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dk001

macrumors demi-god
Oct 3, 2014
10,742
15,087
Sage, Lightning, and Mountains
Admittedly don’t know how it works on Android but I’d hate to lose the convenience of Apple Pay, would be a shame if banks decided to start dropping support and forcing you to use their own separate apps, woild lose the whole convenience of Apples current implementation.

This might be a bit much but ...
 

lartola

macrumors 68000
Feb 10, 2017
1,982
1,021
I have to side with PayPal on this, it is not really right that Apple added a hardware feature into the phone that only Apple applications can access and use. It is my device, I should have the choice in what tap to pay options that I can use with NFC.
So do I. Note, however, that Apple isn’t blocking access to the hardware, but rather just a specific use for it. They do allow 3rd party access for other uses of the NFC hardware, just not for payments. It still isn’t right.
 

lartola

macrumors 68000
Feb 10, 2017
1,982
1,021
Rubbish. They didn't add "NFC" as a feature and then restricted the use of it. "NFC" was never once advertised as a feature of the iPhone. What was advertised was ApplePay and Apple Wallet with the ability to handle contactless payments via NFC.

Correct, but NFC isn’t Apple’s proprietary technology. It’s an international standard that has been in use for over a decade. And it’s used for multiple purposes, not just for payments.
 

Unregistered 4U

macrumors G4
Jul 22, 2002
10,224
8,212
We'll see how it'll play out, but I frankly doubt that a significant portion of iOS users really bought the phone because it only allows one store or one payment option. People just go with it because they want their shiny iPhone.
Users don’t care in any of this (or, I should say a huge number of users don’t care because Apple has a minority -20% or less- marketshare in all these countries, and it’s a minority of that minority that care).
 

lartola

macrumors 68000
Feb 10, 2017
1,982
1,021
Admittedly don’t know how it works on Android but I’d hate to lose the convenience of Apple Pay, would be a shame if banks decided to start dropping support and forcing you to use their own separate apps, woild lose the whole convenience of Apples current implementation.

On Android, people can use 3rd party apps, such as their bank’s own app, to make payments using their phones. With Apple it’s their way (Apple Pay) or the Long Island expressway.
 

genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,107
2,685
The point is companies have to go through Apple Pay instead of directly interfacing with the NFC chip, which means Apple gets a cut no matter what.

It would be similar to if users were only able to take photos using the built-in Camera app.
How would that be a Problem? They made the camera and the apps store. It seems like the mistake was allowing any access to anything. They should delete the App Store and only offer APIs for 1st party apps. Everyone else can use web apps like the Original I phone just 15 years ago.
 

d686546s

macrumors 6502a
Jan 11, 2021
672
1,630
They should delete the App Store and only offer APIs for 1st party apps. Everyone else can use web apps like the Original I phone just 15 years ago.

That sounds like a marvellous idea and would definitely not destroy the iPhone. Are you a Samsung shareholder by any chance?
 
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Seoras

macrumors 6502a
Oct 25, 2007
763
2,016
Scotsman in New Zealand
All the griping about Apple's 30/15% for App store and trying to break open iOS, enforce side loading and bring in alternative payment methods. What about PayPal's 6% commission for all payments?

As a developer who uses PayPal and Apple App Store with Apple in-app payments the PayPal 6% bugs me the most because I get the least for the money I lose.
With the App store I get all the local tax taken care of, I get refunds taken care of and I get credit card fees covered as well as being provided with software to create my apps (Xcode).
With PayPal I get SFA other than losing 6% on a system that looks, works and feels like it is engineered and maintained by Dilbert's Pointy hair boss.

The end user isn't going to get a better deal.
This is nothing other than a cash grab by corporates using legislation as muscle.
Apple doesn't have a monopoly but PayPal effectively does.
EU - legislation for hire at the right price or out of envy/spite.
 

CthuluLemon

Cancelled
Aug 14, 2020
260
455
That's like being upset that you can't use your Visa card to pay with Amex.
No it’s not, and it’s a ridiculously bad-faith argument to even suggest the two scenarios are comparable; it’s ludicrous to have to decide what phone you want to buy based on if it is compatible with your bank card or payment service of choice. The metaphor is laughably flawed. There is no reason for Apple to limit NFC to Apple apps beyond giving Apple a competitive edge, one they aren’t not entitled to as the device manufacturer rather than end user.

What’s next, GM buys Coca-cola and designs the cup holders to eject Pepsi products? Hyundai buys Spotify and only lets the aux and usb inputs work with the Spotify app? Remember that every argument Apple makes can than be used by other companies to limit consumer choice; Apple policy does not exist in a vacuum or above the fray of competition like on some Mount Olympus. They are a company, a public one with fiduciary responsibilities to shareholders; there primary goal, as required by law, must always be to maximize profit and provide the best value to those shareholders. The foundation of every decision is profit, and they, like any company, will never favor the user experience— or any other product attribute— over profit.
 
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vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,409
9,875
Columbus, OH
Rubbish. They didn't add "NFC" as a feature and then restricted the use of it. "NFC" was never once advertised as a feature of the iPhone. What was advertised was ApplePay and Apple Wallet with the ability to handle contactless payments via NFC.

What right does the EU have - or any other body, for that matter - to dictate to a private company which parts of their products must be accessible to the public? Should the EU force car makers to provide public APIs to all vehicle functions and all sensors? Etc., etc.

Why does the EU need to get into the middle of this at all? If Apple's refusal to create a public API to its NFC chip and mobile payment apps such as PayPal can't provide NFC payments on iOS, then consumers that value PayPal can vote with their wallets and buy an Android device! Let the free market decide these things!
By existing in their jurisdiction. Apple can leave if they don't like the laws and regulations they're subject to. What kind of question is "what right do they have?" Are you under the impression that its a new phenomenon for a company to be subject to the laws and regulations of the places they operate in?
 

genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,107
2,685
Apple didn't invent NFC. They added it to the iPhone as a feature and then restricted the use of it.
They invented the mechanism that has allowed 1000s of banks around the world to allow their card to be linked to apples system. They also allow for FaceID that is the only one of its kind that is certified to be used for payments.

Allowing one wallet means allowing any wallet. Because of the trust Apple has generated people can use that trust against customers.
 

JPack

macrumors G5
Mar 27, 2017
12,778
23,898
How would that be a Problem? They made the camera and the apps store. It seems like the mistake was allowing any access to anything. They should delete the App Store and only offer APIs for 1st party apps. Everyone else can use web apps like the Original I phone just 15 years ago.

The problem is that there are anti-trust and anti-competition regulations around the world, including EU and U.S.
 

genovelle

macrumors 68020
May 8, 2008
2,107
2,685
Function vs App? That gets really grey when Apple uses a "function" to compete with 3rd party apps and/or uses it for its' own apps and cuts 3rd party out.
Ironically, no one in the US was interested in NFC payment when Apple introduced Apple Pay. It took years of work going bank by bank to build a secure functionality into the OS and hardware of the iPhone. The 3rd parties are garbage. It’s Apple’s built in security that makes people want to use it.
 

vipergts2207

macrumors 601
Apr 7, 2009
4,409
9,875
Columbus, OH
Ironically, no one in the US was interested in NFC payment when Apple introduced Apple Pay. It took years of work going bank by bank to build a secure functionality into the OS and hardware of the iPhone. The 3rd parties are garbage. It’s Apple’s built in security that makes people want to use it.
Why would I have any less faith in Chase than I do Apple in making sure my payments are secure, seeing as how fraud results in significant losses for the issuer. It’s in the bank’s own interest to keep things secure.
 
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