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obamtl

macrumors 6502a
May 24, 2010
553
860
I'm pretty sure you can't tell a company how to manufacture a product they produce. You can't force them to design something that is easier to repair by "law". Your free to make whatever you want so long as it complies with safey and it's not toxic or something like that. You can't make Apple or anyone make a product that is repairable.
Actually, yes you can. It's kind of how car manufacturers are required by law to provide seat belts and mirrors. If you want to sell things in that market, you make things according to the legal requirements.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,362
9,713
Columbus, OH
BS. What about water heaters, washers, dryers, cars, ETC and ETC. Why are you suddenly so concerned about phones? Why not demand this of washers and dryers which are mostly unfixable or the cost to fix any one element within it is double the cost of new. That's what you want? Do people buy less washers and dryers and water heaters and stoves and blenders? I call BS on this whole Let Geeky Cousin Dan fix it in his basement. Either you want to make money doing repairs, which means it's just a excuse to create a job for yourself or you are not cognizant of the demands of modern designs.
Dude, I replaced the broken water pump in my washer for like $80. I do all kinds of work on my car myself including replacing the water pump and timing belt. Do you think people aren’t capable of fixing their own things? Just because you don’t know the difference between a wrench and a screwdriver doesn’t mean nobody else does. ?
 
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DeanL

macrumors 65816
May 29, 2014
1,297
1,237
London
There are more than 10 billion transistors in the CPU. Which ones do you think you can replace? On modern iPhones, the batteries and screens are already replaceable. Certainly you aren't going to replace individual components on the circuit boards.

This feels a lot like California's Proposition 65

Right: the right to repair focuses exclusively on repairing CPU transistors.
Thank you for making me laugh at that straw man.
 

2010mini

macrumors 601
Jun 19, 2013
4,698
4,806
Apple should stand behind its products with a minimum 3 year warranty, i
I find it absurd that a giant company like Apple has only a 1 year warranty.

I applaud the EU for this, lots of things are glued in now, nearly impossible to repair, and then there are absurd RAM prices, RAM should be removable and replaceable by the user.
Why? There products are over built to begin with. My 2010 Mac mini is still going strong. And my wife passed down her 2010 MBP to our 10 year old and that is still going without a hickup.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,362
9,713
Columbus, OH
Why? There products are over built to begin with. My 2010 Mac mini is still going strong. And my wife passed down her 2010 MBP to our 10 year old and that is still going without a hickup.
Macs haven’t generally been kind to me with regard to reliability. 2007 MBP had the notorious GPU failure issue. 2011 MBP another notorious GPU failure issue. 2016 MBP notorious keyboard issue. Anyone buying an MBP would be best advised to not buy in years that I buy lol. Those are the only three Macs I’ve owned.
 

NufSaid

macrumors 6502
Oct 28, 2015
445
771
ÜT: 41.065573,-83.668801
Finally, the ball has started to roll... It's shameful that companies like apple (and others in all sorts of technological domains) willfully makes things so hard/impossible to make repairs. Shameful.
Keep in mind they themselves have to repair these electronics from time to time. They are making the best device possible.

I don’t want the device I would end up with if it was super repairable.

I especially don’t like governments dictating how products should be made.
 

Blowback

macrumors 65816
Jan 10, 2018
1,294
735
VA


The European Parliament has this week voted to support the recommendations of the EU Committee on the Internal Market and Consumer Protection on the "Right to Repair," including a system of mandatory labelling on consumer electronics to provide explicit information on the repairability and lifespan of products (via iFixit).

european-parliament.jpg


The motion will compel the EU Commission to "develop and introduce mandatory labeling, to provide clear, immediately visible and easy-to-understand information to consumers on the estimated lifetime and reparability of a product at the time of purchase." This includes a repair score, akin to the repairability scores assigned by iFixit, being clearly shown on goods at the point of purchase. France is already planning to roll out repairability ratings for smartphones, laptops, and other products from January 2021.



According to a recent EU survey of public opinion, 77 percent of EU citizens would rather repair their devices than replace them and 79 percent think that manufacturers should be legally obliged to facilitate the repair of digital devices or the replacement of their individual parts.



Apple has repeatedly been criticized for disproportionate repair prices, such as the $79 fee to service the $99 HomePod mini, and arbitrary limits on repairs, such as barring repair of the iPhone 12's camera without access to Apple's proprietary cloud-linked System Configuration app.

Yesterday, the UK Parliament's Environmental Audit Committee published a report chastising Apple for contributing to a "throwaway culture" of "short-lived products."

The EU motion is likely to encourage a range of repair-friendly policies and product disclosures, but this will be contingent on the European Commission legislating to bring them into effect.

Note: Due to the political or social nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Political News forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: European Parliament Votes to Support Right to Repair
Yep...just like our nutrition labels have lowered obesity and type2 diabetes . Don't get me wrong; I read and use the labels but sometimes I think ALL of the energy and monies involved in endeavors such as this should all go to Education and at the earliest grades. Pols LOVE anything that they can do that doesn't require one iota of effort on the part of their constituents or , especially , campaign contributors.
 
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Blowback

macrumors 65816
Jan 10, 2018
1,294
735
VA
Actually, yes you can. It's kind of how car manufacturers are required by law to provide seat belts and mirrors. If you want to sell things in that market, you make things according to the legal requirements.
Thats apples (no pun intended) and oranges! You're comparing safety vs ease of repair/convenience. I don't think any judge would agree...though Texas juries and EU bureaucrats might.
 

Blowback

macrumors 65816
Jan 10, 2018
1,294
735
VA
Dude, I replaced the broken water pump in my washer for like $80. I do all kinds of work on my car myself including replacing the water pump and timing belt. Do you think people aren’t capable of fixing their own things? Just because you don’t know the difference between a wrench and a screwdriver doesn’t mean nobody else does. ?
You're not addressing his answer .
 

neutrino23

macrumors 68000
Feb 14, 2003
1,881
391
SF Bay area
Sad that Apple's M1 based macs are a shot across the bow of 'self repair', and upgrade.

You either buy big, or you suffer. Like the MacBook Pro I have that is suffering running video intensive programs, and I can't upgrade the memory because Apple decided it was going to sell it as a closed box, no upgrades. So it's a dead end. It'll be still viable if I could upgrade it. With the M1 having the RAM literally on the chip, it gets even worse, right? I don't think there is an excuse for doing this to customers...

Right to repair, and Right to upgrade!
It is not that simple. There are benefits to designing the SOC with very tight coupling between RAM and CPU/GPU. Maybe 99% of MB Air users would never care about upgrading memory. If you want to upgrade memory you can get an iMac or Mac Pro. Your issue seems to be that Apple doesn't make exactly the configuration of device that you want. Welcome to the club.
 

robertosh

macrumors 65816
Mar 2, 2011
1,100
920
Switzerland
I think that the right of repair is not that you need to actually repair yourself the device, is just to have a way to repair it at a reasonable cost by the manufacturer. The cost of repairing the iPhone 6 screen in france is 150€ which is way more of the value of the phone and I’m sure that the screen assembly does not cost that money (and can be swapped in 5 minutes)
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,362
9,713
Columbus, OH
You're not addressing his answer .
I’m not sure what “addressing an answer means”. In any case, the implication was that people aren’t complaining about cars and washing machines not being fixable. Which isn’t true in the first place, as they’re already user-repairable if you are even halfway competent with basic tools. I have zero training on auto or appliance repair, but have managed to do both thanks to this newfangled thing called the Internet and Google. Doing a full brake job including rotor replacement, either this or next weekend. Never done it before, but with basically limitless information available at my fingertips, I don’t anticipate it being overly complicated.
 
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jimbobb24

macrumors 68040
Jun 6, 2005
3,356
5,385
Apple should stand behind its products with a minimum 3 year warranty, i
I find it absurd that a giant company like Apple has only a 1 year warranty.

I applaud the EU for this, lots of things are glued in now, nearly impossible to repair, and then there are absurd RAM prices, RAM should be removable and replaceable by the user.
You have this exactly backward. Toyota builds the best engines and has the worst warranty. When Hyduia came to America they were at 10 years. As they got bigger and better their warranty went lower and lower.
 

justperry

macrumors G5
Aug 10, 2007
12,558
9,750
I'm a rolling stone.
Macs haven’t generally been kind to me with regard to reliability. 2007 MBP had the notorious GPU failure issue. 2011 MBP another notorious GPU failure issue. 2016 MBP notorious keyboard issue. Anyone buying an MBP would be best advised to not buy in years that I buy lol. Those are the only three Macs I’ve owned.
Your just unlucky to "pick" the wrong ones, my Powerbook Pismo lasted me for 8 years, mostly used in a hot and humid tropical country, it was used for more than 15.000 hours.
 

justperry

macrumors G5
Aug 10, 2007
12,558
9,750
I'm a rolling stone.
Why? There products are over built to begin with. My 2010 Mac mini is still going strong. And my wife passed down her 2010 MBP to our 10 year old and that is still going without a hickup.

Why, because if Apple knows their products last that long than stand behind their products with a long warranty, nothing to lose if 99.99% of their products last for ages.
 

Hammerd

macrumors 6502
Jun 2, 2019
373
512
Tim Apple
Apple should stand behind its products with a minimum 3 year warranty, i
I find it absurd that a giant company like Apple has only a 1 year warranty.

I applaud the EU for this, lots of things are glued in now, nearly impossible to repair, and then there are absurd RAM prices, RAM should be removable and replaceable by the user.
They now integrate the RAM into the cpu chip so this is not going to chan for the good
 

justperry

macrumors G5
Aug 10, 2007
12,558
9,750
I'm a rolling stone.
They now integrate the RAM into the cpu chip so this is not going to chan for the good
It wouldn't be such a problem if Apple wouldn't gauge customers on RAM prices.
Going from 8 to 16 GB cost us an extra (Edit)€200 €230(/edit)...insanity.

Price of RAM is dirt cheap nowadays, I bet they make lots of money from just these upgrades alone.
What does 8/16 GB cost, I bet not more than €20

They even "keep" the 8 GB if one upgrades to 16 GB.
 
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CarpalMac

macrumors 68000
Nov 19, 2012
1,623
3,996
UK
Apple should stand behind its products with a minimum 3 year warranty, i
I find it absurd that a giant company like Apple has only a 1 year warranty.

I applaud the EU for this, lots of things are glued in now, nearly impossible to repair, and then there are absurd RAM prices, RAM should be removable and replaceable by the user.

I love that some people have downvoted / disagreed with you on this. Shows off the agents of Apple.

"No, charge me more, offer me less..."
 

gsurf123

macrumors 6502
Jun 1, 2017
472
848
Another motherly law created by the EU which continues to run its nanny state. This repairability rating will only mean something to 1/1000000% for people buying them. If you want an phone (Samsung, Apple, or LG) repairability means nothing to you. Surveys are meaningless as they can give you the results you want depending on how you ask the questions. Repairability sounds good so obviously people would prefer that. Change the question to "would you be willing to pay an extra 10% to have a replaceable battery and accept the larger size of the phone".
 
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