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DigiTimes Reports PowerBook G5 and iBook G5 Contracts
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sahomuzi said:
Awesome news... I'm just hoping it's not misinformation, even though it's supposed to be "fact".
Please let it be... please let it be...
I'm sure that the first gen G5 will have problems, so I'd much rather stick with the G4 with a speed update. (Even though a 64 bit processor is nice to have... that'll have to wait until my next Mac purchase...)
sahomuzi said:
They certainly seem to be awfully sure of themselves. Wonder if Apple will be looking at them next?
Only if they obtained the information through illegal means. Apple is not suing rumor sites just because they're rumor sites or just because they're accurate. Remember that the suit against ThinkSecret is more or less unprecedented in recent years.
~J
~J
dodonutter said:
ZDNet does not often make typos, much less two of them. The current iBook lines take only up to 1.25GB of RAM, so if it was an iBook they were testing, it was one we can't order yet. It looks like little leaks are starting to pop up, from the shipping notice at DigiTimes, the ZDNet review, and the end-of-life announcement (I've noticed that the Apple stores around here are also not stocking default configurations in the number they normally would). Hopefully, this means something new soon.
Edit: The date on that article is October 2004. they were probably referring to the iMac G5 instead. Damn.
Dual-Core G4... maybe.
I agree with all of you two guys "-hh" and yourself. But this thought of a Dual-Core G4 is a whole new engineering process. First off, they don't exist yet. Which means, why would Apple use a non-existant chip and stick it in their new line of laptop computers? Laptop computers aren't a testing agent for CPUs? They would have stuck DualCore G4's on their desktops before anything. Notice the gradual step between using a G5 with lots of fans, then liquid cooling, then test variable fans on the latest iMac (a more confined space), This means they already stuck with thinking about placing G5s into laptops. They wouldn't have a plan B saying: ok newly designed CPUs for the powerbook as replacement... Did you think how much it'll cost to do that experimentation.. it's just as tough as sticking a G5 in a laptop itself. The G4 CPU isn't neccessarily a completely "cool" computer. a Dual Core will definitely tend to the same problems in terms of Heat.
If there were Dual Core G4 chips, i am certain Apple would have integrated them in their Mac Mini's before anything. Mac Mini's would be a perfect testing agent for a Dual Core G4 chip. Bringing it into a laptop is too risky for Apple to try new technology. Making a double G4 chip "seems" easy, but to me sounds like A LOT of hardwork and lots of testing time required.
Lastly, Double processing is only noticeable on selected applications that will utilize Dual Processing effeciently. For the need for speed, Dual Processing won't really solve that problem but rather it will solve efficiency in multi-tasking and intellectual programs that fully utilize Dual Processors. But again consumers need speed, G5 will solve that problem and a dual core won't
My guess is then, Apple will put money on the research of making the G5 laptop possible, rather than set an alternative route and copping out dual G4 latpops.
AidenShaw said:
I agree with all of you two guys "-hh" and yourself. But this thought of a Dual-Core G4 is a whole new engineering process. First off, they don't exist yet. Which means, why would Apple use a non-existant chip and stick it in their new line of laptop computers? Laptop computers aren't a testing agent for CPUs? They would have stuck DualCore G4's on their desktops before anything. Notice the gradual step between using a G5 with lots of fans, then liquid cooling, then test variable fans on the latest iMac (a more confined space), This means they already stuck with thinking about placing G5s into laptops. They wouldn't have a plan B saying: ok newly designed CPUs for the powerbook as replacement... Did you think how much it'll cost to do that experimentation.. it's just as tough as sticking a G5 in a laptop itself. The G4 CPU isn't neccessarily a completely "cool" computer. a Dual Core will definitely tend to the same problems in terms of Heat.
If there were Dual Core G4 chips, i am certain Apple would have integrated them in their Mac Mini's before anything. Mac Mini's would be a perfect testing agent for a Dual Core G4 chip. Bringing it into a laptop is too risky for Apple to try new technology. Making a double G4 chip "seems" easy, but to me sounds like A LOT of hardwork and lots of testing time required.
Lastly, Double processing is only noticeable on selected applications that will utilize Dual Processing effeciently. For the need for speed, Dual Processing won't really solve that problem but rather it will solve efficiency in multi-tasking and intellectual programs that fully utilize Dual Processors. But again consumers need speed, G5 will solve that problem and a dual core won't
My guess is then, Apple will put money on the research of making the G5 laptop possible, rather than set an alternative route and copping out dual G4 latpops.
HomesliceJ said:
not only consumers need speed. professionals using macs for audio these days need it as well. Would you believe that Ableton Live 4 (voted software of the year in Future Music), isn't altivec optimized, or multiple processor aware? While the Abletons did add noticable optimizations for the OSX version of their software from version 3 to version 4, stil it runs like a dog on a Mac compared to a PC.
and i mean a lazy hound dog. G4 800mhz performing as well as P3 800mhz, throws the whole megahertz myth out the window. But the application flies on a G5 (thanks to much less altivec dependency), and eventually with dual cpu optimizations will fly even faster.
i organized a "performance test" amongst Live users on the Ableton forum. $2500 1.5ghz Powerbooks were performing at 1/3 the effeciency of a $1,250 AMD64 3400 laptops. with all featres (superdisk, ram, hd, screen, vid card) being equal.
The problem is with software like that, it becomes so inspiring that mac users are switching to PC. and its not just Ableton's fault, its Apple's as well. and unfortunately i'm one of those that "switched back." It'd be nice if Apple had an option for me for under $1500.. but i'm starting to feel like a Gamer here, as is the rest of the audio community. If we see dual core G4's in these PBs, expect the same kind of sentiments from audio producers and digital DJs that we're used to hearing from Gamers, "Macs can't run them."
HomesliceJ said:
As far as I know, the timeline for the Freescale Dual Cores that all of macrumors is using is coming from a single article (from, of all places, The Register, IIRC). That's hardly enough to make accurate predictions about such a chip. If I'm wrong about the source, please inform me.
The G4, even in its possible Dual Core Freescale incarnation, is hardly a new chip. In any case, Apple would need some marketing geniuses to be able to move a desktop line from a newer chip architecture to an older one, even if it would provide performance boosts (more on this later).
From the sources I've seen, the Dual Core running at more than 1.5 GHz (for the sake of argument, let's say 1.6) dissipates considerably less heat than a 970FX running at 2.0 GHz (15-25 v.s. ~24). Both can be clocked down to get cooler numbers, but the point is that the Dual Core is probably going to be easier to fit into a laptop.
The iMac being faster than the PowerBook is one thing, but a $500, 2.9-pound box is probably not getting a high-class processor before the PB. However, if Apple does intend to go with Freescale, I can definitely see the up-and-coming processors going into the Mac mini.
Absolutely wrong. First of all, you're downplaying the benefits of two processors. If speed is truly an issue for a application (rendering, etc.), it's quite likely that said application will support multiple processorsand when multiple processors can be utilized, speed gains can be very significant.
Secondly (and more importantly), the MPC8641D is far more than two conventional G4s slapped together. Firstly, it *eliminates* the northbridge of the current G4 and has a system bus that can run at more than 600 MHz. Neither of these features have anything to do with core processor speed, and yet they will likely be the features that will really put the MPC8641D leaps and bounds ahead of its predecessors. The 8641D also supports DDR2 RAM, which is faster and consumes less power than ordinary RAM and lets the chip further take advantage of system memory. The chip *also* has certain architectural improvements over the current G4s, though these will probably result in minor improvement in overall performance. Finally, the 8641D starts at over 1.5 GHz and scales up to over 2 GHz.
Really, dual core is just icing on the cake.
When compared to the G5, the 8641D holds up favorably as well. Again, the main benefit of the G5faster bus speedis present in the 8641D, and when you take the fact that the G5 sysbus must be crippled (a la the iMac G5) to fit into a small form factor and the 8641D's elimination of the northbridge into account, Freescale's offering looks even better. Finally, remember that the G4's implementation of AltiVec is superior to that found in the G5.
Oh, and, I almost forgot: the 8641D has two cores.
SuperThread said:
Oh, and in case you forgot: it doesn't exist yet. Sampling in the second half of this year.
Very nice on paper, but given Apple's history with Moto..Scale, I think it unlikely that they will be pinning the future of any of their products on what that company says it's going to produce.
Pip pip!
Hmmm i see
Well sorry for my uneducated assumptions. But for some reason i'm still very strong on Apple introducting the new 64-bit world on the laptops. Dual-Core chips may be good for iBooks i presume. But seeing how the dualcore chip enables higher FSB and DDR2, then i can totally see how the G4 dualcore can rival the single G5 chip.
Also the reason i down played the dual processor is that i own one and i own the titanium G4 1ghz (same speed), and work wise i've notice only a fraction of the difference in the things i do. In multitasking, i do see a significant difference but working on one program at a time, i see no difference. I also work on Digital Performer. Recording with Digital Performer is much more stable on the Dual System, but rather working almost at the same speed as my titanium. Is it just me?
but thanks for the correction.
SuperThread said:
Well sorry for my uneducated assumptions. But for some reason i'm still very strong on Apple introducting the new 64-bit world on the laptops. Dual-Core chips may be good for iBooks i presume. But seeing how the dualcore chip enables higher FSB and DDR2, then i can totally see how the G4 dualcore can rival the single G5 chip.
Also the reason i down played the dual processor is that i own one and i own the titanium G4 1ghz (same speed), and work wise i've notice only a fraction of the difference in the things i do. In multitasking, i do see a significant difference but working on one program at a time, i see no difference. I also work on Digital Performer. Recording with Digital Performer is much more stable on the Dual System, but rather working almost at the same speed as my titanium. Is it just me?
but thanks for the correction.
I've been following this thread and many G5 Powerbook threads like it hoping to get a better feel for the timing of the next major revision. My last computer purchase was 3 years ago with a 667 G4 Powerbook. I timed that one perfectly. As much as I'm disappointed that the processor speed has only a little more than doubled on the same chip architecture in those three years, I feel even better knowing I'm getting a good lifespan out my laptop.
I am really hoping I can replace my Powerbook soon so I can still get some decent money out of selling it. I also really want a DVD burner and a new generation of video card in the next major update before I buy. I'm hoping that I can also get one with a 4 gig RAM capacity to take advantage of 64-bit applications once they start coming out in a few years. I'm planning to keep my next Powerbook purchase even longer than this most recent one provided Apple can put that G5 or dual-core in there.
Do you guys think there's a good chance of getting a Powerbook with new chip architecture that will have the 4 gig RAM capacity along with a newer video card to boot, or would you guess that this is still a year or more out.
Stutz
I am really hoping I can replace my Powerbook soon so I can still get some decent money out of selling it. I also really want a DVD burner and a new generation of video card in the next major update before I buy. I'm hoping that I can also get one with a 4 gig RAM capacity to take advantage of 64-bit applications once they start coming out in a few years. I'm planning to keep my next Powerbook purchase even longer than this most recent one provided Apple can put that G5 or dual-core in there.
Do you guys think there's a good chance of getting a Powerbook with new chip architecture that will have the 4 gig RAM capacity along with a newer video card to boot, or would you guess that this is still a year or more out.
Stutz
stutz said:
All I know is what everyone else knows, I hear not to wait for anything big coming for the next update. But, maybe around WWDC or the update after this coming one may hold something for our future. First time I have ever heard anyone say anything about 4 gigs worth of RAM capacity is from reading your post, I would think that would shorten any battery life that a PowerBook might have. On a side note, I am waiting also, my 500 Ti is good for mail, but not much else. Oh, and Welcome to the Forums, this place is like reading tea leaves.
Brian
Getting Hopes Up
It happened today the 26th in Japan. Apple Store Japan there is a wait for PowerBooks of 5 to 7 working days. Looks like they are running short, is something coming soon? Nah.... no way right?
Brian
It happened today the 26th in Japan. Apple Store Japan there is a wait for PowerBooks of 5 to 7 working days. Looks like they are running short, is something coming soon? Nah.... no way right?
Brian
archer75 said:
Apple has never dropped prices on a computer more than 10% in one revision (at least to my knowledge), so I wouldn't expect anything drastic, if anything at all. I wouldn't be surprised if they raised the prices a hundred or so. I mean they spent so much money (two years of development!) on this thing, it's going to be expensive.
My best guess would be no change in pricing. Even though their computer prices (PBs, iBooks, PMs, etc.) have been going down steadily over the years, I think with this revision they will stay the same.
Just had a very late dinner with a client. All the stores, including Apple's, at Easton (Columbus, Ohio) were closed. However, a huge semi was parked in front of the Apple store, and they had rolled out a very long crate, completely covered in blankets and opaque dropcloths. About six guys were slowly moving it towards the Apple store, where one of the Apple employees had propped the door open.
Could it be a shipment of... new Powerbooks?
Could it be a shipment of... new Powerbooks?
mangoman said:
Don't tease us. I wonder if there is room in the storeroom for what you saw coming in.
shawnce said:
The depths some people go to for clues. And how quick Apple responds to potential rumors.
