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JustMartin

macrumors 6502a
Feb 28, 2012
787
271
UK
I was just re-reading your original post.

You said “The way I figure it is anyone who requires an all powerful being to command them not to kill or steal under threat of punishment probably isn’t very ethical in the first place.”

I mean, you just said, in so many words, the only thing stopping an entire group of people from murdering or stealing is a commandment from God.

Just wow. Ergo, all Christians are murdering liars but for a commandment from God saying no.

Imagine if you said that about Muslims, Jews or blacks or insert group here.

I’m glad I don’t hold views like that. If I did, I’d seriously reconsider my life and maybe some if the choices that got me here.

Best of luck to you.

He didn't say Christians. He could be referring to all three Abrahamic religions or any other religion with a single deity and an instruction not to kill
 

chrono1081

macrumors G3
Jan 26, 2008
8,456
4,165
Isla Nublar
Mr. Cook is the CEO of a $960 Billion company. If he truly wants to make the Mac Pro in the USA then he certainly has the authority and resources to make that happen. Actions speak louder than lip service.

Spoken exactly like someone who has never once studied how Asia absolutely dominates us in electrical component manufacturing.
 
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GadgetBen

macrumors 68000
Jul 8, 2015
1,901
3,763
London
If you want the best parts they are not all made or produced by companies in the US. It’s as simple as that.

It’s always been that way, it’s the way the world works.

That’s right, there is a world out there where people come together and trade what they do best.
 

buran-energia

macrumors 6502
Oct 9, 2017
296
113
Does Trump (and his supporters) really believe that Americans want to assemble iPhones for minimum wage pay? There's a reason these companies outsource work.

The talk here is about Mac Pro that starts at 5999$. This is just the base config. The price already includes the "made in USA" tax, but why make it in USA, if you can get an even bigger margin by making it in China?
 

scottishwildcat

macrumors 6502
Oct 24, 2007
292
364
You mean...
"we would love to make the Mac pro in the United states, I just don't want to because I am full of greed and refuse to accept a slightly lower stock price"
Except he wouldn't be allowed to do that. As CEO, he and the board have a legal obligation to serve their shareholders best interests.
 
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0989382

Suspended
Jan 11, 2018
527
379
Except he wouldn't be allowed to do that. As CEO, he and the board have a legal obligation to serve their shareholders best interests.

It's kind of a two way street. I mean that's the attitude that got Steve Jobs fired, "no more risk taking or thinking guide the box, we're going to run this company well, the corporate way and serve our shareholders" who, of course had no clue about the industry or its future. Then it all went down hill.

Shareholders need to (and generally do) understand that in an industry like this they are likely to not be the most qualified person to 'tell Apple what to do'. They have faith in Tim Cook to continue making them absolutely insane gains as he has done since he took over. I can't see any of them disputing this or having an issue with this. I think they're too mature to walk in and start commanding things be done their way quoting "It's your obligation to listen to me Cook, do what I say!"
 

Ramchi

macrumors 65816
Dec 13, 2007
1,088
563
India
Mac Pro can be made in USA provided Apple could get the skilled resources and locally made components (again another chain of issues). This is the best product in theory that can be made locally since there is no scaling issue like iPhones where production volumes go in many millions within short time frame.

If USA can't make this locally, it would be very difficult to make any consumer electronics there anymore...
 
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Glockworkorange

Suspended
Feb 10, 2015
2,511
4,184
Chicago, Illinois
He didn't say Christians. He could be referring to all three Abrahamic religions or any other religion with a single deity and an instruction not to kill
And in subsequent comments he admitted it and walked it back. You really want to die on this hill?
[doublepost=1564574404][/doublepost]
Mac Pro can be made in USA provided Apple could get the skilled resources and locally made components (again another chain of issues). This is the best product in theory that can be made locally since there is no scaling issue like iPhones where production volumes go in many millions within short time frame.

If USA can't make this locally, it would be very difficult to make any consumer electronics there anymore...
Yep. This is the only one they could assemble here. It's unfortunate, but that's the world we live in.
[doublepost=1564574651][/doublepost]
Spoken exactly like someone who has never once studied how Asia absolutely dominates us in electrical component manufacturing.
You're telling us HE CAN'T make it here, or you're saying it would be more beneficial to make them elsewhere? And when I say "make," i mean manufacture, because that's what we're taking about.
 

hagar

macrumors 68000
Jan 19, 2008
1,970
4,946
Funny how some people are so ignorant as to think China is stealing jobs from American workers.

Globalisation was invented by and for American companies. They invested in it and made a lot of money by outsourcing production a long time ago.

They became rich because of it and nobody was thinking of the underpaid werkers overseas. Or the lack of environmental or labor rules.

And now, because of this nationalistic Trump wave, you want these jobs back??But no word about exploiting African countries for their resources or exporting waste to dump it in some third world nation. Or the million other ways to screw over other countries.

How hypocritical can America First be?
 

rpat701

macrumors regular
May 25, 2016
228
994
Does Trump (and his supporters) really believe that Americans want to assemble iPhones for minimum wage pay? There's a reason these companies outsource work.
Yes, I do. Do you have evidence (hard, factual evidence) to the contrary?
 

ipponrg

macrumors 68020
Oct 15, 2008
2,309
2,087
Apple already employs 50k+ workers in the US, many are designers and engineers. It makes sense to employ those jobs in the US.

Sure, it’ll be nice to employ some assembly in the US. But why should they be obligated?

Should they be obligated to move Silicon Valley Mac Pro engineers and designers to, say, China? The same way they ‘should’ move Mac Pro assembly jobs to the US?

To me, it just makes sense to keep the engineering in the US and most of assembly in Asia.

It’s well known that most of Apple’s workers are hourly store employees, not corporate and exempt employees
 

TechZeke

macrumors 68020
Jul 29, 2012
2,455
2,288
Dallas, TX
Does Trump (and his supporters) really believe that Americans want to assemble iPhones for minimum wage pay? There's a reason these companies outsource work.
True, but I think part of it is just not wanting to give up the profit margins. I think Apple could pay American employees a decent wage with products at current prices and still make plenty of money. It's just about pleasing wall street and shareholders; Which is perfectly fine as a for-profit company, but lets not sit here and pretend that money couldn't be made building these in the US.
 

gnipgnop

macrumors 68020
Feb 18, 2009
2,179
2,892
If Trump really had an interest in employing Americans to make things in America then he would have followed through on the campaign promises to spend trillions on domestic infrastructure. That's the low-hanging fruit/no-brainer and yet neither Trump nor the GOP are willing to do it. Instead, you have the focus put on inconsequential stuff like whether or not the Mac Pro is assembled in the United States.
 
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BootsWalking

macrumors 68020
Feb 1, 2014
2,268
14,188
Spoken exactly like someone who has never once studied how Asia absolutely dominates us in electrical component manufacturing.

What does Asia dominating us in electrical component manufacturing have to do with whether or not Apple can assemble those components into a computer in the USA?
[doublepost=1564576480][/doublepost]
Apparently you CANT build jetliners over there anymore either. I mean you can still build them, they’re jut not able to fly safely anymore.
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49026285

Building them has nothing to do with whether or not they can design them properly. You could say the same thing about the MacBook's horrible keyboards.
 

jaxhunter

macrumors regular
Dec 14, 2012
118
15
Maryland Eastern Shore
I think the important distinction here is component assembly vs final assembly. Apple asked for a tariff exemption on the Mac Pro's parts, which are made in China. Final assembly of the Pros will likely take place in Texas.

It's also quite true that the US cannot compete in large scale manufacturing - particular on components that require a large amount of small, but detailed work, like that of circuit boards. Most, if not all, manufacturers of any goods in the US require Chinese, Mexican, Pakistani, Indian, etc. parts or components to complete final assembly of a product. To be honest, I'm not sure how a company would go about getting that kind of infrastructure started in the US at cost-competitive prices. It seems like it would almost have to be a Chinese company setting up shop in the states to do the work. Further, I'm not sure the tariffs imposed will provide enough incentive for that.
 

bbednarz

macrumors 65816
Nov 16, 2017
1,408
3,739
Chicago
Yeah they should turn a blind eye to declining iPhone reviews and double down on current efforts.
People are bored with the iPhone. It has peaked. People are realizing they really don't need to upgrade every year or even every other year. Apple Watch sales are helping to supplement that though.
 

Gasu E.

macrumors 603
Mar 20, 2004
5,034
3,150
Not far from Boston, MA.
Mr. Cook is the CEO of a $960 Billion company. If he truly wants to make the Mac Pro in the USA then he certainly has the authority and resources to make that happen. Actions speak louder than lip service.

What exactly does "make the Mac Pro in the USA" even mean these days? Final assembly? 51% content? More content from the USA than from any other country?
 

satchmo

macrumors 601
Aug 6, 2008
4,979
5,633
Canada
So, which one is it?

Given that the U.S. has trouble producing even a custom screw, I'm pretty sure he's leaning towards China. Tim's statement seems more like lip service in order to appease everyone.

Exactly. Just stop using custom screws. Problem solved.
 
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