But don't worry, Liberty has a fancy video saying it isn't so!

Must be true then! It will be interesting but expect to see the usual suspects at the front.

 

[robbieduncan]

Must be true then! It will be interesting but expect to see the usual suspects at the front.

It might not be the usual suspects. As per the double diffusers an unusual suspect figured it out quickest. But this was pretty unusual: normally a big team will find these things simply though spending more/having more brains to think with. Whichever way it's likely that different teams will explore the rules in different ways. Some will be more successful than others and there will be gaps in performance.

 

[Akrapovic]

It might not be the usual suspects. As per the double diffusers an unusual suspect figured it out quickest. But this was pretty unusual: normally a big team will find these things simply though spending more/having more brains to think with. Whichever way it's likely that different teams will explore the rules in different ways. Some will be more successful than others and there will be gaps in performance.

It was unusual for half a season, but by mid-way, RBR were on the back of them, and then ahead for the rest of the rule set. We might get a different team at the front, but it doesn't tend to be closer.

If anything, the Ferrari v Mercedes battle now is closer than it has been after the rules matured and there's little for Mercedes to extract from the current regulations.

 

[BenTrovato]

It might not be the usual suspects. As per the double diffusers an unusual suspect figured it out quickest. But this was pretty unusual: normally a big team will find these things simply though spending more/having more brains to think with. Whichever way it's likely that different teams will explore the rules in different ways. Some will be more successful than others and there will be gaps in performance.

Don't forget .. I wouldn't call Ross Brawn with 8 titles an unusual suspect. In 2008, he completely ignored that years car and jumped right on the 2009 version before anyone else. They had what? Four wind tunnels going or something crazy. Despite all that, once RBR figured it out, it took them a month or two to catch up, and they would never be surpassed again in that era.

 

[robbieduncan]

Don't forget .. I wouldn't call Ross Brawn with 8 titles an unusual suspect. In 2008, he completely ignored that years car and jumped right on the 2009 version before anyone else. They had what? Four wind tunnels going or something crazy. Despite all that, once RBR figured it out, it took them a month or two to catch up, and they would never to be surpassed again in that era.

Sure. But the Honda team were hardly front-runners before becoming Brawn GP. We frequently see teams abandoning the current season development to concentrate on the next season when it becomes clear their car is a dog. However that rarely seems to result in a good next year car either! Normally because whatever issue caused them to build a bad car for year X is not actually resolved for X+1.

 

[BenTrovato]

Sure. But the Honda team were hardly front-runners before becoming Brawn GP. We frequently see teams abandoning the current season development to concentrate on the next season when it becomes clear their car is a dog. However that rarely seems to result in a good next year car either! Normally because whatever issue caused them to build a bad car for year X is not actually resolved for X+1.

Absolutely but it was a bit different.. Ross received a massive lump sum advance payment from F1 to keep the Honda team afloat and he completely ignored the '08 car and started on '09 straight away while Ferarri and McLaren battled until the last corner in Brazil for the championship. RBR was second to focus on the '09 car, but a distant second and they caught up very quickly.

 

[Apple fanboy]

The speed that teams catch up can depend on luck talent and money.
Brawn were a bit of a curve ball that year, but they also had a good driver in Button. Not the best, but a cool pair of hands in a good car.

 

[jdechko]

I'm relatively new to the sport, so I can't comment on the historical perspective, but I did want to point out that a lot of other sports are this way as well. The same teams tend to be "good" season over season--specifically thinking of college & professional American football here. The same teams usually make the playoffs, attract the talent, and end up as the preseason favorites. Lots of leagues have a salary/ spending cap to keep the rich teams from completely outspending the poorer teams, but, as it's been pointed out, that doesn't work well over the long term.

One thing that is different is that the rules surrounding F1 (and the technologies of the engines themselves) seem to change every few years, whereas other sports tend to stay more static in their rules. Nothing really to add, but just thinking of how different sports would be turned upside down if they underwent fundamental rule changes.