Apple Delays Plans for Return to Office Three Days a Week, Masks Required in Common Areas Amid Rising COVID Cases

[Blackstick]

We closed 70% of our corporate offices.

My wife and I both work full time remote. We sold our house in South Florida. Bought a place in Ohio that's more than twice the size, for half the money.

No brainer. Apple is fighting for no reason. People should go full remote if it makes them happy and their job allows for it.

 

[eyeseeyou]

100% agree

Maybe Apple should start re-tooling Apple Park to be an incredible community to live in -- it might become highly desirable to work and live at Apple

Isn't this kind of what the big tech companies were trying to make their campuses feel like? For example, Facebook massive, free, food court.

 

[jerryk]

Isn't this kind of what the big tech companies were trying to make their campuses feel like? For example, Facebook massive, free, food court.

Plus laundry service, nap room, etc.

Works great when you are young and childless. Not so well when you have kids to pick up, older parents, etc.

 

[eyeseeyou]

Plus laundry service, nap room, etc.

Works great when you are young and childless. Not so well when you have kids to pick up, older parents, etc.

I get for some people work is an escape from their kids and talk to adults but also, at least in tech, some people are paid very well and would prefer their “castle” they live in with the flexibility to be around loved ones would still be preferred in a custom-tailored environment.

For me WFH is saving me almost 3 hours of commuting

 

[Razorpit]

This is bad advice. For everyone. Companies have a bad track record for protecting public health. They shouldn't have a say in it.

This isn't a 19th century steel mill. I put faith in people knowing what is and isn't safe for them. However you are correct in that many company's forced an unknown and unproven "vaccine" on their workers for no good reason.

Even when the alternative is not living? I can think of a million reasons why this is bad advice.

Sorry, there's going to be a day where you aren't. Happens to the best of us.

Because there isn’t full immunity. One can still get Covid even after several doses of the vaccine or get it again after having already had it. Add to that the existence of variants and people who won’t vaccinate or don’t care to get a booster and you get the picture of why cases increase again when the safety measures are relaxed.

Read The Real Anthony Fauci by RFK Jr. Fauci has a history of creating "vaccines" (using the traditional definition of the word) that work the opposite of what vaccine's are supposed to do. In otherwords the vaccinated are more likely to catch what they are vaccinated against, than prior to the jab. This goes back decades for multiple "pandemics". It's all documented in the book. I was mortified to learn what he did during the AIDS/HIV scare of the 80's.

But there’s no full immunity to covid, you can still get it even after being vaccinated or after you had it and recovered. Unlike with other diseases such as polio or measles, with covid there is no 100% immunity as in being sure there’s no possible way to get it once you got vaccinated or already had the disease. That’s what people don’t seem to understand.

Thankfully Omicron was the great vaccine we all needed. Even Dr. Bill agrees.

 

[siddavis]

Why wouldn't we call vaccines, 'vaccines'?

The CDC’s definition changed from “a product that stimulates a person’s immune system to produce immunity to a specific disease” to the current “a preparation that is used to stimulate the body’s immune response against diseases.”

Like I said, I guess that's just me clinging to the old use of the term... back when they provided immunity.

 

[siddavis]

You can’t be responsible for your own health by deciding whether to wear a mask or not. Your likelihood of contracting the virus depends mostly on whether other people wear it or not.

This is an honest question from me.
Why is the mask so effective at blocking the virus as it leaves the mouth/nose, but so ineffective at blocking the virus from entering the mouth/nose?

 

[BaldiMac]

The CDC’s definition changed from “a product that stimulates a person’s immune system to produce immunity to a specific disease” to the current “a preparation that is used to stimulate the body’s immune response against diseases.”

Like I said, I guess that's just me clinging to the old use of the term... back when they provided immunity.

People like you that misinterpret the old definition are the exact reason that they changed the wording. It still has the exact same meaning.

Why did CDC change its definition for ‘vaccine’? Agency explains move as skeptics lurk

The new definition clarifies the misconception that vaccines are 100% effective — they’re not.

www.miamiherald.com

 

[4jasontv]

This isn't a 19th century steel mill.

Could have fooled me. Are you suggesting food, shelter, and healthcare isn't tied to employment?

I put faith in people knowing what is and isn't safe for them.

I don't. Clearly, people have no idea what is safe for them because then we wouldn't be having this discussion. People would be wearing masks and limiting travel without a pandemic.

However you are correct in that many company's forced an unknown and unproven "vaccine" on their workers for no good reason.

Who said anything about a vaccine. Avoidance comes even before protection.

Sorry, there's going to be a day where you aren't. Happens to the best of us.

One million people died because people couldn't suck it up and do what was best for others. How selfish does one have to be to think that it's ok to run out to the store for an extra box of Nut-Thins. Go without.

 

[4jasontv]

This is an honest question from me.
Why is the mask so effective at blocking the virus as it leaves the mouth/nose, but so ineffective at blocking the virus from entering the mouth/nose?

One mask is effective, but a mask only prevents exposure if the concern comes close enough to the material. Some will pass through the pores, but if both people have a mask on then it is far, far more likely to be blocked. The difference between one and two masks is substantial.

If one person wears a cotton mask over a surgical mask they reduce particle exposure by 85.4%. If two people double mask, they reduce it by 95%.

Even cotton masks help, though they are not as good as charged masks that can attract fomites and other particles as they pass through the pores.

The next issue is that people need to use the mask correctly. That means wearing it over the nose and mouth, not touching the outside of the mask, and washing or disposing of the mask after every single use. People claim they wore a mask but they take it off frequently often containing their hands and then touching the inside of the mask or their face. If you take the mask off when you get in your car you shouldn't put it back on and use it again.

We have seen some interesting numbers about mask use. People who buy N95 masks are more likely to wear them correctly, than people who wear cloth masks. There is a 1 in 5 chance that someone who uses scarves or other protective barriers is not wearing it correctly. None of this however matters if you touch the outside of the mask because you then have to assume your hands are contaminated and can't touch anything else. Even when I see people wearing them correctly they often negate the benefits by pulling the mask off by the nose or sliding their thumb under but grabbing the outside with a finger.

 

[siddavis]

People like you that misinterpret the old definition are the exact reason that they changed the wording. It still has the exact same meaning.

Why did CDC change its definition for ‘vaccine’? Agency explains move as skeptics lurk

The new definition clarifies the misconception that vaccines are 100% effective — they’re not.

www.miamiherald.com

No, that's not just a misinterpretation and I am well aware of that cover article that you cite. From that article:
There remains the misconception that COVID-19 vaccines were designed to prevent infections altogether, leading people to believe the vaccines aren’t working as they should when they learn about breakthrough infections among the vaccinated.

Now, from the FDA's Dec 11, 2020 EUA of the Pfizer shot:
They stated that it “was 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease among these clinical trial participants with eight COVID-19 cases in the vaccine group and 162 in the placebo group."

I'll repeat - 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease. Sorry, but THEY instilled the 'misconception'.

 

[Razorpit]

There are still hundreds of people dying every single day in the U.S alone from Covid. Let me guess, you don’t think those numbers are real?

They aren't.

That's of course not how vaccines work. Please don't spread misinformation.

Why wouldn't we call vaccines, 'vaccines'?

Because they had to change the definition of a vaccine when they found out it does nothing.

In the past two years here in Florida we have had spikes during the dog days of summer.

"Spike" of what? Let me guess, "cases."

This is stupid. Everyone needs to get back to work. COVID is here to stay. There's always going to be a certain level spreading in the community and it's going to ebb and flow. If you're going to shut everything down until it's "over", it's never going to happen.

Yep, the flu has been around since the dawn of man and will continue to do so until the end of man.

No one loves masks or lockdowns. But sometimes they are necessary. Maybe if people took masks seriously, they would be more effective in slowing the spread of covid. Masks don't work when only some people do it.

And its not about just covid. Work from home has reduced some company costs, reduces absenses from work and sickness from other disease (colds, flu) and improves employee moral - with no loss in efficiency.

They were not necessary for this flu.

Could have fooled me. Are you suggesting food, shelter, and healthcare isn't tied to employment?

I don't. Clearly, people have no idea what is safe for them because then we wouldn't be having this discussion. People would be wearing masks and limiting travel without a pandemic.

Who said anything about a vaccine. Avoidance comes even before protection.

One million people died because people couldn't suck it up and do what was best for others. How selfish does one have to be to think that it's ok to run out to the store for an extra box of Nut-Thins. Go without.

Not everyone is as paranoid. One million people have not died from COVID. They even revised the numbers saying 3/4's of the number of "reported deaths" had four or MORE comorbidities.

Do you lock down the planet because grandma is over weight, 93, has a bad heart, failing bladder and kidneys, got a bad case of the sniffles? Gates himself said it was primarily a disease of the elderly.

Wake up and put things in to perspective people, you're being played.

 

[JoeShades]

One mask is effective, but a mask only prevents exposure if the concern comes close enough to the material. Some will pass through the pores, but if both people have a mask on then it is far, far more likely to be blocked. The difference between one and two masks is substantial.

Even cotton masks help, though they are not as good as charged masks that can attract fomites and other particles as they pass through the pores.

The next issue is that people need to use the mask correctly. That means wearing it over the nose and mouth, not touching the outside of the mask, and washing or disposing of the mask after every single use. People claim they wore a mask but they take it off frequently often containing their hands and then touching the inside of the mask or their face. If you take the mask off when you get in your car you shouldn't put it back on and use it again.

And some people say this should be done for the rest of out lives, well I am not doing that and am certainly not driving around in an N95 mask, that is ridiculous and if that makes me bad person that does not care about others then so be it I guess I am a horrible person, enjoy a lifetime of masks

 

[Ethosik]

I’m going to bet anything you can wear a mask for more than 30 minutes.

No not really. It gets VERY VERY VERY uncomfortable. I have tried.

 

[BaldiMac]

No, that's not just a misinterpretation and I am well aware of that cover article that you cite. From that article:
There remains the misconception that COVID-19 vaccines were designed to prevent infections altogether, leading people to believe the vaccines aren’t working as they should when they learn about breakthrough infections among the vaccinated.

Now, from the FDA's Dec 11, 2020 EUA of the Pfizer shot:
They stated that it “was 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease among these clinical trial participants with eight COVID-19 cases in the vaccine group and 162 in the placebo group."

I'll repeat - 95% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease. Sorry, but THEY instilled the 'misconception'.

Like I said, you simply don't understand what you are posting. The FDA statement doesn't contradict the definition of a vaccine.

 

[4jasontv]

Not everyone is as paranoid. One million people have not died from COVID. They even revised the numbers saying 3/4's of the number of "reported deaths" had four or MORE comorbidities.

Do you lock down the planet because grandma is over weight, 93, has a bad heart, failing bladder and kidneys, got a bad case of the sniffles? Gates himself said it was primarily a disease of the elderly.

Wake up and put things in to perspective people, you're being played.

People also said they can't get AIDS because they are straight. Many people have underlying health conditions that they don't even know about but could cause complications if they were infected.

More importantly, if you could do something that prevented one person, even an old person with complications, from dying you have a moral obligation to do it. You shouldn't need to be told this.

 

[4jasontv]

And some people say this should be done for the rest of out lives, well I am not doing that and am certainly not driving around in an N95 mask, that is ridiculous and if that makes me bad person that does not care about others then so be it I guess I am a horrible person, enjoy a lifetime of masks

That makes you part of the problem. If we want to get rid of the problem we need to get rid of the problems.

 

[siddavis]

One million people died because people couldn't suck it up and do what was best for others. How selfish does one have to be to think that it's ok to run out to the store for an extra box of Nut-Thins. Go without.

Don't worry, hundreds of millions if not billions of people will now suffer because of this terrible risk calculation. The global supply chain is in shambles because too many people thought it was a great idea to hide in the basement.

 

[4jasontv]

Don't worry, hundreds of millions if not billions of people will now suffer because of this terrible risk calculation. The global supply chain is in shambles because too many people thought it was a great idea to hide in the basement.

Not having things doesn't mean they are suffering. Quality of life is not defined by how much stuff we have.

 

[JoeShades]

Not having things doesn't mean they are suffering. Quality of life is not defined by how much stuff we have.

Yeah actually lack of food and money does matter, those are important things

 

[jerryk]

No not really. It gets VERY VERY VERY uncomfortable. I have tried.

Doctors, nurses, dentists, lab workers, semi-conductor workers, etc. wear masks for many hours a day. And in some countries in Asia, they are fashion statements for kids and young adults.

 

[JoeShades]

A New World Health Organization Report Once Again Proves Sweden Right

Even The WHO has to acknowledge reality

ianmsc.substack.com

 

[4jasontv]

Yeah actually lack of food and money does matter, those are important things

Fair enough. Enjoy your grits, lentils, and boiled potatoes. No more luxuries.

 

[siddavis]

More importantly, if you could do something that prevented one person, even an old person with complications, from dying you have a moral obligation to do it. You shouldn't need to be told this.

No, actually I don't. I could be 100% certain I would not infect an old person with complications if I moved to the middle of Antarctica. I'm not morally obligated to do that. Why? Because LIVING everyday is a risk/benefit calculation. You have decided for yourself that it is best to stay inside a hermetically sealed bottle. That's fine. Just don't tell the rest of the world that they are subhuman for not doing the same. I'll do what I can within reason to get along with this virus among us.

 

[4jasontv]

Doctors, nurses, dentists, lab workers, semi-conductor workers, etc. wear masks for many hours a day. And in some countries in Asia, they are fashion statements for kids and young adults.

Americans don't respect experts or foreigners.