I hate Macbooks

[sierra oscar]

...There's no difference. It's not as though your computer is going to be better if you buy directly from Apple. Order from either Apple, NextByte, Streetwise, MAC1, etc. I bought mine online, but only because I wanted the educational discount, and resellers aren't allowed to sell computers with an educational discount anymore.

Well I've always received my edu discount through an apple reseller - unless things changed since last week.

The difference (and essence of my post) is when something goes wrong....it would be nice to and walk into an apple store / or make a genius bar apt. If you buy online you have to return it online / to POS. This is the issue for me - would be nice to have a choice instead of having to send my computer back interstate somewhere for some unknown time.

 

[CrackedButter]

Having a discoloured palm rest gives the iBook or white MacBook some character! I have one on the left side palm rest shaped exactly like my palm, I use it as a place holder now so I know where to properly rest my palm!

Getting Apple to replace something you have worked on is silly but for some reason an acceptable problem caused by Apple.

"My duvet is covered in dead skin and has slightly discoloured pillows, instead of keeping it clean I'll get Duvets Inc to get me replacement."

"My brand new bike has got mud on it, instead of cleaning it, I'll get a replacement bike."

"The fan in my ATX case is covered in fluff and dirt, I want a replacement part."

Doesn't sound right does it, but its okay if its Apple. You all see how this works? You used the laptop as it should be used but expect the company you bought it off to look after it for you. Nothing is wrong with it but your own sense of appreciation for it, which you want Apple to fix. Some put this ideology down to the fact Apple sell "wonderful looking products" but somehow comprised this product's design and aesthetic appeal when someone doesn't like the fact the product isn't looking good after they use it.

Suck it up and stop wasting Apple's time over such visual issues.

 

[mattjgalloway]

No, but there's a difference there...

The staining issue is a problem with the way the plastic was manufactured and therefore Apple's issue and not something people should have to live with.

When you buy a bike you know it will get dirty and you can clean it with some water. With the MacBook, you don't expect it to get dirty from using it non-excessively as some people have experienced.

Anyway, Apple fixed the problem, so it's all good.

 

[Abstract]

Apple used a plastic that was too porous and trapped oil. It is a manufacturing related mistake, so they chose to replace it.

"My duvet is covered in dead skin and has slightly discoloured pillows, instead of keeping it clean I'll get Duvets Inc to get me replacement."

"My brand new bike has got mud on it, instead of cleaning it, I'll get a replacement bike."

"The fan in my ATX case is covered in fluff and dirt, I want a replacement part."

All these things can be maintained and cleaned by the user after normal use.

I think this is the 2nd most poorly argued point I have replied to over the past week.

 

[NicP]

Having a discoloured palm rest gives the iBook or white MacBook some character! I have one on the left side palm rest shaped exactly like my palm, I use it as a place holder now so I know where to properly rest my palm!

Getting Apple to replace something you have worked on is silly but for some reason an acceptable problem caused by Apple.

"My duvet is covered in dead skin and has slightly discoloured pillows, instead of keeping it clean I'll get Duvets Inc to get me replacement."

"My brand new bike has got mud on it, instead of cleaning it, I'll get a replacement bike."

"The fan in my ATX case is covered in fluff and dirt, I want a replacement part."

Doesn't sound right does it, but its okay if its Apple. You all see how this works? You used the laptop as it should be used but expect the company you bought it off to look after it for you. Nothing is wrong with it but your own sense of appreciation for it, which you want Apple to fix. Some put this ideology down to the fact Apple sell "wonderful looking products" but somehow comprised this product's design and aesthetic appeal when someone doesn't like the fact the product isn't looking good after they use it.

Suck it up and stop wasting Apple's time over such visual issues.

The funny thing is when people first started complaining about this i thought exactly the same thing, they shouldnt have used it with dirty hands, they should try cleaning it etc etc. Mine and my girlfriends macbooks have been treated extremly well (this is a large amount of money for us) and my girlfriends palm area has gone all gross (mine is fine at the moment) and no amount of cleaning will fix it. Also there are people who have put protective covers over the plastic on the palm rests and are still having the discoloration problem.

If i bought a car and it got dirty i would clean it. If i bought a car and the paint went a funny color in some places that could not be cleaned off i would be taking it back. Of course if the discoloration happened over a few years and was the result of me not maintaining it properly thats a different story.

 

[Fuchal]

So i just got back from my local apple replace place where mine and my girlfriends macbooks have been sitting for the past week, i went there to try and show them the random shutting down problem the computers have. Mine also has a faulty superdrive and my girlfriends has discoloration on the palm rests. So far the only thing being fixed is the superdrive (one is on order), the discoloration they wont replace without geting authorisation from apple and the random shutdown problems they cant duplicate.

A week ago i spoke to apple on the phone for an hour to try and get these computers replaced, after being fowarded through 4 departments and back to the one i started at i was told that they only replace or refund computers under "exceptional circumstances".

Its frustrating enough when something goes wrong with a brand new piece of equipment, but when multiple things go wrong with 2 pieces of equipment and i'm told its not an "exceptional circumstance" and it cant be replaced it needs to go in for repair i get pissed.

And now the computers arent even being repaired, nothing is being done about the shutdowns because the problem is hard to duplicate. now i need to call applecare again to get authorisation to swap the palm rest for one that isnt discolored.

These computers are driving me insane, i can understand that there might be problems but why cant apple just swap the computers? Ive called applecare numerous times and driven to the repair place 3 times, I just want computers that work. 3 people I know were going to buy macbooks (2 friends and my girlfriends brother), after both our macbooks have have problems and its been such a hassle to get them fixed they have changed their mind.

Well done on driving customers away

/end rant

Send a nice email to sjobs@apple.com explaining everything with your phone number.

 

[miles01110]

why cant apple just swap the computers?

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1984

A company would much rather sell 2 units to 2 people and risk having one of them coming back for a repair than to sell 1 unit and "give" 1 unit to ONE person.

Simple economics, really, especially given the shortage.

 

[Trekkie]

I think you missed the point, i understand there are problems but what i cant understand is how apple cant just replace the faulty macbooks and be done with it. As i said, if there is 1 problem with a macbook fine, but for multiple problems with multiple macbooks dont you think apple should clasify this as an "exceptional circumstance" and just replace the machines?

Speaking from experience as a person who designs a product that has to be warranted, there are several problems that need convoluted processes to make sure it really is an 'exceptional circumstance' and not just a bitchy customer who wants something for nothing. Me personally I'd define 'exceptional circumstance' as something that has 'fire' in the sentance when someone calls you. Random lockups, or discoloration of plastic wouldn't hit that. But again, that's just me.

I know it will come as a shock, but not all computers are really broken. Usually it's something the user does to them and either doesn't realize it, or 'forgets' to mention it. I do not believe you are doing this, I'm just saying a large chunk of the time you'll find that they're either 'avoiding' to mention that it bounced down a flight of stairs or they're clicking/poking something at the same time something else happens.

First, regardless of the situation they will treat both your machine and your girlfriends machine as two seperate instances. They will not combine them as a 'systemic problem'. This is pretty much SOP unless you happen to have a personal Apple sales person and buy large quantities a year from them, then that tends to grease the wheels.

Unless you surf porn all day, I suggest you set up a video camera over your shoulder and document the random shutdowns. The problem with those is extremely frustrating as a service provider and as a user of a product. The hard part is that could be a short caused by slight flexing of the case that is only done in certain instances, or something odd of that nature. It's very hard to document something like this, so video is your friend. If it is happening to you on a regular basis you should be able to catch it rather quickly.

Second, don't shoot the messenger. A lot of service personnel are given zero leeway on things. Sometimes your best option is to win them over personally so that they go to bat for you, but if you rip em a new one or they all run for the back room when you show up they're not going to go to bat for you when they get the paperwork pushback.

Usually those two things can get you a lot further than screaming and yelling.

 

[CrackedButter]

Apple used a plastic that was too porous and trapped oil. It is a manufacturing related mistake, so they chose to replace it.



All these things can be maintained and cleaned by the user after normal use.

I think this is the 2nd most poorly argued point I have replied to over the past week.

At least it wasn't the first most poorly argued point you have replied to over the past week!

One wasn't to know about the plastic Apple used. However, if I did know, I wouldn't have typed what I typed, BUT my original point would still stand if they hadn't have used a plastic that was too porous! Just so you know.

 

[slffl]

I always tell people who ask me for advice on which computer to get, to get an abacus. Computers fail, abaci don't.

 

[JAT]

I always tell people who ask me for advice on which computer to get, to get an abacus. Computers fail, abaci don't.

God, if only that were true! My abacus has, indeed, failed. It fell apart (glue issue) and oxidized (part copper, I think). Very sad, I had to get rid of it.

 

[beloved84]

don't buy macbooks! i had to fix it 5 times!

 

[NicP]

Speaking from experience as a person who designs a product that has to be warranted, there are several problems that need convoluted processes to make sure it really is an 'exceptional circumstance' and not just a bitchy customer who wants something for nothing. Me personally I'd define 'exceptional circumstance' as something that has 'fire' in the sentance when someone calls you. Random lockups, or discoloration of plastic wouldn't hit that. But again, that's just me.

I know it will come as a shock, but not all computers are really broken. Usually it's something the user does to them and either doesn't realize it, or 'forgets' to mention it. I do not believe you are doing this, I'm just saying a large chunk of the time you'll find that they're either 'avoiding' to mention that it bounced down a flight of stairs or they're clicking/poking something at the same time something else happens.

First, regardless of the situation they will treat both your machine and your girlfriends machine as two seperate instances. They will not combine them as a 'systemic problem'. This is pretty much SOP unless you happen to have a personal Apple sales person and buy large quantities a year from them, then that tends to grease the wheels.

Unless you surf porn all day, I suggest you set up a video camera over your shoulder and document the random shutdowns. The problem with those is extremely frustrating as a service provider and as a user of a product. The hard part is that could be a short caused by slight flexing of the case that is only done in certain instances, or something odd of that nature. It's very hard to document something like this, so video is your friend. If it is happening to you on a regular basis you should be able to catch it rather quickly.

Second, don't shoot the messenger. A lot of service personnel are given zero leeway on things. Sometimes your best option is to win them over personally so that they go to bat for you, but if you rip em a new one or they all run for the back room when you show up they're not going to go to bat for you when they get the paperwork pushback.

Usually those two things can get you a lot further than screaming and yelling.

I used to work in tech support for a large company (over summer holidays, i'm a student) so i know what you mean about most computers not just failing by themselves. I can assure you that these computers have been taken care of and have in fact had these problems all by themselves.

About the documenting random shutdowns, they appear in the log files every time the computer shuts down, and there are pleanty of people talking about it all over the internet. I tried to show the tech yesterday (often happens if you work the processor when the computer is cold), but alas it would not shutdown for me. I recorded a video of it happening on my cell phone and showed him, but they like to see the problem for themselves.

RE: dont shoot the messenger. Dont worry i know this one too well, i work in retail, and a nice customer you are way more willing to help than someone screaming at you. But... Its pretty hard not to get a little worked up when you get fowarded through 4 departments (over an hour) and back to the one you origionally started at and they tell you there is nothing they can do to help. The guy told me that he would get the next level to ring me back or something and they never rung.

 

[sulhaq]

I am a neat freak, among other things, especially in things that I buy, and when I pay $1500+ on something I expect it to be completely flawless. I bought a macbook and after a week's use the palmrest started creaking. I called up Apple immediately and they told me to either send it in or take it to a retail store so a technician can look at it. I took it to a retail store and the guy observed the creaking problem and immediately acknowledged a DoA product, I was able to get a replacement within 1 business day in the mail.

so, in conclusion, my experience with Apple has been great in this regard, I don't know why they are giving you such a hard time. Perhaps you are not diligent enough, don't be shy or be afraid to demand something of them. Call up apple and in a firm calm voice demand that you be sent two new products immediately. Usually if you make a big fuss they agree to whatever it is you want. After all you payed good money, why should you get anything but flawless, especially when it's new.

 

[NicP]

I got the 2 macbooks back yesterday. On my girlfriends they replaced the front discolored panel, i had to ring up apple customer support, who then rang the repair center to authorise replacement (not sure why the repair center couldn't just ring up customer support). The replaced the superdrive in my macbook.

So far there have been no problems on my girlfriends machine, i updated the firmware and there doesn't seam to be any random shutdowns or hangs. Mine is a different story, it shutdown once yesterday and 10 times so far today, I've found that a cool machine often shuts down when doing the hardware test.

I'm ringing the ACCC tomorrow and then apple support again, I can't afford to be without a laptop for another 2 weeks while they get their act together, I paid for a laptop that works.

 

[Temujin]

http://www.macbookrandomshutdown.com/

 

[twistedlegato]

Get them to replace your heat sink not your logic bored. the logic board replacment does nothing, your heat sink has a problem, and when they replaced my heat sink....it was fixed...

 

[SndChsr]

Possible Fix

I have a MacBook I bought the day they came out, and experienced the shutdown problem as well. Since I live 3 hours away from an Apple store, I wanted to look at all options before turning the problem over to Apple. I swaped the RAM chips into the opposite slots (RAM A in Slot B....RAM B in Slot A), and haven't ever had the problem since. I know its a long shot, but its simple to try, doesn't void your warrenty, and you may get lucky and fix the problem yourself.

 

[gigantic]

Could it be.....

I had a similar experience and wrote about it in and earlier thread.

I wonder if Apple Canada has a very different protocol or way of dealing w things because I recieved nothing but full respect and excellent service from my Apple Store. I even wrote a letter thanking the Genius for making me feel like a human being and valued customer.
I by no means think you are out of line w ur request for new computers but somtimes the approach makes the BIG difference on how you will be dealt with, along w whos ear is listening to your problems.
My advice BE POSITIVE BE POLITE AND BE CALM whenever you have a breakdown that requires customer service. It really works ...... at least up here in Canada, and now I'm talking from experience.
Good luck,I'll bet you will be pleased w how it all pans out in the end.

 

[airmac]

However, I'd like to see statistics that show that the random shut-down problem is major, and that lots of people are suffering from this known issue. I didn't know about it until I read this thread, and I know 4 other MacBook users who haven't had problems like this, either.

Another smart guy. Well, if you would like to know if this is a major problem or not, just enter *random shut down* in the Google.

...

 

[Temujin]

Another smart guy. Well, if you would like to know if this is a major problem or not, just enter *random shut down* in the Google.

...

or go here as mentioned a couple of posts back

http://www.macbookrandomshutdown.com/

 

[NicP]

I have a MacBook I bought the day they came out, and experienced the shutdown problem as well. Since I live 3 hours away from an Apple store, I wanted to look at all options before turning the problem over to Apple. I swaped the RAM chips into the opposite slots (RAM A in Slot B....RAM B in Slot A), and haven't ever had the problem since. I know its a long shot, but its simple to try, doesn't void your warrenty, and you may get lucky and fix the problem yourself.

I've tried with 2 different sets of ram and the problem still occurs

to the person who has never heard of the random shutdown issue:

http://arstechnica.com/journals/apple.ars/2006/7/18/4689
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/213531/
http://forums.appletalk.com.au/index.php?showtopic=24056&pid=202353&st=0&#entry202353
http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?t=300808
http://www.macworld.com/forums/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=432309&an=0&page=0
http://www.macintouch.com/readerreports/macbook/index.html
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=32&threadid=1909803&enterthread=y
http://www.appledefects.com/?p=65
http://www.mobilemag.com/redirect.php?content=9263
blogs.zdnet.com/Apple/?p=274
http://digg.com/search?s=random+shutdown

 

[alec]

This is obviously a major problem for lots of MacBook owners, including me. Maybe they can just give me a MacBook with Core 2's when they come out?

 

[Gurutech]

After my great experience with Powerbook G4 1.33 Ghz, I persuade my younger brother to get MB for his college laptop.
He was very glad for it until now. Not that he doesn't like it, but his MB has started to show some problem. He got his palmrest replaced due to strain problem. He doesn't mind actually. However, after last firmware and OSX security patch, he sometimes started to get rainbow thingy that can be solved by PRAM reset. Then he's complaning that his MB sometimes shuts down without any warning.

He doesn't really know that much about computer in general, so I'm monitoring his problem (think he has random shutdown issue that many of members nowadays are complaining)

 

[TBi]

I'm having the random shutdown problem too. I am in the market to buy a new Merom based iMac but with the macbook i have a feeling like i can't fix anything in it, and i know it will be the same with an iMac. At least with a PC i know i can fix it. I can take out the motherboard and exchange it, i can replace the ram, replace the CPU, replace the graphics card. I know that within one year of buying any of those i'll get a direct replacement when it goes faulty. I won't have to send it in to get looked at to see if they can see the problem, i have it fixed myself.

This lack of control is quite depressing for me as i've always built and fixed my own computers in the past. I know the mac will work perfectly when it's working but these problems i'm having...

Oh and they can't seem to replicate my random shutdown problem so they might not be replacing anything which means i'm going to get a broken laptop back. Which could mean that the next time it shuts down i might be out of my 3 month free phone call support. I don't want to pay however much it is just for them to look at my laptop again.

I had a bad experience with my MBP and now with my MB.

Also for the price of an iMac + extra ram i can get a

ANTEC NSK1300 micro atx case
Zalman Reserator + (w/NB cooler)
Conroe 2.4GHz
2GB DDR
ASUS i965 uATX motherboard
7900GT
320GB HD

I can cool everything with the reserator and stick the computer itself into a cupboard. That will make it very quiet and the zalman can passively dump all the heat outside the cupboard.

With Vista coming soon it's a tough choice.