Spoilers Dune Books and Movie Talk

[ugru]

It almost makes you wonder if they weren't going to greenlight it anyway.

Agree....it looks like to me like an elaborate marketing strategy...plans within plans...

 

[Huntn]

My Dune movie review:
Post in thread 'What Movie Are You Watching?'
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/what-movie-are-you-watching.1069107/post-30563371

Sigh…

 

[Huntn]

I just realized something, I need to rewatch 1984 Dune. While I consider it to be a failure due to being over stylized, in hindsight the characters were more alive than the 2021 version, which is a visual spectacle with practically lifeless characters. I can’t say the actors are bad, so despite impressive visuals, I have to plop blame on the director, the pacing and a generally oppressive atmosphere which for myself, diminished the actors performances as I watched it.

 

[JT2002TJ]

I just realized something, I need to rewatch 1984 Dune. While I consider it to be a failure due to being over stylized, in hindsight the characters were more alive than the 21 version, which is a visual spectacle with practically lifeless characters. I can’t say the actors are bad, so despite impressive visuals, I have to plop blame on the director, the pacing and a generally oppressive atmosphere which for myself, diminished the actors performances as I watched it.

I watched 1984 Dune on Friday night of Dune 2021 release, then on Saturday watched Dune 2021. I did not read the books, so take this for what it is worth.

With all the negative of the 2021 version, I think they did a very good job. I think they did a better job than the 1984 version of entertaining me, especially since they didn't try to tell that much of a story all in one movie. I felt the 1984 version was rushed.

Even the 2021 could have done a better job telling more of the story. I think they should have made 3-4 movies:

• Pre-Arrakis move
• Arrakis move and taking over of spice mining ending where the 2021 ended
• Pick up right were 2021 ended (finish in one move or end before the epic battle)

But, I assume the director did what he did because these days, you never know if you are going to get a second movie, yet alone a third or forth.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

I just realized something, I need to rewatch 1984 Dune. While I consider it to be a failure due to being over stylized, in hindsight the characters were more alive than the 21 version, which is a visual spectacle with practically lifeless characters. I can’t say the actors are bad, so despite impressive visuals, I have to plop blame on the director, the pacing and a generally oppressive atmosphere which for myself, diminished the actors performances as I watched it.

I think it is just the mechanism of having internal dialogue. I was hoping they would do that with the new movie.

 

[obeygiant]

Chills!

 

[decafjava]

I need to watch the first film! 🤔

 

[romanof]

Do yourself a favor and stay far, far away from the original Hollywood Dune. Watch the old made-for-tv serial in its place. Not bad and makes sense.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Do yourself a favor and stay far, far away from the original Hollywood Dune. Watch the old made-for-tv serial in its place. Not bad and makes sense.

I disagree.

Lynch’s Dune has plenty of faults, and the second half collapses completely. However, it’s still so crazy that it’s worth a watch. Also, the visual imagery is something that not even the new Dune could parallel.

 

[decafjava]

I disagree.

Lynch’s Dune has plenty of faults, and the second half collapses completely. However, it’s still so crazy that it’s worth a watch. Also, the visual imagery is something that not even the new Dune could parallel.

Agree it's rather enjoyable actually if you aren't hardcore.

 

[Euroamerican]

.... And..... it really helps if you like David Lynch'es stuff, Twin Peaks, and the actors he repeatedly casts in his movies.

 

[romanof]

Possibly my dislike is because I read the book when it came out in the 60s, back in SciFi's great days, then saw the movie years later on the day it hit the screens. What we were expecting was not what we got. Until they ran out, the theaters would hand out flyers explaining various things that people were going to see but absolutely would not have a clue about unless they had read the book. When it reached the part where the "super powers" of Paul and his cohorts were replaced by an idiotic sound gun, a couple of my crowd walked out. I stayed but... Actually, I can't remember why I stayed. Probably wished I hadn't, when for some unexplained reason, when Paul is crowned at the end, some magic makes it rain without explaining where the water came from!! Water that would have destroyed the spice entirely. That is only a pair of the ten thousand examples of where it deviated from the book in ridiculous ways.

 

[Mousse]

Possibly my dislike is because I read the book when it came out in the 60s, back in SciFi's great days, then saw the movie years later on the day it hit the screens. What we were expecting was not what we got. Until they ran out, the theaters would hand out flyers explaining various things that people were going to see but absolutely would not have a clue about unless they had read the book. When it reached the part where the "super powers" of Paul and his cohorts were replaced by an idiotic sound gun, a couple of my crowd walked out. I stayed but... Actually, I can't remember why I stayed. Probably wished I hadn't, when for some unexplained reason, when Paul is crowned at the end, some magic makes it rain without explaining where the water came from!! Water that would have destroyed the spice entirely. That is only a pair of the ten thousand examples of where it deviated from the book in ridiculous ways.

The movie versions have always been inferior to the book version. Come on, Hollywood, Paul's story has been done to death. Move on the Leto II's story.🤓

Matt Lablanc as Leto II.😉

Spoiler: Joey?

On a serious note, even the books had major flaws. The master [of the weirding way] level Paul vs Feyd-Rautha fight made no sense. How can they fight at the same level? It should have been as lopsided as a 80's WWE squash match. Apprentice level Paul easily beat Freman veteran warrior. Freman are better fighters than the Sardaukar. The Sardaukar, the greatest fight force during Leto I's time, mopped the floor with the Atreide's trooper. Feyd barely beat a drugged up Atreide's trooper. So Paul > Freman warrior > Sardaukar > Atreides trooper, Feyd-Rautha.

And in the Messiah and Children, Alia was to access the Baron Harkonan's memories/conscienceness. Only the Kwisatz Haderach should have access to memories of both male and female ancestors. A Bene Gesserit should only be able to access the genetic memories of their female ancestors. The Baron is a dude. No way should Alia been able to access the Baron's memories.

 

[romanof]

That is a fact. And accurate Dune move would be 10 hours long. But a good movie made from a good book just abridges the tale. The Day of the Jackal being a good example of a good bood and a good movie faithful to the plot. On the other hand, you have something like Dune that just replaces massive portions of the tale with... something. Not the first one to do so - Up Periscope, Ice Station Zebra, Raise the Titanic were gripping books that were absolutely trashed by Hollywood. And so on

The movie versions have always been inferior to the book version.

 

[Jeffrey Hart]

I’m in the process of reading the first book in the series. I think it’s all right so far; really enjoying it. ☺️

 

[Huntn]

That is a fact. And accurate Dune move would be 10 hours long. But a good movie made from a good book just abridges the tale. The Day of the Jackal being a good example of a good bood and a good movie faithful to the plot. On the other hand, you have something like Dune that just replaces massive portions of the tale with... something. Not the first one to do so - Up Periscope, Ice Station Zebra, Raise the Titanic were gripping books that were absolutely trashed by Hollywood. And so on

I‘ve read the first 2 Dune books, and liked the first book, back in the day. The first Dune movie was a fail, I really wanted to like this latest version, but something about it made it feel not special. I really hated the droning, foreboding music. It’s one of the stories for me that clicks as a book, but is a hard transition to film.

 

[transmaster]

Thank God we didn't get the Alejandro Jodorowsky version. It would have been a clown show and an insult to Frank Herbert's vision. Just look at Alefandro's "Mœbius" illustrated version of The Baron and compare it with Denis Villeneuve's

Moedius
.

 

[transmaster]

I am a gigantic fan of "Mœbius" Jean Henri Gaston Giraud. (8 May 1938 – 10 March 2012) My avatar is from his French Western comic series "Blueberry" Sheriff, or Lt, Blueberry. I am so glad his illustrations did not make it into a Jodorowsky's version.

 

[transmaster]

There is an interesting detail in the production of the David Lynch's Dune. Take a look at the suits the Sardaukar are wearing when they attack the Atreides on Dune. Lynch was getting desperate he was way over budget and he didn't have anything for the Sardaukar attack. A LA fire station was being torn down. It had been used for nothing but storage from the early 1960's. In it where found 100's of unused fire suits from the 1950's. Lynch's production crew found out about it and they got them on the really cheap. Some of the extra's that wore them during the attack had to be hospitalized with heat stroke. The suits smelled to high heaven and with no ventilation they were life threatening to wear in the filming environment. Plus they looked cheap, they were, and ridiculous.

 

[Mousse]

I‘ve read the first 2 Dune books, and liked the first book, back in the day. The first Dune movie was a fail, I really wanted to like this latest version, but something about it made it feel not special. I really hated the droning, foreboding music. It’s one of the stories for me that clicks as a book, but is a hard transition to film.

IMO, it's because the producers/directors want to add their creative touch to an otherwise great work. What happens is they ruin a classic.😒 Just stick to what made the book great and they movie will be great. HBO's Game of Thrones was great until they didn't have the books to copy from.😑

The Dune books are marvelous works. Herbert could have gone the whodunit route by hiding the traitor's identity for the big reveal. Instead, he told us early who the traitor was and his reason. The story still pulls you in and the storytelling is top notch.

The kept the Preacher's identity secret in the 2nd book for a good long time, although he dropped a lot of hints. I but swung back and forth as he dropped more hints; a lot yeah "he's the Preacher" and "oh no, he can't be the Preacher". I was never 100% sure until the big reveal.

 

[Euroamerican]

^--- And by then........ does it really matter?

 

[transmaster]

What really gets me is when the producers, writers, and directors blame the fans for their failures.

 

[yaxomoxay]

On a serious note, even the books had major flaws.

Do we know how could Arrakis, a planet with no trees and no technology have breathable air?

 

[transmaster]

Do we know how could Arrakis, a planet with no trees and no technology have breathable air?

Yes, It was the Bene Gesserit that seeded Arrakis with the sand trout that consumed the free water and grew into the Sand Worms. The Bene Gesserit wanted a secure source for The Water of Life. This took over a 1000 years. The big mystery not spelled out is were the sand trout came from originally. Before this Arrakis was a wet planet. It does have a oxygen producing ecosystem but it is not detailed much in the original books. The goal of the Fremen is to change it back.

 

[yaxomoxay]

Yes, It was the Bene Gesserit that seeded Arrakis with the sand trout that consumed the free water and grew into the Sand Worms. The Bene Gesserit wanted a secure source for The Water of Life. This took over a 1000 years. The big mystery not spelled out is were the sand trout came from originally. Before this Arrakis was a wet planet. It does have an oxygen producing ecosystem but it is not detailed much in the original books. The goal of the Fremen is to change it back.

I swear I don’t remember that in any of the books, but I think it’s just my bad memory.