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vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,359
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Columbus, OH
Location data falls under PII. What additional scenarios fall under privacy than the handling of PII?


You’ll note as I said, one’s personal address specifically is PII. Other things where individuals may want privacy could include lists of favorite websites or recent phone calls they may have made or received. Those are not PII either.
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
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Gotta be in it to win it

You’ll note as I said, one’s personal address specifically is PII. Other things where individuals may want privacy could include lists of favorite websites or recent phone calls they may have made or received. Those are not PII either.
Yes. Any information entered or derived is considered PII. Examples include zip code, clicked links, favorite locations, etc.

 

Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
1,130
Lisbon, Portugal
Privacy is the handling of your PII. If you don’t feel safe using apple software, doesn’t leave you anywhere to go.

No. Privacy and security are the same thing at a personal level.

These data hosts suddenly started marketing and merchandising your data … institutionalizing personal security violations … sometimes violating even basic IP rights … so they created the concept of Digital Privacy reducing it to PII.

It’s fundamentally a gaslighting scam in my view.

PS: I wonder if you wrote a novel between you and your computer … someone in these hosts made a copy without you knowing and published it … what would happen? Oh it’s out of PII so I guess according to your stance it would be fine all legal … call it a data breach, you licensed it, swallow it.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
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Gotta be in it to win it
No. Privacy and security are the same thing at a personal level.
They are clearly different.
These data hosts suddenly started marketing and merchandising your data … institutionalizing security violations … sometimes violating even basic IP rights … so they created the concept of Digital Privacy reducing it to PII.
The handling of pii is a core issue large tech companies and companies that have mountains of your data.
It’s fundamentally a gaslighting scam in my view.
I disagree.
PS: I wonder if you wrote a novel … someone in these hosts made a copy without you knowing and published it … what would happen? Oh it’s out of PII so I guess according to your stance it would be fine all legal … call it a data breach, swallow it.
Copyright breach equivalent to pii?
 

Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
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Lisbon, Portugal
They are clearly different.

Security is about data not greeted to hands or eyes of people not intended by its owner. So is data privacy. In digital terms is fundamentally the same thing as the object is data.

The issue of privacy appeared because not only the first was institutionalized but was also being monetized in ways people have no control of. Simple as that.

Now in the analog world there are indeed differences.

Reducing the scope of data privacy to personal identification data is a scam to elude users.

There are many things you own that you have not went to legal to establish copyright. Yes … corps would love to force citizens to use legal to copyright all they do … otherwise get lost. It’s stupid because normal people do not have the resources these corps have for such a practice. Before they would write something on their computers and only if someone came to their office or house and took it … stole … but now it’s out there on someone’s else’s private property. What rights do you have? None … the legal framework is mostly absent … and there is an active campaign to reduce the issue to PII … farsical.

To add … license agreements over hosting your data and device operation are constantly changing unilaterally.

Between companies are usually negotiated because they have the power to do so. Imagine Qualcomm changing the license agreement over their tech just like that …lawsuit right after. Citizens don’t.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
24,047
Gotta be in it to win it
Security is about data not greeted to hands or eyes of people not intended by its owner. So is data privacy. In digital terms is fundamentally the same thing as the object is data.

The issue of privacy appeared because not only the first was institutionalized but was also being monetized in ways people have no control of. Simple as that.

Now in the analog world there are indeed differences.

Reducing the scope of data privacy to personal identification data is a scam to elude users.

There are many things you own that you have not went to legal to establish copyright. Yes … corps would love to force citizens to use legal to copyright all they do … otherwise get lost. It’s stupid because normal people do not have the resources these corps have for such a practice. Before they would write something on their computers and only if someone came to their office or house and took it … stole … but now it’s out there on someone’s else’s private property. What rights do you have? None … the legal framework is mostly absent … and there is an active campaign to reduce the issue to PII … farsical.

To add … license agreements over hosting your data and device operation are constantly changing unilaterally.

Between companies are usually negotiated because they have the power to do so. Imagine Qualcomm changing the license agreement over their tech just like that …lawsuit right after. Citizens don’t.
Privacy is the stated policy (and the laws behind it) of handling personal information, distinct from security which is keeping the device safe from for example, zero day remote execution vulnerabilities.
 

Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
1,130
Lisbon, Portugal
Privacy is the stated policy (and the laws behind it) of handling personal information, distinct from security which is keeping the device safe from for example, zero day remote execution vulnerabilities.

All information in a device for personal use is personal. Eschewing that to a bunch of data fields characterising you is nothing but a technocratic fabrication. In affect is establishing that anything else in such a personal device is not than personal, say a book you maybe creating ... neither its use ... so access to it constitutes no violation of privacy. Which is insane.

In a normal stance, that anyone can recognise, What you do in your home or car ... and all its contents are personal ... non authorised observation or entry is indeed a violation of privacy ... and if a threat to your personal is than a breach of your security. So it should be for personal computers.

Now the technical jargon you employed simply points to one technical approach that third party can follow to access that personal information. But there are many others, in particular when your data is not just being hosted by your device. Which seams to be more and more the case.

My preferences can be a private matter in the sense that as far as I'm concerned no one else but me and my family (optionally) are concerned with. Apple and other may anonymise some of my interactions with their services but in the end of the day they are indeed profiling my preferences ... identifying me in preference group to than sell me stuff more efficiently. Now this might or not be considered a security threat ... it depends on the individual. Some people feel threatened merely by having their photograph taken by someone they have no control of.

Meaning, interpretation of privacy its not at all fluid. What is fluid is if such violation constitutes or not a security threat. Somehow these concepts got reversed by technocrats. The reason is simple ... it erodes the notion of personal property. If data is not private ... as of hold by law in privacy ... is then public ... if is public is then observable if not usable by third parties with the tacit permission by law. What then rules the notion of property becomes the license agreement ... a license agreement that is written by corps to their favor of course.

People and law makers need to wake up. At this pace not long from now ... what you put in your personal device it stops being yours if not for a license agreement designed by corps ... that changes every year ... with a simple notification and tens of pages to be read every time. By law, your rights will be zilch.
 
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vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,359
9,710
Columbus, OH
Yes. Any information entered or derived is considered PII. Examples include zip code, clicked links, favorite locations, etc.

I didn’t see where clicked links or favorite locations were mentioned in the link you posted, but feel free to quote. Zip code would refer to your home address, not where you happen to be at any given moment.
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
24,047
Gotta be in it to win it
I didn’t see where clicked links or favorite locations were mentioned in the link you posted, but feel free to quote. Zip code would refer to your home address, not where you happen to be at any given moment.
Similar to innovation, there are differing definitions…different lines in the sand.
 

I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
24,047
Gotta be in it to win it
All information in a device for personal use is personal. Eschewing that to a bunch of data fields characterising you is nothing but a technocratic fabrication. In affect is establishing that anything else in such a personal device is not than personal, say a book you maybe creating ... neither its use ... so access to it constitutes no violation of privacy. Which is insane.

In a normal stance, that anyone can recognise, What you do in your home or car ... and all its contents are personal ... non authorised observation or entry is indeed a violation of privacy ... and if a threat to your personal is than a breach of your security. So it should be for personal computers.

Now the technical jargon you employed simply points to one technical approach that third party can follow to access that personal information. But there are many others, in particular when your data is not just being hosted by your device. Which seams to be more and more the case.

My preferences can be a private matter in the sense that as far as I'm concerned no one else but me and my family (optionally) are concerned with. Apple and other may anonymise some of my interactions with their services but in the end of the day they are indeed profiling my preferences ... identifying me in preference group to than sell me stuff more efficiently. Now this might or not be considered a security threat ... it depends on the individual. Some people feel threatened merely by having their photograph taken by someone they have no control of.

Meaning, interpretation of privacy its not at all fluid. What is fluid is if such violation constitutes or not a security threat. Somehow these concepts got reversed by technocrats. The reason is simple ... it erodes the notion of personal property. If data is not private ... as of hold by law in privacy ... is then public ... if is public is then observable if not usable by third parties with the tacit permission by law. What then rules the notion of property becomes the license agreement ... a license agreement that is written by corps to their favor of course.

People and law makers need to wake up. At this pace not long from now ... what you put in your personal device it stops being yours if not for a license agreement designed by corps ... that changes every year ... with a simple notification and tens of pages to be read every time. By law, your rights will be zilch.
That’s some moral high ground, but it doesn’t work that way. Don’t get me wrong I want my pii to be controlled by me…but the state of the state is it is not that way.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,359
9,710
Columbus, OH
Similar to innovation, there are differing definitions…different lines in the sand.
So is this an admission that your own link didn’t say what you did? Odd to try to pass it off as a source. Your definition would appear to be different than every other definition for PII I’ve ever seen which makes it rather useless in communication.
 

Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
1,130
Lisbon, Portugal
What is under dispute by my intervention is the following statement:

Privacy is the handling of your PII.

I don't see this in the description of what PII is.

There is no moral high ground in my interventions. Its about what Privacy actually means to people ... ask any regular person if they consider private any and all information they stored in their smartphone or in some cloud and its use. Not some technocratic reduction of Privacy to handling PII (a bunch a field in a form) that is not even formally defined as such. Of course its private, irrespective if their observation constitutes or not a security problem.

Respecting peoples privacy is indeed giving them the choice of what others can see and what cannot and when in their personal devices and digital services ... with no *** attached. Not just PII. Regardless if its observation by third parties actually represent or not a security threat ... the second is a personal evaluation. That is why you have a "PIN" on your personal devices to get in ... so that you and only you can exercise such choice.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
24,047
Gotta be in it to win it
So is this an admission that your own link didn’t say what you did? Odd to try to pass it off as a source. Your definition would appear to be different than every other definition for PII I’ve ever seen which makes it rather useless in communication.
Like innovation, a definition can be interpreted different ways.

Personally identifiable information is defined by the U.S. government as:

“Information which can be used to distinguish or trace an individual’s identity, such as their name, social security number, biometric records, etc. alone, or when combined with other personal or identifying information which is linked or linkable to a specific individual, such as date and place of birth, mother’s maiden name, etc.”
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
34,311
24,047
Gotta be in it to win it
What is under dispute by my intervention is the following statement:



I don't see this in the description of what PII is.

There is no moral high ground in my interventions. Its about what Privacy actually means to people ... ask any regular person if they consider private any and all information they stored in their smartphone or in some cloud and its use. Not some technocratic reduction of Privacy to handling PII (a bunch a field in a form) that is not even defined by the later. Of course its private, irrespective if their observation constitutes or not a security problem.

Respecting peoples privacy is indeed giving them the choice of what others can see and what cannot and when in their personal devices and digital services ... with no *** attached. Not just PII. Regardless if its observation by third parties actually represent or not a security threat ... the second is a personal evaluation. That is why you have a "PIN" on your personal devices to get in ... so that you and only you can exercise such choice.
Ask a regular person if they believe data they enter on a website, such as name, birthday, etc, is kept under lock and key and not used in ways they don't want it to be used. Facebook showed the world the real answer to that. In today's digital age, people have to be savvy about their direct and indirect personal information and know how once the data is collected, how is it going to be used.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,359
9,710
Columbus, OH
Like innovation, a definition can be interpreted different ways.

Personally identifiable information is defined by the U.S. government as:

“Information which can be used to distinguish or trace an individual’s identity, such as their name, social security number, biometric records, etc. alone, or when combined with other personal or identifying information which is linked or linkable to a specific individual, such as date and place of birth, mother’s maiden name, etc.”
Right, so a list of things that are actually PII. I still haven’t seen anything claiming general location data or website favorites are PII. Aside from you anyway.
 

Beautyspin

macrumors 65816
Dec 14, 2012
1,009
1,174
Location data falls under PII. What additional scenarios fall under privacy than the handling of PII?
Maybe this explains the difference between personal data and PII as defined by Europe's GDPR.


 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,359
9,710
Columbus, OH
Maybe this explains the difference between personal data and PII as defined by Europe's GDPR.


“It follows that any information that encompasses ‘PII’ can be considered ‘personal data’, but not all personal data is considered PII.”

And that pretty much sums it up right there. Those trying to pretend that all personal data is PII is just a transparent attempt to intimate that Apple is the holy grail of privacy protection and doesn’t utilize users’ personal data for their own benefit.
 
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Nuno Lopes

macrumors 65816
Sep 6, 2011
1,268
1,130
Lisbon, Portugal
Ask a regular person if they believe data they enter on a website, such as name, birthday, etc, is kept under lock and key and not used in ways they don't want it to be used.

Such activity is included in my observation. Not only for some website, but your device, the OS you use. Not only PII data but also data you stored in your device or that is hosted in the software devices you use (website, cloud drives, payment systems, so on and so forth). Your parle in this late post is not being disputed by what I said. What is in dispute is your interpretation,

You defined Privacy has handling PII only which does not cover all the spectrum of what I'm describing. I strongly disagree with this. It opens the door to full institutionalised privacy predators. Whatever data is not defined in PII ... which is the majority of data stored … is than not private … meaning … open for grabs.
 
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