Banks are competing with Apple? What does Apple have that banks need to compete with? Apple is an aggregator and banks will pay to use it only if they find some benefit for them. Currently Apple is forcing them by limiting access to NFC. Why would banks pay money to Apple to let their customers use their cards?
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European Regulators Will Soon Approve Apple's Plan to Open Up Tap-to-Pay to Banks and Payment Providers
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Security. Apple pay reduces fraud, which is a very real cost to banks. Also, the easier it is to use a payment system the more it gets used and the more the banks make in interchange fees.
In most countries, the banking sector is heavily regulated and regularly audited. Apple pay will reach there once they too are subjected to the same regulatory oversight. Until then, I will take my chance with the banks and credit cards.
The regulators are coming for Apple Pay
Apple Pay is next on the regulatory hit list as the US Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (CFPB) moves to put large tech firms with digital payment platforms under stricter scrutiny.
www.computerworld.com
Apple pay introduces another vector of attack. Apple pay has tokenization, which is what most banks would have to implement shortly or have already implemented. American Express, Visa, Thales, Google Pay, Apple pay, Samsung pay, etc., have already implemented tokenization. Nothing special about Apple pay that it has to limit the NFC to itself. Also, Apple pay (and other payment aggregators) are not under the same level of regulatory scrutiny as the banks and the credit cards are. Until then, better to go with the banks or the CCs.
The banks complained about it. They were not fond of paying 0.15% Apple tax on every transaction to which Apple contributes nothing. That kind of thing works in the US not in the EU
Just kidding.It may come to the US too.
US judge orders Apple to face Apple Pay antitrust suit
A US judge has told Apple it must face an antitrust class-action lawsuit from card issuers accusing the firm of preventing competition to its Apple Pay wallet.
You do not want your bank to have data about you? Why? It has all the data about you.
“If Apple can mandate [that] banks pay 15 basis points to Apple for every transaction, couldn’t they mandate a better-provisioning process by banks?” he asked.
Loomis said that Apple has a history of bypassing comprehensive security verification processes in favor of making things easy for consumers. For example, the celebrity iCloud hacks that took place last year may have been prevented if Apple had stronger verification requirements, like two-factor authentication, in place to authenticate users. But then again there is always a trade-off, Loomis said."
Banks screw and harm customers and society all the time.
Yes, it makes sense because it’s based on endless examples.
Except for Apple pay, no other wallet (Google Pay or Samsung Pay) charges the banks. So, the banks support them. You can choose one of them, in that case.
Those hacks happened a decade ago because the celebs had crap passwords and largely because Apple didn’t force users into 6-digit passcodes and 2FA. This was about 2 years before Apple Pay existed and Apple massively upgraded its security in the time in between.
This EU move will soon be replicated all over the world, so I guess people better get used to it. This specific move I like, as long as other financial payment platforms, cannot compel the customer to use their platform, instead of Apple Wallet, which is what I suspect is the case? If it’s not? Then it wouldn’t make sense compelling Apple to open up their NFC access.
In the UK, we are no longer part of the EU, but I can see similar changes coming via UK legislation. To be fair to the EU, most of what they are compelling Apple to do with IOS, already happens on MAC OS for years, to no major or any detriment to the user and gives the consumers a choice. Most of my apps in MAC OS are bought from the App Store and never had a problem on MAC OS making purchases outside the App Store.
In the UK, we are no longer part of the EU, but I can see similar changes coming via UK legislation. To be fair to the EU, most of what they are compelling Apple to do with IOS, already happens on MAC OS for years, to no major or any detriment to the user and gives the consumers a choice. Most of my apps in MAC OS are bought from the App Store and never had a problem on MAC OS making purchases outside the App Store.
Although banks pay a transaction fee to Apple, they do benefit because it increases card usage and reduces cash usage. Customers benefit from a faster, more secure and streamlined purchase flow, and banks benefit from increased card usage as a result, reduced fraud and better security.
It's been shown repeatedly that Apple customers on average have higher incomes and are more willing to spend, so banks also benefit from those people spending more money, more frequently using Apple Pay.
Hmm I don't think Apple has offered to give any app access to the nfc chip, instead they'll probably allow integration with the wallet. So same convenience as before.
Unfortunately, that means they won't give any app access to the NFC chip, so it will still be limited to payments and nothing else.
Unfortunately, that means they won't give any app access to the NFC chip, so it will still be limited to payments and nothing else.
Most banks all over the world have had their politicians under the thumb for centuries would be more accurate.
What national cards are you talking about? There are some, sure, like dankort in Denmark, but it does support Apple Pay; I have one from Danske bank. It’s a multi-role card in Apple Pay, so the merchant can select dankort or VISA.
But since ApplePay supports local cards, that’s irrelevant. Also, ApplePay charges the banks, not the retailer.
All this is not relevant to NFC, which is what the article is about.
Every alternative NFC app also does.
Wouldn't that only be if Apple doesn't open up the Wallet API so that banks can add their own NFC implementations directly into the wallet app? If there is an API available to get your bank's NFC payment option by just double-tapping the side button, how many banks are not going to implement it at least eventually?
This all sounds like complaining about how third-party music applications like Spotify sucked in comparison to Apple's music app, since the Apple one would keep playing music in the background even after you went into another app. For Spotify, you had to keep Spotify as the active application. Of course, the reason for this was quite simple: there was no generally-available multitasking API to play music from a background application before iOS 4. Only the iPod app could play music while being in the background. And once music apps could play music in the background in iOS 4, they obviously implemented it.
Yea… if that’s true I wonder how effective they are considering EU have the lowest fraud rates in the world and the highest security standards within the banking sector.
While the U.S. still uses magnetic strips because it was more expensive in the short term to implement chip & pin payments compared to the visa/ Mastercard fraud expenses.. while EU have long required chip and pin for well over two decades.
EU have required secure online payment verification, the U.S. have had no security improvements.
U.S. fraud rates are skyrocketing year by year, while EU have had it shrink for a decade.
EU dictated you need clear consent to collect private user data, while in the USA if you missed the ToS fine print in their toilet roles that the banks had they could probably do whatever they pleases.
Example I live close to the edge of two counties I would need to use two different card in your example and that sounds kind of clunky.
Well it’s private enterprises, nothing for the authorities to do for the separate counties private public transport companies.
Competition is great if it drives down prices and/or innovates.
I haven't seen any explanation on what innovation payment needs compared to Apple Pay. It's convenient as hell, its cryptography is also sound, and privacy is taken into account.
What this will instead do is allow stores and banks to set up their own proprietary systems, making them more money, giving them more data, and making the experience worse for consumers.
Well the payment system, the wallet, user to user transactions, B2C etc.
Are they actually reducing that much fraud in Eu tho?
I would believe it’s a major security improvement for US banks and customers.
We have for example the current eID that we use for both online/ local verification is more secure than Apples current Apple pay security standard.
It would make the current phone number based money payment system to be way more convenient etc etc
I think you should look at the diversity of payment methods employed in EU or the eID we have that are hampered by no NFC support
Giving them data?… they have it already
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Banks already have apps. Apple inserting itself is an unneeded risk.
Once banks have access to NFC, these benefits will not be exclusive to Apple Pay. The convenience of tap to pay will be available to the bank apps also.
Exactly. They did not think anything would happen until it happened. Banks are regulated strictly. Apple pay is not. Therefore, Apple pay is not safe for consumers the way banks are. Once both of them are regulated the same way, then we can talk about it.
Why would you expect any of those things?
I certainly have a degree of trust in Apple, but I also trust financial institutions to be able to handle financial transactions.
Tell me how is my experience improved by the the Swish app we use for purchasing at shops or sending payment between two users instantly.
It works exactly like Apple Cash ( without iMessage) but as a instand direct bank to bank transfer,As well as tap to pay.
- Blik
- Swish
- Mobilepay
- Vipps
- Siirto
- Bizum
- SEPA
How are they improved if NFC wasn’t available?
Banks are regulated but fraud has happened to major banking institutions in North America. Since Apple Pay is not safe can you point to some stories of a general issue where the owner of an iPhone had their apple pay transaction go askew?