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genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,105
2,683
Glad to hear that Apple came back to their senses. Supporting free speech for everyone is more important than making the elite comfortable.
You do know that musk and those he reinstated are members or the elite who have their own agenda. He supports the voices he wants. For instance telling Twitter users to vote for Republicans this cycle no matter what they represent. His purpose for buying Twitter supports free speech in the way Murdoch supports free speech with Fox News and his 600 other media companies. It’s to allow the elites to control which voices get heard.
 

ApplesAreSweet&Sour

macrumors 68000
Sep 18, 2018
1,959
3,580
Free speech means people can say whatever they want as long as they aren't doing something illegal.

Only people who have weak arguments can't stand free speech. Everyone else is mature enough to allow people to hold opinions without trying to use the threat of government violence to silence them.

I believe people are smart enough to make the right decisions for themselves. I believe in free speech for all.

Feel free to test this out by calling me an *******, I'm totally fine with that.
That's all correct but extremely naive.

The kind of free speech you desire is the ideal. But it's not feasible when you consider human nature and how societies without moderation of speech have progressed:

Eventually you will have factions of society conspire and preach intolerance and persecution.

These people don't believe in your right to free speech unless you use it in their favor. Or they want to limit some other groups freedoms (persecution).

Some level of moderation and censorship is essential.
 

A MacBook lover

Suspended
May 22, 2009
2,011
4,582
D.C.
The kind of free speech you desire is the ideal. But it's not feasible when you consider human nature and how societies without moderation of speech have progressed:
Twitters model seems good enough. It’s already here, and it’s staying!

Ideas are allowed to be exchanged so long as you don’t threaten anyone.

Very happy and excited that Twitter is better than it’s ever been, and very active. So much more active discussions now and flow of ideas
 

russell_314

macrumors 603
Feb 10, 2019
6,046
9,010
USA
You do know that musk and those he reinstated are members or the elite who have their own agenda. He supports the voices he wants. For instance telling Twitter users to vote for Republicans this cycle no matter what they represent. His purpose for buying Twitter supports free speech in the way Murdoch supports free speech with Fox News and his 600 other media companies. It’s to allow the elites to control which voices get heard.
You’re right, maybe he says vote Republican on his Twitter account. I don’t know that, but I’m guessing that’s what you saw. What he is not doing is censoring other Twitter accounts telling people to vote Democrat or maybe libertarian. I would have a big issue if he was doing that.

This is called free speech. It’s amazing! You don’t threaten anyone or do something crazy and you can say hey let’s vote for Jack Smith in 2026. Or maybe you don’t like Jack Smith and you want to vote for Don Johnson or Susan Jones. I made those names up if it’s not obvious.
 

Karma*Police

macrumors 68030
Jul 15, 2012
2,523
2,869
Strange how the term “fascist” is thrown about by the super-ignorant who think Twitter was better off when it censored people for expressing ideas that they disagreed with which is exactly what real fascists do.

Hint: if you’re against free speech, censoring people you don’t like, and would rather live in a bubble than debate ideas, you’re likely supporting fascists/authoritarians.
 

inkswamp

macrumors 68030
Jan 26, 2003
2,953
1,278
Yes, the very last thing Democrats would ever do is to display outrage towards Fox News.

I mean, besides AOC claiming (without evidence) that Fox is trying to get her killed every few weeks.

And besides all of the calls to censor and cancel the network, have it removed from cable carriers and its on-air talent fired.

But yes, besides all of that non-stop outrage, I also wonder why outrage isn’t directed at Fox.

You're sidestepping the point. Conservatives are outraged because it appears Twitter was biased in favor of Dems. Why are they not outraged at Fox for being biased for Republicans? I understand if you prefer to ignore that because it's an embarrassing double-standard, but flailing around and predictably bringing up AOC just seems like you're trying to distract.
 
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genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,105
2,683
Have you seen this video posted earlier today. It's wild out there.

I wonder why this same organization never asked Trump about his connection to China. A good amount of his MAGA hats were manufactured there. Ironic


Apple has "fully resumed" advertising on the Twitter social network, Twitter CEO Elon Musk said today during a two-hour Twitter Spaces chat highlighted by Bloomberg. Musk also confirmed that Apple is Twitter's largest advertiser.

Twitter-Feature.jpg

Just five days ago, Musk accused Apple of hating "free speech," "making moderation demands," and ceasing ad spending, causing a slew of press coverage about a potential battle brewing between Apple and Twitter. Musk publicly claimed that Apple had "mostly stopped" offering ads on Twitter and that it had also threatened to "withhold Twitter from its App Store."

Then, two days after making those statements, Musk met with Apple CEO Tim Cook, and ended up reversing course. After the meeting, Musk said that there had actually been a "misunderstanding" about Twitter potentially being removed from the App Store, and Cook "was clear that Apple never considered doing so."

Musk said that Cook had shown him around Apple Park and that the two had a "good conversation," which apparently led to Apple resuming its Twitter ads. Apple had not confirmed that it had stopped ad spending on Twitter, nor has it said anything about Musk's comments today. Following the Twitter Space discussion, Musk tweeted to "thank advertisers for returning to Twitter."

Apple is consistently one of Twitter's top advertisers, and the ad spending reportedly exceeds $100 million annually.

Article Link: Elon Musk Says Apple Has 'Fully Resumed' Advertising on Twitter
He should probably stop posting every on Twitter. Especially when it comes to Apple. They don’t like attention and will cut you when you least expect it.
 

shyam09

macrumors 68020
Oct 31, 2010
2,230
2,502
You're sidestepping the point. Conservatives are outraged because it appears Twitter was biased in favor of Dems. Why are they not outraged at Fox for being biased for Republicans? I understand if you prefer to ignore that because it's an embarrassing double-standard, but flailing around and predictably bringing up AOC just seems like you're trying to distract.
You're missing the point entirely. Democrats are obbbbbbviouslyyyyyyy super evil villains = justification for just about anything in the world. Mandate of Heaven.
 
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A MacBook lover

Suspended
May 22, 2009
2,011
4,582
D.C.
I wonder why this same organization never asked Trump about his connection to China. A good amount of his MAGA hats were manufactured there. Ironic
This is false. They were made in USA. However, if you went to Washington DC and bought it off the street vendors - those are made in China.

Anyone can alibaba knock offs these days. Even I bought the Chinese version because the American one was expensive
 
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jimbobb24

Suspended
Jun 6, 2005
3,361
5,393
Tim isn’t dumb enough to fall for that trap. He’s a businessman and I’m sure he’s not happy with what’s going on but when it comes down to it, his job is to keep Apple doing well.

The same people that criticize Apple for human rights are likely buying clothes made by children in some terrible sweatshop. Of course you can buy properly made clothes by union workers but then you’re going to be spending significantly more money. Then it would come down to well do I buy some great clothes made by union workers and not have money for groceries or buy the clothes made in a sweatshop. In the end, just like Tim most people are going to do what’s best for their family.

No, it’s not a good situation but it’s reality
Tim is not a disinterested businessman looking solely at money. They actively helped suppress Chinese dissidents by disabling airdrop- that’s the worst of calculated businessman parodies. Then he pulled ads on Twitter to protest free speech. That might cost him money. Based on this sample it might be time to wonder if maybe Tim just is actively anti-speech.
 
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jimbobb24

Suspended
Jun 6, 2005
3,361
5,393
All those countries don’t have free speech to the degree the US does. I am sure he will try to follow their laws. But his free speech desires are much more in line with US ideals not European who don’t mind suppressing speech to a much more invasive degree.
 
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jimbobb24

Suspended
Jun 6, 2005
3,361
5,393
It is much easier to just shutdown Twitter. All the balcony about free speech to help spread lies, misinformation, and hate is not worth it. If Twitter was gone tomorrow...who cares.
Free speech has been spreading lies, misinformation, and hate since we agreed as a society that the pros of free speech far outweighed the negatives. What’s changed?

You post could be changed to refer to radio, the “internet”, printed words, etc.

It’s worth it. Free speech is crucial for free societies. Haters gonna hate…but free people can handle it.
 
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jimbobb24

Suspended
Jun 6, 2005
3,361
5,393
It is very amusing to see conservatives latch on to this supposed outrage that a social media company was biased in favor of Dems. I wonder why that same outrage isn't directed as Fox "News", a media company clearly biased in favor of Republicans. Curious double-standard. When they do it, it's all about being fair and balanced, but when someone else does it, it's pearl clutching time.
One of the most common intellectual mistakes people make is to make analogies out of non-analogous things. You are doing that here.

You are comparing a network news site to a platform for individuals communicating. The correct analogy for Fox News is CNN and for Twitter is Facebook or even email. Your analogy is meaningless so everything that follows is meaningless.

FYI I favor regulation of all social media companies to mandate free speech or publish their algorithms or that they remove current protections and have to moderate their content and be responsible for it. They have become too important and data shows they have too great an impact on election to let a few oligarchs have that much concentrated power. Concentrated private power of this degree is usually bad for societies.
 

anthogag

macrumors 68020
Jan 15, 2015
2,203
3,613
Canada
Free speech has been spreading lies, misinformation, and hate since we agreed as a society that the pros of free speech far outweighed the negatives. What’s changed?

You post could be changed to refer to radio, the “internet”, printed words, etc.

It’s worth it. Free speech is crucial for free societies. Haters gonna hate…but free people can handle it.
Radio, news, and print is about consumption. What’s changed is anyone from anywhere can write or share anything using the Internet, right.

Everyone wants and likes free speech but companies like Twitter have to be very responsible with it. It is not good to ban people but lies, misinformation, and hate comments should be removed because these work to subvert freedom.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,406
9,840
Columbus, OH
Free speech means people can say whatever they want as long as they aren't doing something illegal.

Only people who have weak arguments can't stand free speech. Everyone else is mature enough to allow people to hold opinions without trying to use the threat of government violence to silence them.

I believe people are smart enough to make the right decisions for themselves. I believe in free speech for all.

Feel free to test this out by calling me an *******, I'm totally fine with that.
Elon certainly isn’t letting Kanye West say what he wants.
 

1885507

Cancelled
Apr 21, 2022
218
259
The real wisdom of "free speech" lies not in how freely words are spread but in who [or what] arbitrates censorship over said words, explicitly or otherwise.
 
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SnappleRumors

Suspended
Aug 22, 2022
394
515
Why are they not outraged at Fox for being biased for Republicans? I understand if you prefer to ignore that because it's an embarrassing double-standard, but flailing around and predictably bringing up AOC just seems like you're trying to distract.

There’s no double standard. Fox is a conservative news organization.
 

seek3r

macrumors 68020
Aug 16, 2010
2,334
3,355
More like Musk came to his senses. The suspension of Kanye West shows a willingness to moderate the extremists after all.
There are tons of accounts posting the same extremist crap Kanye posted right now that arent suspended, Kanye was suspended because he’s big enough news to force musk’s hand. The content moderation team at twitter was decimated, which is why the ADL and NAACP among other have been noting massive rises in antisemitism and racism on the platform…
 
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