U.S. Government to Investigate Sideloading and Web App Restrictions on iOS

[bookofxero]

then don't use them. nobody is forcing anyone to install sofware. right now users are forced not to.

This is such a disingenuous argument. Forcing iOS to have a mechanism to allow third party app stores and sideloading introduces a very big security risk vector and potential vulnerabilities, forcing this on all users for the "benefit" of a vocal few that are completely welcome to "vote with their wallets" and go to Android, Fire (Android based), Tizen, or Linux phones (eg, Purism).

There is more competition in the smartphone and app store markets than there is in cell providers.

 

[4743913]

On one level, I agree with you. I think my concern is that side-loading, on any platform, increases the risk and volume of malware propagating around.

someone next to you was holding a jailbroken iPhone.. and you never knew. see how that works? quit worrying about what other people are doing. If you get infected with malware, its 100% your fault usually.

 

[boss.king]

As a no-mark uneducated EU redneck I now get my say on another country and to opportunity to abuse lawmakers whose decisions have no impact on me. That’s how it works here, right?

Companies have to follow the laws of the countries they operate in, even when those laws change. Are you really just learning about this now?

 

[jayducharme]

are you impacted by macs or pcs? because they sideload too except that it's called "install software" for them.

IMO, the difference is that with a desktop computer, you turn it on when you use it and turn it off when you don't. And it's usually not a life-or-death situation if it crashes. A mobile device needs to be on all the time because it's also a communication device. I wouldn't want to be facing the equivalent of a BSOD if I have to call 911. I want my iPhone to be secure and perform reliably. So far it has, and I think that's because Apple has so tightly controlled what goes onto it.

But as others have pointed out, if the mobile world becomes a Wild West for software I could simply choose to live with Apple's default apps. I'd prefer a curated App Store though.

 

[boss.king]

This is such a disingenuous argument. Forcing iOS to have a mechanism to allow third party app stores and sideloading introduces a very big security risk vector and potential vulnerabilities, forcing this on all users for the "benefit" of a vocal few that are completely welcome to "vote with their wallets" and go to Android or Linux phones (eg, Purism).

Nope, it doesn't.

 

[Psychicbob]

someone next to you was holding a jailbroken iPhone.. and you never knew. see how that works? quit worrying about what other people are doing. If you get infected with malware, its 100% your fault usually.

Thanks for your condescending post. You know as well as I do that there is no interaction at that device to device level. It’s server-side impact that I am worried about.

 

[Boyd01]

I am developing a complex web app (it's free, with no ads and no registration). It works fine in Safari under iOS. The main difference with Chrome on Android is that when you go to the site, it will ask if you want to install the app. iOS is a little more opaque, you have to go to Share > Add to Home Screen to install on your phone. And it's also ambiguous as to whether a home screen icon is a web app or just a bookmark on iOS.

Safari on MacOS is more of an issue because it does not support web apps at all where Chrome, Edge, etc. have an option to install the site as a web app. You can accomplish the same things on my website without installing it as an app, however you will still see the browser interface whereas the web app runs full-screen without the browser interface. The less obvious difference is that web apps have persistent data storage but Safari websites do not. And MacOS has gotten more aggressive about automatically deleting site data if you don't visit often. IIRC, your data will be deleted after one week if you don't go to the site. A web app *should* store your data indefinitely on iOS, although Apple has made some confusing statements about this in the past. There is no persistent data storage in Safari on MacOS, since it doesn't support web apps.

Anyway, I decided to go the web app route because it's compatible with all platforms, a single web app works on Android, iOS, MacOS, Windows and Linux. And I also avoid having to pay registration fees, get my app approved etc. The downside is that web apps cannot directly access the filesystem on the device, for obvious security reasons. Files can only be saved to the downloads folder and the user must directly choose files to open (you can't open a file programatically, even if the app "knows" where it is located). For what I'm doing, this all works pretty well though.

 

[4743913]

Thanks for your condescending post. You know as well as I do that there is no interaction at that device to device level. It’s server-side impact that I am worried about.

in what way?

 

[scottness]

As usual, the EU leads and the US follows.

In regulations, right?

 

[scottness]

I’d be ok if they restricted sideloading by default, but then offered a way to disable the restriction if desired. Then it’s your own fault if you download something stupid.

 

[smeagol]

I can't help but sense ulterior motives here on the government's part. They've been engaged in a cat and mouse game on encryption with Apple on mobile phones for years. What better way to make their obsession with spying on citizens easier than to open up a closed platform as much as possible by requiring them to sideload/open up to 3rd party app stores, etc.?

 

[Orange Bat]

It would be fine to allow side loading on devices. User’s will still be able to get everything from the app store if they so choose, but developers will have another option for distribution. This will also automatically allow for other app stores. The big issue will be discovery. The big plus of the App Store is it makes it easy to find apps. Offering your own software on a web site will be hobbled by the difficulty of discovery. Also, innovation will come faster as developers won’t have to follow Apple’s rules. This is all a good thing that will improve the iPhone in the long run, but Will also open the iPhone up to risks as well. But with any anything in life, with no risk comes no reward.

 

[VulchR]

Web apps suck. Just my opinion, of course.

 

[Wanted797]

are you impacted by macs or pcs? because they sideload too except that it's called "install software" for them.

And that’s why macs and PCs get viruses. My mac also doesn’t carry basically my entire life within its data (ID, banking apps, credit cards personal email account).

Id rather avoid randoms being able to “install software” on my phone. I assume you’re someone who likes using Ask Toolbar.

 

[4743913]

Id rather avoid randoms being able to “install software” on my phone.

why are you referring to yourself as third person "random"?

 

[gnipgnop]

Also, innovation will come faster as developers won’t have to follow Apple’s rules.

Really? I've never heard the tech press saying much per Windows/Mac having huge amounts of innovation relative to mobile. The term "legacy software" came from the desktop/laptop world.

 

[erikkfi]

I think Apple is safe from this one. The process is absurdly long and subject to endless appeals. And those lobbying dollars ain’t for nothing.

 

[d686546s]

On one level, I agree with you. I think my concern is that side-loading, on any platform, increases the risk and volume of malware propagating around.

If malware and privacy was really the driving concern we should make it an offence to distribute it, including platform operators who argue that their model is superior because they check apps. If they don't meet their obligations, we'll fine them heftily and painfully.

I bet we would see an observable and immediate change in corporate messaging.

If they want to audit every app, fine, let them. But hold them accountable for it.

 

[VulchR]

then don't use them. nobody is forcing anyone to install sofware. right now users are forced not to.

With all due respect, if you do not like it, then buy Android. My issue with this crass government overreach is that once side-loading becomes available, the apps I normally trust will vacate the App store and I'll have to get them from the Wild West. Of course that is what normally happens for other operating systems, like Android, but then again I put much more sensitive information on my Apple devices than I otherwise would precisely because of the walled garden. Lawmakers should butt out, with the exception perhaps of making Apple guarantee security of all apps in the app store if there is a walled garden (the supposed justification for the iOS ecosystem).

 

[Deguello]

This is such a disingenuous argument. Forcing iOS to have a mechanism to allow third party app stores and sideloading introduces a very big security risk vector and potential vulnerabilities, forcing this on all users for the "benefit" of a vocal few that are completely welcome to "vote with their wallets" and go to Android, Fire (Android based), Tizen, or Linux phones (eg, Purism).

There is more competition in the smartphone and app store markets than there is in cell providers.

How is it disingenuous? What‘s the very big security risk vector for people who don’t enable or utilize third party app stores?

 

[Mailia]

Indeed. Like all those fine mobile phones that were invented and developed in the EU. Also that leading edge SOC tech comes from the EU, and.....oh, wait. ?

Ever heard of GSM?

 

[d686546s]

Indeed. Like all those fine mobile phones that were invented and developed in the EU. Also that leading edge SOC tech comes from the EU, and.....oh, wait. ?

You mean like ARM, which for most of its existence was a company in the EU (and is of course still a European company)?

 

[Deguello]

With all due respect, if you do not like it, then buy Android. My issue with this crass government overreach is that once side-loading becomes available, the apps I normally trust will vacate the App store and I'll have to get them from the Wild West. Of course that is what normally happens for other operating systems, like Android, but then again I put much more sensitive information on my Apple devices than I otherwise would precisely because of the walled garden. Lawmakers should butt out, with the exception perhaps of making Apple guarantee security of all apps in the app store if there is a walled garden (the supposed justification for the iOS ecosystem).

It’s possible to be against crass government overreach while being in favor of third party app stores.

 

[4743913]

With all due respect, if you do not like it, then buy Android.

nope. you will evolve. you will learn to install software. if your app leaves the AppStore, it's because the dev felt is was better for them. you will follow them or find a comparable app in the AppStore and maintain your illusion of security.

 

[Orange Bat]

Really? I've never heard the tech press saying much per Windows/Mac having huge amounts of innovation relative to mobile. The term "legacy software" came from the desktop/laptop world.

That‘s because the flashy innovation on desktops came 20 years ago. There is constant innovation on desktops today that is never reported because it’s no longer sexy. The desktop market is about 40 years old. The smart phone market is only about 15. A more open system always allows for greater innovation, and a more open iPhone will be no different.