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iPhelim

macrumors regular
Oct 24, 2007
243
0
The UK HE store is just a part of the several different Education stores that you can use to purchase in the UK. I have no idea if the same applies in the US.
I found only recently that i have 3 years of warranty on my MacBook for free, its in its second year and i almost want it to die so i get a new one!


Yeah, that was your fault, not Dell's.

Well yes it may have been the persons fault, but Apple have a solution for it don't they.


This one is genuinely funny, because Vista actually does precache often used files & programs to make them faster at loading, whilst OS X doesn't! But hey, placebo is a good enough reason to buy a Mac, right?

OS X does cache, AppleInsider mentioned this today:

"Mac OS X aggressively caches data to allow the slower HDD to launch its applications nearly as fast on a second try."

Windows Vista Home Premium and Ultimate both come with Windows Media Center. Sorry, but Media Center simply blows away Front Row in terms of looks and functionality.

abahshh! LOOKS!? Compare this: http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keating/image-files/media-center-edition-2005.jpg

with this: http://atinyblip.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/frontrow_20071016.jpg

And as you said, only the two top, most expensive versions come with it. Compare that with one, substantially cheaper, version which contains all.


Plus, if you're using it for DVDs, the built-in DVD decoder in Vista Home Premium and Ultimate takes full advantage of GPU video features. So you get full hardware MPEG-2 decoding, deblocking, hardware upscaling, etc.

Now i'm really no DVD expert...but...did you just make some of those terms up :D
 

iPhelim

macrumors regular
Oct 24, 2007
243
0
Bingo. People steal iPods not because they're the bestest players ever, but because they're by far the most popular mp3 players out there, with the largest market share. No different with Windows. In fact, you could even say Zune users who spend all of their time flaming iPods are the media player equivalents of Apple users who spend all of their time flaming Windows.

Except for the fact that there are fewer Zune users, that iPods are good and Windows is crap compared to OS X.
 

lost eden

macrumors 6502a
Mar 18, 2007
651
0
UK
Well yes it may have been the persons fault, but Apple have a solution for it don't they.
A solution for stupidity? If you're stupid enough to pull your power cable so tight that you actually damage the plug/socket, firstly you shouldn't be let near a computer & secondly what's to stop you doing the same for the USB/firewire/monitor/audio/etc? The magnetic connector is a neat idea for the most part, but I've lost count of how many times somebody has brushed past it & knocked it out. Not to mention that if you have just one other cable connected, it completely loses it's benefits over a cylinder plug. It also prevents cheap 3rd-party accessories like universal power adaptors, external battery packs, etc. & forces you to buy any replacements needed from Apple.

OS X does cache, AppleInsider mentioned this today:
Caching after an initial launch of an application/file for faster subsequent launches isn't the same as what Vista does which helps faster initial launches (no, I haven't read TFA so I will politely concede this point if somebody who gives a damn wants to fight it & find links).

and Windows is crap compared to OS X
Anybody who makes a claim like this with absolutely no support is clearly a complete & utter smacktard & should be completely ignored.
 

mosx

macrumors 65816
Mar 3, 2007
1,465
3
abahshh! LOOKS!? Compare this: http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keat...ition-2005.jpg

with this: http://atinyblip.files.wordpress.com...w_20071016.jpg

And as you said, only the two top, most expensive versions come with it. Compare that with one, substantially cheaper, version which contains all.

First, have you SEEN Media Center in action? Yeah it looks a lot better. Also makes you wonder where Apple got the idea for the UI for Front Row ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rdpt8jcQjUo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjoyXh2LNuw&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfjE6MTJFOE&feature=related

Sorry, but Front Row has nothing on Media Center ;) Nothing at all. The UI isn't as good, the functionality isn't as good, even the eye candy isn't as good.

Most expensive versions? Vista Home Premium can be had for less than Leopard. You can pick up Vista Home Premium (full version) at newegg for $111.49 (64-bit) or the 32-bit edition for $109.99. Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 is $114.99.

Now i'm really no DVD expert...but...did you just make some of those terms up

Nope, I did not. You're more than welcome to search nVidia, Intervideo, Cyberlink, and Microsoft's own websites to see what I'm talking about. http://www.nvidia.com/page/purevideo.html there you go. Some of their products listed have slightly different feature sets compared to their comparison list. For example, the GeForce 8400M GS HP uses IS capable of deblocking (the feature is there in the drivers and moving the slider has a noticeable impact on image quality).
 

mrtune

macrumors 6502a
Jun 23, 2007
803
20
I'm in full agreement with mosx. Vista's media center (not to be confused with the one that xp media center uses) is miles ahead of front row. I'm an ex vista user (used it for a year before switching to a mac) and I've got to say, frontrow feels like a downgrade compared to what I used to use.
 

heatmiser

macrumors 68020
Dec 6, 2007
2,431
0
Except for the fact that there are fewer Zune users, that iPods are good and Windows is crap compared to OS X.

See, this is where fanboy blindness kicks in. You prefer OS X. That's cool. But your subjective preference doesn't make OS X objectively superior to Windows. Sort of like how my subjective preference of the iPod doesn't make the player objectively superior to the Zune. And there being fewer Zune users agrees with my point, as there are far fewer Apple users than Windows users. For the most part, people use iPods and people use Windows. A small percentage of people use Zunes and Macs. The overwhelming percentage of people in both groups (iPods, Zunes, Windows, and OS X) use them without disparaging their "competition". The small percentage of people who don't are called...wait for it...FANBOYS. You as an Apple user flaming Windows are no different from a Zune user flaming iPods. It looks silly to everyone else in the real world who uses whatever they use to get the job done without flaming gear they don't use. :D
 

UnclePaulie

macrumors regular
Apr 6, 2004
123
12
LA, CA
Since you're looking at the 13" MacBook, have you considered the Dell XPS M1330? That's about the same size/weight as a MacBook but has faster processor options, LED backlit screen, nVidia graphics card, etc. I am currently an owner of a 15" 2.4 MBP and the M1330. I'm selling the MBP though, as much as I like OS X I bought too expensive of a computer for what I need. I was considering switching over to the MacBook, but I'd rather have a good Windows machine than a slower OS X one.
 

Shackler

macrumors 6502a
Feb 3, 2007
617
0
behind you!
See, this is where fanboy blindness kicks in. You prefer OS X. That's cool. But your subjective preference doesn't make OS X objectively superior to Windows. Sort of like how my subjective preference of the iPod doesn't make the player objectively superior to the Zune. And there being fewer Zune users agrees with my point, as there are far fewer Apple users than Windows users. For the most part, people use iPods and people use Windows. A small percentage of people use Zunes and Macs. The overwhelming percentage of people in both groups (iPods, Zunes, Windows, and OS X) use them without disparaging their "competition". The small percentage of people who don't are called...wait for it...FANBOYS. You as an Apple user flaming Windows are no different from a Zune user flaming iPods. It looks silly to everyone else in the real world who uses whatever they use to get the job done without flaming gear they don't use. :D

WOW! you just slapped a bunch of Apple Fanbooys in the face with this right here. i COMPLETELY agree, as much as i LOVE everything APPLE and hate windows with a passion, this is so true.

as for a OP i feel ur pain. i just wish i could run OSX on a Dell XPS:rolleyes:...legally.
 

ayeying

macrumors 601
Dec 5, 2007
4,547
13
Yay Area, CA
Nope, I did not. You're more than welcome to search nVidia, Intervideo, Cyberlink, and Microsoft's own websites to see what I'm talking about. http://www.nvidia.com/page/purevideo.html there you go. Some of their products listed have slightly different feature sets compared to their comparison list. For example, the GeForce 8400M GS HP uses IS capable of deblocking (the feature is there in the drivers and moving the slider has a noticeable impact on image quality).

Its capable, but that also requires a BETTER video card to run it. If you tried something similar to a machine such as the macbook, macbook air, mac mini, it'll lag if they used the GPU for those features. Therefore, it relies on a seperate component to do the SAME THING without requiring maxed out specs on the VIDEO CARD or CPU.

I'm not saying Macs are better then PCs because PCs usually have the upper hand when it comes to upgrade/repair. However, OSX is far superior to Windows Vista or XP in many different ways that we don't use normally so we don't notice it. Its just the little things that people tend not to even bother mentioning and just go ahead with the major stuff such as GUI or bundled programs.

Furthermore, unless your watching a blue-ray or HD-DVD movie on a HDTV with an HDMI thats connected to your laptop, people can easily say that default DVD player program that came with OSX are more then enough in terms of picture quality and sound quality.
 

mosx

macrumors 65816
Mar 3, 2007
1,465
3
Its capable, but that also requires a BETTER video card to run it. If you tried something similar to a machine such as the macbook, macbook air, mac mini, it'll lag if they used the GPU for those features. Therefore, it relies on a seperate component to do the SAME THING without requiring maxed out specs on the VIDEO CARD or CPU.

Well, OS X actually is NOT capable of this feature.

Neither are the GMA 950 or GMA X3100s used in the Mac minis and MacBooks.

However, all of the dedicated GPUs Apple has been using for the last few generations of computers have been. Even the old Radeon 9200 used in the now old iBook G4s and Mac minis were capable of full MPEG-2 decoding and deblocking. But OS X does not take advantage of these features.

Also, those features don't require "maxed out specs". Nvidia and ATI/AMD's GPUs have been doing things like this for generations now, and even their integrated GPUs have had similar capabilities for quite some time.

The lowest models of the GeForce 8400M family can even have these features, and be configured with only 64MB of video memory if Apple chooses to do so.

The thing is, even modern low-end hardware is capable of features beyond what Apple includes in their "low-end" hardware that has a premium price.

Thats why its possible for low-end PC hardware well under $1,000 to be able to play blu-ray and HD DVD discs, as well as modern games.

I'm not saying Macs are better then PCs because PCs usually have the upper hand when it comes to upgrade/repair. However, OSX is far superior to Windows Vista or XP in many different ways that we don't use normally so we don't notice it. Its just the little things that people tend not to even bother mentioning and just go ahead with the major stuff such as GUI or bundled programs.


OS X being "superior" to Windows is also a matter of opinion. While OS X might have the advantage in say... UI or the way you install software, Windows is far more flexible and has better software variety and DirectX gaming walks all over what OS X can do with OpenGL. Also, OS X has no equivalent to software like WinDVD, PowerDVD, Media Center (Vista), and Nero.

Furthermore, unless your watching a blue-ray or HD-DVD movie on a HDTV with an HDMI thats connected to your laptop, people can easily say that default DVD player program that came with OSX are more then enough in terms of picture quality and sound quality.

Spoken like someone who has never used a good DVD player in Windows with a good GPU ;) Tiger and below had DVD Players that were just terrible. Not even worth mentioning. But Leopard's is better. However, it is still a night and day difference comparing it to WinDVD, PowerDVD, or Vista's built-in decoder. Especially if your hardware is doing all of the work as far as deinterlacing, deblocking, etc. is concerned. When it comes to audio, there is no comparison. You get boomy and funky sounding bass with DVD Player in OS X, thanks to the EQ and the LFE channel (the .1 in 5.1) being discarded. WinDVD and others in Windows can decode the LFE and send it through to headphones or speakers. That makes the difference between boomy bad sounding bass and a good set of headphones hitting as low as a subwoofer and vibrating on your head ;)

For the most part, OS X vs. Windows is subjective. There are areas where both have advantages over others. It really depends on what you're willing to sacrifice. With OS X you have to sacrifice video quality, gaming, software choice, and (lately) hardware build quality, but you gain great built-in software and a beautiful UI and some really cool features. With Windows you have to sacrifice a great pack-in software package and a much better UI, but you gain better hardware, better video, and more overall flexibility.
 

ayeying

macrumors 601
Dec 5, 2007
4,547
13
Yay Area, CA
Spoken like someone who has never used a good DVD player in Windows with a good GPU ;) Tiger and below had DVD Players that were just terrible. Not even worth mentioning. But Leopard's is better. However, it is still a night and day difference comparing it to WinDVD, PowerDVD, or Vista's built-in decoder. Especially if your hardware is doing all of the work as far as deinterlacing, deblocking, etc. is concerned. When it comes to audio, there is no comparison. You get boomy and funky sounding bass with DVD Player in OS X, thanks to the EQ and the LFE channel (the .1 in 5.1) being discarded. WinDVD and others in Windows can decode the LFE and send it through to headphones or speakers. That makes the difference between boomy bad sounding bass and a good set of headphones hitting as low as a subwoofer and vibrating on your head ;)

In all seriousness, there's always something better in a few weeks/months/years. So what's the point of having the best right now anyways? If you want a sharper picture on your DVDs, fine, I don't care. But watching a 2 hour movie in ultra high quality or regular DVD quality is still the same thing. I personally care about the story line more then if I can see the pores on the actors face. If I wanted that, I'll goto an Art Museum, that's way better and way better quality (depending on art) then anything on screen.

Vista's built-in decoder is a piece of junk. Sure it has it, I don't deny that, but they don't work. At least for me, I still have to install something such as PowerDVD to make use of the built-in decoder. For OSX, even if you think its crappy, the majority average users are fine with the built in DVD Player. It plays the DVDs they need to watch.

No matter which OS you use, the method of decoding/interlace and such are still the same. Vista take advantage more then what OSX or Apple provides, but 90% of the users using a PC or Mac could care less. All they want, is that "It Works" and not in Vista or any other windows that requires third-party install of software and such.

Also, the specs still need to be higher then what Apple provides for their lower end MacBook or Desktop systems. Running a 8400M card vs running an Integrated X3100 or GMA950 does mean something in terms of other stuff, such as battery life, portability, instead of watching movies/DVDs.

And I agree some of the "lower" end, according to computer knowledged people, will be able to play HD-DVD/Blu Ray. Actually, last time I saw something like this in action, this company's demo of a HD-DVD movie played on a 42" HDTV w/ HDMI, it had somewhere around the specs of a 2.2GHz C2D, 2GB Ram, and a 128MB 8400 vid card and it lagged during the demo.
 

mosx

macrumors 65816
Mar 3, 2007
1,465
3
In all seriousness, there's always something better in a few weeks/months/years. So what's the point of having the best right now anyways? If you want a sharper picture on your DVDs, fine, I don't care. But watching a 2 hour movie in ultra high quality or regular DVD quality is still the same thing. I personally care about the story line more then if I can see the pores on the actors face. If I wanted that, I'll goto an Art Museum, that's way better and way better quality (depending on art) then anything on screen.

Well, there is the issue of quality. DVD Player in Tiger and below was so bad that going fullscreen resembled high quality streaming internet video. Not even close to what you got on PCs in the 90s.

Leopard brings DVD quality up to where Windows was at the end of the last decade/beginning of this one. But it still has a long way to go.

It's very distracting when that DVD you're watching on your $1400 computer doesn't even look as good as it does on a $500 Wal-Mart system or even a $25 Cyberhome player connected to a 27" TV via S-Video.

Vista's built-in decoder is a piece of junk. Sure it has it, I don't deny that, but they don't work. At least for me, I still have to install something such as PowerDVD to make use of the built-in decoder. For OSX, even if you think its crappy, the majority average users are fine with the built in DVD Player. It plays the DVDs they need to watch.

You're using Vista Business, according to your sig. Which means you do NOT have the built-in decoder. Only Home Premium and Ultimate have the built-in decoders. Besides, you have a MacBook, it wouldn't matter if it did have the built-in decoder because it wouldn't be able to take advantage of the hardware features. However, if you're using PowerDVD, it has software based features that will still improve the image quality above what DVD Player offers.

No matter which OS you use, the method of decoding/interlace and such are still the same. Vista take advantage more then what OSX or Apple provides, but 90% of the users using a PC or Mac could care less. All they want, is that "It Works" and not in Vista or any other windows that requires third-party install of software and such.

To those of us who care about quality, and want our $1400 computer to perform as good as a $500 system from Wal-Mart, this is very important. Theres no excuse for systems that generally have a $700-$1,000 premium tacked on them to come with such shoddy software that isn't even up to what was offered on rival platforms many years ago.

The decoding and deinterlacing process is pretty different on Macs and PCs. Just look at the CPU use ;) With a good GPU on Windows, a DVD will come in around 4% CPU time (2GHz C2D) on a Mac with DVD Player (2.16GHz C2D) you generally clock in around 30% CPU time. 720p H.264 video ramps the Windows system up to 6% and the Mac up to 60%

Also, the specs still need to be higher then what Apple provides for their lower end MacBook or Desktop systems. Running a 8400M card vs running an Integrated X3100 or GMA950 does mean something in terms of other stuff, such as battery life, portability, instead of watching movies/DVDs.

Battery life and decreased portability have been proven to be false myths. A GeForce 8400M GS is capable of clocking down to 100MHz on the core and 100MHz on the memory. Apple could even write the driver so that the dedicated memory only gets activated during games and have it syphon memory via the PCI Express bus from the system RAM. Also, look at the Dell XPS M1330. Roughly the same size as the MacBook yet it has the GeForce 8400M GS and gets roughly the same battery life in real world situations.

And I agree some of the "lower" end, according to computer knowledged people, will be able to play HD-DVD/Blu Ray. Actually, last time I saw something like this in action, this company's demo of a HD-DVD movie played on a 42" HDTV w/ HDMI, it had somewhere around the specs of a 2.2GHz C2D, 2GB Ram, and a 128MB 8400 vid card and it lagged during the demo.

First of all, people need to stop using the term "lag" when describing frame drops. "Lag" always has been and always will be when there is internet connection speed interruptions during online gaming. Not frame drops.

Anyway, if that system was experiencing frame drops then there was something wrong with their configuration. My HP (2GHz C2D SR, 2GB of RAM, GeForce 8400M GS) plays all HD content without a single frame drop and the CPU never goes above 10%, it's all done by the GPU.
 

Cinner

macrumors newbie
Oct 9, 2007
21
0
I recently sold my 17" MacBook Pro (latest version) and intend to replace it with a Dell XPS M1330. I've had it with the numerous hardware issues me and my friend both experienced with Mac computers. But other than that, I want that little Dell because it fits cutting edge hardware in a lovely, tiny form factor. I'm also going to love the HDMI output, and multimedia on Windows is so much better than on a Mac. I think Mac is years behind on that aspect.

What I will miss is Leopard, which is why I'll try to get that working on the Dell (OSx86).
 

angrygolfer

macrumors 6502
Jun 25, 2007
272
0
PA
I've used Dell desktops for the past 10 years, and the service has been outstanding.

I'll have to second this. I just ordered a Dell XPS m1330 with the 2.5 6MB Penryn. A buddy at work bought one 4 weeks ago but the Penryn was not an option. He was ticked off one he found out I was getting the Penryn so he called and Dell is sending him a brand new replacement laptop with the Penryn AND and extra gig of RAM wich they just offered to him (he didn't ask). Dells return policy is 21 days. He is outside of that. Thats pretty good service if you ask me.
 

Shua

macrumors regular
Jan 5, 2008
111
0
No, You are hopefully a sensable human being, or a close Proximation to one.

You have a brain! Use it.
 

stevenfarrisohi

macrumors newbie
Jan 28, 2008
29
0
I was in the same predicament...

I wanted a Dell XPS M1530 and had waited for months for their arrival. They look sleek but in person they feel cheap. Look at the reviews on the Dell site. What I don't understand is people mention that they key covers fall off, the screens are cracked, the fingerprint reader is temperamental, the paint is chipping, and they give it such a high rating? Once I touched a MBP - I feel in love. The quality if palpable!
 

dj420118

macrumors regular
May 17, 2006
186
0
I wanted a Dell XPS M1530 and had waited for months for their arrival. They look sleek but in person they feel cheap. Look at the reviews on the Dell site. What I don't understand is people mention that they key covers fall off, the screens are cracked, the fingerprint reader is temperamental, the paint is chipping, and they give it such a high rating? Once I touched a MBP - I feel in love. The quality if palpable!

That is so true...all Dell's feel like a big piece of plastic. I can only think that they are cheaper because they don't use the same quality material that Apple uses in their laptops. Apple all the way!!!:D
 

ChrisN

macrumors 65816
Aug 27, 2007
1,071
0
Demarest, NJ
Well I have a macbook and love it, the only thing i dont like are the integrated graphics, I also play cod( actually cod:uo) and it runs ok, I am actually thinking of getting a macbook pro because of the screen size, processor, hd space and ofc the graphics card.
Like you I dont have $2000 to spend which is why I am gonna get a refurb model so I think you should look into that because they give you 1 year warrenty and the only thing you dont get is the fancy box.
 

tremendous

macrumors 6502
Jan 16, 2008
413
1
UK? Yeah I'm OK. Stop asking.
didn't see anyone mention this but they might have...anyway

1) just buy a new HD and upgrade yourself = cheaper.
2) applecare for students/those with educational discount in the UK is around £53. it is not free (unless something has changed since last week when i was in the apple store asking about it)

oh and i care not a jot which computer you buy.
 

angrygolfer

macrumors 6502
Jun 25, 2007
272
0
PA

Not...
I just received my new Dell XPS M1330. I'd tak it over a MBP, MB, or MBA anyday. It's absolutely beautiful. Like most I thought I was getting a plastic machine, but it's mostly all aluminum. It has the 2.5Ghz 6MB cache Penryn. 160GB HDD 4GB RAM, wifi, bluetooth, etc. I am very impressed. It came with a really nice fake leather binder with the manuals, disc sleeves for the restore CD's and a nice little pocket with a microfiber cloth for cleaning.

I like macs too so don't get me wrong. If you're ok with running Vista (which I am and I don't see what all the fuss is about) then I'd say get the XPS.

It came in at $2065 with tax and shipping. included in that price is a second power supply 3yr warranty WITH accidental damage and 3yr Lojack, Adobe Photoshop Elements and Premiere elements.
 

deputy_doofy

macrumors 65816
Sep 11, 2002
1,461
391
Until the Windows malware problem is solved, 1 core and some RAM will always be wasted on real-time scans of everything. Therefore, when the Penryn MBP comes out, it will be more efficient.

Please, no comments from the "we have been running Windows since 1800 and never had a virus and never used anti-virus software" people. You're the exceptions, not the rule.
 

angrygolfer

macrumors 6502
Jun 25, 2007
272
0
PA
Until the Windows malware problem is solved, 1 core and some RAM will always be wasted on real-time scans of everything. Therefore, when the Penryn MBP comes out, it will be more efficient.

Please, no comments from the "we have been running Windows since 1800 and never had a virus and never used anti-virus software" people. You're the exceptions, not the rule.

Are you serious? You really think it takes a whole core for real-time scanning? Geez, what did I do before dual core processors?? what an idiot fanboy...
 

Killyp

macrumors 68040
Jun 14, 2006
3,859
7
Are you serious? You really think it takes a whole core for real-time scanning? Geez, what did I do before dual core processors?? what an idiot fanboy...

He's right actually. AntiVirus takes up a lot of processing power, particularly with things like video and games.

Before dual core processors, about 40% of your processing power was going towards Windows' built in real-time scanning provisions. Windows compensates for this in the task manager so you don't notice any difference (other than a loss of performance).
 
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